Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;770221]Just read thru this entire thread... WOW!

Let me pose a few questions here:


1. After reading hundreds of posts here, I doubt that the name Bruce Allen was mentioned a dozen times. If he is the General Manager - - the guy so many folks around here were so happy to see come on board - - and an actual participant in personnel decisions, why hasn't anyone mentioned his name? Might it be that he is no more an actual GM than Francis the Talking Mule? If he really is a General Manager and a "player" in team decisions, then what are his thoughts and what was his role in the handling of the Haynesworth debacle and now the McNabb controversy? :sleep:

My take: Bruce Allen's biggest responsibility is making sure the Gatorade jugs are full on game day... :twocents:

2. In his tenure as the MOFO in Washington, Mike Shanahan has had three "sticky" personnel situations to handle. Which one did he handle with the greatest "aplomb"[INDENT][B]A. Joey Galloway [/B]- - took almost 3 mos to realize he can't play anymore and to screw up the courage to jettison him. :confused-

[B]B. Albert Haynesworth [/B]- -that was a goat rope from the first time the two of them sat down together. :nono:

[B]C. Donovan McNabb [/B]- - twice actually, the Detroit benching and the current benching that have been handled so constructively. :censored:
[/INDENT]3. If you were the GM - - a real GM not a pretend GM - - for another NFL team and you wanted McNabb for your team next year, would the events of this week make you want to hurry up and make a pre-emptively high offer to trade for him - - or make you want to low-ball the Skins because you know the probablyity that McNabb is coming back next year is really low? :(


4. Who brings more in trade value now - - Hayneswworth or McNabb? Would either one bring anything more than a conditional 5th round pick? :Flush:


5. If Rex lights it up this week and leads the Skins to a last minute win over the Cowboys by a score of 42-37 by throwing his fifth TD pass of the day in the final seconds, the Shanahans might think he is worth starting next year. Therefore, if the Redskins start Rex Grossman for 14 games next season (don't know if there will be 16 games or 18 games), what is the over/under on victories? My O/U would be 5.5. :doh:


6. Shanahan said that making McNabb the #3 QB starting with the Jax game was because he wanted to see how John Beck handled himself as the #2 QB. On the assumption that the #1 QB is not carried off the field on a gurney, exactly what does the #2 QB do that the #3 QB does not do? Does the #2 QB wear a baseball cap and the #3 QB wears only a visor? :confused:


7. And the biggest question of all:


[B][COLOR=red]R You In?[/COLOR][/B][/quote]

Number 2 qb prepares more for the game then the number 3 qb. MS is saying he does not need to see anything else from NcNabb which could mean he is thinking about his back up or he is looking to see if we have ayone who could be our #1 qb next year. I think thats the question no one knows the answer to.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

This team was a loser before way McNabb got here. But McNabb is being made to be the fall guy by the press that does not understand football and some of the short sighted fans. That is the big story.
Shanahan and his incredibly poor communications and leadership skills is letting some of the players take the fall uncontested. The stink is not sticking to him yet so he will keep his mouth shut.
According to the pro-Shanahan posts on this thread it is everyone fault but the Shanahan's. To say we do not have enough talent is a cop out. Teams like Cleveland that had less talent than us when this season started are now showing signs of improvement as the season goes on. That is what great coaches do is coach up their struggling or less talented players and help them improve, not bench them and treat them like they do not belong. Shanahan does not inspire his players.
What alarms me the most and it is getting louder and louder, is all along the way since Shanahan has arrived he continues to show poor leadership skills and make bad decisions.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

^ so are you saying fire MS and start over again?? That's what it sounds like to me

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;770241]^ so are you saying fire MS and start over again?? That's what it sounds like to me[/quote]


Do you always put words into other peoples mouth? :biggthump
Get your hearing checked.
I have never said that.
I am just saying it has been a roast Haynesworth, Mcnabb and the players, but handle wonderful great coach differently.
What established FA veteran is going to want to come here next year with the way Shanahan has Thrown MCNABB UNDER THE BUS!

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

^ lol not trying to put words in anybodys mouth man, and yes I disagree with how Mcnabb was treated this season, Shanny though he was the next John elway and it's just not the case. I don't think he's trying to blame 5 for this whole season but honestly Mcnabb hasn't played well and if he was JC we would have been calling for grossman weeks ago

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

^My point was....In the NFL, after a season of major underachievement there is always a fall guy, an offensive coordinator or defensive coordinator gets fired so there is an appearance of positive change. Since the Offensive Coordinator is the Dictator's son, could McNabb be set up as the fall guy? Maybe.
All of the leaks in the press is very unproductive and unprofessional.
Shanahan has his share of the blame for the dysfunction on his team and it is growing daily.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

^ ok I see eat your saying, last year the fall guy was zorn and JC and yes this yr it will be Mcnabb and AH, unfortunately when you are a losing franchise every season this happens. It's getting pretty normal for us redskins fans IMO

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

I have always been in the camp that says it is the lack of sufficient talent on the 2010 Redskins that has produced the "no playoffs status" this year. Coaches are not magicians; they are not miracle-workers.

Coaches - - particularly the good ones - - can look at their preferred "systems" and "schemes" when those systems/schemes are not working and make adaptations that better fit the talent shortage they are working with.

It is that kind of adaptation that I have not seen a whole lot of this year. And one thing that concerns me is the "my way or the highway" approach that seems to have taken root at Redskins Park. Yes, the coach has to be in charge and yes he has to be the leader. But there are leadership styles that include other forms of communication than "Do it, dammit!"

I do NOT want to see Mike Shanahan fired nor do I want to see him resign from his job. I would like for him to take a bit more of the blame/responsibility for the results of the 2010 season because there are things that are his fault (particularly since the consensus here is that he is the MOFO in charge of all football matters) such as:


1. You had to see on film that the OL in 2009 stunk in spades. You made a couple of moves to improve it - - drafting Williams, changing out Dockery, acquiring J. Brown/A. Hicks. Other than Trent Williams, it ain't all that much better. That is on Shanahan.


2. You had to notice from your film study that the WR corps on the 2009 team was "deficient". You made some moves to try to improve it - - J. Galloway, R. Williams, Armstrong. Out of all that, you have a marginal #3 WR in Armstrong and not much else. That is on Shanahan.


So, when might he admit that it was his mistakes and his misjudgments that failed to improve the team significantly in those areas. Those things were not Donovan McNabb's fault; they were not Albert Haynesworth's fault, they were not anyone's fault except for the guy who did not bring in enough raw talent to make sigmificant improvements to those units.

And if Danny Boy isn't making decisions anymore and Bruce Allen is making his contributions on the fiscal responsibility front, the number of "suspects" is narrow enough that we need not hire Sherlock Holmes to crack the case.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

I was never a fan of Shanahan . In my view Shanahan only took this job to give his son a chance to be a head coach. Let's face it Kyle Shanahan's stock as a future head coach has taken a hit. Blood is thicker than water. This is all about blaming someone to protect his son. If anyone on this planet believes Rex Grossman gives any team on this planet a better chance to win you are nuts. Rex Grossman? I think the way Shanahan goes about business is disrespectful to the Redskin fanbase. We are not stupid . Maybe the only people impressed Shanny are all members of that terrible forum that is the official website of the Redskins. I love my Redskins but I want Shanny fired. I never wanted Mcnabb here. Classy dude but he is a Eagle.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Defensewins;770247]^My point was....In the NFL, after a season of major underachievement there is always a fall guy, an offensive coordinator or defensive coordinator gets fired so there is an appearance of positive change. Since the Offensive Coordinator is the Dictator's son, could McNabb be set up as the fall guy? Maybe.
All of the leaks in the press is very unproductive and unprofessional.
Shanahan has his share of the blame for the dysfunction on his team and it is growing daily.[/quote]

Like I said this is all about protecting his son . I have seen better play calling in Madden 11 online

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

All Kyle needed to do was ride it out as the Texans OC with that high powered offense for a few more years and he would have wrote his own ticket to a HC job.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=THE TRUTH DETECTOR;770263]Like I said this is all about protecting his son . I have seen better play calling in Madden 11 online[/quote]

Probably me bcuz im a beast on madden..

And if u say fire mike who do u want as HC? Haven't we done this enough people????!!!

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;770250]I have always been in the camp that says it is the lack of sufficient talent on the 2010 Redskins that has produced the "no playoffs status" this year. Coaches are not magicians; they are not miracle-workers.

Coaches - - particularly the good ones - - can look at their preferred "systems" and "schemes" when those systems/schemes are not working and make adaptations that better fit the talent shortage they are working with.

It is that kind of adaptation that I have not seen a whole lot of this year. And one thing that concerns me is the "my way or the highway" approach that seems to have taken root at Redskins Park. Yes, the coach has to be in charge and yes he has to be the leader. But there are leadership styles that include other forms of communication than "Do it, dammit!"

I do NOT want to see Mike Shanahan fired nor do I want to see him resign from his job. I would like for him to take a bit more of the blame/responsibility for the results of the 2010 season because there are things that are his fault (particularly since the consensus here is that he is the MOFO in charge of all football matters) such as:

[B]
1. You had to see on film that the OL in 2009 stunk in spades. You made a couple of moves to improve it - - drafting Williams, changing out Dockery, acquiring J. Brown/A. Hicks. Other than Trent Williams, it ain't all that much better. That is on Shanahan.


2. You had to notice from your film study that the WR corps on the 2009 team was "deficient". You made some moves to try to improve it - - J. Galloway, R. Williams, Armstrong. Out of all that, you have a marginal #3 WR in Armstrong and not much else. That is on Shanahan.[/B]


So, when might he admit that it was his mistakes and his misjudgments that failed to improve the team significantly in those areas. Those things were not Donovan McNabb's fault; they were not Albert Haynesworth's fault, they were not anyone's fault except for the guy who did not bring in enough raw talent to make sigmificant improvements to those units.

And if Danny Boy isn't making decisions anymore and Bruce Allen is making his contributions on the fiscal responsibility front, the number of "suspects" is narrow enough that we need not hire Sherlock Holmes to crack the case.[/quote]

There is no way, in one season, anyone was going to fix all the holes, including OL, RB, WR, QB (and that's offense alone!). He had to replace 4 offensive lineman. That is no easy task.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Mattyk;770264]All Kyle needed to do was ride it out as the Texans OC with that high powered offense for a few more years and he would have wrote his own ticket to a HC job.[/quote]Like Josh McDaniels did. McDaniels got fired (probably prematurely) for a number of things he did that were unprofessional and created a losing culture. I don't think Kyle Shanahan has done anything unprofessional while he's been here, and sure his offense might work, but if Gary Kubiak is available and wants to coordinate Mike Shanahan's offense and we don't go after him because the role of OC on this team is already filled by Kyle, how committed to winning is this team?

Kyle Shanahan would land on his feet and would go on to a pretty nice coaching career if he got fired, but if Mike Shanahan has the guts to tell Donovan McNabb that he's just not good enough for his offense, but doesn't have the guts to tell his son that he has someone better to run his offense...well, that's why you don't hire your offspring, at least before you're established at your current job.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

The sad thing is that this season feels so much like last year with the team seemingly self destructing. Us fans deserve so much better than what we have been getting.

It has taken me until about 3 weeks now to come to realize that this is all Dan Snyder's doing. He maybe a great buisness man in the coorperate world, but the vision and the buisness model he has for our Redskins is SHIT!

I highly encourage all of the fans that will attend the last few games at FedEx this year, to boo the piss out them every chance they get. Dan S. needs to hear the boos echo throughout the stadium. Boo so much that the talking heads on national tv make regular comments about it.

Dan S. you have made this once proud franchise your toliet, and us fans are fed the F up about it! R U in? F you Dan and EVERTHING about this sorry ass team!

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

I dont know why everyone is hating on Rex Grossman. Yeah, the guy did poorly for a couple year in Chicago, but inmy opinion the Chicago Bears were worse off on the offensive side of the football then we are now back then.

Mcnabb has played BELOW Average this year. He has missed several WR's. Underthrown several more. Anthony Armstrong should have atleast 2-3 more TD's this year. Moss was wide open last week in the endzone waiting for the pass, and this has happen week in, an week out. If this was J.C. everyone would be screaming for the backup, or if it was Brunell a few years ago. Everyone would be sceremaing for the backup.

Mcnabb just doesn't fit this offense. I would think it would take him 3-4 years to learn it. He can't even run the WHOLE offense yet. I mean we always talk about how predictable we are on offense. Alot of it has to do with not being able to run half the playbook.

I'm excited to see what Grossman can do. Maybe him earning his roster spot will put some fire under him, and make him perform at a top level. I mean he can't get any worse then Mcnabb has been this year.

I don't really want to hear about the "talent" level we have. There has been several times like in Philly pt. 1. Where we ran the ball for over 120 yards, but Mcnabb still couldn't find open WR's down the field, and it wasn't because they were not open. Its because he didn't even find them.

The week before last it was 3rd and 5, and Armstrong right a flat pattern out of a trips set, and was wide open for atleast 15 yards in front of him, and Mcnabb had plenty of time but threw it into double coverage LOW to Cooley. 70% of the time Mcnabb is throwing low to our WR's so they never get any yards after the catch. They ahve to catch it off the ground like Moss's catch last week that was ruled incomplete because it was 2 yards behind him and low.. I mean.. That's a 15 yard pass to and OPEN WR.

I'm excited about tomorrow. I wanna see what Rex can do. If anything it makes us younger at the QB position, and if he does well it could give us some stability for a change.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

The Redskins have a lot of problems.
1. We have a revolving coaching door.
2. We have a terrible offensive live.
3. We have a terrible defensive scheme to match the players we currently have.
4. We have no depth at virtually all positions.
5. We have an old team. THE OLDEST TEAM. Maybe ever.
6. We have some diva head case players that cause problems.
7. We have virtually no picks in every draft because of Cerrato.
8. We had Vinny Cerrato.
9. Vinny Cerrato used to make personnel decisions.
10. Dan Snyder.

Here is how I see it. I say this all the time on here. Winning cures all ills. We have not had a winning culture in DC for a long time. We have an owner with good intensions and a terrible track record. We had Vinny making decisions with an even worse track record who left our future in shambles with aging rental veterans and no draft picks.

People are so polarizing in these posts. Its either Shanny's fault b/c of his inability to relate to players and make stupid decisions, or its the fault of players. Well, last I checked, teams are winners or losers not by one person, but by all people together. Owner, front office, coach, staff, players, everyone. We haven't had a real good track record with any of that lately.

Has Shanny made some stupid moves? Yes. Do a lot of our players suck? Yes. Do we need to rebuild and do things a different way? I think so, and I think progress is being made. My point is, Rome wasn't built in a day. This shit that we are in took a long time to cook up and its going to take a long time to get out of. Yes Shanny has made some stupid decisions but I think he has been laying it out there the way you have to in order to get something good to come out of a team.

Zornification of a team is not going to work. That has been proven. People that are saying Shanny is going to get fired, that he isn't good for the team, are stupid. No he hasn't been perfect, but its going to take many years and a hard nosed approach to getting this ship turned around and headed in the right direction. I for one have been saying for awhile we need to take the Bucs approach to blowing up this team, dropping all the dead weight veterans and infusing the team with free agent and drafted youth.

The bottom line is what we have been doing has not been working and I would be a much happier fan sitting through several years of losing football with a youthful team with upside and the possibility to get better than the old, falling apart mess we have been witnessing for so long.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=SkinzWin;770295]The Redskins have a lot of problems.
1. We have a revolving coaching door.
2. We have a terrible offensive live.
3. We have a terrible defensive scheme to match the players we currently have.
4. We have no depth at virtually all positions.
5.[B] We have an old team. THE OLDEST TEAM. Maybe ever.[/B]
6. We have some diva head case players that cause problems.
7. We have virtually no picks in every draft because of Cerrato.
8. We had Vinny Cerrato.
9. Vinny Cerrato used to make personnel decisions.
10. Dan Snyder.

Here is how I see it. I say this all the time on here. Winning cures all ills. We have not had a winning culture in DC for a long time. We have an owner with good intensions and a terrible track record. We had Vinny making decisions with an even worse track record who left our future in shambles with aging rental veterans and no draft picks.

People are so polarizing in these posts. Its either Shanny's fault b/c of his inability to relate to players and make stupid decisions, or its the fault of players. Well, last I checked, teams are winners or losers not by one person, but by all people together. Owner, front office, coach, staff, players, everyone. We haven't had a real good track record with any of that lately.

Has Shanny made some stupid moves? Yes. Do a lot of our players suck? Yes. Do we need to rebuild and do things a different way? I think so, and I think progress is being made. My point is, Rome wasn't built in a day. This shit that we are in took a long time to cook up and its going to take a long time to get out of. Yes Shanny has made some stupid decisions but I think he has been laying it out there the way you have to in order to get something good to come out of a team.

Zornification of a team is not going to work. That has been proven. People that are saying Shanny is going to get fired, that he isn't good for the team, are stupid. No he hasn't been perfect, but its going to take many years and a hard nosed approach to getting this ship turned around and headed in the right direction. I for one have been saying for awhile we need to take the Bucs approach to blowing up this team, dropping all the dead weight veterans and infusing the team with free agent and drafted youth.

The bottom line is what we have been doing has not been working and I would be a much happier fan sitting through several years of losing football with a youthful team with upside and the possibility to get better than the old, falling apart mess we have been witnessing.[/quote]


The Raiders of the early 2000's would disagree

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;770296]The Raiders of the early 2000's would disagree[/quote]

We don't have the Al Davis voodoo magic. And this ain't yo momma's early 2000's football league anymore. It's 2010. If it was going to work like it did for the Raiders, it would have already happened.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=SkinzWin;770297]We don't have the Al Davis voodoo magic. And this ain't yo momma's early 2000's football league anymore. It's 2010. If it was going to work like it did for the Raiders, it would have already happened.[/quote]

Oh I agree that we are too old to win but I was saying the Raiders may have been older than this team back then lol.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;770298]Oh I agree that we are too old to win but I was saying the Raiders may have been older than this team back then lol.[/QUOTE]

Only because of Rich Gannon. lol

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

Why resign McNabb and even keep him if he is moving down the depth chart?

AND I WANT A REFUND ON MY MCNABB JERSEY AND THE ONE I BOUGHT FOR THE GF, THIS IS BS !!!!!!

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Bucket;770293]I dont know why everyone is hating on Rex Grossman. Yeah, the guy did poorly for a couple year in Chicago, but inmy opinion the Chicago Bears were worse off on the offensive side of the football then we are now back then.

Mcnabb has played BELOW Average this year. He has missed several WR's. Underthrown several more. Anthony Armstrong should have atleast 2-3 more TD's this year. Moss was wide open last week in the endzone waiting for the pass, and this has happen week in, an week out. If this was J.C. everyone would be screaming for the backup, or if it was Brunell a few years ago. Everyone would be sceremaing for the backup.

Mcnabb just doesn't fit this offense. I would think it would take him 3-4 years to learn it. He can't even run the WHOLE offense yet. I mean we always talk about how predictable we are on offense. Alot of it has to do with not being able to run half the playbook.

I'm excited to see what Grossman can do. Maybe him earning his roster spot will put some fire under him, and make him perform at a top level. I mean he can't get any worse then Mcnabb has been this year.

I don't really want to hear about the "talent" level we have. There has been several times like in Philly pt. 1. Where we ran the ball for over 120 yards, but Mcnabb still couldn't find open WR's down the field, and it wasn't because they were not open. Its because he didn't even find them.

The week before last it was 3rd and 5, and Armstrong right a flat pattern out of a trips set, and was wide open for atleast 15 yards in front of him, and Mcnabb had plenty of time but threw it into double coverage LOW to Cooley. 70% of the time Mcnabb is throwing low to our WR's so they never get any yards after the catch. They ahve to catch it off the ground like Moss's catch last week that was ruled incomplete because it was 2 yards behind him and low.. I mean.. That's a 15 yard pass to and OPEN WR.

I'm excited about tomorrow. I wanna see what Rex can do. If anything it makes us younger at the QB position, and if he does well it could give us some stability for a change.[/quote]
I'm not excited, but I do think the offense will be livelier tomorrow. I also agree that we should actually let Grossman show his stuff here before hanging him.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Dread-Skin;770301]Why resign McNabb and even keep him if he is moving down the depth chart?

AND I WANT A REFUND ON MY MCNABB JERSEY AND THE ONE I BOUGHT FOR THE GF, THIS IS BS !!!!!![/quote]

That's y I buy the Chinese fakes lmao

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

I'm personally more interested in seeing what Beck can do so hopefully he'll get a shot.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

I support the coaches decision Mcnabb has done nothing to deserve to keep playing, besides that we need a high 1st round pick. Who better to help than sexy Tech.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=GTripp0012;770087]Carolina is going to get Luck if he comes out, no doubt. But he's a 21 year old kid who would be passing up a legitimate shot to win the national championship to go first overall in a year where he doesn't even get to read the CBA under which he will sign his contract before he declares. That's a terrible deal for the kid.

His major is architectural design at Stanford. You don't study that for three years to decide to get your degree later. Just saying.[/quote]

The Panthers drafted 2 qb's last years NFL draft in Jimmy Clausen and Pike kid from Cinncinati. It will be interesting to see if they spend another high pick on a young QB again this coming draft.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=htownskinfan;770095]I just cant believe the mess ShanaASS has made of skins.I hope Snyder fires him after the season,theres no way anybody could be worse.But with the lockout looming along with ShanaASS's contract dont see it happening.Probably keep Haslett also.[/quote]

Fire Shanny after 1 season are you on crack or what? Thats exactley what the old Synder may have done but anyone that knows football you just dont hire and fire coach year after year and expect to be a winning team.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

according to
[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/17/AR2010121704572_2.html?sid=ST2010121706876]Thomas Boswell - Donovan McNabb benching: Mike Shanahan wears two hats and should add a third - dunce cap[/url]

McNabbs numbers : He's passed for 3,377 yards, seventh best in the NFL, and was on pace for his first 4,000-yard season. Also, under a constant battering, he's turned the ball over 16 times, 15 on interceptions but only one on a fumble.....[B]Shanahan is wrong in thinking McNabb is unworthy to run his offense and execute his son's plays[/B].

I have long wanted a 4000 yd passer here. That means we are moving the ball even late in games and scoring points. This article shares shares how I am feeling that OL/RB depletion really had the team in a bind and I didnt realize just how big a rift Kyle/McNabb were dealing with. McNabb never really got a chance. We let go of DThomas, we keep Galloway. Coach has cleaned house like in historic and pariah like fashion.

Why couldn't we head into the offseason with a QB and build up the OL/get defense players??? I am amazed that every facet of our team is in turmoil b/c despite having Banks we have no LS, K ,or P so even Danny Smiths special teams suffers .All the AH drama and Haslett failures/f*ups are easier to accept in the end.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;770096]The receiving corps is not the problem here. If McNabb was the QB we thought he was we would easily be putting up more then 20 points a game. The receivers aren't the ones that throwing behind themselves or throwing balls into the dirt nor are they throwing into traffic at inopportune times. They also aren't overthrowing or under throwing themselves on potential big plays.

Face it we're not going to have an offensive line made up of 5 first and second round picks nor are we going to be able to compliment them with two 1,000 yard receivers and a pro bowl tight end. Moss, Armstrong, Cooley, Davis is a more then suitable receiving corps for a pro bowl QB. Certainly better than most of the groups McNabb played with during his pro bowl years in Philly.

Who is Tom Brady's best receiver? Dieon Branch? What about Peyton Manning outside of Reggie Wayne these days? Piere Garcon? And by the way where's Peytons offensive line made up of first and second round picks?

Big Ben is making the Steelers offense go with Mike Wallace as the main option. His other two options an injury prone Heath Miller (who's not as good as Cooley) and an aging Hines Ward. His offensive line is made up of a 1st round rookie, a 2nd round pick (Flozell Adams), a 5th round pick, a 6th round pick, and a 24 year old undrafted free agent.

Who's Matt Cassel throwing to after Dwayne Bowe? Tony Moeaki? By the way Cassel is currently being protected by three guys who were undrafted free agents (ages 33, 37, and 29), a fifth round pick and one first round pick (a converted guard playing LT).

Matt Ryan only has Roddy White and Tony Gonzalez (not as good as Cooley these days) to throw to. Matt Jenkins is decent but even if he had played in all 16 games he would still have less yards then our own Anthony Armstrong. His line, an injury prone first round LT, a 2nd round pick, 2 undrafted free agents, and a 7th round pick.

Quality along the offensive line (in fact I hope they find a guy that fits their system in the second round during this years upcoming draft) and depth in the receiving corps is important but if a QB is good you're going to see it.[/quote]

I agree with you even as far as to mention Phillip Rivers has had more unknown wr line up on Sunday due to injuires to Malcom Floyd, Pat Crayton, and the susp. of Vincent Jackson and they still put up points. Gates has been out as of late. Remember we did have Norv Turner as a HC when Synder took over but he fired him towards the end of the season. That was the last time our Redskin could put up 24-27 points a game.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=SkinzWin;770295]The Redskins have a lot of problems.
1. We have a revolving coaching door.
2. We have a terrible offensive live.
3. We have a terrible defensive scheme to match the players we currently have.
4. We have no depth at virtually all positions.
5. We have an old team. THE OLDEST TEAM. Maybe ever.
6. We have some diva head case players that cause problems.
7. We have virtually no picks in every draft because of Cerrato.
8. We had Vinny Cerrato.
9. Vinny Cerrato used to make personnel decisions.
10. Dan Snyder.

Here is how I see it. I say this all the time on here. Winning cures all ills. We have not had a winning culture in DC for a long time. We have an owner with good intensions and a terrible track record. We had Vinny making decisions with an even worse track record who left our future in shambles with aging rental veterans and no draft picks.

People are so polarizing in these posts. Its either Shanny's fault b/c of his inability to relate to players and make stupid decisions, or its the fault of players. Well, last I checked, teams are winners or losers not by one person, but by all people together. Owner, front office, coach, staff, players, everyone. We haven't had a real good track record with any of that lately.

Has Shanny made some stupid moves? Yes. Do a lot of our players suck? Yes. Do we need to rebuild and do things a different way? I think so, and I think progress is being made. My point is, Rome wasn't built in a day. This shit that we are in took a long time to cook up and its going to take a long time to get out of. Yes Shanny has made some stupid decisions but I think he has been laying it out there the way you have to in order to get something good to come out of a team.

Zornification of a team is not going to work. That has been proven. People that are saying Shanny is going to get fired, that he isn't good for the team, are stupid. No he hasn't been perfect, but its going to take many years and a hard nosed approach to getting this ship turned around and headed in the right direction. I for one have been saying for awhile we need to take the Bucs approach to blowing up this team, dropping all the dead weight veterans and infusing the team with free agent and drafted youth.

The bottom line is what we have been doing has not been working and I would be a much happier fan sitting through several years of losing football with a youthful team with upside and the possibility to get better than the old, falling apart mess we have been witnessing for so long.[/quote]

I'm glad to see we do have a few intelligent and football knowledgable Redskins fans on this site. Well said and I agrre 100% with you.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

Yes McNabb has thrown for a lot of yards but when you watch the games you see that a) he left a lot of yards on the ground and b) we are so fortunate to have Armstrong's ability to adjust on deep routes

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

Its hard to keep hearing all the apologists on the last few pages for what Shanny has done. McNabb is a future Hall of Fame QB. I just can't believe that the Redskins treat him this way. Shanny's reasons is for the organization to see what Rex and Beck have. He says McNabb couldn't do anything to change the way he views McNabb, well what is he going to see from Rex or Beck in 3 games that would lead him to a good decision. I just can't get over how it is a complete circus at Redskins park, EVERY damn year. How is it people just can't see that the decade of ignoring the "big fellas" upfront is what has been this organizations downfall. HOW FREAKING HARD IS THAT TO UNDERSTAND. The constant switching and moving of offensive line, the free agent additions, only to have them move on the next year. Teams that win in this league have an offensive line of guys that build a chemistry together of several years. Are young well thought out draft picks, instead of on the fly FA pickups. Someone mentioned Phillip Rivers throwing to lesser known receivers, well guess what, this is the NFL and if a QB has more that a few seconds to hit a receiver they should be able to get open. We have no offensive line, and when McNabb has time, just like Campbell, Just like ole Lefty Brunell, when given time these QB's can find someone open. But when you consistanty have a fat ass lineman breathing down your neck or running full blast down your sights, that is a little hard to complete passes. Look, you can bring Peyton , or Brady or who ever you want, if they stand behind this cast of characters we have on the oline, use RB's for a running game we have to use, they WILL NOT be successful either. It is a proven fact. Look at the games the colts lose or the patriots loose. Watch how much middle pressure is put on Peyton, if they are getting to him, then he throws several picks and gets sacked a few times, same with Brady. The fact that these teams consistanty win is they have the big guys up front that keep the QB's uniforms clean, allowing them to make the throws and put points on the board. We haven't been able to keep a QB upright in a all most a decade. Go back to when we won the division with Norv. We had a young Samuels, a young Jansen, some decent guys upfront with Stephen Davis. Until someone in this damn organization stands up and drafts guys for the lines, we will continue to see the same results we have been for the next decade.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=#56fanatic;770319]Its hard to keep hearing all the apologists on the last few pages for what Shanny has done. McNabb is a future Hall of Fame QB. I just can't believe that the Redskins treat him this way. Shanny's reasons is for the organization to see what Rex and Beck have. He says McNabb couldn't do anything to change the way he views McNabb, well what is he going to see from Rex or Beck in 3 games that would lead him to a good decision. I just can't get over how it is a complete circus at Redskins park, EVERY damn year. How is it people just can't see that the decade of ignoring the "big fellas" upfront is what has been this organizations downfall. HOW FREAKING HARD IS THAT TO UNDERSTAND. The constant switching and moving of offensive line, the free agent additions, only to have them move on the next year. Teams that win in this league have an offensive line of guys that build a chemistry together of several years. Are young well thought out draft picks, instead of on the fly FA pickups. Someone mentioned Phillip Rivers throwing to lesser known receivers, well guess what, this is the NFL and if a QB has more that a few seconds to hit a receiver they should be able to get open. We have no offensive line, and when McNabb has time, just like Campbell, Just like ole Lefty Brunell, when given time these QB's can find someone open. But when you consistanty have a fat ass lineman breathing down your neck or running full blast down your sights, that is a little hard to complete passes. Look, you can bring Peyton , or Brady or who ever you want, if they stand behind this cast of characters we have on the oline, use RB's for a running game we have to use, they WILL NOT be successful either. It is a proven fact. Look at the games the colts lose or the patriots loose. Watch how much middle pressure is put on Peyton, if they are getting to him, then he throws several picks and gets sacked a few times, same with Brady. The fact that these teams consistanty win is they have the big guys up front that keep the QB's uniforms clean, allowing them to make the throws and put points on the board. We haven't been able to keep a QB upright in a all most a decade. Go back to when we won the division with Norv. We had a young Samuels, a young Jansen, some decent guys upfront with Stephen Davis. Until someone in this damn organization stands up and drafts guys for the lines, we will continue to see the same results we have been for the next decade.[/quote]

How freaking hard is it to understand that Shanahan didn't have enough draft picks to fix the offensive line overnight? Shanahan spent the highest draft pick he had on the most important position on the line. He brought in a mix of veteran free agents for the rest of the positions, and shuffled guys around sometimes due to injury, other times due to poor performance to find out what works best.

Obviously the coaches saw things on film from McNabb which caused them to believe he wasn't making the right decisions despite protection from the line. And to be fair -- the protection up front has been better at times this year. It's amazing to hear so many fans so livid over the benching of a guy who hasn't played well.

And I wouldn't say McNabb is a lock for the Hall of Fame.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=Defensewins;770240]This team was a loser before way McNabb got here. But McNabb is being made to be the fall guy by the press that does not understand football and some of the short sighted fans. That is the big story.
Shanahan and his incredibly poor communications and leadership skills is letting some of the players take the fall uncontested. The stink is not sticking to him yet so he will keep his mouth shut.
[B]According to the pro-Shanahan posts on this thread it is everyone fault but the Shanahan's. [/B] To say we do not have enough talent is a cop out. Teams like Cleveland that had less talent than us when this season started are now showing signs of improvement as the season goes on. That is what great coaches do is coach up their struggling or less talented players and help them improve, not bench them and treat them like they do not belong. Shanahan does not inspire his players.
What alarms me the most and it is getting louder and louder, is all along the way since Shanahan has arrived he continues to show poor leadership skills and make bad decisions.[/quote]

Of course Shanahan deserves blame. After the Monday Night debacle against the Eagles, Shanahan[I] took [/I]all of the blame. Contrary to the claims of the anti-Shanahan crowd, his supporters never implied that he's perfect and the team would be an instant success just because of his presence on the sideline.

And I don't believe it's assured that Cleveland has less talent than us. I'd say the two teams are about even.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=THE TRUTH DETECTOR;770262]I was never a fan of Shanahan . In my view Shanahan only took this job to give his son a chance to be a head coach. Let's face it Kyle Shanahan's stock as a future head coach has taken a hit. Blood is thicker than water. This is all about blaming someone to protect his son. If anyone on this planet believes Rex Grossman gives any team on this planet a better chance to win you are nuts. Rex Grossman? I think the way Shanahan goes about business is disrespectful to the Redskin fanbase. We are not stupid . Maybe the only people impressed Shanny are all members of that terrible forum that is the official website of the Redskins. I love my Redskins but [B]I want Shanny fired.[/B] I never wanted Mcnabb here. Classy dude but he is a Eagle.[/quote]

How unbelievably absurd.

You want to bring in a new coach and start this all over again?

Remember, at the time of the hiring, Shanahan was the best option available. Gruden and Cowher didn't want the job. They're still in broadcasting, and have made no intentions clear that they even want to coach again. There isn't a head coach out there who would have turned this disaster of a franchise around in less than one year.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

BEEM...YOU are the man!
I thank you for accurately defending the realm against the detractors and.........stupidsayers

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

Thanks Hog1. I do what I can.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

[quote=THE TRUTH DETECTOR;770262]I was never a fan of Shanahan . In my view Shanahan only took this job to give his son a chance to be a head coach. Let's face it Kyle Shanahan's stock as a future head coach has taken a hit. Blood is thicker than water. This is all about blaming someone to protect his son. If anyone on this planet believes Rex Grossman gives any team on this planet a better chance to win you are nuts. Rex Grossman? I think the way Shanahan goes about business is disrespectful to the Redskin fanbase. We are not stupid . Maybe the only people impressed Shanny are all members of that terrible forum that is the official website of the Redskins. I love my Redskins but I want Shanny fired. I never wanted Mcnabb here. Classy dude but he is a Eagle.[/quote]

How do you gather that Shanny only took this job to give his son a chance to be a head coach? To draw him from the #1 ranked offense in the league with weapons like Andre Johnson to a team with a perennially bad offense who can't move the ball well and can't get it done in the red zone? That helps your chances to be a head coach? Really? REALLY?!? I thought it was because they ARE related and wanted to work together.

The way Shanny goes about his business is NOT disrespectful to the fanbase. It is making players accountable for their actions and if they are not going to be the best player on the field, then they don't play, regardless of what their pedigree is.

YOU are stupid if you say that. YOU are the reason this fanbase has perpetually bad teams because you want a winning caliber team every year and call for the coach to be fired if you don't get it. If you thought Shanny could come in here in one year with Kyle and turn this team around into a winning team, you are nuts and you need to find a new team. No coach could do that with the mess they inherited thanks to Vinny. It is going to take several years of complete overhauling for this thing to get turned around.

Yes Shanny made some stupid PR calls, and said something things he should have gone in a different direction with instead, but with a team with this many problems and this many diva head case players I'd like to see you do it any better. No one is perfect. It blows my mind that some of you fans act like unless a coach does everything perfectly with a team with this many problems, he needs to get out. Ridiculous. Absolutely absurd.

Re: Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday
 

Good luck Rex your gona need some. Go skins.