Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794647]I don't see it like that. For me it's more along the lines of

High Floor High Ceiling
........okay no one.

Medium Floor, Medium to High Ceiling
Blaine Gabbert
Andy Dalton
Christian Ponder

Low Floor, High Ceiling
Kaepernick

Low Floor, Ridiculously High Ceiling
Cam Newton
Jake Locker
Ryan Mallet[/quote]

I agree with this and it's why I keep coming back to Locker. I want a shot at someone who can be great not just good. And in spite of all his troubles...I would take a shot at Mallet also becasue he has franchise QB talent...just not at #10.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/peter_king/04/20/2011-nfl-mock-draft/index.html?eref=sihp]2011 NFL Mock Draft with Cam Newton, Marcell Dareus, more - Peter King - SI.com[/url]

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

My Mock

What we should do?

10th pick Robert Quinn OLB
43rd pick Jerrell Powe NT
5th rounder Austin Pettis WR Boise St
5th rounder Mike Arkin G Missouri State
6th rounder Evan Royster RB Penn State
7th rounder Justin Rogers CB Richmond
7th rounder Alex Henery K Nebraska
7th rounder Chase Beeler C Stanford

What will probably happen but shouldn't IMO

10th Pick Jake Locker
43rd pick Brooks Reed
5th rounder Jarvis Jenkins DT/DE
5th rounder Sione Fua NT
6 Royster
7 A WR you've never heard of
7 Another TE for no reason at all
7 An OLineman that won't make the team

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=30gut;794674]Why so serious? What is about Jake Locke'rs great play in lifting an 0-12 team to a bowl game win that you don't see? Was is his ability to make bigtime throws in key situations and outstanding accuracy outside the pocket and on the move, 'great presences', elite arm strength and playmaking ability, quick release, great leadership skills, tunring around an entire football program?[/quote]
He didn't make anyone on his team better so how is it that he has great leadership skills? His team was sub 500 under his so called leadership. He has the ability(like many others) to make big throws but he rarely does. His accuracy is terrible that is why he had a 55% completion percentage. His whole college career has been mediocre at best. I have tons of evidence to support each one of these statements. Do you wish to challenge them?

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

how do you know he didnt make anyone on his team better? have you ever thought that players on his team made him worse than he truly is?

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Landry44;794787]He didn't make anyone on his team better so how is it that he has great leadership skills? His team was sub 500 under his so called leadership. He has the ability(like many others) to make big throws but he rarely does. His accuracy is terrible that is why he had a 55% completion percentage. His whole college career has been mediocre at best. I have tons of evidence to support each one of these statements. Do you wish to challenge them?[/quote]

I am not a fan of Locker. But he did take a winless team and make it a .500 bowl winner. To that end he did, in fact, make others around him better.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Lotus;794795]I am not a fan of Locker. But he did take a winless team and make it a .500 bowl winner. To that end he did, in fact, make others around him better.[/quote]

If they do draft him, we really have to hope that Shanahan can make another Plummer like miracle turn around, except this time he won't bail so soon, because Locker will be on the right side of 30....or the left....but the right side in terms of.....oh f**k it.

Still you look at Plummers numbers when he played at Arizona State (0 TD's and 9 Ints in 11 games during his second year) and for the Cardinals and you wonder how the hell did Shanahan turn him into a pro bowler +90 QB.
[url=http://www.totalfootballstats.com/PlayerQB.asp?id=3134]Jake Plummer College & Pro Football Statistics - Totalfootballstats.com[/url]

Still it's a leap of faith to think that he can get the same kind of turn around with Locker.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794796]If they do draft him, we really have to hope that Shanahan can make another Plummer like miracle turn around, except this time he won't bail so soon, because Locker will be on the right side of 30....or the left....but the right side in terms of.....oh f**k it.

Still you look at Plummers numbers when he played at Arizona State (0 TD's and 9 Ints in 11 games during his second year) and for the Cardinals and you wonder how the hell did Shanahan turn him into a pro bowler +90 QB.
[url=http://www.totalfootballstats.com/PlayerQB.asp?id=3134]Jake Plummer College & Pro Football Statistics - Totalfootballstats.com[/url]

[B]Still it's a leap of faith to think that he can get the same kind of turn around with Locker.[/B][/quote]

You are correct. And Texas-sized-ego Shanny might make that leap, for good or for ill.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Landry44;794787]He didn't make anyone on his team better so how is it that he has great leadership skills? His team was sub 500 under his so called leadership. He has the ability(like many others) to make big throws but he rarely does. His accuracy is terrible that is why he had a 55% completion percentage. His whole college career has been mediocre at best. I have tons of evidence to support each one of these statements. Do you wish to challenge them?[/quote]

Thank you Landry44 for bringing some reality back to this Jake Locker lovefest. I feel the same way you do about Locker. The more game footage I watch of Locker the more I dislike him. His highlight reel of big game winning plays are him running the ball. Look what happen to him in the Bowl game nearly got knocked unconscious when he ran the ball against Nebraska. He will get killed in the NFL if he runs like he did in college. He is not very bright for running with his head down.
Kind of reminds me of Patrick Ramsey, great guy, looks like your frat brother, tough, can take a hit, strong arm, but inaccurate. Just like Ramsey. One major difference is he can run and Ramsey could not.
Locker will not wake up one day and go from being inaccurate college Qb against lesser talent and suddenly transform into an accurate passer against MUCH better talent he will face in the NFL.
Locker is a project and a bit of a gamble. You do not draft a project with the #10 pick. That is a Cerratto move.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

Sporting News War Room has Skins taking:

1) Castonzo
2) Locker
5) Pernell McPhee
5) Bruce Miller
6) Terrence Toliver
7) Sealver Siliga
7) Chris Stewart
7) Jeremy Ross


Castonzo and Locker? I'm all for it.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794810]Thank you Landry44 for bringing some reality back to this Jake Locker lovefest. I feel the same way you do about Locker. The more game footage I watch of Locker the more I dislike him. His highlight reel of big game winning plays are him running the ball. Look what happen to him in the Bowl game nearly got knocked unconscious when he ran the ball against Nebraska. He will get killed in the NFL if he runs like he did in college. He is not very bright.
Kind of reminds me of Patrick Ramsey, great guy, looks like your frat brother, tough, can take a hit, strong arm, but inaccurate. Just like Ramsey. The only difference is he can run and Ramsey could not.
Locker will not wake up one day and go from being inaccurate college Qb against lesser talent and suddenly transform into an accurate passer against MUCH better talent he will face in the NFL.
Locker is a project and a bit of a gamble. You do not draft a project with the #10 pick.[/quote]


It's only reality to you and Landry because you both share the same opinion. Others disagree believing that Locker deserves the benefit of the doubt when you look at the quality of the talent that surrounded him at Washington. If we can get Locker in the second round after taking Castonzo in the first as TSN's mock shows, that would be great in my opinion, especially if you take Locker with the idea of having him sit the first year getting some occasional mop up duty. Locker isn't the guy if you are expecting him to start day one.

As for the Locker/Ramsey comparison, I always like Ramsey and have always felt he got a raw deal considering the sieve for an offensive line we had. He was tough and his teammates respected him and that I can see in Locker. I'd be willing to bet that Locker will have the teams respect in short order by the way he works on and off the field and through his [b]leadership[/b]. He may not end up with a Tom Brady/Peyton Manning career, but I think he'll be someone we'll either wish we had drafted or are glad we did draft. Whatever we do, I just hope we get it right this year.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

^I like the idea of taking a day one starter at offensive tackle. It will help our terrible running game and help protect our Qb. Locker will just sit on the bench.
If we stay at 10 and all the elite pass rushers and Defensive linemen are gone, the few remaining elite Offensive linemen, WR or RB seems to a safer bet, then reaching for a QB.
Stick with what is proven works, elite pass rusher or elite offensive linemen. I would love to come away with from this draft with the next Russ Grimm and Joe Jacoby. They proved you win with any of three different Qb's.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794810]Thank you Landry44 for bringing some reality back to this Jake Locker lovefest. I feel the same way you do about Locker. The more game footage I watch of Locker the more I dislike him. [B]His highlight reel of big game winning plays are him running the ball. [/B] Look what happen to him in the Bowl game nearly got knocked unconscious when he ran the ball against Nebraska. He will get killed in the NFL if he runs like he did in college. He is not very bright for running with his head down.
Kind of reminds me of Patrick Ramsey, great guy, looks like your frat brother, tough, can take a hit, strong arm, but inaccurate. Just like Ramsey. One major difference is he can run and Ramsey could not.
Locker will not wake up one day and go from being inaccurate college Qb against lesser talent and suddenly transform into an accurate passer against MUCH better talent he will face in the NFL.
Locker is a project and a bit of a gamble. You do not draft a project with the #10 pick. That is a Cerratto move.[/quote]

There you go. A whole drive of passes and one run by Locker to set up a game winning field goal. I suggest you fast forward to 3:40 if you want to know what this Locker kid is all about.
[YT]fhTjtK2EcWc[/YT]

By the way, if Vick can learn to be an accurate passer then I'm pretty sure this Locker guy can to. Just remember 70% completion rate on throws outside the pocket. We run a bootleg, play action, down the field passing system.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Terpfan76;794812]It's only reality to you and Landry because you both share the same opinion. Others disagree believing that Locker deserves the benefit of the doubt when you look at the quality of the talent that surrounded him at Washington. [B]If we can get Locker in the second round after taking Castonzo in the first as TSN's mock shows, that would be great[/B] in my opinion, especially if you take Locker with the idea of having him sit the first year getting some occasional mop up duty. Locker isn't the guy if you are expecting him to start day one.

As for the Locker/Ramsey comparison, I always like Ramsey and have always felt he got a raw deal considering the sieve for an offensive line we had. He was tough and his teammates respected him and that I can see in Locker. I'd be willing to bet that Locker will have the teams respect in short order by the way he works on and off the field and through his [b]leadership[/b]. He may not end up with a Tom Brady/Peyton Manning career, but I think he'll be someone we'll either wish we had drafted or are glad we did draft. Whatever we do, I just hope we get it right this year.[/quote]

Of course that would be great. Just do not reach for Locker at #10.

You talk about Locker's college team not being very good. Yes that is true. But what really shocked me when watching his games from last year, I was shocked at how unathletic and bad some of the competition was. HIs highlights from the UCLA and Cal games in particular, some of the Db's and Lb's looked worse then my highschool teamates. The PAC 10 last year was not very good, especially the bottom half. Last years Pac10 will not be confused with the SEC. You are only as good as your competition.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

ChrisSteuber Chris Steuber
@
@evansilva The marriage between #Redskins & Locker is something I've been saying since January. Shanny gets the QB he wanted in '10 draft.
4 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

JuddZulgad JuddZulgad
@JustinRust Analysts are being sold on the fact the Redskins really like Locker and the Titans might, too. Not sure I buy it.
9 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

osman1878 Osman Abdullah
2011 NFL Draft: Mike Mayock Says Jake Locker To Redskins Makes Sense [url=http://bit.ly/eR2MmT]2011 NFL Draft: Mike Mayock Says Jake Locker To Redskins Makes Sense - SBNation.com[/url]
9 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

nfl_alerts FantasyPros
News: Mayock, Gruden say Locker fits Redskins ... [url=http://bit.ly/gvAjMi]Jake Locker - College Player - 2011 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com[/url] [url=http://www.FantasyPros.com]Fantasy Football Cheat Sheets, NFL Player Rankings and Expert Reviews[/url]
15 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794814]There you go. A whole drive of passes and one run by Locker to set up a game winning field goal. I suggest you fast forward to 3:40 if you want to know what this Locker kid is all about.
[YT]fhTjtK2EcWc[/YT]

By the way, if Vick can learn to be an accurate passer then I'm pretty sure this Locker guy can to. Just remember 70% completion rate on throws outside the pocket. We run a bootleg, play action, down the field passing system.[/quote]

Sir Dirtbag59
Locker rushed 12 times for 112 yards in that game. Locker rushed for 84 yards and a decisive touchdown in his final college game. Locker nearly got decapitated running the ball in that game.
Everyone talks about how he is not so accurate as a pocket passer but so much more accurate when getting outside of the pocket. In the NFL the speed of the defenders especially on the edge is so much more than college, Locker better develop pocket passing accuracy or he will get killed if he has to rely on one thing. Thinking Locker is a Franchise Qb at this stage is reckless. We have so many holes to fill taking a chance with Locker at 10 is a big gamble for Mr. Shanahan and his longevity in DC.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794817]Sir Dirtbag59
Locker rushed 12 times for 112 yards in that game. Locker rushed for 84 yards and a decisive touchdown in his final college game. Locker nearly got decapitated running the ball in that game.
Everyone talks about how he is not so accurate as a pocket passer but so much more accurate when getting outside of the pocket. In the NFL the speed of the defenders is so much more than college, Locker better develop pocket passing accuracy or he will get killed.[/quote]

Why is everyone knighting me today? You're like the 12th person to call me Sir.

And I agree on the need for him to develop as a pocket passer. I don't go into this prediction/desire for Locker without reservations but I certainly don't think it's unrealistic to expect him to develop that skill at the next level. Plus if the Redskins have done all this work since week 8 and decided that Locker is their guy that should at least say something about how he projects at the next level in this system.

Still while NFL defenses will make it significantly harder for QB's to gain yards on the ground it's still hard to get to QB's on designed play action. Especially when you have tackles like Trent Williams leading the way. Also the right side won't be shabby either with Brown or Harris manning the RT spot. Every Shanahan QB has had great success getting to the edges on bootlegs and rollouts....except McNabb but thats beside the point.

I mean if Schuab can get outside the pocket then I'm pretty sure that Locker can get there to.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794818]Why is everyone knighting me today? You're like the 12th person to call me Sir.

And I agree on the need for him to develop as a pocket passer. I don't go into this prediction/desire for Locker without reservations but I certainly don't think it's unrealistic to expect him to develop that skill at the next level. Plus if the Redskins have done all this work since week 8 and decided that Locker is their guy that should at least say something about how he projects at the next level in this system.

Still while NFL defenses will make it significantly harder for QB's to gain yards on the ground it's still hard to get to QB's on designed play action. Especially when you have tackles like Trent Williams leading the way. Also the right side won't be shabby either with Brown or Harris manning the RT spot. Every Shanahan QB has had great success getting to the edges on bootlegs and rollouts....except McNabb but thats beside the point.

I mean if Schuab can get outside the pocket then I'm pretty sure that Locker can get there to.[/quote]

Mcnabb was running for his life behind our line last year. I was not very impressed with Brown. I would not be so quick to lay all the blame on Mcnabb who was playing in a new system for him. I do not hate Locker and I would be ok with us taking further down the draft. He is a reach at 10. That is all. Reaching when you have so many other holes to fill is a Ceratto move.
We are not a Qb away from being good. This is a deep draft and we should get a day one starter at 10. Not a project roll of the dice. Not at 10 please.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794819]Mcnabb was running for his life behind our line last year. I was not very impressed with Brown. I would not be so quick to lay all the blame on Mcnabb who was playing in a new system for him. I do not hate Locker and I would be ok with us taking further down the draft. He is a reach at 10. That is all. Reaching when you have so many other holes to fill is a Ceratto move.
[B]We are not a Qb away from being good[/B].[/quote]

Agreed, but you don't draft a QB to be good that year. You draft a QB to be good 3 or 4 years down the road.

Lineman can be drafted and added in between and get up to speed much quicker (how many weeks, not years but weeks, did it take for Trent to get good enough to hold off Pro Bowl pass rushers). Bottom line if you see your franchise QB you take him. Maybe you can manage a quick trade down but you don't play fast and loose with a guy you see as your QB of the future.

Look at it this way. Without a QB of the future you're going to have to worry about the Skins taking a QB instead of a trench player for the next 2 or 3 years. You will never get any sleep. Even if Locker is a total bust the team will stay away from drafting the QB position for the next few years and instead focus on front 7 defenders, lineman, and other positions.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

Thats my Quarterback :'(
[YT]zWqU3VXIJY4[/YT]

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794814]There you go. A whole drive of passes and one run by Locker to set up a game winning field goal. I suggest you fast forward to 3:40 if you want to know what this Locker kid is all about.
[YT]fhTjtK2EcWc[/YT]

By the way, if Vick can learn to be an accurate passer then I'm pretty sure this Locker guy can to. Just remember 70% completion rate on throws outside the pocket. We run a bootleg, play action, down the field passing system.[/quote]

I remember this game like it was yesterday. The very game that turned me into a Locker fan. Clutch comeback.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

A different POV by Kevin Ewoldt:

We all know the Redskins are rebuilding, here's why drafting a QB makes zero sense.

1. There are no elite QBs in this draft. Every GM is saying this and it's obvious to numbnuts like me. The Redskins have a defense that can't get off the field and an offense line that is missing legit starters from Left Guard through Right Tackle. How does adding a flawed QB really help this team? (see next point)
2. We already have not one, but TWO average QBs. What's really the difference between Chris Ponder, Jake Locker, Andy Dalton, Rex Grossman, and John Beck? Nothing. They're all the same size with mobility, so what's the point of burning a quality pick on another QB? Grossman is 30 and knows the offense. Are any of these college QBs going to outplay Grossman the next 3 years? NO. Build the team where we need starters and fill the QB when a legit prospect rolls through.
3. Starting talent is deep in the draft. Parks Smith and I just did a live mock draft on Twitter where trades were allowed. We had several offers to move back at #10, which we did. The Redskins will have that opportunity and there were still quality players on the board in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
4. Redskins need starters. This is huge. With two average QBs on the bench, why add a 3rd when the Redskins have so many holes? Grossman can hold this ship for multiple years until we get a line that can protect him and some skilled players to bail him out. The Redskins are a bad team all around, so adding a QB that will ride the pine is criminal when that 2nd round pick is more likely than not to net a starter for several years to come.

Note: This isn't meant to be a "Bring back the Hogs" post. It's simply a fact our OLine is atrocious. It's a shame we didn't have free agency to help things out pre-draft, but perhaps it's a blessing in disguise in that it forces the front office to build our team through the draft.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

1. The coaches definitely want a young QB to develop

2. The Draft is still a crapshoot no matter what position you decide to draft.

3. I don't get how you can honestly say we don't need a QB.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

This is my new selling line. If we draft a QB this year, success or not, we won't have to worry about the front office drafting the position for at least the next 3 years. And hey if it works out then you get to draft all the lineman you want for the next 10 to 15 years and no one will challenge you. And best of all I won't have to hear about next years QB class being better for at least the next 2 or 3 years.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=53Fan;794824]A different POV by Kevin Ewoldt:

We all know the Redskins are rebuilding, here's why drafting a QB makes zero sense.

1. There are no elite QBs in this draft. Every GM is saying this and it's obvious to numbnuts like me. The Redskins have a defense that can't get off the field and an offense line that is missing legit starters from Left Guard through Right Tackle. How does adding a flawed QB really help this team? (see next point)
2. We already have not one, but TWO average QBs. What's really the difference between Chris Ponder, Jake Locker, Andy Dalton, Rex Grossman, and John Beck? Nothing. They're all the same size with mobility, so what's the point of burning a quality pick on another QB? Grossman is 30 and knows the offense. Are any of these college QBs going to outplay Grossman the next 3 years? NO. Build the team where we need starters and fill the QB when a legit prospect rolls through.
3. Starting talent is deep in the draft. Parks Smith and I just did a live mock draft on Twitter where trades were allowed. We had several offers to move back at #10, which we did. The Redskins will have that opportunity and there were still quality players on the board in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
4. Redskins need starters. This is huge. With two average QBs on the bench, why add a 3rd when the Redskins have so many holes? Grossman can hold this ship for multiple years until we get a line that can protect him and some skilled players to bail him out. The Redskins are a bad team all around, so adding a QB that will ride the pine is criminal when that 2nd round pick is more likely than not to net a starter for several years to come.

Note: This isn't meant to be a "Bring back the Hogs" post. It's simply a fact our OLine is atrocious. It's a shame we didn't have free agency to help things out pre-draft, but perhaps it's a blessing in disguise in that it forces the front office to build our team through the draft.[/quote]

They also came up with a pretty good article on Landry44's boy Mallet.


A Solid Case Why The Redskins Are Targeting Ryan Mallett
by back_to_the_future on Apr 20, 2011 12:35 PM EDT


149 COMMENTS EMAIL PRINT
Editor Update: A fine post possibly ruined by this breaking news on Mallett.

This is not Mike Shanahan's offense...it is Kyle's. Why do people talk about the type of QB Mike Shanahan likes (which most get it misconstrued), when Kyle's QB is on the contrary.The difference in both systems is that Mike is run first and Kyle is pass first.

[B]Mike Shanahan
He runs first to set up play action and bootleg. His basic package is with 2 WR, 1 TE, 1 HB, and a FB. To succeed in this system, Mike NEEDs a QB that can throw on the run. That is why the trade for McNabb made perfect sense. Cutler thrived in it.

Kyle Shanahan
Shotgun heavy with emphasis on stretching the field. Basic package: 3 WR, 1 TW, and 1 HB. To succeed in this system, Kyle Shanahan NEEDs a Qb with pocket presence to allow the play to develop. Matt Schaub thrived in it.
[/B]
McNabb, prior to the trade, fit the bill for both Shanahans. He can pass on the run with pocket presence. Late in the season, it was clear that Rex rossman ran the offense more smoothly then McNabb. Not because he can throw off the run, but because of pocket presence. Looking into this years draft, the only QB that makes sense for Kyle's system is Ryan Mallet. Jake Locker is what I stated about McNabb, but without pocket presence. Accuracy is a huge factor to be a pocket passer in Kyle's system. How many deep balls were under or over thrown by McNabb? And for that matter, even intermediate routes?




Don't be fooled by all the smoke and mirrors.[B] We were sure to receive Russell Okung last year (Jake Locker this year) for a system he did not fit in. Mallet is this years Trent Williams.[/B]


The Redskins WILL DO WHATEVER it takes to draft him.

Editor update: This YouTube highlight shows Mallett running and gunning out of the pocket quite a bit. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdagmnnKUx0]YouTube - Ryan Mallett[/ame]

The last part interest me the most. Maybe I was thinking that I was looking at the QB version of Williams when in fact I may have been looking at OKUNGGGGGGGGGGGGG! (Sorry I've gone to long without saying that). In my defense though I did say earlier in the offseason that Mallet reminded me of Schuab. But alas my faith in my Locker prediction can't be shaken. I must stick to my guns and become the Warpaths Rain Man, which will be a step up from my current position as QB whore.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794827]They also came up with a pretty good article on Landry44's boy Mallet.


A Solid Case Why The Redskins Are Targeting Ryan Mallett
by back_to_the_future on Apr 20, 2011 12:35 PM EDT


149 COMMENTS EMAIL PRINT
Editor Update: A fine post possibly ruined by this breaking news on Mallett.

This is not Mike Shanahan's offense...it is Kyle's. Why do people talk about the type of QB Mike Shanahan likes (which most get it misconstrued), when Kyle's QB is on the contrary.The difference in both systems is that Mike is run first and Kyle is pass first.

[B]Mike Shanahan
He runs first to set up play action and bootleg. His basic package is with 2 WR, 1 TE, 1 HB, and a FB. To succeed in this system, Mike NEEDs a QB that can throw on the run. That is why the trade for McNabb made perfect sense. Cutler thrived in it.

Kyle Shanahan
Shotgun heavy with emphasis on stretching the field. Basic package: 3 WR, 1 TW, and 1 HB. To succeed in this system, Kyle Shanahan NEEDs a Qb with pocket presence to allow the play to develop. Matt Schaub thrived in it.
[/B]
McNabb, prior to the trade, fit the bill for both Shanahans. He can pass on the run with pocket presence. Late in the season, it was clear that Rex rossman ran the offense more smoothly then McNabb. Not because he can throw off the run, but because of pocket presence. Looking into this years draft, the only QB that makes sense for Kyle's system is Ryan Mallet. Jake Locker is what I stated about McNabb, but without pocket presence. Accuracy is a huge factor to be a pocket passer in Kyle's system. How many deep balls were under or over thrown by McNabb? And for that matter, even intermediate routes?




Don't be fooled by all the smoke and mirrors.[B] We were sure to receive Russell Okung last year (Jake Locker this year) for a system he did not fit in. Mallet is this years Trent Williams.[/B]


The Redskins WILL DO WHATEVER it takes to draft him.

Editor update: This YouTube highlight shows Mallett running and gunning out of the pocket quite a bit. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdagmnnKUx0]YouTube - Ryan Mallett[/url]

The last part interest me the most. Maybe I was thinking that I was looking at the QB version of Williams when in fact I may have been looking at OKUNGGGGGGGGGGGGG! (Sorry I've gone to long without saying that). In my defense though I did say earlier in the offseason that Mallet reminded me of Schuab. But alas my faith in my Locker prediction can't be shaken. I must stick to my guns and become the Warpaths Rain Man, which will be a step up from my current position as QB whore.[/quote]

You're looking to deep into this.

Ryan Mallett is a mess and does not have the personality to be the franchise player of the Redskins. It really is that simple.

Not only that but it's just too easy to beat a QB like Mallett when your O-line is so sketchy, and it's not like we can rely on our receivers to be making plays.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

Kyle's offense has a lot of bootleg actions in it too, Schaub might not be all that mobile but he's athletic enough to run the boots and move around. I don't see Mallett as a good fit here at all from that perspective.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=53Fan;794824]A different POV by Kevin Ewoldt:

[B]We all know the Redskins are rebuilding[/B], here's why drafting a QB makes zero sense.

[/quote]

No one told Shanahan this last year!

On a serious note, I think we should draft a QB. Having a coach and offensive coordinator that insist on having their QB fit their system, it is logical for them to pick up a young QB to groom. However, Shanny and Co. need to figure out how to get a QB and additional picks.

Right now I think it would have been great if the team had traded Haynesworth for a 3rd rounder. That would have given us picks in the first three rounds, without the need of trading down. Or we could have traded down and have a low first, a second, and two third rounders.

Oh well, I just hope they do the right thing this offseason.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=GreekSkin;794825]1. The coaches definitely want a young QB to develop

2. The Draft is still a crapshoot no matter what position you decide to draft.

3. I don't get how you can honestly say we don't need a QB.[/quote]

I'll do my best to help out.... with #3.....

I think he's half right/half wrong. I've been saying all along as well it doesn't matter who you bring in if there is no protection for them. The team will get the same results out of a Rookie QB or a Vet who is scrambling for their life.

Second point is .... No matter who you, me, the coaches or anyone else think is the best QB prospect this year it's going to take time for them to learn the scheme, and play calls. This is where some people differ but you can't tell me McNabb being a future HOF playing in the NFL after so many seasons and having the game already slowed down because he knows what to look for and where to go with the ball... can't get the job done but a Rookie will come in and play better? Aint going to happen.

I'd rather keep McNabb or Grossman for another year while said Rookie learns the system for next year. Which is more likely to happen.

So all I think he was pointing out is if there is no clear cut top QB in the draft then it might be best to draft for OL and DL and fix those problems in order to give the QB more time in the pocket and next year when there are fewer teams who need a QB hopefully a top ranked one will fall to us. At that time yes he will still have to learn the system but he will have better protection around him vs. what he would have now which is very little.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Mattyk;794876]Kyle's offense has a lot of bootleg actions in it too, Schaub might not be all that mobile but he's athletic enough to run the boots and move around. I don't see Mallett as a good fit here at all from that perspective.[/quote]

Yeah neither do I. Totally understand what he's saying though and agree this was not MS's offense, however I think the idea was to have MS's run package meet up with KS pass package and I think for what ever reason the OL failed to execute the run package well. Almost no holes were created for the run so the team leaned heavily on KS's passing scheme.

I think it will be interesting to see how the OL does this year after having been in it for a year and having a better understanding of where and how to zone block. But it could just as easily be MS handing over the offense to KS and letting him implement the scheme. Which would mean Dirtbag is correct... the QB's mentioned might not be the type needed for this scheme.

which is why I still like Dalton. He can run, he can pass, he is pretty accurate, and he threw for a lot of yards in college. Plus he's a winner...... "If you aint first your last." lol.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Ruhskins;794877]No one told Shanahan this last year!

On a serious note, I think we should draft a QB. Having a coach and offensive coordinator that insist on having their QB fit their system, it is logical for them to pick up a young QB to groom. However, Shanny and Co. need to figure out how to get a QB and additional picks.

Right now I think it would have been great if the team had traded Haynesworth for a 3rd rounder. That would have given us picks in the first three rounds, without the need of trading down. Or we could have traded down and have a low first, a second, and two third rounders.

Oh well, I just hope they do the right thing this offseason.[/quote]

I was going to say something sarcastic but I'll just politely ask.... you really think the Skins would get a 3rd rounder for Haynesworth? I'd say 4th is a pipe dream. After he sabatoged the year I'd think we would be lucky to get a 5th or later.

McNabb we might have gotten a 4th.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

I hope and pray all this QB talk is just that.....TALK.

If we stay at #10 and don't wind up with JJ Watt, Cam Jordan, Von Miller (if he drops like Orakpo) or Quinn I will not be a happy camper.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=GreekSkin;794825]1. The coaches definitely want a young QB to develop

2. The Draft is still a crapshoot no matter what position you decide to draft.

3. I don't get how you can honestly say we don't need a QB.[/quote]

re:#2 - Yes, there is a variable amount of luck involved in picking a player due to injuries and bust factor. But there is[B] much less[/B] of a crap shoot chance a blue chip player like LB Vonn Miller or CB Patrick Petersen is going to be bust than say a Mallet or Locker. It is not a complete crap shoot.

re:#3 - Nobody is saying we do not need a young Qb of the future. What the people that are against taking a QB at #10 is there is no QB in this draft worthy of projecting at the #10. The two QB's that most "so called experts" are projected worthy of being a top 10 pick Blaine Gabbert and Cam Newton, will most likely be gone. I really am not too impressed with those two either anyway.
At this point filling the huge holes in our starting line up with quality players is more important then reaching for a Qb with question marks.
This is a deep draft, so spending such a valuable (#10 pick) at this point on a questionable QB (Locker) when there much less questionable talented players like a OT Anthony Costanzo or even possibly Tyron Smitho or a JJ Watt or Cam Jordan might still be there. There are so many other greater foundation needs to address then a luxury pick of a future franchise Qb that will sit on the bench come September. A day one starter at OT or DE/LB would be ideal at #10.
We have to get value player or else trade back.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=SBXVII;794884]I was going to say something sarcastic but I'll just politely ask.... you really think the Skins would get a 3rd rounder for Haynesworth? I'd say 4th is a pipe dream. After he sabatoged the year I'd think we would be lucky to get a 5th or later.

McNabb we might have gotten a 4th.[/quote]

Probably a 4th rounder, heck a 5th rounder...I know a 3rd is a reach. My point is that Shanny should've been thinking more about acquiring picks for this upcoming draft, than whatever the hell he was thinking when they decided to keep him in the team.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

@IrMitchell

Ryan Mallett is the best qb in this draft. He has played behind a really poor line for the last 2 years and still put up huge numbers against top quality opponents.

@Mattyk

If you actually watched any Arkansas games you would know that they run a lot of bootlegs. You don't have to be a mobile qb to run the bootleg successfully on a consistent basis.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794810]Thank you Landry44 for bringing some reality back to this Jake Locker lovefest. I feel the same way you do about Locker. The more game footage I watch of Locker the more I dislike him. His highlight reel of big game winning plays are him running the ball. Look what happen to him in the Bowl game nearly got knocked unconscious when he ran the ball against Nebraska. He will get killed in the NFL if he runs like he did in college. He is not very bright for running with his head down.
Kind of reminds me of Patrick Ramsey, great guy, looks like your frat brother, tough, can take a hit, strong arm, but inaccurate. Just like Ramsey. One major difference is he can run and Ramsey could not.
Locker will not wake up one day and go from being inaccurate college Qb against lesser talent and suddenly transform into an accurate passer against MUCH better talent he will face in the NFL.
Locker is a project and a bit of a gamble. You do not draft a project with the #10 pick. That is a Cerratto move.[/quote]
I don't understand why the world can't see that this kid just don't got it. When at Locker I see a kid with a great arm, quick release, and great mobility. However, I also see a kid that's inaccurate with the football, rarely go through his progressions, make terrible decisions with the football, and mediocre in almost every category that counts. People keep saying that his supporting cast wasn't all that good and didn't give him to much help. In his defense, I would have to say that's true. However, he didn't give them much help. I can recall so many games where he had time to throw and a wr open but couldn't get the ball to the guy. I've also seen him flatout miss open guys. Now I don't want anyone to think I'm being bias against him because I did want to see him do well this year. I really believe he's a good kid with very good character. The problem is he hasn't shown me that he can be a good qb. In my opinion this kid is nothing more than a project that's not worth drafting in the first round.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Defensewins;794887]re:#2 - Yes, there is a variable amount of luck involved in picking a player due to injuries and bust factor. But there is[B] much less[/B] of a crap shoot chance a blue chip player like LB Vonn Miller or CB Patrick Petersen is going to be bust than say a Mallet or Locker. It is not a complete crap shoot.

re:#3 - Nobody is saying we do not need a young Qb of the future. What the people that are against taking a QB at #10 is there is no QB in this draft worthy of projecting at the #10. The two QB's that most "so called experts" are projected worthy of being a top 10 pick Blaine Gabbert and Cam Newton, will most likely be gone. I really am not too impressed with those two either anyway.
At this point filling the huge holes in our starting line up with quality players is more important then reaching for a Qb with question marks.
This is a deep draft, so spending such a valuable (#10 pick) at this point on a questionable QB (Locker) when there much less questionable talented players like a OT Anthony Costanzo or even possibly Tyron Smitho or a JJ Watt or Cam Jordan might still be there. There are so many other greater foundation needs to address then a luxury pick of a future franchise Qb that will sit on the bench come September. A day one starter at OT or DE/LB would be ideal at #10.
We have to get value player or else trade back.[/quote]

I assumed you said we don't need a QB in the draft as you said it numerous times in your post. I personally don't mind if we take a QB high as long as the coaches really want him, but at the same time just look at the suggestion I have in my sig. I would love for us to get help on the DL and OL and draft a QB later. That way you aren't as tied to him next year as you would be a first round QB.

To that point though I definitely won't be disappointed if we go QB high, the coaches would have there reason for doing so. I highly doubt Vonn Miller or Patrick Peterson will be available at 10 anyways.

another point I want to make is that our O-line got better toward the end of the season and it isn't as atrocious as some would have us thing. They had a few good games and hopefully with at least a few weeks of FA we can sign a few players to help out, on top of the players we already have getting better.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Landry44;794904]@IrMitchell

Ryan Mallett is the best qb in this draft. He has played behind a really poor line for the last 2 years and still put up huge numbers against top quality opponents.

@Mattyk

If you actually watched any Arkansas games you would know that they run a lot of bootlegs. [B]You don't have to be a mobile qb to run the bootleg successfully on a consistent basis[/B].[/quote]

Oh I know, like I said Schaub was able to operate in KS's offense just fine. I'll defer to you on your opinion that Mallett can run boots. I admit I haven't seen a ton of him in action.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Mattyk;794920]Oh I know, like I said Schaub was able to operate in KS's offense just fine. I'll defer to you on your opinion that Mallett can run boots. I admit I haven't seen a ton of him in action.[/quote]

Does anyone have anymore insight on possible differences between Kyle's version of the offense and Mike's version, and who has more influence over the actual plays ran because I feel if such a difference exist it would help shed some light on what the Skins are looking for in a QB.

Re: 2011 NFL Mock Draft thread.
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;794930]Does anyone have anymore insight on possible differences between Kyle's version of the offense and Mike's version, and who has more influence over the actual plays ran because I feel if such a difference exist it would help shed some light on what the Skins are looking for in a QB.[/quote]Look at the run/pass ratio of the MS Broncos vs. the Texans while KS was there. HUGE disparity. IMO we're better off with KS's offense with a higher percentage of power runs instead of the ZB/PA scheme.