Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;1079064]Well, it is his 7th time? Not surprising the league is gone to suspensions again. The hit on Pierce was definitely the worse of the two in my book. The other one wasn't as bad to me. He led with the shoulder and did what a S should do. Maybe Flacco shouldn't get his WRs killed by throwing shitty passes to guys covered.





edit: Looking at it again, he did go high even though he led with the shoulder.



[url]https://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/864450652.gif?1408855282[/url][/QUOTE]


I dont think he went high i mean he tried to aim at the numbers. How low can he go?

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079068]I dont think he went high i mean he tried to aim at the numbers. How low can he go?[/quote]

Didn't say it was intentional, that the hit landed high. Hence we are, where we are today.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

Seemed like a clean hit to me,

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

Alas nothing on DJ Swearinger yet for probably ending welkers career? Fucking mara in his butt buddy goodells ear as.usual. this is an absolute JOKE.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=Meks;1079075]Alas nothing on DJ Swearinger yet for probably ending welkers career? Fucking mara in his butt buddy goodells ear as.usual. this is an absolute JOKE.[/QUOTE]


Swearinger Welker hit:

[url]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OrLO8SAGB0A[/url]

IMO it's the same exact hit. Welker does the same thing as T Smith and gets smaller as he is about to be hit. Swearinger then lowers his should and leaves his feet hiring Welker in the head. And there is clearly no attempt to wrap up by Swearinger.

How Meriweather gets 2 games and Swearinger doesn't even get a fine is absurd.

I think this also goes back to a point made by NC Skins, and something that I've said and heard before. It's time that these QB's take some responsibility. They can see where the safety is playing and it's their job to lead their WR away from the hit. The pass from Manning to Welker and from Flacco to Smith, were both terrible passes in the middle that left their WR's exposed and open to get laid out.

Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

Does Swearinger have a track record like BW? I mean it isnt a complete mystery why BW got suspended.
Edit: i dont think BW did anything wrong this time around, but as far as his penalty - it has everything to do with his priors.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

i find it surprising the number of people defending meriweather. he has a history of doing this, he's been suspended before, it's the number one reason he's considered (entering this season) a liability for this team.

he's a dirty player and a marked man. no other player in the league has such a huge issue with tackling correctly like meriweather does.

i don't know why we continue to bring him back. he's perpetually one hit away from a suspension and he's proven he's too stupid to understand that and play the game the way he's been asked to play it.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

^ but do you think this hit in particular was dirty? Im not sure what he could have done? He led with the shoulder and aimed at the numbers.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079098]^ but do you think this hit in particular was dirty? Im not sure what he could have done? He led with the shoulder and aimed at the numbers.[/quote]

he could stop lowering his head every time he goes to make a tackle, like he's been asked repeatedly not to do, so that he doesn't go helmet to helmet.

he could stop shoulder tackling and otherwise turning himself into a missile. he could stop trying to make it about a big hit and instead make it about stopping a play.

in other words, he could tackle the correct way. the way they teach you when you're 7 years old.

if this was his first, or even second time, then i'd say ok. but it's not, it's his 6th time + all the times he got away with it before the league started cracking down hard.

this is his fault. blaming it on anyone else is ridiculous. how many times must the same conversation be had with the same player/organization before that player/organization is forced to accept responsibility for it?

get rid of him. he's a dirty player and the league is calling him out for being one. i hate that he's on my team.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

I dont know, i mean one thing a good safety does is try to jar the ball loose as opposed to wrapping a guy up for a 15 yard gain. In this case he tackled by the letter of the law and the offensive player lowered his head when he saw BW coming.
Yes though due to BW's track record it is an issue.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079101]I dont know, i mean one thing a good safety does is try to jar the ball loose as opposed to wrapping a guy up for a 15 yard gain. In this case he tackled by the letter of the law and the offensive player lowered his head when he saw BW coming.
Yes though due to BW's track record it is an issue.[/quote]

He lowered his helmet and the play resulted in helmet to helmet contact. That is not the letter of the law and that's why he's been suspended. There is a zero tolerance policy with him and he's too stupid to get it, and now we're the ones paying the pice.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=tshile;1079102]He lowered his helmet and the play resulted in helmet to helmet contact. That is not the letter of the law and that's why he's been suspended. There is a zero tolerance policy with him and he's too stupid to get it, and now we're the ones paying the pice.[/QUOTE]


Well we can agree to disagree. He led with his shoulder. He in no way targeted the head. In the past there has been plenty of times where he clearly went helmet to helmet launching himself in that direction. I just dont see this play as one of them. Anybody else want to weigh in on this? Im curious as to who thought this was a dirty hit.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=tshile;1079097]i find it surprising the number of people defending meriweather. he has a history of doing this, he's been suspended before, it's the number one reason he's considered (entering this season) a liability for this team.

he's a dirty player and a marked man. no other player in the league has such a huge issue with tackling correctly like meriweather does.

i don't know why we continue to bring him back. he's perpetually one hit away from a suspension and he's proven he's too stupid to understand that and play the game the way he's been asked to play it.[/quote]

a) because it wasnt an illegal hit, he lead with his shoulder

b) because the penalty is baised

c) how the fuck is ray rice only suspended 2 games

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1079105]a) because it wasnt an illegal hit, he lead with his shoulder

b) because the penalty is baised

c) how the fuck is ray rice only suspended 2 games[/quote]

I be more upset if BM played OL considering we have to play JAX and HOU the next 2 games. Losing BM for those two games really not a big hit.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1079105]a) because it wasnt an illegal hit, he lead with his shoulder



b) because the penalty is baised



c) how the fuck is ray rice only suspended 2 games[/QUOTE]


If this was last year he would he left his feet about 2 steps earlier and lead with his forearms. He left his feet right at contact put his head down to go into the body of the WR. His target was the rib area, but the WR ducked down and and he made contact shoulder to shoulder, and his helmet hit the WR helmet, but not intentionally.

He obviously has a target on his back and rightfully so. This suspension is BS and will hopefully get reduced to 1 game.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=mredskins;1079107]I be more upset if BM played OL considering we have to play JAX and HOU the next 2 games. Losing BM for those two games really not a big hit.[/QUOTE]


This. Thank God. Would be so much worse if he played OL. Or imagine the first two games were Denver and the Saints?!?

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1079105]a) because it wasnt an illegal hit, he lead with his shoulder

b) because the penalty is baised

c) how the fuck is ray rice only suspended 2 games[/quote]

a) the league says otherwise, and they're th eones that make and enforce the rules.

b) of course it is. this is what happens when you have a track record of being a dirty player, you get scrutinized more and judged more. some people would call it unfair but that's life - you get to earn your own reputation, it's his fault.

c) while i agree the rice suspension is ridiculous, that has nothing to do with meriweather forcing the league to hand down a punishment for the same problem for the 6th time, and it has nothing to do with our organizations inability to prevent itself from being harmed by it. we KNOW this is the type of player he is. EVERYONE does.

yet here we are.

at some point the league is going to tell meriweather he can't play any longer because the risk he poses in injuring other players is simply not fair to the rest of the league. and in my opinion, they'd be right.

if meriweather played for the ravens and he hit jackson/reed/garcon like that and injured them, given his track record, how would you react?

assuming you'd react like i believe most people would react (the way every other fan in the league reacts when they see a meriweather hit worthy of punishment), why do you react differently just because he's wearing your team's jersey?

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[url=http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap3000000383585/Meriweather-penalized-for-hit-on-Torrey-Smith]Washington Redskins defensive back Brandon Meriweather is penalized for hit on Baltimore Ravens wide receiver Torrey Smith - NFL Videos[/url]

The call on the field was hitting the head of a defenseless player. A receiver needs to establish himself as a runner before you can make initial contact with a ball carriers head. That is why the head hit on pierce was not flagged.

I watched the video and paused it a few times. I think (like everyone else) that defensive players have an impossible task of trying to do their job and only deliver clean hits. Many times a receiver like welker will lower their body right before impact changing the impact zone of the defender who has already committed to the hit.

But here BM has about 10 yards and closes in full speed on smith, lowers his head for the last 2 yards and uses the crown of his helmet like a missile and it is pretty clear his helmet hits the chin bars of smith's helmet.

BM cannot take a 10 yard sprint and lead with the crown of his helmet.

BM needs to stop leading with his helmet.

Pause the video a yard or 2 before BM makes contact. His eyes are pointing directly down as if he is bowing.

BM is the best secondary player we have, i like the way he plays but this is clearly deserving of a flag and league discipline given his prior history.

re ray rice - a lot of people think ray rice cold clocked his wife with a fist in the elevator. godell and the prosecutor both saw the camera footage inside the elevator, the public has not. there is chatter that ray rice didnt punch his wife or anything as bad as people seem to think who only saw the footage of him dragging his wife outside of the elevator door. i have no position on ray rice or his punishment, but i dont see how his penalty has anything to do with BM or any other on field infraction. if ray cold clocked his wife on video, i believe his suspension would have been much longer. i do not know what happened inside the elevator.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

T-shile you watched the hit. Do you see him lead with his shoulder? That is NOT illegal. Nobody is saying BW didnt bring this on himself. Just saying that this particular hit and suspension for said hit is bogus. Whatever like MRedskin said the Jags and Texans arent exactly going to lead the league in air assault.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079117]T-shile you watched the hit. Do you see him lead with his shoulder? That is NOT illegal. Nobody is saying BW didnt bring this on himself. Just saying that this particular hit and suspension for said hit is bogus. Whatever like MRedskin said the Jags and Texans arent exactly going to lead the league in air assault.[/quote]

pause the video i linked at the 0:34 mark and tell me what BM is leading with.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079117]T-shile you watched the hit. Do you see him lead with his shoulder? That is NOT illegal. Nobody is saying BW didnt bring this on himself. Just saying that this particular hit and suspension for said hit is bogus. Whatever like MRedskin said the Jags and Texans arent exactly going to lead the league in air assault.[/quote]

I think any other player would have gotten a warning or a fine.

I think he continually ducks his head, after being punished so many times, and the NFL looks at it says - we've fined you multiple times, we've suspended you, we've had this conversation, you continue to do the same things and it continues to lead to helmet to helmet contact.

He's injured people playing like this. The NFL is dealing with expensive lawsuits related to helmet to helmet contact.

You see this with him all the time. Everyone else (for the most part) has figured it out. He hasn't.

I realize I'm coming off extremely opinionated on it but I told my wife when the hit happened he was going to get suspended for it. Now he's suspended. If you're Meriweather you [i]cannot[/i] continue to play like this. If you're the Redskins you [i]cannot[/i] continue to rely on this guy. Just the way I view it.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

So was he suspend for the Pierce hit or the Smith hit?

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

smith hit. pierce was an established ball carrier and BM head was up, not lowered.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=mredskins;1079125]So was he suspend for the Pierce hit or the Smith hit?[/quote]

he was suspended for 2 games last year, i forget the specific hits they were for, he appealed and got it down to 1 game.

unless he can make a really good case that these hits were not the result of him doing something wrong (I think any time you duck your head and blindly go into a tackle you lose that argument, but just my opinion) he's going to get the full 2 games time.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

You put your shoulder down and the head follows. I don't know what these guys are supposed to do sometimes.

We're probably moving toward not being able to touch a WR until they complete the catch.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=mlmdub130;1079056][url=http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=11408933]NFL Brandon Meriweather suspended - ESPN[/url]

I thought a fine might be coming when I saw the hit. This is complete horse s. So now who's starting week one?[/quote]

Mike Jones reporting Rambo is taking 1st team SS reps today with BM sitting out with bumps and bruises.

Id wouldnt mind seeing that if BM is out

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;1079131]You put your shoulder down and the head follows. I don't know what these guys are supposed to do sometimes.

We're probably moving toward not being able to touch a WR until they complete the catch.[/quote]

you're supposed to see what you hit.
you're supposed to go for the waist area.

this is among the first things they teach you when you start playing at a young age. it's something they teach you as you continue to go through sports.

it changes when you start trying to get scholarships and when you start trying to get drafted, and you make a conscious decision to go for big hits in an effort to be noticed. after years of playing that way it becomes hard to undo it.

that doesn't make it anyone else's fault. everyone else in the league is figuring it out. it's our one guy that can't seem to get his shit together.

you never saw fletcher tackle that way.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1079136]Mike Jones reporting Rambo is taking 1st team SS reps today with BM sitting out with bumps and bruises.

Id wouldnt mind seeing that if BM is out[/quote]

ugh, I'm still not convinced Rambo has matured into an NFL caliber player. i hope i'm wrong.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=tshile;1079128]he was suspended for 2 games last year, i forget the specific hits they were for, he appealed and got it down to 1 game.

unless he can make a really good case that these hits were not the result of him doing something wrong (I think any time you duck your head and blindly go into a tackle you lose that argument, but just my opinion) he's going to get the full 2 games time.[/quote]

Thank you for totally not answering the question.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=over the mountain;1079127]smith hit. pierce was an established ball carrier and BM head was up, not lowered.[/quote]

Thank you for totally answering the question.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=mredskins;1079142]Thank you for totally not answering the question.[/quote]

you're welcome

Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=over the mountain;1079122]pause the video i linked at the 0:34 mark and tell me what BM is leading with.[/QUOTE]


At the 34 second mark i see the play from behind. At the 43 second mark i see shoulder first. You can clearly see him throwing his forearms in front of his body. As Matty said if you lead with the shoulder the head follows.
For what it is worth Smith himself called it a clean football play.
Edit: so did Burress. Another wr who had nothing to do with the play.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=tshile;1079124]The NFL is dealing with expensive lawsuits related to helmet to helmet contact.[/quote]

Lawsuits and lawyers ruin everything. Now, they're messing with my beloved game of NFL football.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079151]At the 34 second mark i see the play from behind. At the 43 second mark i see shoulder first. You can clearly see him throwing his forearms in front of his body. As Matty said if you lead with the shoulder the head follows.
For what it is worth Smith himself called it a clean football play.
Edit: so did Burress. Another wr who had nothing to do with the play.[/quote]

yeah the video is hard to tell bc it is a poor quality. thanks for taking a look punch. at the :34 mark a second before impact i clearly see BM head down. imo (and i wont belabor the point again), there is a difference with leading with your head up (like the pierce hit) and leading with your head down/crown of your helmet (like the smith hit).

sucks bc entering this season, the next flag may lead to a 4+ game suspension and we cannot afford to lose BM for any extended period of time.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=over the mountain;1079155]yeah the video is hard to tell bc it is a poor quality. thanks for taking a look punch. at the :34 mark a second before impact i clearly see BM head down. imo (and i wont belabor the point again), there is a difference with leading with your head up (like the pierce hit) and leading with your head down/crown of your helmet (like the smith hit).



sucks bc entering this season, the next flag may lead to a 4+ game suspension and we cannot afford to lose BM for any extended period of time.[/QUOTE]


Certainly not a guy we want to lose at all considering our depth, or lack there of at S. I hear what you are saying about lowering the head. I said it before, playing S, and a WR catches a 20 yard pass you are thinking jar that ball loose. Cannot be easy to do running full speed - bang bang play. I agree he needs to keep his head up. I think the refs/ league need to take a really good look at the WR's body motion before the hit. If the WR is lowering his head in a defensive motion than I just am not sure how the DB is supposed to avoid it. Hopefully like you said BW figures it out before we lose him for an extended time period.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1079164]Certainly not a guy we want to lose at all considering our depth, or lack there of at S. I hear what you are saying about lowering the head. I said it before, playing S, and a WR catches a 20 yard pass you are thinking jar that ball loose. Cannot be easy to do running full speed - bang bang play. I agree he needs to keep his head up. [B]I think the refs/ league need to take a really good look at the WR's body motion before the hit[/B]. If the WR is lowering his head in a defensive motion than I just am not sure how the DB is supposed to avoid it. Hopefully like you said BW figures it out before we lose him for an extended time period.[/quote]

i think it is a no-brainer that personal flags for helmet to helmet/hitting a defenseless player in the head will be subject to review. im not sure if it will be a ref instituted review, an auto review like they do for turnovers and scores or take a coach challenge but a in-game review is the easiest solution and coming next season.

KI - i think the NFL in part wants to say they did everything they could to prevent death or traumatic brain injury before a player dies or goes into a trauma induced coma on the field. make no mistake about it, a player will die on the field. whether it be this year, 5 years or 20 years from now .. a dale earnhardt type moment is coming. whether the NFL is doing this to truly prevent that or just CYA is up for debate.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=over the mountain;1079168]i think it is a no-brainer that personal flags for helmet to helmet/hitting a defenseless player in the head will be subject to review. im not sure if it will be a ref instituted review, an auto review like they do for turnovers and scores or take a coach challenge but a in-game review is the easiest solution and coming next season./QUOTE]

It won't necessarily be the solution because the league office reserves the right to fine and suspend players for h-to-h hits even if a penalty isn't called.

What happens when a penalty is called and then overruled only to have the player fined or suspended by the league office?

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[quote=over the mountain;1079122]pause the video i linked at the 0:34 mark and tell me what BM is leading with.[/quote]

He is leading with his shoulder and his head is tucked down and in. Compare the angle at the :34 mark with the angle at the :41 mark. If he comes in head up, it would have been face mask to face mask. Really, BM or not, given the angle of approach, hitting the WR's head was an almost impossible task on that play without whiffing on the WR altogether.

It's a bang-bang play and it appears - to me - BM was actually tucking his head in an attempt to lead with the shoulder b/c anything short of that was going to end in a head shot. It's close, but, given BM's history, he will never, ever get that call.

Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

[QUOTE=JoeRedskin;1079173]He is leading with his shoulder and his head is tucked down and in. Compare the angle at the :34 mark with the angle at the :41 mark. If he comes in head up, it would have been face mask to face mask. Really, BM or not, given the angle of approach, hitting the WR's head was an almost impossible task on that play without whiffing on the WR altogether.



It's a bang-bang play and it appears - to me - BM was actually tucking his head in an attempt to lead with the shoulder b/c anything short of that was going to end in a head shot. It's close, but, given BM's history, he will never, ever get that call.[/QUOTE]


Exactly how i see it.
Edit : if we cant beat the Jags without BM the season is over early anyway.

Re: Ravens v. Redskins Gameday Thread
 

cooley did a really good tape breakdown of RG3 yesterday of the ravens game.
i love listening to cooley bc he gives you really good in-depth breakdowns.

he sd the offense was very very vanilla. we didnt call any short quick passes on purpose and he expects a lot of that once the regular season starts.

rg3 needs to trust his pre snap reads (where the safeties are dictates whether he reads the right or left side of the field)

he needs to trust his receivers will win the battle for the ball. he needs to get the ball out quicker and on-time. he cannot wait until he sees his receiver win the battle/become open.

he sd he didnt see rg3 throw into tight spaces = lack of confidence

he sd he knows rg3 can do this, he did it in 2012 albeit when his 1st read was wide open but that gave rg3 confidence to also try and fit tight throws etc.

he sd in games when rg3 would hit a pass play early he would come into the huddle super confident and had the look that he was unstoppable. he expects gruden to dial up short pass plays to get rg3 going early.

specific plays

1. the early pass play to d jax that was intercepted (a flag on D negated it). he sd rg3 read it right and threw it on time (before d jax broke) but d jax misread the play and took his route to far and into coverage causing the pick.

2. on a 5 yard hitch route he sd rg3 waited until his guy was done the route and standing open before he threw the ball. rg3 should have trusted the pre snap read and should have trusted his receiver would be in the spot he was supposed to be. especially considering it was a simple 5 yard hitch.


cousins - he sd cousins play call did include short pass plays. cousins is real good going from read 1 to 2, real good keeping his eyes down the middle of the field even though he knows he is going to the left or right.