Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;700978]You are wrong....about...a....great...many....things.....young jedi.

1) "Spreading the wealth" or wealth redistribution is not a function of any economic system. The only entitiy that would redistribute wealth is one with the ability to do so (guns, jails, etc.)....the gov't. The function of federal gov't should be providing for national defense, certain nationwide infrastructure projects, courts, limited regulation of businesses, and not much more (that's why we have states). What is not a function of gov't is to take personal property from one group simply because of how much money they make and give it to others in the form of govt' payments in one form or another. There should be a uniform percentage of tax on all, with the very poor exempt. Those who make more money will pay more into that system because x % of $ 150K is more than x % of $ 50K.

Do you think it's fair that 47% of households in the U.S. pay no federal taxes? Is it fair that the top 10% paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government? Is it fair that the bottom 40%, on average, make a profit from federal income taxes?

2) I'm not a regular Rush listener and haven't listened in months.....I'm working in the middle of the day. But, you may want to stay off Air America.....ooops you can't listen to Air America, they went bankrupt and shut down.

3) So by your logic we should be getting the shots ready for saden's boys Billy G, Warren B, etc. because they've been too successful :frusty:[/quote]


I was being over dramatic. From your let the markets decide philosphy is ther a danger that a democracy turn into an oligarchy like in Russia. You must understand no system is perfect and must be regulated. Money is just a way to distribute welath itself. Not saying that's the governmnt's job, but in a good system design mooney does not collect in one spot. If it deos then it fails the society. You wind up with dictators. The free market will not regulate itself that would be a dangerous experiment and step back in time.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;700957]Taxes are a reality. Even Jesus said give Ceasar what's Ceasar's. I think it is cynical to boost up gullible people with the intoxicating idea of no taxes. There is a finite sum of money and it must be spread to the benefit of society, or we learn lesson of history (i.e. Mari antoinette etc etc). Having said that we are taxed too much though.[/quote]

I and most people don't have any problems with paying any fair tax its the FUCKING WAIST and evrything else that goes on that we have a problem with. Don't ask me to send more money if your waisting what I have already sent. When they clean waist, ear marks, etc.. then talk to me about paying more in taxes. Thats not asking for much. Would you keep donating to a charity if you knew they waist 30 to 40 % of what you donated?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;700996]Its not that hard. I and most people don't have any problems with paying any fair tax its the FUCKING WAIST and evrything else that goes on that we have a problem. Don't ask me to send more money if your waisting what I have already sent. When they clean waist, ear marks, etc.. then talk to me about paying more in taxes. Thats not asking for much. Would you keep donating to a charity if you knew they waist 30 to 40 % of what you donated?[/quote]



i think we can all agree on this.

the gray areas is that some "ear mark" might be something great for a local community and might give someone a new job. (that said, there's plenty of bridges to nowhere and golden toilet seats that are just waste)



cut the defense budget way back.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;700988]i think so.
but i'm a socialist.[/quote]Sorry to hear that. Here's a great analogy for you:

[url=http://www.sodahead.com/fun/a-teachers-excellent-analogy-on-socialism/blog-243013/]A Teachers Excellent Analogy on Socialism![/url]

also a good vid if you care to watch:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DioQooFIcgE]YouTube - The American Form of Government[/ame]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;700997]i think we can all agree on this.

the gray areas is that some "ear mark" might be something great for a local community and might give someone a new job. (that said, there's plenty of bridges to nowhere and golden toilet seats that are just waste)



[B]cut the defense budget way back[/B].[/quote]

I don't have a problem with cutting deffense but as long as its done smart and does not jeopardize our safty. Having a strong military is what has gievn you the freedom to walk this land and I personally want to keep that freedom. With that said there is a ton of waist in defense spending and that could be a great place to start.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;701000]I don't have a problem with cutting deffense but as long as its done smart and does not jeopardize our safty. Having a strong military is what has gievn you the freedom to walk this land and I personally want to keep that freedom. With that said there is a ton of waist in defense spending and that could be a great place to start.[/quote]


Really you should become an author, your way with words just beautiful.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;700997]cut the defense budget way back.[/quote]There's a lot more to the defense budget than Procurement (primarily weapons systems) and Research & Dev. These two areas are only 32% of the defense budget. The remainder is operations, maintenance, personnel, construction and family housing. Don't forget the military provides jobs for a great many people.

I agree defense spending needs to be looked at, just like any other gov't program, to eliminate waste and unnecessary spending. But unless we get SS/Medicare figured out (approx 40% of fed budget) and reduce the national debt (interest is over 5% of fed budget) we aren't going to get our financial house in good order.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

I know FD's spelling gives everyone :)'s but I gotta say the use of waist in place of waste makes me crack up laughing everytime I see it.
Fucking waist (nice visualization - think Winnie Cooper thread)
ton of waist (not so nice visualization - think summo wrestler)
clean waist, ear marks(mom's instruction to young kid)

:rofl: every single time!

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701014]I know FD's spelling gives everyone :)'s but I gotta say the use of waist in place of waste makes me crack up laughing everytime I see it.
[B]Fucking waist (nice visualization - think Winnie Cooper thread)[/B]
ton of waist (not so nice visualization - think summo wrestler)
clean waist, ear marks(mom's instruction to young kid)

:rofl: every single time![/quote]


Wait there is a Winnie Copper thread????? Where?????

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701013]There's a lot more to the defense budget than Procurement (primarily weapons systems) and Research & Dev. These two areas are only 32% of the defense budget. The remainder is operations, maintenance, personnel, construction and family housing. Don't forget the military provides jobs for a great many people.

I agree defense spending needs to be looked at, just like any other gov't program, to eliminate waste and unnecessary spending. But unless we get SS/Medicare figured out (approx 40% of fed budget) and reduce the national debt (interest is over 5% of fed budget) we aren't going to get our financial house in good order.[/quote]

Personnel costs are huge in the military, and this is my biggest problem. If we define our military responsibilities as world policemen our budget probably is not gonna be reduced a lot. But if we define the scope in terms of national defense, you could go to an extremely reduced Army/Marine (boots on the ground are not needed if we are not extending our reach) with a heavy reserve component. I doubt many US citizens would not pick up arms if a Mexican or Canadien ;) force attempted a land invasion of the US. Air Force and Navy and Space Defense forces are vital to our national defense, and thus can't really be touched, although in this area procurement should be put on a 3 year moratorium, only maintaining on going equipment, no new products or gizmos (except satellites cuz I need my MTV). We have a commanding lead in nearly every fighting system and production capacity to meet any threat in the next 3 years.

BUT as Rainy said, this part can't happen without Obama getting blasted as being soft, any more then Republicans can cut social programs without being blasted as being uncaring.

The US public needs a re-invention of understanding government's role, but most politicians, mainstream media, and internet blogging, lives and dies off the Republican/Democratic framework

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701019]Personnel costs are huge in the military, and this is my biggest problem. If we define our military responsibilities as world policemen our budget probably is not gonna be reduced a lot. But if we define the scope in terms of national defense, you could go to an extremely reduced Army/Marine (boots on the ground are not needed if we are not extending our reach) with a heavy reserve component. I doubt many US citizens would not pick up arms if a Mexican or Canadien ;) force attempted a land invasion of the US. Air Force and Navy and Space Defense forces are vital to our national defense, and thus can't really be touched, although in this area procurement should be put on a 3 year moratorium, only maintaining on going equipment, no new products or gizmos (except satellites cuz I need my MTV). We have a commanding lead in nearly every fighting system and production capacity to meet any threat in the next 3 years.

BUT as Rainy said, this part can't happen without Obama getting blasted as being soft, any more then Republicans can cut social programs without being blasted as being uncaring.

The US public needs a re-invention of understanding government's role, but most politicians, mainstream media, and internet blogging, lives and dies off the Republican/Democratic framework[/quote]


Because they are uncaring.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701023]Because they are uncaring.[/quote]

:rofl: and thus the proletariat has spoken

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701019]Personnel costs are huge in the military, and this is my biggest problem. If we define our military responsibilities as world policemen our budget probably is not gonna be reduced a lot. But if we define the scope in terms of national defense, you could go to an extremely reduced Army/Marine (boots on the ground are not needed if we are not extending our reach) with a heavy reserve component. I doubt many US citizens would not pick up arms if a Mexican or Canadien ;) force attempted a land invasion of the US. Air Force and Navy and Space Defense forces are vital to our national defense, and thus can't really be touched, although in this area procurement should be put on a 3 year moratorium, only maintaining on going equipment, no new products or gizmos (except satellites cuz I need my MTV). We have a commanding lead in nearly every fighting system and production capacity to meet any threat in the next 3 years.

BUT as Rainy said, this part can't happen without Obama getting blasted as being soft, any more then Republicans can cut social programs without being blasted as being uncaring.

The US public needs a re-invention of understanding government's role, but most politicians, mainstream media, and internet blogging, lives and dies off the Republican/Democratic framework[/quote]No problem with reducing our "boots on the ground" count, but it would have to be done gradually through attrition not involuntary separations. A lot more could be done "behind the scenes" with special forces and intel services, but our politicans don't have the stomach for that either.

Can't put a moratorium on procurement, production on major weapons systems can't be started and stopped on a dime. You also don't cut R&D, many developments from military R & D have gone on to have application in the civilian sector.

That being said, if a 5% cut (and I mean cut, not less of an increase) across the board to all gov't agencies/programs was implemented and spending levels kept constant until our national debt was at least halved and a balanced budget ammendment put in place, I'm on board.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701019]Personnel costs are huge in the military, and this is my biggest problem. If we define our military responsibilities as world policemen our budget probably is not gonna be reduced a lot. But if we define the scope in terms of national defense, you could go to an extremely reduced Army/Marine (boots on the ground are not needed if we are not extending our reach) with a heavy reserve component. I doubt many US citizens would not pick up arms if a Mexican or Canadien ;) force attempted a land invasion of the US. Air Force and Navy and Space Defense forces are vital to our national defense, and thus can't really be touched, although in this area procurement should be put on a 3 year moratorium, only maintaining on going equipment, no new products or gizmos (except satellites cuz I need my MTV). We have a commanding lead in nearly every fighting system and production capacity to meet any threat in the next 3 years.

BUT as Rainy said, this part can't happen without Obama getting blasted as being soft, any more then Republicans can cut social programs without being blasted as being uncaring.

The US public needs a re-invention of understanding government's role, but most politicians, mainstream media, and internet blogging, lives and dies off the Republican/Democratic framework[/quote]

Keep in mind that our strong military provides a strong sense of security for our allies. Cutting back but so much could send a message that may not be so received. I don't think it's so simple to say "sucks to be you" (not that you did) and scale back our force projection.

I think the SecDef has recently been vocalizing cutting back, anyway. Whatever it is, it probably won't be substantial.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

I understand what you are saying Sammy, but I think that is evidence of a military establishment that has in fact become too entrenched and bureacratic. As for stopping and starting on a dime, I am not naive enough to say $0 funding level, but, I am saying you keep a highly scaled back operation in place for 3 years, while the government is reduced overall. As for boots on the ground forces, if you gave a transitional 1-3 years converting army personnel from military purposes to civilian you could revert to a reserve force with a Professional Officer corps that would be trained in rapid response to aggression. We would also put our "partners" on watch in Europe and SEATO that they have the primary "boots on the ground" responsibility for defending their soil. Is that more risky, more likely that a ground war starts somewhere, probably, but we are spending a TON both in financial capital and human capital to act as a tripwire against world wars.

AND at the same time this human capital is wasted if not being used in some military diversion, thus politicians from Clinton-Somalia, Bush-Iraq, Obama-Afghanistan, etc etc have to find outlets for this capital does not involve having military assets sit unused on US soil.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=724Skinsfan;701039][B]Keep in mind that our strong military provides a strong sense of security for our allies. Cutting back but so much could send a message that may not be so received. I don't think it's so simple to say "sucks to be you" (not that you did) and scale back our force projection.[/B]

I think the SecDef has recently been vocalizing cutting back, anyway. Whatever it is, it probably won't be substantial.[/quote]
While the moves would have to be in concert with our allies to prevent havoc, as much as possible, it should not be a debatable question as much as a firm resolve with assurances.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701030]No problem with reducing our "boots on the ground" count, but it would have to be done gradually through attrition not involuntary separations. A lot more could be done "behind the scenes" with special forces and intel services, but our politicans don't have the stomach for that either.

Can't put a moratorium on procurement, production on major weapons systems can't be started and stopped on a dime. You also don't cut R&D, many developments from military R & D have gone on to have application in the civilian sector.

That being said, if a 5% cut (and I mean cut, not less of an increase) across the board to all gov't agencies/programs was implemented and spending levels kept constant until our national debt was at least halved and a balanced budget ammendment put in place, I'm on board.[/quote]

Makes too much sense to come from the corporate structue of any entity, especially the gubmint.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701055]While the moves would have to be in concert with our allies to prevent havoc, as much as possible, it should not be a debatable question as much as a firm resolve with assurances.[/quote]

As far as allies, I consider those that get money from us to survive not allies but client states. Besides, nobody can survive attacking any one of our allies except for maybe Karzi because his head is as good as gone.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701088]As far as allies, I consider those that get money from us to survive not allies but client states. Besides, nobody can survive attacking any one of our allies except for maybe Karzi because his head is as good as gone.[/quote]

I was thinking more so of europe/seato, but as far as those who we basically pay to stay at peace, egypt/israel, pakistan/india, and a few others, they are not allies but devils ya gotta deal with. I wouldn't consider to many pure client states as Soviet Union had back in the day. We generally encourage and expect that most of our allies to be productive high GDP equals, but we have continued to bear an unproportionate share of the military expenses. Of course by doing that, it gives our voice much more say in world affairs.

As a CS teacher once told me, everything is about trade-offs.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;700962]Why change what happeend to our traditonal values, tradional way of doing the border thing? I thought it was about keeping our heritage the same. Why the radical change at the border? It worked for the founding fathers it should work for us, right?[/quote]

I think you are quoting the wrong person as I do not recall making those statements.........but, something must change, right? You don't think that our border and current immigration policies are working?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

not sure where this thread has headed or if this was brought up i'm not going back through 30 some pages but i just saw this on the news

[url=http://www.examiner.com/x-6571-Atlanta-Political-Buzz-Examiner~y2010m5d14-Georgia-illegal-immigrant-student-arrested-again-for-lying-to-police-holds-a-press-conference]Georgia illegal immigrant student arrested again for lying to police, holds a press conference[/url]

and the school is tax funded and she got instate tutition rates

she got pulled over without a liscense and gave false information, she says she didn't know that was against the law

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmdub130;701203]not sure where this thread has headed or if this was brought up i'm not going back through 30 some pages but i just saw this on the news

[url=http://www.examiner.com/x-6571-Atlanta-Political-Buzz-Examiner~y2010m5d14-Georgia-illegal-immigrant-student-arrested-again-for-lying-to-police-holds-a-press-conference]Georgia illegal immigrant student arrested again for lying to police, holds a press conference[/url]

and the school is tax funded and she got instate tutition rates

[B]she got pulled over without a liscense and gave false information, she says she didn't know that was against the law[/B][/quote]
:doh:

but i will say again, by criminalizing this lady for simply being here, you insure that she doesn't understand the laws. It's like Marijuana, legalize it, regulate it, and tax the s*** out of it.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701205]:doh:

but i will say again, by criminalizing this lady for simply being here, you insure that she doesn't understand the laws. It's like Marijuana, legalize it, regulate it, and tax the s*** out of it.[/quote]

i've been saying the same thing for years if they wanna be legal fill out a good ol 1040ez and if they pay taxes for three years they get a temporary green card, if they don't they go home.

if we had taxes on pot and illegals we would be out of this reccesion in a heartbeat :)

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Hog1;701128]I think you are quoting the wrong person as I do not recall making those statements.........but, something must change, right? You don't think that our border and current immigration policies are working?[/quote]

Why the urgency to change it. I think it is just a tradition in that part of the country. There never was a time there was fence there, was it? What's so urgent now? Maybe the Mexican drug lords have reseted control of the drug pipeline fomr teh gold old boy ranchers. Wasn't a problem when they were getting cheap labor? It's always been that way, what changed that makes this a must change now?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmdub130;701212]i've been saying the same thing for years if they wanna be legal fill out a good ol 1040ez and if they pay taxes for three years they get a temporary green card, if they don't they go home.

if we had taxes on pot and illegals we would be out of this reccesion in a heartbeat :)[/quote]

add to that hookers and we would be in da black baby!

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701213]Why the urgency to change it. I think it is just a tradition in that part of the country. There never was a time there was fence there, was it? What's so urgent now? Maybe the Mexican drug lords have reseted control of the drug pipeline fomr teh gold old boy ranchers. Wasn't a problem when they were getting cheap labor? It's always been that way, what changed that makes this a must change now?[/quote]

They's still gettin cheaper labor, and a form of indentured servitude. we aint all talkin bout buildin no wall, but gettin em in and counted so dey can start payin da man all upfront and legal, see.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701217]add to that hookers and we would be in da black baby![/quote]

sounds like a plan i can see the 2012 slogans now

"tax hookers pot and illegals...the change we've been waiting for"

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

Its cases like this that make this such a tough issue. It seems like she has done what we would want but whats the deal with her parents? How did she pay for college? Did that degree she is getting cost the tax payers a 100,000 in social programs? While I agree with the law in AZ innocent kids will get punished by this law but at the same time we have kids here that also need our help. We just cannot help everyone.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmdub130;701219]sounds like a plan i can see the 2012 slogans now

"tax hookers pot and illegals...the change we've been waiting for"[/quote]
Hey Bart and Homer could run the Ad Campaign. We might have a chance!

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmdub130;701219]sounds like a plan i can see the 2012 slogans now

"tax hookers pot and illegals...the change we've been waiting for"[/quote]Actaully the FairTax plan does tax illegals, hookers, and drug dealers.....and it could be our way out of our finanacial mess.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701224]Actaully the FairTax plan does tax illegals, hookers, and drug dealers.....and it could be our way out of our finanacial mess.[/quote]
Yea, like I want a bill that taxes my drugs and hookers. How would you list that on your tax form?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;701226]Yea, like I want a bill that taxes my drugs and hookers. How would you list that on your tax form?[/quote]No tax forms. Tax is taken by merchants as basically a national sales tax on all items purchased. The poor receive a monthly or yearly rebate check to cover the tax on basic necessities. IRS is greatly reduced because they only need to enforce on merchants. And no, this isn't a VAT, this is the only federal tax you would pay. All other income, SS, Medicare taxes are removed and you keep your pay execpt for what states levy. If the FairTax is implemented states will likely follow and eliminate income taxes and move to the same model. Also no corporate taxes, making the business climate much more competitive against other countries.

With no corporate taxes, (estimated pass-thru to consumers is approximately 22%) and a FairTax rate of 23 % to fully fund the Fed, an item that used to cost $ 1.00 would now cost $ 1.01.....and you would have no federal deductions from your check. The wealthy will still pay a larger portion of the Fed tax burden as they buy more expensive items.

This system taxes those who don't claim or file Fed taxes, (drug dealers, hookers, illegals, etc.) because it collects the tax when items are purchased.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

SS I was joking and would not mind having the fair tax. It would save me $3,000 a year just in what I pay a my CPA to do my payroll and taxes.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;701455]SS I was joking and would not mind having the fair tax. It would save me $3,000 a year just in what I pay a my CPA to do my payroll and taxes.[/quote]I figured you were, just a shameless FairTax plug.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701265]No tax forms. Tax is taken by merchants as basically a national sales tax on all items purchased. The poor receive a monthly or yearly rebate check to cover the tax on basic necessities. IRS is greatly reduced because they only need to enforce on merchants. And no, this isn't a VAT, this is the only federal tax you would pay. All other income, SS, Medicare taxes are removed and you keep your pay execpt for what states levy. If the FairTax is implemented states will likely follow and eliminate income taxes and move to the same model. Also no corporate taxes, making the business climate much more competitive against other countries.

With no corporate taxes, (estimated pass-thru to consumers is approximately 22%) and a FairTax rate of 23 % to fully fund the Fed, an item that used to cost $ 1.00 would now cost $ 1.01.....and you would have no federal deductions from your check. The wealthy will still pay a larger portion of the Fed tax burden as they buy more expensive items.

This system taxes those who don't claim or file Fed taxes, (drug dealers, hookers, illegals, etc.) because it collects the tax when items are purchased.[/quote]


Okay sounds good, those are the positives, what are the negatives?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701515]okay sounds good, those are the positives, what are the negatives?[/quote]

The amount of people needed to process the tax would drop so some federal employees would loose their job.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2010/05/17/miss-oklahoma-named-runner-miss-usa-pageant-answering-controversial-immigration/]FOXNews.com - Miss Oklahoma Named First Runner Up in Miss USA Pageant After Answering Immigration Question[/url]

Miss Oklahoma was asked about the Arizona law, which she agrees with. She ended up getting dos.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701551][url=http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2010/05/17/miss-oklahoma-named-runner-miss-usa-pageant-answering-controversial-immigration/]FOXNews.com - Miss Oklahoma Named First Runner Up in Miss USA Pageant After Answering Immigration Question[/url]

Miss Oklahoma was asked about the Arizona law, which she agrees with. She ended up getting dos.[/quote]

[quote]An unhappy crowd booed Miss USA judge Oscar Nunez when he asked Miss Oklahoma Morgan Elizabeth Woolard a question about Arizona’s immigration law on Sunday night’s pageant.

But could Woolard's answer have cost her the crown?

The "The Office" star asked Woolard if she supported Arizona’s right to enforce the law, which requires police to verify a person's immigration status if there's "reasonable suspicion" that the person is in the country illegally.
[/quote]

they had oscar from the office as a judge for miss usa?? sounds like they were pretty desperate

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701515]Okay sounds good, those are the positives, what are the negatives?[/quote]Here is the wiki link to two excellent books on the FairTax, the first is the FairTax book and the follow on is a response to critics of the plan (most criticisms false or misleading).

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_FairTax_Book]The FairTax Book - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/url]

Here is a link to the FairTax site, on the bottom of the front page are the five most common criticisms of the plan with rebuttals.

[url=http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=about_main]Americans For Fair Taxation:[/url]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

I see VA. was well represented:

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/slideshow/entertainment/2010/05/10/miss-usa-topless-lingerie/#slide=16]FOXNews.com - Miss USA Changes Its Image[/url]