Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Ok, I can't do it. I was going to come on here and do something profound like write one word..."WOW", or "Interesting", or "Disappointing." Then I made the mistake and read half your posts from around page 22 to the last. I don't like Betts, never have, all he's good for is KR/PR and we keep him fresh to fill in for Portis. But it struck me as odd that the Betts lovers have not chimed in on his behalf?

Most importantly though I feel I have to be a cheerleader here. Even JC was interviewed and he said their play tonight was no big deal. Zorn kept the Offense very vinella so to speak so as to not give away any of our plays. Zorn did not put in any long balls according to JC cause he simply wanted JC and the rest of the offense to get into a rythem. JC did not appear to be concerned about tonight.

I'm sure Zorn called plays specifically to see how certain players handled themselves as well as Blache. I can not believe this team is this bad. There was no game planning, no stratege. Zorn walked into this game with 5-10 yrd plays to see many things I'm sure. How the offense would respond to protection. To see JC's speed of getting rid of the ball. To see the young WR's and possibly the RB's. I think Blache was simply trying out different packages of players together. Just to see who worked well together. I think he wanted to see what he had in a D-line and Orakpo and Jarmin.

It took me 3 1/2 quarters to finally decide to change the channel because for whatever reason I was glued to the disaster on my TV, but finally woke up and realized it was the first preseason game. Players have to learn to gel with each other. Rookies have to get rid of the jitters. and Zorn is not going to show his hand like Gibbs never did. Most of preseason was for the O-line to get their blocking down and D-line to learn where to rush and when. Having said all that....

"WOW" LOL :O

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Damn that Glengarry Glen Ross scene is so crazy well written!

Also if Jason Campbell doesn't stop using the word rhythm so much this year I will possibly freak out. "Just have to get in a rhythm, couldn't get in a rhythm, in college it was all about the rhythm, we stayed vanilla because we had to stay in rhythm the gameplan was established for rhythm.........the goal is to get us in a rhythm and ahhhhhhhhhhh I have no rhythm" stop saying that word please say something else!

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Also this is why there is a preseason. You can only practice for so long with your own teamates cause you get used to how they play, what their tendencies are, and how to stop them. Tonight gave the second and third string a chance to play, a chance to play against a different scheme, and a chance to look at film and see what they are doing wrong or what they need to fix. Now if preseason game 4 looks like this I'll cry.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Here's my takes on the game;

Good signs:
Orakpo- he definitely looks good, he looks like he needs little bit more work on LB though..
Jarmon- he looks like he has high motor, hope it will be same when it counts (which I'm sure it will be)..
Moore- man, does he like to hit?! Although he did gave up a long pass to Hunter (it wasn't supposed to be a catch, but still)..
Henson- after going through learning curve, I think he might be a nice find (for 2nd stringer or possible starter in future?)
Campbell- I'm not sure exactly but I think he's better than before (sort of)
Kelly and D. Thomas- with limited actions, they look good so far.. Keep it coming!
D-line- it seems as if we are stacked (so far, it looks like so)

Bad signs:
Special team- needs more work..
Tryon- after all the hype in training camp, he kept getting beaten.. Although he did give a nice lick on Mason at red zone..
Barnes- he doesn't look good, as well..
Grant and Dutch- unless they perform much better next preseason games, don't expect to see them on the rooster list..
Davis- two fumbles, enough said..
Defense- too many missed tackles..

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Oh yes, Davis, Davis, Davis.......I'm not an NFL player but is it that difficult to remember or learn from your mistake and put two hands on the ball in traffic?

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=SBXVII;575663] Most importantly though I feel I have to be a cheerleader here. Even JC was interviewed and he said their play tonight was no big deal. [B]Zorn kept the Offense very vinella [/B]so to speak so as to not give away any of our plays. Zorn did not put in any long balls according to JC cause he simply wanted JC and the rest of the offense to get into a rythem. JC did not appear to be concerned about tonight.
[/quote]

Did Zorn also keep our offensive line protection vanilla just because it was preseason?

I understand that it is a preseason game and record-wise it doesn't matter but what DOES matter is the performance we delivered in that meaningless game.

No overall improvements were made to our O-Line and everyone expects Campbell to do the leg work in moving the ball. There has to be realistic expectations on our offense as a whole and it comes down to one fundamental:


"If you have no line, you have no time."


My opinion is that our personnel has been severely mismanaged. There wasn't any considerably major reinforcements made to our most vulnerable position on the offensive line.


...And to those about to hit quote on my post and reply with a witty "The sky is falling".

How many more 8-8 seasons do you have to see before you realize that the sky HAS already fallen?

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;575676]Did Zorn also keep our offensive line protection vanilla just because it was preseason?

I understand that it is a preseason game and record-wise it doesn't matter but what DOES matter is the performance we delivered in that meaningless game.

No overall improvements were made to our O-Line and everyone expects Campbell to do the leg work in moving the ball. There has to be realistic expectations on our offense as a whole and it comes down to one fundamental:


"If you have no line, you have no time."


My opinion is that our personnel has been severely mismanaged. There wasn't any considerably major reinforcements made to our most vulnerable position on the offensive line.


...And to those about to hit quote on my post and reply with a witty "The sky is falling".

How many more 8-8 seasons do you have to see before you realize that the sky HAS already fallen?[/quote]

Good point there, you have.. I can say I'm almost on your side, it's hard not to.. But once again, it seem as if every person within Redskins believe they are fine with the players we have on the list.. They have more insights than we do.. I guess I can say I would have to wait until half of season to find out.. Or ending of the season going in playoffs? We don't know how serious Thomas's situation is, yes he isn't playing much but they might hold him for a while to let him heal 100%? Let's wait until the 1st game to see the results.. If it's still same as old sh*t, then I'm on your side; count on it, man..

The FO believes Heyer can fill in the spot; after all, some of us complained that we are not developing players like some other teams (Pats, Giants, and Steelers).. Even I believe in Heyer too, he needs experience to grow.. Give it a shot.. Rinehart is ahead of Bridges for RG, and Bridges is much better than Wade.. Maybe, he will get better by 1st game, enough to take over the #1 spot when Thomas feels better or whatever?

We did sign Bridges, to give the FO some credit.. And for Mike Williams, he did move well, especially for the big boy who haven't played since 2006.. I'm not saying that he's good player, but just that he's getting his groove back.. It takes time.. If he keeps it up and continue to get in shape, it could pay off nicely..

If they are right, we all owe it to Bugel - he's the man..

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

i LIKE BUGS

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Just so it doesn't look like I'm all hater and no praiser, here are some brights & shights from Thursday's game:

[B][U]Brights:[/U][/B]
- Malcolm Kelly's aggressive catching
- Orakpo, solid while rushing
- Jarmon, gave good pressure though it seemed like he was gassed at points
- D. Hall, looks ready for the season
- 1st Team Defense, the strongest aspect of our team

[B][U]Shights[/U][/B]
- Tryon, need I say more?
- Reed Doughty, more of the same ineffectual play, gets stiff-punked by McGahee
- O-Line, gave our QB's no time and RB's no room, having no depth is frustrating on many levels
- Fred Davis's bad luck, one is his fault the other was pretty much a delayed drop
- Backup secondary couldn't get burned anymore than they did
- Theismann is too boring and nerdy, put him out to pasture.

Overall I was pretty frustrated with the game but there were some bright spots. Orakpo looks like an athlete who wants to excel and win. I like to see that. I hope we can stoke that competitive fire for the long run. It was nice to see Kelly's attitude too. He seems bitter and hungry now that he's coming into the season behind D. Thomas. Hope that translates to improvement on the field this year.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=53Fan;575633]Blache said he wanted to put the young guys "on an island" tonight and see how they handled it. Surprisingly he didn't seem to disappointed in Tryon. He said the guys should learn from this. From what I saw, Tryon has a LOT to learn.[/quote]

I suspected as much. Williams used to do the same thing with his young safeties and cornerbacks

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

The O line looked terrible. JC looks like he always does and so did the WRs. Orakpo did look good. Its only the first preseason game so its not panic time.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=irish;575702]The O line looked terrible. JC looks like he always does and so did the WRs. Orakpo did look good. Its only the first preseason game so its not panic time.[/quote]

Really? I actually thought the O Line looked pretty decent

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;575703]Really? I actually thought the O Line looked pretty decent[/quote]

Ok. They didnt look like they could protect anything to me. The QB seemed under pressure too often.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

The fact that it was vanilla makes matters worse, in my opinion. Preseason is vanilla and everyone gets 1v1 match ups. Fact is, we lost a large majority of 1v1 match ups.

As I say every preseason. The score doesn't matter, but the individual play of our players matters. We need to see this team beat the man in front of them.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=wilsowilso;575679]i LIKE BUGS[/quote]

Really? I hate bugs, gross.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

I really thought the OLine looked good, well the first and seconds. Campbell was not touched, I don't think, except for a blown block by Betts. And Collins seemed to have time as well. Also, I would point out that the D we were playing was no slouch.
I think I said this before, we got a good break with our preseason schedule, because the offense is going to get tested by the best of the best defenses. Maybe they won't rise up, but if our O can be forged into something better than last year, these are the teams we should be playing.

We beat Indy in the opener last year, didn't mean much. I don't think this loss will mean much either.

And yes I am disappointed.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Oh and the biggest positive:

No Injuries.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;575660][B]Someone needs to help me out with this. What did Betts do to get the backlash tonight?[/B] He didn't drop two first down passes like Hagans.

Did you expect a touchdown on those plays where 2 Ravens are in the backfield when he gets the handoff?

At least I can put to bed the he is better than Portis argument.... I remember several heated exchanges over that one.[/quote]

Some people just have it out for him. Just tune it out, no sense in trying to make sense of it.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

It took me 3 1/2 quarters to finally decide to change the channel because for whatever reason I was glued to the disaster on my TV, but finally woke up and realized it was the first preseason game. Players have to learn to gel with each other. Rookies have to get rid of the jitters. and Zorn is not going to show his hand like Gibbs never did. Most of preseason was for the O-line to get their blocking down and D-line to learn where to rush and when. Having said all that....

"WOW" LOL :O[/QUOTE]

You lasted 3 1/2 quarters? My, you ARE a glutton for punishment! I was outta there before the end of the first half. Your comments with respect to what preseason is all about are on point; however, you probably also realize that that applies to BOTH teams. Unfortunately, only one had the drive and desire to come out and play football, while the other merely showed up and went through the motions (pathetically, I might add.)

It would have been more fitting for the 'skins players to have emerged from their locker room last night sporting red rubber noses and huge shoes, stuffed into a number of tiny cars spinning wildly in small circles, with the Redskins band playing that Ringling Brothers favorite, "Enter The Gladiators".

(Heavy Sigh) Only one game under our belts, and already, this year looks just like [the second half] of last year; brace yerselves ladies and germs, methinks it's going to be a loooooong season....

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=Meks;575648]campbell needs more snaps, brady and mcnabb both got more than he did.... and they both took a few shots down the field... 1st preseason game or not, play calling bothered me again from highlights and what im hearing... i was at the eagles game, thier offense looked alot better than ours. w/out westbrook[/quote]

I couldn't agree w/ you more. Brady and McNabb were in there well into the 2nd q and their offenses were waaaaaaaaay better than ours last year.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;575717]Oh and the biggest positive:

No Injuries.[/quote]

Exactly.

Of course you'd like to see things go a little better, but at the same time the 1st preseason game is pretty damn meaningless in the grand scheme of things.

As someone already pointed out we beat Indy a year ago at this time and what did it end up meaning in the long run? Nothing.

On the disappointed meter with 10 being ready to jump off a bridge, I'm at a 2 right now.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;575640]My vote goes to Zorn wanting to save more for the regular season. I know a lot of people are freaking out but preseason really only means so much. I mean in Spurriers first year we were preseason kings and look how much that meant. Last year the Panthers destroyed us on defense and yet we finished 4th overall. Right now a lot of players and coaches are holding back so it's no surprise if teams struggle more then they should.[/quote]

I don't buy it. It was a pre season game for Balt. too and they're playing a 2nd year QB.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;575722]I don't buy it. It was a pre season game for Balt. too and they're playing a 2nd year QB.[/quote]

I keep wondering what people think the Skins are holding back. Its not like they were a Super Bowl contender last year and looking like a favorite again this year, they were a no playoff team. I just dont think the Skins (coaches or players) have the luxury of holding anything back at any time.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=irish;575730]I keep wondering what people think the Skins are holding back. Its not like they were a Super Bowl contender last year and looking like a favorite again this year, they were a no playoff team. I just dont think the Skins (coaches or players) have the luxury of holding anything back at any time.[/quote]

What really pissed me off was CSN had a camera on Snyder and Cerrato before the game talking with Portis and Moss. Just the 4 of them. I just don't get why these two are not getting the reps in when they were two important starters on one of the worst offenses in the NFL. If Randy Moss is playing and running deep pass patterns then these two should certainly be on the field. They need the work! It starts w/ the head coach and he just doesn't command the respect of some players.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;575733]What really pissed me off was CSN had a camera on Snyder and Cerrato before the game talking with Portis and Moss. Just the 4 of them. I just don't get why these two are not getting the reps in when they were two important starters on one of the worst offenses in the NFL. If Randy Moss is playing and running deep pass patterns then these two should certainly be on the field. They need the work! [B]It starts w/ the head coach and he just doesn't command the respect of some players.[/B][/quote]

Do you have proof of that?

Snyder and Cerrato walk around and talk with players before most of the games. They did it at the HOF last year, heck they even talked with the Indy coaches and players.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Maybe all of the naysayers on the board want us to go undefeated in the preseason like the Detroit Lions did last year? Will that make you guys happy?

It's only stinking preseason. It is an "evaluate and get better" process. The starters do not need to get hurt in a game that means nothing. They can gell and get better in practice. Come September 13th, the full complement will be out there as long as they can stay healthy in preseason. So far we are doing well in that department.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

That was a disaster to watch. It was preseason for Balt too (like someone said) and they kicked our butts. They were playing their back ups too. 2nd year coach too. Don't try to rationalize. We weren't a very cohesive unit out there. To be honest w/ you i couldn't watch past the 3rd quarter. Uggggly.

Come on Zorn, do something.

It is just one preseason, plenty of time to "get it straight." I'm not saying we should have played everyone last night, but the next two games...play em. Who ever is not hurt. It's not like we are a top tier offense. We're below average. Play em. We need to give this offensive unit as much playing time as possible.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;575735]Do you have proof of that?

Snyder and Cerrato walk around and talk with players before most of the games. They did it at the HOF last year, heck they even talked with the Indy coaches and players.[/quote]

Yeah I have proof. My own damn eyes! My point is why aren't they over w/ the coaches and the players? I just don't like the vibe of it. It's like, "we're too good for the pre season and we're going to hang out w/ the owner and his butt buddy". Chris Samuels was out there and IMO he's more valuable than CP.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

My final thoughts last nite:
The Good:
1. No injuries-awesome
2. Orakpo preformed better than expected
3. I thought the first team O-line played just fine, JC got time, he was slow to get the ball out
4. This is ONLY the first preseason game
5. Todd Collins looked good
The Bad:
1. The entire offense cant put one freakin drive together to score
2. Fred Davis, come on! that flat out sucked
3. The Baltimore first team offense made our first team D look pretty bad right off the bat
4. Special teams coverage team was lousy
The Ugly:
Justin Tryon on one-one coverage. This is only the first preseason game, build on it, a learning experience. But that wasnt good.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

ah football sure is back.

Overreactions, freak outs, and over analysis.

And... it's only August! Just wait til these things are for real.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;575743]Yeah I have proof. My own damn eyes! My point is why aren't they over w/ the coaches and the players? I just don't like the vibe of it. It's like, "we're too good for the pre season and we're going to hang out w/ the owner and his butt buddy". Chris Samuels was out there and IMO he's more valuable than CP.[/quote]

So they stood there the whole time, didn't do anything with the team... Please thats ridiculous. CP and Moss are out busting their tails at practice and with the team. DS and VC talk to most all the players, and I think you are reading way too much in to a normal scene.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;575733]What really pissed me off was CSN had a camera on Snyder and Cerrato before the game talking with Portis and Moss. Just the 4 of them. I just don't get why these two are not getting the reps in when they were two important starters on one of the worst offenses in the NFL. If Randy Moss is playing and running deep pass patterns then these two should certainly be on the field. They need the work! It starts w/ the head coach and he just doesn't command the respect of some players.[/quote]

Its not that the head coach doesnt command respect, it that players like Portis & Moss know they dont have to answer to Zorn because DS will back them no matter what. Moss & Portis work for DS, not Zorn. The chain of command is screwed up and until the players kknow the head coach is in charge of the team no matter what (and get backed by the front office) the Skins will continue to struggle as on organization.

That said, I dont have a problem with vets not playing in the first pre season game.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=irish;575754]Its not that the head coach doesnt command respect, it that players like Portis & Moss know they dont have to answer to Zorn because DS will back them no matter what. Moss & Portis work for DS, not Zorn. The chain of command is screwed up and until the players kknow the head coach is in charge of the team no matter what (and get backed by the front office) the Skins will continue to struggle as on organization.

That said, I dont have a problem with vets not playing in the first pre season game.[/quote]


I don't think it's that big a deal w/ them talking to DS and Vinny before the game.

With that being said I don't thing Jim Zorn commands the respect other coaches might get. How could he? Snyder hires the coaches, brings in the players, etc. Snyder hired the coaches before Zorn even came in.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=redsk1;575765]I don't think it's that big a deal w/ them talking to DS and Vinny before the game.

With that being said I don't thing Jim Zorn commands the respect other coaches might get. How could he? Snyder hires the coaches, brings in the players, etc. Snyder hired the coaches before Zorn even came in.[/quote]

I agree Zorn doesnt get the respect other coaches get because other coaches know the front office has their back and they are in charge of the team. With the Skins the head coach isnt in charge of the team, the owner is, the players know it and hence any authority Zorn has is undermined. Thats not the way successful teams work.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

I feel sorry for Colt. He waited many months for that opportunity and it did not go well for him. That's my negative.

No one got seriously hurt. That's my positive.

Everything else was a learning experience. I'd rather someone like Tryon learn lessons last night than have him learn them in the regular season.

Chill people, please chill.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;575703]Really? I actually thought the O Line looked pretty decent[/quote]

I have the game recorded, and I went back and looked again. Not sure what game you guys were watching, but I felt like the Oline was pretty pathetic.

The 2nd drive for Campbell, 1st down had great pass-pro, and JC threw a strike to ARE for the 1st down. 1st and 2nd down runs, then the disaster of a line showed their true colors. It is 7vs4, they leave Cooley and Betts alone to handle a guy, and Rhinehart/Raback/Dockery are just "floating in open space doing nothing". When we have 7 guys blocking 4, Jason should have time to make a sandwich back there.....IMO pretty sad.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

For two weeks I have read nothing but post after post that the O line was crap. The starters and 2nd team was really the bright spot last night but some of that might be from all the negative I've heard. Now, I guess I'm going to have and read post after post that Betts needs to go after one preseason game. I know we looked bad but its just one preseason game so lets give it a week or 2 and then assess where we are.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=roth74va;575806]I have the game recorded, and I went back and looked again. Not sure what game you guys were watching, but I felt like the Oline was pretty pathetic.

The 2nd drive for Campbell, 1st down had great pass-pro, and JC threw a strike to ARE for the 1st down. 1st and 2nd down runs, then the disaster of a line showed their true colors. It is 7vs4, they leave Cooley and Betts alone to handle a guy, and Rhinehart/Raback/Dockery are just "floating in open space doing nothing". When we have 7 guys blocking 4, Jason should have time to make a sandwich back there.....IMO pretty sad.[/quote]

I heard that...what I saw was no glaring standouts on the O-Line.

I don't think people are factoring the fact that we couldnt run as part of the O-Line's problem. It was 1.5 yards and a cloud of dust for Betts and then pass protection for short routes only.

That is by no means a good report card for the offensive line. We didn't even score points and if that's not bad enough for you then we barely got past the 50 yard line.

Saying "it's just a preseason game" goes both ways. We barely managed to get past midfield against another NFL team's preseason squad. Poor results if you ask me.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

Firstdown I have been one very critical the last several weeks of the O-line and the FO plan to fix it. I thought the first team O-Line played pretty descent last nite. Protection was good. Cooley missed a block but that was it. The Right Side didnt get much of a push for Betts in the run game, but thats the Ravens run D, its been ass kicking for 10 years straight. Would like nothing better to see more improvement.

Re: Redskins vs Ravens Gameday thread
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;575827]I heard that...what I saw was no glaring standouts on the O-Line.

I don't think people are factoring the fact that we couldnt run as part of the O-Line's problem. It was 1.5 yards and a cloud of dust for Betts and then pass protection for short routes only.

That is by no means a good report card for the offensive line. We didn't even score points and if that's not bad enough for you then we barely got past the 50 yard line.

Saying "it's just a preseason game" goes both ways. We barely managed to get past midfield against another NFL team's preseason squad. Poor results[B] if you ask me[/B].[/quote]

Well no one did Tee but we appreciate your thoughts anyhow. :)