Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633020]If Danny gets rid of Vinny the skins job will be very appealing, all they have to do is rebuild the OL. Campbell will be alright with a rebuilt line and they can draft a young QB for the future in the mid rounds. Whoever coaches this team next year will be inheriting lots of up and coming young players, Thomas, Kelly, Davis, Mitchell, Orakpo, Jarmon, Horton, Edwin Williams, Rinehart, etc. There's talent on this team, execution and attitude have been the problem.[/quote]

:food-smil We just need a smart coach who isn't afraid to bench players and be smart about it.. I'm disappointed that Barnes isn't in that list, or at least not yet.. Barnes looked like he would be good one; he has nice size but he definitely needs to bulk up to compete in NFL level though.. But he's been invisible ever since..

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633020]If Danny gets rid of Vinny the skins job will be very appealing, all they have to do is rebuild the OL. Campbell will be alright with a rebuilt line and they can draft a young QB for the future in the mid rounds. Whoever coaches this team next year will be inheriting lots of up and coming young players, Thomas, Kelly, Davis, Mitchell, Orakpo, Jarmon, Horton, Edwin Williams, Rinehart, etc. There's talent on this team, execution and attitude have been the problem.[/quote]

Exactly. It's not as complicated as it's made out to be.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633020]If Danny gets rid of Vinny the skins job will be very appealing, all they have to do is rebuild the OL.[B] Campbell will be alright with a rebuilt line[/B] and they can draft a young QB for the future in the mid rounds. Whoever coaches this team next year will be inheriting lots of up and coming young players, Thomas, Kelly, Davis, Mitchell, Orakpo, Jarmon, Horton, Edwin Williams, Rinehart, etc. There's talent on this team, execution and attitude have been the problem.[/quote]

Exactly? No not exactly.

#1) DS is done with JC.
#2) JC is done with the front office.
#3) JC is pretty much a gonner.
#4) Build up the OL all you want but his issues still remain.
a- He can't figure out where to realign his protection.
b- He looks gun shy at this point like Ramsey.
c- He fails to find the open receiver often.
d- He has a slow release.
e- He's not all that accurate on the long ball.
f- He has the same amount of time as other QB's right now 3-7 sec. and still has trouble getting the ball to any one.

Rinehart's good young talent? I thought Buges basically called him a failure, then recanted when he realized we were not bringing any other OL. Rinehart was almost camp fodder.

Re: Our next coach??
 

Rebuid the 0-line and JC gets better. It really ISN'T complicated. Will he be elite? Probably not. But does anyone think our record wouldn't be much better with a GOOD o-line? Please...

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633034]Exactly? No not exactly.

#1) DS is done with JC.
#2) JC is done with the front office.
#3) JC is pretty much a gonner.
#4) Build up the OL all you want but his issues still remain.
a- He can't figure out where to realign his protection.
b- He looks gun shy at this point like Ramsey.
c- He fails to find the open receiver often.
d- He has a slow release.
e- He's not all that accurate on the long ball.
f- He has the same amount of time as other QB's right now 3-7 sec. and still has trouble getting the ball to any one.

Rinehart's good young talent? I thought Buges basically called him a failure, then recanted when he realized we were not bringing any other OL. Rinehart was almost camp fodder.[/quote]

And who do you think would be better than Campbell? A rookie? A mediocre FA? Campbell knows the system and hasn't had a healthy consistent OL since he was drafted. If I was DS I would convince him to come back for at least a year. Campbell believe it or not, is these teams best option at QB.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633037]And who do you think would be better than Campbell? A rookie? A mediocre FA? Campbell knows the system and hasn't had a healthy consistent OL since he was drafted. If I was DS I would convince him to come back for at least a year. Campbell believe it or not, is these teams best option at QB.[/quote]

amen, you could put manning (peyton of course) behind this line and we would be marginally better, JC had a miraculous game against Philly and it was because he was so mobile that he didn't suffer like 8 sacks. The O line was dominated and trent cole made levi jones look like a kid. Plus, Stephon Heyer has no business starting on any offensive line in the league...that guy is a joke

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633034]Exactly? No not exactly.

#1) DS is done with JC.
#2) JC is done with the front office.
#3) JC is pretty much a gonner.
#4) Build up the OL all you want but his issues still remain.
a- He can't figure out where to realign his protection.
b- He looks gun shy at this point like Ramsey.
c- He fails to find the open receiver often.
d- He has a slow release.
[B]e- He's not all that accurate on the long ball.[/B]
f- He has the same amount of time as other QB's right now 3-7 sec. and still has trouble getting the ball to any one.

Rinehart's good young talent? I thought Buges basically called him a failure, then recanted when he realized we were not bringing any other OL. Rinehart was almost camp fodder.[/quote]

I think you mean, he's not accurate on the long ball [B]at all[/B].

We keep hearing that he's an accurate downfield passer, but he's been whiffing on those left and right.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633037]And who do you think would be better than Campbell? A rookie? A mediocre FA? [B]Campbell knows the system[/B] and hasn't had a healthy consistent OL since he was drafted. If I was DS I would convince him to come back for at least a year. Campbell believe it or not, is these teams best option at QB.[/quote]

But will the system next year be the same as this year?

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=skinsfan69;633021]I don't give a damn the records. All I care about is can I guy coach or not. Can these guys lead men and get them to play hard. Can they X and O. I think people around the NFL know Weis and Crennel and do both.[/quote]

Just to add. Weren't you talking about bringing in Weis and Crennel (and between the two I'd prefer Weis) as offensive coordinators, not head coach?

Also, Carmichael and Christensen are not more proven than Weis

And I don't think Buges ever called Rinehart a failure.

Re: Our next coach??
 

What if Gary Kubiak, having been fired by the Texans, is our offensive coordinator next year?

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=53Fan;633036]Rebuid the 0-line and JC gets better. It really ISN'T complicated. Will he be elite? Probably not. But does anyone think our record wouldn't be much better with a GOOD o-line? Please...[/quote]

I 100% agree with you. To me the O-line is the most important thing right now and yes given all day to throw I guess JC would be a better QB.

I guess I should not have thrown so much at everyone at one time....

I doubt JC stays with the Skins. Period.

Next issue. We do need to build up the O-line for whoever is here be it a Rookie or vet from another team.

Next issue. Unless we are keeping Zorn there will be a whole new scheme to learn JC will have no one upsmanship on anyone.

Next issue. Right now JC is being given the same amount of time to get rid of the ball as many other QB's on other teams. The difference is the other teams are making adjustments for the QB to get the ball out throughout the whole game faster to avoid the rush. Other teams QB's seem to be able to move their protection around better in order to avoid the rush.

Next issue. JC is not accurate at all on the long balls.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;633037]And [B]who do you think would be better than Campbell? A rookie? A mediocre FA? [/B]Campbell knows the system and hasn't had a healthy consistent OL since he was drafted. If I was DS I would convince him to come back for at least a year. Campbell believe it or not, is these teams best option at QB.[/quote]

Keep in mind Campbell will be one of those mediocre FA's after this yr. :)

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=Beemnseven;633051]But will the system next year be the same as this year?[/quote]

Atleast some one is thinking with their dip stick. Thank You.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633065][B]Just to add. Weren't you talking about bringing in Weis and Crennel (and between the two I'd prefer Weis) as offensive coordinators, [/B]not head coach?

Also, Carmichael and Christensen are not more proven than Weis

And I don't think Buges ever called Rinehart a failure.[/quote]

Yes they were. Sorry. I just don't see the fascination with Weis after having a bad year at the college level. Crennel has had many jobs and has not been spectacular. If I had to pick as well I guess Weis but I don't like either. Can someone atleast pick a college coach that is having a winning season and maybe has had one for several yrs if we are going to dip into the college ranks again? Preferably one that utilizes a pro style of system.
I don't know who that would be cause I'm not into college so have fun looking into names. I just know when I hear that a man is either fired or resigns at the college level does not give me the warm fuzzy feeling to bringing him in to the Skins.

Carmichael and Christensen may not be more proven but they are currently OCers for winning teams right now that are 10-0 vs. a college coach with a losing record Weis. I'll take the other two over Weis.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=Lotus;633066]What if Gary Kubiak, having been fired by the Texans, is our offensive coordinator next year?[/quote]

I would die. His offense sucks....which is why he might get fired. Part of the issue might be Shanahan's son which slightly bothers me thinking if dad is hired here son may follow. Hopefully the son has been having his hands tied by Kubiak.

Re: Our next coach??
 

Regardless of his lack of success in college Weis is a proven NFL coordinator. He's not going to have a problem getting a job in the NFL. Some guys just aren't cut out for head coach, and the college game is a different animal. Success there doesn't always translate to the NFL and vice versa.

Re: Our next coach??
 

^ I respect that thought. Maybe Weis gets a job and lights it up. I'll happily eat my crow if I'm wrong.

I see Crennel or people talk about him and I see all the NFL networks commercials running through my head.

Edit: sorry Coors light commercials.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633087]Yes they were. Sorry. I just don't see the fascination with Weis after having a bad year at the college level. Crennel has had many jobs and has not been spectacular. If I had to pick as well I guess Weis but I don't like either. Can someone atleast pick a college coach that is having a winning season and maybe has had one for several yrs if we are going to dip into the college ranks again? Preferably one that utilizes a pro style of system.
I don't know who that would be cause I'm not into college so have fun looking into names. I just know when I hear that a man is either fired or resigns at the college level does not give me the warm fuzzy feeling to bringing him in to the Skins.

Carmichael and Christensen may not be more proven but they are currently OCers for winning teams right now that are 10-0 vs. a college coach with a losing record Weis. I'll take the other two over Weis.[/quote]

Weis, as Matty pointed out, has proven himself to be an effective and successful offensive coordinator for many years in the NFL. Don't confuse what he accomplished as a college head coach with what he has and can accomplish as an NFL offensive coordinator. Plus, as has been mentioned previously, offense was not really the problem at Notre Dame. It was the defense. The defense gave up 30 points 6 times this season. 3 of those times, Notre Dame's offense scored 30 points and they still lost

Also, Carmichael (former Marty disciple) doesn't really call the plays in New Orleans. Not that his contributions during the week aren't important.

And let's see how good Christensen would be as offensive coordinator with say Ryan Fitzpatrick as his QB, and not Peyton Manning

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633089]I would die. His offense sucks....which is why he might get fired. Part of the issue might be Shanahan's son which slightly bothers me thinking if dad is hired here son may follow. Hopefully the son has been having his hands tied by Kubiak.[/quote]

Aren't the Texans ranked in the top 10 in offense? Weren't they in the top 5 last year?

I think they've scored at least 3 touchdowns in a game six or seven times this year.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633102]Aren't the Texans ranked in the top 10 in offense? Weren't they in the top 5 last year?

I think they've scored at least 3 touchdowns in a game six or seven times this year.[/quote]

Under Kubiak the offense is 8th in yards this year and 11th in points. Defense is 17th in yards, 18th in points.

Last year they were 3rd in yards and 17th in points. Defense was 22nd in yards, 27th in points.

I would say offense really isn't their problem. Kubiak may be one of those guys better suited for a coodinator position over HC I think.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633100]Weis, as Matty pointed out, has proven himself to be an effective and successful offensive coordinator for many years in the NFL. Don't confuse what he accomplished as a college head coach with what he has and can accomplish as an NFL offensive coordinator. Plus, as has been mentioned previously, offense was not really the problem at Notre Dame. It was the defense. The defense gave up 30 points 6 times this season. 3 of those times, Notre Dame's offense scored 30 points and they still lost

Also, Carmichael (former Marty disciple) doesn't really call the plays in New Orleans. Not that his contributions during the week aren't important.

And let's see how good Christensen would be as offensive coordinator with say Ryan Fitzpatrick as his QB, and not Peyton Manning[/quote]

Then perhaps Weis would be a good OC. Carmichael may not call the plays but according to his bio he is instrumental in helping develope the plays/scheme and designing each weeks game plan. but you are correct calling plays maybe a whole nother ball game for him. Unless he could find someone who could do that for him.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=Mattyk72;633104]Under Kubiak the offense is 8th in yards this year and 11th in points. Defense is 17th in yards, 18th in points.

Last year they were 3rd in yards and 17th in points. Defense was 22nd in yards, 27th in points.

I would say offense really isn't their problem. Kubiak may be one of those guys better suited for a coodinator position over HC I think.[/quote]


I'm not sure what side of the ball Kubiak leans towards. If you go and look at Houston now I think all their yrds are from passing which they are either middle of the pack to top 10. Rushing yrds I think the Skins are better then them right now. That could be who they have running the ball though.

At first glance I thought Smoot was refering to my asking who in the college ranks with a winning record would be good and Texas is 12-0.

Cincinnati 11-0
Ohio State 10-2
Iowa 10-2
Penn State 10-2
Georgia Tech 10-2

Again I don't watch college ball. I'm just throwing teams out there that have decent records right now. Others may be better at decifering which coach's have been winners year in and year out and which coach's would most likely transfer to the pros better. It might even be one with a losing record simply cause he didn't have the players needed or injuries.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633110][B]Then perhaps Weis would be a good OC.[/B] Carmichael may not call the plays but according to his bio he is instrumental in helping develope the plays/scheme and designing each weeks game plan. but you are correct calling plays maybe a whole nother ball game for him. Unless he could find someone who could do that for him.[/quote]

Which is what I think Skinsfan69, myself, and others have been talking about. I don't think any of us, definitely not me, are calling for him to be our next head coach.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633111]I'm not sure what side of the ball Kubiak leans towards. If you go and look at Houston now I think all their yrds are from passing which they are either middle of the pack to top 10. Rushing yrds I think the Skins are better then them right now. That could be who they have running the ball though.

At first glance I thought Smoot was refering to my asking who in the college ranks with a winning record would be good and Texas is 12-0.

Cincinnati 11-0
Ohio State 10-2
Iowa 10-2
Penn State 10-2
Georgia Tech 10-2

Again I don't watch college ball. I'm just throwing teams out there that have decent records right now. Others may be better at decifering which coach's have been winners year in and year out and which coach's would most likely transfer to the pros better. It might even be one with a losing record simply cause he didn't have the players needed or injuries.[/quote]

Kubiak was a QB coach, so I'd imagine he leans toward passing

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633111]I'm not sure what side of the ball Kubiak leans towards. If you go and look at Houston now I think all their yrds are from passing which they are either middle of the pack to top 10. Rushing yrds I think the Skins are better then them right now. That could be who they have running the ball though.[/quote]

He's an offensive guy.

Re: Our next coach??
 

Ok, I took the time to google and look up Weis in Wiki. It was dificult for me I'll have you know. LOL. Just kidding.

Here's the important part.....

[B]He served as offensive coordinator under head coach Bill Belichick from 2000 through 2004, installing the Erhardt - Perkins offensive system, and assisting the Patriots in three Super Bowl victories (XXXVI, XXXVIII, XXXIX).[/B]


I guess my question is what is the "Erhardt-Perkins offensive system"? Who was Erhardt and Perkins? Cause Weis is a deciple of Bill Parcells.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633120]Ok, I took the time to google and look up Weis in Wiki. It was dificult for me I'll have you know. LOL. Just kidding.

Here's the important part.....

[B]He served as offensive coordinator under head coach Bill Belichick from 2000 through 2004, installing the Erhardt - Perkins offensive system, and assisting the Patriots in three Super Bowl victories (XXXVI, XXXVIII, XXXIX).[/B]


I guess my question is what is the "Erhardt-Perkins offensive system"? Who was Erhardt and Perkins? Cause Weis is a deciple of Bill Parcells.[/quote]

So you looked up Weis but why not just look up Erhardt - Perkins offensive system too? Anyway here's your answer:

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_Patriots_strategy]New England Patriots strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/url]

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=Mattyk72;633122][B]So you looked up Weis but why not just look up Erhardt - Perkins offensive system too? [/B]Anyway here's your answer:

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_Patriots_strategy"]New England Patriots strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL][/quote]

Ummm, pure lazyness? Sorry. Actually I didn't even think to look up the system. Weird. I immediatly thought to go there to see what they had on Weis then I guess my brain shut down. LOL.

Re: Our next coach??
 

So now looking at the material picking up Weis might not be a bad idea but obviously Shanahan would not be the right HC for his system. I think Shanahan runs a type of WCO. So who do we pick up as HC?

Re: Our next coach??
 

If we hire Shanahan I doubt Weis would be considered at all.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633111][B]I'm not sure what side of the ball Kubiak leans towards.[/B] If you go and look at Houston now I think all their yrds are from passing which they are either middle of the pack to top 10. Rushing yrds I think the Skins are better then them right now. That could be who they have running the ball though.

At first glance I thought Smoot was refering to my asking who in the college ranks with a winning record would be good and Texas is 12-0.

Cincinnati 11-0
Ohio State 10-2
Iowa 10-2
Penn State 10-2
Georgia Tech 10-2

Again I don't watch college ball. I'm just throwing teams out there that have decent records right now. Others may be better at decifering which coach's have been winners year in and year out and which coach's would most likely transfer to the pros better. It might even be one with a losing record simply cause he didn't have the players needed or injuries.[/quote]

He was the OC under Shanahan in Denver before becoming the Texans head coach.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;630816]There's also always Gregg Williams as an option. So long as Vinny goes, Williams is a possibility. But Snyder won't let him be more than just head coach.[/quote]

I'm going to remain apprehensive about this entire process of selecting a new coach until I see if Vinny stays or goes. It's not so much about the coach as it is who's making the decisions regarding the coach.

The reason Williams was not seen as a viable choice from the beginning was the control factor. With Cerrato and Snyder set to go on their next voyage, I fear we're going to end up with another yes-man, handcuffed and given limited authority. Strong willed personalities do not mesh well with this administration despite the fact that's what this team needs.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=Mattyk72;633138]If we hire Shanahan I doubt Weis would be considered at all.[/quote]

I can see DoubleG bringing in Weiss, though. The more I think about it, DoubleG likely becomes the primary "Plan B" for Snyder should he be unable to secure any of the big name guys.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SBXVII;633126]So now looking at the material picking up Weis might not be a bad idea but obviously Shanahan would not be the right HC for his system. I think Shanahan runs a type of WCO. So who do we pick up as HC?[/quote]

It's kind of funny how you were all anti-Weis for several posts...yet hadn't really given much thought to his actual background other than he was just fired by Notre Dame as head coach.

Anyhow, Weis and Shanahan probably wouldn't and won't be a good combo. Weis and Cowher on the other hand...

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633065]Just to add. Weren't you talking about bringing in Weis and Crennel (and between the two I'd prefer Weis) as offensive coordinators, not head coach?

Also, Carmichael and Christensen are not more proven than Weis

And I don't think Buges ever called Rinehart a failure.[/quote]

I'd want either one or the other to be HC. It really doesn't matter to me cause one will run the offense and one will run the defense and they'll bring in some assistants that can coach. Plus we woudn't play this conservative brand of football anymore.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633065]Just to add. Weren't you talking about bringing in Weis and Crennel (and between the two I'd prefer Weis) as offensive coordinators, not head coach?

[B]Also, Carmichael and Christensen are not more proven than Weis[/B]

And I don't think Buges ever called Rinehart a failure.[/quote]

Yeah this made no sense to me. Neither guy calls plays. Plus wasn't Peyton Manning bitching about how there "wasn't a lot of coaching going on" when Tom Moore wasn't around during the off season workouts? No thanks.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=skinsfan69;633172]I'd want either one or the other to be HC. It really doesn't matter to me cause one will run the offense and one will run the defense and they'll bring in some assistants that can coach. Plus we woudn't play this conservative brand of football anymore.[/quote]

Oh. I was thinking of Weis as a coordinator. Hadn't realized you were talking about him as a head coach.

Re: Our next coach??
 

I'd take Weis as an OC, but definitely NOT as a HC.

Re: Our next coach??
 

Weis is going to end up in NE where he belongs w/ Belichick.

Re: Our next coach??
 

[quote=SmootSmack;633162]It's kind of funny how you were all anti-Weis for several posts...yet hadn't really given much thought to his actual background other than he was just fired by Notre Dame as head coach.

Anyhow, Weis and Shanahan probably wouldn't and won't be a good combo. Weis and Cowher on the other hand...[/quote]

IMO, that would be an amazing combination and would definitely be a move that would be absolutely brilliant for this team. Unfortunately, Snyder and Cowher aren't interested in eachother from what i've read.