Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

Here's his coaching record against every team going into this year

[url]http://redskins.studiotigaapps.net/media/83628/shanahan__mike.pdf[/url]

[QUOTE=Skinzman;957122]Phil Simms was actually a damn good QB. The WWE president was never a QB.

No one denies the defense that McMahon (the bears QB), Dilfer, or Johnson played with, they are some of the greatest defenses ever. The others are Joe Gibbs QB's, which Ive already stated is the greatest coach ever due to the fact that he could win without stud QB's. But winning without stud QB's is far and few between in the NFL, especially the current pass first NFL.

Although by saying that Belichick was the mastermind is to say that Parcells was a terrible coach, so yeah, cant say that I agree. I seriously doubt Parcells was just along for the Belichickian ride in NY. Something tells me Parcells was the main influence there.[/QUOTE]

Vince, Jim - whatever they were bith horrible quarterbacks. Lol.
Phil Simms - damn good? Ehhh
Here is a little internet info for Bucket and you - Bill Belichiks defensive gameplan against the Bills in that superbowl hangs in the Pro Football Hall of Fame - yes he was the mastermind. Parcells most successful years throughout his career were when Belichik was with him. That is fact - not opinion. Also if you look back at teams that have won or made it to the superbowl (which in my mind just screams of a successful season) you will find that the number of teams that did not have stud qb's is not as few and far between. I have already mentioned several, and without the benefit of the internet I will throw Rex Grossman, Neil Odonnell and Matt Hasselback in that mix. Again that is just off the top of my head.


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=Skinzman;957116]Might as well expand that out to be that if Shanny wins 5 SB's in a row, you wont be impressed. You dont like Shanny, so it will be all RG3 if we do.



Yes, there is a prevailing theme. Stud QB's make a helluva difference. Does these even need to be explained?



Oh look, more of the same. Again, you guys keep wanting us to ignore that most of what are considered great coaches won with great QB's. Yet you refuse to "see a prevailing theme" yourself.[/quote]


You could look at it like that, and you could look at it like this.

-Stan Humphries
-Rich Gannon
-Drew Bledsoe
-Chris Chandler
-Neil O'Donnell
-Steve McNair
- Trent Dilfer
- Rex Grossman
- Kerry Collins
- Brad Johnson
- Jake Delhomme
- Donovan McNabb
- Matt Hasselback
- Jeff Hostetler
- Mark Rypien
- Jim Kelly
- Doug Williams
- Tony Eason
- Jim Mcmahon
- Joe Theismann
- David Woodley
- Boomer Esiason
- Ken Anderson


Since 1981, All these quarterbacks either got to a Super Bowl or WON a super bowl. In my opinion, not many of these guys are a "world beater" type quarterback, every one of them successful, no doubt. Many of the QB's listed had great coaches, many didn't. Shanahan himself has coached two of the QB's on this list, but not during their Super bowl appearances of course. Point is, to be considered great, there are plenty of opportunities to get to the big game, especially if you have been coaching since 1987 in a head coaching capacity. Plenty of opportunities to make yourself stand out from the crowd. I think its quite telling, that.......

- during 4 years with Elway, 3 playoff appearances and 2 superbowl wins. 7 playoff wins.

Now Fast forward to October 2012, and look back.

- In the cumulative years without Elway, 15 1/2 seasons in a head coaching capacity (entire career), he has a total of ONE (1) playoff victory


I was excited like most when he took the job over from horny zorny. I mean, Mike Shanahan replacing Jim Zorn? YES PLEASE!!!!!!! But now that I take some time to step back, and look at what he has done over his career, and what he has done here, I'm sorry. I think this MF'er stinks. I also think that for a forward looking program with a huge star in the making, I really hope that Dan Snyder is already searching for his replacement. I don't know if he can find one, I sure hope so. Mike Shanahan is just way overrated. Again, this is just my opinion. Maybe my time at Fort Carson in Colorado Springs has swayed my opinion a bit, because during my time there from 2001 - 2009, all I heard on AM sports radio is hate for this guy, and the oh so frequent rant on how he should have been fired long ago. Like I said, I think that the fans in Denver had a dirty little secret on Shanahan.

The secret is that he is not that good.



(Thanks for listening to my rant) :twocents::blah:

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957125]Vince, Jim - whatever they were bith horrible quarterbacks. Lol.
Phil Simms - damn good? Ehhh
Here is a little internet info for Bucket and you - Bill Belichiks defensive gameplan against the Bills in that superbowl hangs in the Pro Football Hall of Fame - yes he was the mastermind. Parcells most successful years throughout his career were when Belichik was with him. That is fact - not opinion. Also if you look back at teams that have won or made it to the superbowl (which in my mind just screams of a successful season) you will find that the number of teams that did not have stud qb's is not as few and far between. I have already mentioned several, and without the benefit of the internet I will throw Rex Grossman, Neil Odonnell and Matt Hasselback in that mix. Again that is just off the top of my head.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

The whole Beilchick argument is pointless. We are not saying he is a terrible coach. We are saying he is a great coach, but that even a great coach needed Brady for his success as a head coach.

Stud QB or stud defense wins in this league. Im not in disagreement there, its just harder to keep a stud defense together than it is to sign a stud QB to a multiyear contract. Which is why most of those teams that relied on defense was good for a year or two then fell off.

[QUOTE=Mechanix544;957126]You could look at it like that, and you could look at it like this.

-Stan Humphries
-Rich Gannon
-Drew Bledsoe
-Chris Chandler
-Neil O'Donnell
-Steve McNair
- Trent Dilfer
- Rex Grossman
- Kerry Collins
- Brad Johnson
- Jake Delhomme
- Donovan McNabb
- Matt Hasselback
- Jeff Hostetler
- Mark Rypien
- Jim Kelly
- Doug Williams
- Tony Eason
- Jim Mcmahon
- Joe Theismann
- David Woodley
- Boomer Esiason
- Ken Anderson


Since 1981, All these quarterbacks either got to a Super Bowl or WON a super bowl. In my opinion, not many of these guys are a "world beater" type quarterback, every one of them successful, no doubt. Many of the QB's listed had great coaches, many didn't. Shanahan himself has coached two of the QB's on this list, but not during their Super bowl appearances of course. Point is, to be considered great, there are plenty of opportunities to get to the big game, especially if you have been coaching since 1987 in a head coaching capacity. Plenty of opportunities to make yourself stand out from the crowd. I think its quite telling, that.......

- during 4 years with Elway, 3 playoff appearances and 2 superbowl wins. 7 playoff wins.

Now Fast forward to October 2012, and look back.

- In the cumulative years without Elway, 15 1/2 seasons in a head coaching capacity (entire career), he has a total of ONE (1) playoff victory


I was excited like most when he took the job over from horny zorny. I mean, Mike Shanahan replacing Jim Zorn? YES PLEASE!!!!!!! But now that I take some time to step back, and look at what he has done over his career, and what he has done here, I'm sorry. I think this MF'er stinks. I also think that for a forward looking program with a huge star in the making, I really hope that Dan Snyder is already searching for his replacement. I don't know if he can find one, I sure hope so. Mike Shanahan is just way overrated. Again, this is just my opinion. Maybe my time at Fort Carson in Colorado Springs has swayed my opinion a bit, because during my time there from 2001 - 2009, all I heard on AM sports radio is hate for this guy, and the oh so frequent rant on how he should have been fired long ago. Like I said, I think that the fans in Denver had a dirty little secret on Shanahan.

The secret is that he is not that good.



(Thanks for listening to my rant) :twocents::blah:[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the Chris Chandler - couldnt remember his damn name but i wanted to put him on my list of non- world beater qb's.

Edit: jim kelly should not be on this list imo.
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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;957120]First, aren't you the guy who blasted me for being to lawyerly in my responses??

Second, and in short, I simply didn't intend to spend much time arguing Shanny's past b/c I think it, at best, only tangentially relevant to his current ability to succeed. As to his past, believe it or not, I think it cuts [I]both[/I] ways. He has had both success and failure. In addition, I had, and still have, serious concerns about his ability to construct a defense and his ability as a personnel guy. To me, those were the cause of his ultimate failure in Denver - along with his dictatorial ego.

With that said, however, to baldly assert that Shanny's record was built on a cake AFC West schedule [I]without[/I] citing records, opponents or other criteria, as was done, struck me as wrong. I remember: (1) KC as being pretty tough under Schotty and Vermeil, (2) SD having LT on the field for some of that time, and (3) Oakland winning a SB somewhere in there. I simply did some quick checking on pro football reference and found, as I said, several years where the division had multiple 10+ win teams, which seemed to me to be an indicator that it wasn't quite the pushover Goat and others seem to think it was. In fact, one year (96 I think) no one in their division had a losing record (two 8-8's).

Was the AFC West a powerhouse top to bottom the entire time Shanny was there? No. But neither, as was implied, did Shanny build his record playing the 2012 Jax Jaguars. It was a good division that had solid teams. Shanahan's early successes, and again later with Plummer, give some evidence that he has the ability to succeed against solid competition. Can he still do so? He hasn't shown it yet.

Lawyerly enough for you?[/quote]

Good points. And yes, it was very thick in a good barrister type of a way. I still disagree though. :)


:angry-smi

btw, I just shot you a good trade offer for Jennings.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957128]Thanks for the Chris Chandler - couldnt remember his damn name but i wanted to put him on my list of non- world beater qb's.

Edit: jim kelly should not be on this list imo.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

I was thinking of leaving him and Boomer off. But I don't think they are at the end of the day, in elite category. Clutch, yes. Carry the team on your back? Check. But, in the position of building a new team from scratch with every historical NFL player available, I would pick probably 35 other QB's in the league before I even began to ponder either of them.

[QUOTE=Skinzman;957127]The whole Beilchick argument is pointless. We are not saying he is a terrible coach. We are saying he is a great coach, but that even a great coach needed Brady for his success as a head coach.

Stud QB or stud defense wins in this league. Im not in disagreement there, its just harder to keep a stud defense together than it is to sign a stud QB to a multiyear contract. Which is why most of those teams that relied on defense was good for a year or two then fell off.[/QUOTE]

You are overlooking Belichiks defensive genius though by saying he never did it elsewhere. He had success. Also the majority of his head coaching career has been with the Pats and the one year he didnt have Brady he won 11 games. The fact that he didnt make the playoffs is a fluke. How often does that happen? Also and I could be wrong but I believe Belichik had total control the year they drafted Brady - so he deserves credit for that.


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[QUOTE=Mechanix544;957130]I was thinking of leaving him and Boomer off. But I don't think they are at the end of the day, in elite category. Clutch, yes. Carry the team on your back? Check. But, in the position of building a new team from scratch with every historical NFL player available, I would pick probably 35 other QB's in the league before I even began to ponder either of them.[/QUOTE]

Agreed but Chandler and the rest of them wouldnt be in my top 200. Big difference. Plus I went to the U so Kelly is off the list! Lol


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

We should return this thread to Cooley talk

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957132]You are overlooking Belichiks defensive genius though by saying he never did it elsewhere. He had success. Also the majority of his head coaching career has been with the Pats and the one year he didnt have Brady he won 11 games. The fact that he didnt make the playoffs is a fluke. How often does that happen? Also and I could be wrong but I believe Belichik had total control the year they drafted Brady - so he deserves credit for that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

Ask Steve Young about Shanny, its not like Shanny was an accountant that all of a sudden was given a HC job. To use other peoples asst coaching successes and conveniently forgetting about others doesnt seem genuine to me. Shanny was given a lot of credit during his days as the OC on Seiferts staff with the 49ers, and they won a SB.

As for drafting Brady, last I checked RG3 was drafted by Shanny, but for the sake of this argument, lets make sure we dont mention that.

Why isn't the last like 10 pages in a shanny thread?

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957132]You are overlooking Belichiks defensive genius though by saying he never did it elsewhere. He had success. Also the majority of his head coaching career has been with the Pats and the one year he didnt have Brady he won 11 games. The fact that he didnt make the playoffs is a fluke. How often does that happen? Also and I could be wrong but I believe Belichik had total control the year they drafted Brady - so he deserves credit for that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

I believe, and I might be wrong, but Kraft once said that Bellicheat did not have admin or personnel control until after 2001. I think Pete Carrolls scouting team did most of the work on the 2000 draft prior to him getting canned for Belicheck (Bobby Greer I think was his name, and I do know that the patriots scouting team (Greer) are the only people to talk to Bradys college coach prior to the draft about drafting him. Brady was not Bellicheks pick, but he wasn't opposed to the proposition of taking a chance on him in the 6th. He gets alot of the credit for alot of homework that was done under Carrolls watch.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

So, how about that Cooley, wanting beer in his contract..............................................

(His arms looked a little chunkier than usual to me in the pics I saw of hiim at Redskins park.............)

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=Mechanix544;957141]So, how about that Cooley, wanting beer in his contract..............................................

(His arms looked a little chunkier than usual to me in the pics I saw of hiim at Redskins park.............)[/quote]

I dont even want to hear what Davis will be asking for after the season.

If Davis fires his agent and hires Ricky Williams as a new agent, we might want to look at resigning Cooley instead.

I was never in any way comparing Belichik to Shanny. I havent even mentioned shannys name?. I just jumped in to defend Belichek - and I dont even like him.
Anyway yeah back to Cooley.



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[QUOTE=punch it in;957144]I was never in any way comparing Belichik to Shanny. I havent even mentioned shannys name?. I just jumped in to defend Belichek - and I dont even like him.
Anyway yeah back to Cooley.

Edit: i knew i was going to have to point out the fact that i was not comparing the two. I also knew you were going to bring up RG-3. Lets though not compare taking Tom Brady in the seventh/ sixth ? Round to taking RG-3. Lol. Pretty certain RG-3 was alittle bit less of a diamond in the rough. Lol.
Edit: i mentioned shanny when i agreed with JR's take on his current status and also mentioned what a great job he has done with the run/ oline. There is no argument about Shanny vs Belichick. At least not from me. Honestly. Also I think I have spelled Belichick at least nine different ways. Lol.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]




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Why couldnt the Skins add the case of beer to Cooleys contract? Is that against the rules or something? That is hilarious that Cooley even asked for it. I think that request deserves a welcome back - cooooooooley!


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[QUOTE=Skinzman;957142]I dont even want to hear what Davis will be asking for after the season.

If Davis fires his agent and hires Ricky Williams as a new agent, we might want to look at resigning Cooley instead.[/QUOTE]

Is he really considering this? I didnt know Ricky was becoming an agent? Maybe they have the same dealer?


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957149]Is he really considering this? I didnt know Ricky was becoming an agent? Maybe they have the same dealer?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

No, I was just saying that as a joke.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=SmootSmack;957124]Here's his coaching record against every team going into this year

[URL]http://redskins.studiotigaapps.net/media/83628/shanahan__mike.pdf[/URL][/quote]

What a CROCK O' S...
If Cowher had not cashed his chips in early....Shanahan would be....toast.
Who the F.. is Curly Lambeau anyway....Right?

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=Skinzman;957142]I dont even want to hear what Davis will be asking for after the season.

If Davis fires his agent and hires Ricky Williams as a new agent, we might want to look at resigning Cooley instead.[/quote]

If Ricky Williams was his agent he'd probably advise him to take a year off to go smoke weed and enlighten himself, and then come back when he's "ready."

I doubt Davis will be asking for a big money deal after this season.

[QUOTE=Skinzman;957154]No, I was just saying that as a joke.[/QUOTE]

Ahh. Stranger things have happened.


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;957058]Didn't Mike go to an afc championship game with both of those guys?[/quote]

With Plummer for sure, who I thought was a solid QB and probably underrated.

On a side note while I've never met him personally a guy in my office puts on an annual hand-ball tournament Plummer participates in, and the guys around here say he's a genuinely good dude. Does lots of non-profit and benefit stuff.

Evidently Plummer has quietly said Shanahan is one of the biggest douchebags he ever met in pro football, which is repeated by a lot of Denver folks too. Still, I don't really give a damn what Mike is like personally.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957119]It is not always stud QB's! My God. Phil Simms, Vince Mcmahon, Trent Dilfer, Joe T, Doug Williams, Mark Rypien, Brad Johnson. Thats just off the top of my head. Some coaches have won in this league without stud qb's. Belichik was the mastermind behind the Giants first superbowl victory. Shanny is a great judge of running backs his ZBS is genius when you look at the utter lack of talent that he has on his offensive lines. There are coaches that win without stud qb's though!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

It's the truth, all of it. Good work punch.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=Skinzman;957142]I dont even want to hear what Davis will be asking for after the season.

If Davis fires his agent and hires Ricky Williams as a new agent, we might want to look at resigning Cooley instead.[/quote]

:lol:

That's excellent. I saw Ricky with his fam in Vegas years ago, at some outdoor concert. Some jackass on stage pointed Ricky out a few times, and it was painfully obvious how shy the dude still is.

[QUOTE=The Goat;957162]:lol:

That's excellent. I saw Ricky with his fam in Vegas years ago, at some outdoor concert. Some jackass on stage pointed Ricky out a few times, and it was painfully obvious how shy the dude still is.[/QUOTE]

Maybe he was just paranoid. :)


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[QUOTE=Hog1;957155]What a CROCK O' S...
If Cowher had not cashed his chips in early....Shanahan would be....toast.
Who the F.. is Curly Lambeau anyway....Right?[/QUOTE]

I was surprised to see Mora on the list.
Great coaches? Great coaches? You want to talk about great coaches?


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[QUOTE=SmootSmack;957124]Here's his coaching record against every team going into this year

[url]http://redskins.studiotigaapps.net/media/83628/shanahan__mike.pdf[/url][/QUOTE]

Gibbs averaged 10.4 wins a year
Shanny averaging 8.8 wins a year which will either go a little higher or a little lower after this year.

Edit: just an observation. Was curious is all.
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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957125]Vince, Jim - whatever they were bith horrible quarterbacks. Lol.
Phil Simms - damn good? Ehhh
Here is a little internet info for Bucket and you - Bill Belichiks defensive gameplan against the Bills in that superbowl hangs in the Pro Football Hall of Fame - yes he was the mastermind. Parcells most successful years throughout his career were when Belichik was with him. That is fact - not opinion. Also if you look back at teams that have won or made it to the superbowl (which in my mind just screams of a successful season) you will find that the number of teams that did not have stud qb's is not as few and far between. I have already mentioned several, and without the benefit of the internet I will throw Rex Grossman, Neil Odonnell and Matt Hasselback in that mix. Again that is just off the top of my head.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

so your making the case that bill b was a good defensive coordinator? that has nothing to do with anything. as a head coach without brady he was awful. there are tons of good D coordinators that failed or never become head coaches (like gregg williams, blache, etc) so that entire arguement/point is completely worthless to assessing him as a HEAD coach.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=Mechanix544;957126]You could look at it like that, and you could look at it like this.

- Trent Dilfer
- Brad Johnson
- Jeff Hostetler
- Mark Rypien
- Doug Williams
- Jim Mcmahon
- Joe Theismann
[/quote]

fixed it, here are the actual non world beating qb winners. it wasn't really about getting there. notice 3 are gibbs, 2 had insanely good defenses, and the last non world beating qb to win a super bowl did so over 10 years ago.

great qbs make all the difference.

that said, can you guys please stop trolling every single thread and wasting everyone's time. you don't like shanny, we get it, really, we do. unless you've got something new or worthwhile to add, please just stop. it's annoying.


as for cooley, welcome back.

[QUOTE=That Guy;957202]fixed it, here are the actual non world beating qb winners. it wasn't really about getting there. notice 3 are gibbs, 2 had insanely good defenses, and the last non world beating qb to win a super bowl did so over 10 years ago.

great qbs make all the difference.

that said, can you guys please stop trolling every single thread and wasting everyone's time. you don't like shanny, we get it, really, we do. unless you've got something new or worthwhile to add, please just stop. it's annoying.


as for cooley, welcome back.[/QUOTE]

I aint trolling shit. This wasnt about Shanny. Its annoying that you are gonna sit there and tell me Bill Belichik isnt a good coach. Insane actually. Stop trying to turn everything into an argument. As had been pointed out lately - there is an ignore list. So instead of getting miffed - use it.

Edit: stop trolling EVERY post woth Shanny hate? That is so over the top. For the most part I give credit to Shanny for alot of things. I have made I think 1500 posts in two months and there might be three where I pick on Shanny. So please dont just assume what you THINK i am commenting about. Also how interesting would the thread be if it was 250 " welcome back Cooley". I mean there aint much of a story there.
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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=That Guy;957202]fixed it, here are the actual non world beating qb winners. it wasn't really about getting there. notice 3 are gibbs, 2 had insanely good defenses, and the last non world beating qb to win a super bowl did so over 10 years ago.

great qbs make all the difference.

that said, can you guys please stop trolling every single thread and wasting everyone's time. you don't like shanny, we get it, really, we do. unless you've got something new or worthwhile to add, please just stop. it's annoying.


as for cooley, welcome back.[/quote]Ben Roethlisberger has won a bunch of super bowls, but I think we have a better quarterback.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957205]I aint trolling shit. This wasnt about Shanny. Its annoying that you are gonna sit there and tell me Bill Belichik isnt a good coach[/quote]


Bill Belicheat is only as good as his talent, as is ANY coach. Look no further than his stint in Cleveland to understand this concept. It's also one of the main reasons I believe Bill will retire when Brady does. I would be willing to bet some very good money on this.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=NC_Skins;957210]Bill Belicheat is only as good as his talent, as is ANY coach. Look no further than his stint in Cleveland to understand this concept. It's also one of the main reasons I believe Bill will retire when Brady does. I would be willing to bet some very good money on this.[/quote]would you say he's a good coach?

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;957210]Bill Belicheat is only as good as his talent, as is ANY coach. Look no further than his stint in Cleveland to understand this concept. It's also one of the main reasons I believe Bill will retire when Brady does. I would be willing to bet some very good money on this.[/QUOTE]

Not going to disagree with talent having something to do with it. Lol. One of my biggest sports related beliefs is circumstance and situation. I happen to hate the Lakers. My brother is a huge fan. I love knocking Phil Jackson. Who couldnt win multiple championships with jordan pippen shaq and kobe! Belichik though did take those atrocious browns teams to 11 wins and a playoff birth once though. I am not enough of a history buff to tell you who was on that team but im pretty sure it wasnt loaded with talent. Also he guided the Pats to 11 wins with Cassell. Total fluke thing that wasnt good enough to make the playoffs. So he has proven that he can win alot if games with not alot of talent twice in his career?


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=los panda;957218]would you say he's a good coach?[/quote]


Yes, but I do think he's vastly overrated and one of the luckiest sons of bitches to walk this earth. I've never in my life seen a team get more calls or balls bounce their way than the Patriots and Steelers. Mind you, this was during their run in the early to mid 2000's. Winning super bowls takes a lot of luck, which is something many fans simply don't get. It also takes a lot of preparation and talent as well, so don't think I'm discounting that fact either.

Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957220]Not going to disagree with talent having something to do with it. Lol. One of my biggest sports related beliefs is circumstance and situation. I happen to hate the Lakers. My brother is a huge fan. I love knocking Phil Jackson. Who couldnt win multiple championships with jordan pippen shaq and kobe! Belichik though did take those atrocious browns teams to 11 wins and a playoff birth once though. I am not enough of a history buff to tell you who was on that team but im pretty sure it wasnt loaded with talent. Also he guided the Pats to 11 wins with Cassell. Total fluke thing that wasnt good enough to make the playoffs. So he has proven that he can win alot if games with not alot of talent twice in his career?


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You know a big reason why BB isn't winning those Super Bowls that he used to? Defense. His staple in the early/mid 2000's was a stingy defense. They ranked middle of the pack in yards allowed, but ranked in the top 5 in points allowed. They simply did not give up points. Fast forward to today, and its a team heavily reliant on a offense, while the defense folds like a cheap tent. THIS is why the Patriots won super bowls while the Colts tended to fade in the playoffs. Not because Brady was better, but that defense was ten times better than what the Colts ever had.

ps. I agree with your Phil Jackson statement. He without a doubt is one of the most hype coaches in all of history. Larry Brown is twice the coach that Phil ever was. Did more with way less talent and has won on every level.

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;957224]You know a big reason why BB isn't winning those Super Bowls that he used to? Defense. His staple in the early/mid 2000's was a stingy defense. They ranked middle of the pack in yards allowed, but ranked in the top 5 in points allowed. They simply did not give up points. Fast forward to today, and its a team heavily reliant on a offense, while the defense folds like a cheap tent. THIS is why the Patriots won super bowls while the Colts tended to fade in the playoffs. Not because Brady was better, but that defense was ten times better than what the Colts ever had.

ps. I agree with your Phil Jackson statement. He without a doubt is one of the most hype coaches in all of history. Larry Brown is twice the coach that Phil ever was. Did more with way less talent and has won on every level.[/QUOTE]

Love Larry Brown. Big sixers fan. Funny you say that because I always throw that name out there when I bring up Phil Jackson. He turns teams around. Great great coach.


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Re: Fred Davis Done for Season. Welcome Back Cooley
 

[quote=punch it in;957205]I aint trolling shit. This wasnt about Shanny. Its annoying that you are gonna sit there and tell me Bill Belichik isnt a good coach. Insane actually. Stop trying to turn everything into an argument. As had been pointed out lately - there is an ignore list. So instead of getting miffed - use it.

Edit: stop trolling EVERY post woth Shanny hate? That is so over the top. For the most part I give credit to Shanny for alot of things. I have made I think 1500 posts in two months and there might be three where I pick on Shanny. So please dont just assume what you THINK i am commenting about. Also how interesting would the thread be if it was 250 " welcome back Cooley". I mean there aint much of a story there.
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couple things. first, what makes you think the trolling comment was even about you? it was in a seperate post replying to another user. it's directed at the goat mainly, but there are a couple others and i'm just tired of hearing about how much shanny sucks 13 times in every thread. if there's any assuming about intent, i assure you it's not on my part.

second, where did i say BB is a bad coach? all i was saying is that his success is shared with brady. before that happened he was a bad HEAD coach as referenced by his record, his firing, and the players comments about him at the time.

that's part of the ongoing shanny sucks campaign saying that he didn't win without a good qb. guess what? most other coaches haven't either. a great QB makes you over 600% more likely to win a super bowl. it's important, and most of the "good" coaches just happened to have good qbs.

and yes, i think rg3 will be better than big ben, with a lot less women troubles to boot.