Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=los panda;998968]valid

"Three years ago NFL owners agreed that teams would not be allowed to exploit the uncapped year to gain a competitive advantage. [B]There was not a written edict violated or a binding contract broken.[/B]"

i've been looking at business all wrong, binding contracts appear to be overrated, while agreements are all the rage.[/quote]


Verbal contracts are legal, but the agreement itself can't be illegal. This to me is similar to all of us agreeing to purchase drugs, two of us fans don't, and the rest of us punish those two by making them give the rest of us $$ to make up for it.

The court has been just as bad.....(overlook the illegal agreement) well there was an agreement between owners, the NFLPA waited too long to file and signed away their rights, so....yeah punishment should stand.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=SBXVII;999390]Some of you guys are weenies.

"oh we deserved to get punished"
"we dumped cap"
"we must have done something wrong"
"there was an agreement"

A bunch of pansies! DS is an idiot for not going "nuclear" when he had leverage. I'll bet Goodell was behind the scene's "look don't hold up free agency cause we are thinking of lowering the penalty" then after FA, "F U we are not lowering anything".

What we know:

The NFL colluded (broke the law)
Two teams showed they had character by not breaking the law
The suspect owners were jealous of the two teams
Punishment was issued for not breaking the law
The whole scenario is immoral
And to simply "move past this" fans are "oh we need to move on."

I'll never move on from this blatant disregard of rules, laws, and out right immoral act of a punishment. The league approved the contracts. Period. They had a duty to deny any contracts that didn't fall within their guide lines. So why didn't they?

I don't want to hear the BS about they would have been found to have been colluding BS. The league should not be able to have it both ways and eat their cake too. You either deny the contracts and hope not to get caught or you approve the contracts and look the other way. This is completely immoral to and borderline illegal to approve the contracts to not get caught, look the other way for a year, then come out with a BS story about how the two teams should be punished. If the two teams right now handed in those contracts do you think the league would have approved them and waited a year to punish? Hell no they would deny them and tell the two teams to redo the contracts.

The Skins did nothing wrong and got punished for not breaking the law. <that my friends are what we are teaching our kids today.[/quote]


Well said.

This is one of the few times I wish I could join a class action lawsuit against the NFL.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

Goodell and Mara
Will lead the way straight to hell
Redskins will prevail

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=SBXVII;999390]Some of you guys are weenies.

"oh we deserved to get punished"
"we dumped cap"
"we must have done something wrong"
"there was an agreement"

A bunch of pansies! DS is an idiot for not going "nuclear" when he had leverage. I'll bet Goodell was behind the scene's "look don't hold up free agency cause we are thinking of lowering the penalty" then after FA, "F U we are not lowering anything".

What we know:

The NFL colluded (broke the law)
Two teams showed they had character by not breaking the law
The suspect owners were jealous of the two teams
Punishment was issued for not breaking the law
The whole scenario is immoral
And to simply "move past this" fans are "oh we need to move on."

I'll never move on from this blatant disregard of rules, laws, and out right immoral act of a punishment. The league approved the contracts. Period. They had a duty to deny any contracts that didn't fall within their guide lines. So why didn't they?

I don't want to hear the BS about they would have been found to have been colluding BS. The league should not be able to have it both ways and eat their cake too. You either deny the contracts and hope not to get caught or you approve the contracts and look the other way. This is completely immoral to and borderline illegal to approve the contracts to not get caught, look the other way for a year, then come out with a BS story about how the two teams should be punished. If the two teams right now handed in those contracts do you think the league would have approved them and waited a year to punish? Hell no they would deny them and tell the two teams to redo the contracts.

The Skins did nothing wrong and got punished for not breaking the law. <that my friends are what we are teaching our kids today.[/quote]


This is so over --- it's time to let it go. Really.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[IMG]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-upWGy5k4OLA/TdM45-SubtI/AAAAAAAABfk/Dchto7-rXks/s1600/beating+a+dead+horse.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

I come back to this thread all the time ... I just don't know why. Morbid fascination I guess.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

Now, with the recent confirmation that we are in no way recouping any cash back this is a dead issue... I do to Joe, hoping for some miracle of justice to be reported saying we are getting the money back this year and an extra 18 mil next year or maybe an extra 2 mil on our salary cap for the next 18 years. F U NFL. :)

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;999413]I come back to this thread all the time ... I just don't know why. Morbid fascination I guess.[/quote]

Ditto. I keep hoping I'll see "closed".

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

This thread has turned into haikus. Close this poetic crap.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;999447]This thread has turned into haikus. Close this poetic crap.[/quote]

Dont be a Hatter
Focus on next draft sleepers
Shanny draft genius

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=Chico23231;999451]Dont be a Hatter
Focus on next draft sleepers
Shanny draft genius[/quote]

Well done.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

Screw Goodell/Mara
The Shanahans will fix this
'Ayebody jealous

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

This year kinda sucks for improving our team through free agency, but we should have oodles of cap space in 2014. As it stands now, we've got about 23MM in cap room available (assuming the cap stays fairly flat). Orakpo is the only significatn player with an expiring contract. Further, we've got ALOT of players scheduled to make waaaaay more money than they are worth (Josh Morgan is a prime example, due over 10MM next year). Just looking over the cap chart, if the cap stays flat, and we make reasonable moves to cut/restructure certain players, we could easily have 40MM to play with. If Vinny were running things, that would be cause for concern and we'd have to worry about signing a bunch of old guys to ridiculous contracts. With Shanahan and Allen calling the shots, that means we can sign a number of young, quality players while offering extensions to deserving home-grown players.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

A dyslexic man walks into a bra.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=SBXVII;999392]Verbal contracts are legal, but the agreement itself can't be illegal. This to me is similar to all of us agreeing to purchase drugs, two of us fans don't, and the rest of us punish those two by making them give the rest of us $$ to make up for it.

The court has been just as bad.....(overlook the illegal agreement) well there was an agreement between owners, the NFLPA waited too long to file and signed away their rights, so....yeah punishment should stand.[/quote]

wait... what drugs are we buying?

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;999461]wait... what drugs are we buying?[/quote]

the drugs to revive this horse

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

Look, I come here in hopes I'll find out that some how some way our team owners is actually doing something productive in order to get the CAP back. I get let down each time. I'm also a person whom believes in fairness, and although life sometimes is not fair, I still like to think something can be done about the unfairness.

Since no one on this board wants me to go into other threads ranting about our punishment periodically I come here to vent. Unfortunatly I'm met with people who are finished with the topic, done, and have decided to move on whom for whatever reason can't bring themselves to not come into this thread if they are done talking about it so they would prefer it closed.

If your done don't come. Let the rest of us come and vent. Unless you'd like for us to bring the topic up in other threads once and a while? I'm trying to be polite and keeping the talk to this thread and now your talking about wanting it closed.

Don't hate if I speak my mind in another thread then. Just ignore and move on.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=mooby;999455]Screw Goodell/Mara
The Shanahans will fix this
'Ayebody jealous[/quote]

Nice.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;999461]wait... what drugs are we buying?[/quote]

Sugar pills.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;999459]This year kinda sucks for improving our team through free agency, but we should have oodles of cap space in 2014. As it stands now, we've got about 23MM in cap room available (assuming the cap stays fairly flat). Orakpo is the only significatn player with an expiring contract. Further, we've got ALOT of players scheduled to make waaaaay more money than they are worth (Josh Morgan is a prime example, due over 10MM next year). Just looking over the cap chart, if the cap stays flat, and we make reasonable moves to cut/restructure certain players, we could easily have 40MM to play with. If Vinny were running things, that would be cause for concern and we'd have to worry about signing a bunch of old guys to ridiculous contracts. With Shanahan and Allen calling the shots, that means we can sign a number of young, quality players while offering extensions to deserving home-grown players.[/quote]

Right on. And there's the rub for the rest of the league: after forcing us on a diet, they will HATE how slim we are a year from now. There will be a measure of payback.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

What's crazy about this whole thing is there are teams in this league who have no intentions of using the extra (redistributed) cap space. Those teams are tens of millions under the cap every year. Talk about spirit of the cap and competitive balance. Has Goodell and the league heard of the 80/20 role? Roughly 4 teams in this league 'make' the NFL. WSH, DAL, PITT, and ________.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

There are a handful of major revenue teams but make no mistake....they all make money. Problem is the top revenue teams like DC, Dal, NE, NYs, Pitt, Philly have boat loads more cash to spend...which matters. Just because a team runs a 115 million dollar cap number doesn't mean that's their cash outlay. It could be 50% higher. Or lower. The amortization of guaranteed monies plays a big role. That's why DS's style has been so disliked. Many teams can't really compete with it. Had it ever really worked you can be sure that the new CBA would have addressed he issue more aggressively.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=RGIII;999514] Roughly 4 teams in this league 'make' the NFL. WSH, DAL, PITT, and ________.[/quote]


Nope,not even close.Really expect people to think NE,GB,Oakland.SanFran,Da Bears,Eagles...don't help make up the NFL

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=Giantone;999534]Nope,not even close.Really expect people to think NE,GB,Oakland.SanFran,Da Bears,Eagles...don't help make up the NFL[/quote]

Oakland has great tradition and history but their stadium is half full 8 games a year. They have become a bottom feeder without any national presence.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;999461]wait... what drugs are we buying?[/quote]

boner pills...

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=skinsfan69;999565]Oakland has great tradition and history but their stadium is half full 8 games a year. They have become a bottom feeder without any national presence.[/quote]

Thank you. This isn't just about money but, rather "cornering the market". All of the teams make money. Some teams win. But, as an example, who really cares about BAL? Are they respected? Of course. Are they "America's Team"? No. They're not even considered a "dynasty" although they consistently win and have some hardware.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=skinsfan69;999565]Oakland has great tradition and history but their stadium is half full 8 games a year. They have become a bottom feeder without any national presence.[/quote]

I disagree,the fact they haven't won in the last few years doesn't make the bottom feeders (your words).Many teams have gone years at being bad,some might say even to a point of a joke(as where the Saints and Bucs for awhile) but all these teams start of with the exact same chance of winning each year.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=RGIII;999571]. But, as an example, who really cares about BAL? Are they respected? Of course. Are they "America's Team"? No. They're not even considered a "dynasty" although they consistently win and have some hardware.[/quote]


A hell of a lot of people like Baltimore and many of them old Colt fans!

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

I bet DemonBunny came out ALOT during these meetings!

Rich Campbell ‏@Rich_Campbell 11m

Mike Shanahan personally met with the commissioner twice in the last 30 days to discuss salary cap penalty. They, um, disagreed on things.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=Giantone;999580]A hell of a lot of people like Baltimore and many of them old Colt fans![/quote]

DAL has more fans than IND, BAL, and NYG combined.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;999679]I bet DemonBunny came out ALOT during these meetings!

Rich Campbell ‏@Rich_Campbell 11m

[B]Mike Shanahan personally met with the commissioner twice in the last 30 days to discuss salary cap penalty. They, um, disagreed on things.[/[/B]QUOTE]

I'm so tired of this. We've spent money in the past and gotten terrible results. How about Mr. Shanahan suck it up, roll up his sleeves and coach up the guys we have? Why are they still crying like babies about this? It is what it is. They obviously violated the spirit of the (behind closed door) rule. Mr. Shanahan, do what you're paid 7 mil a year to do..COACH.

I'm sure in 2014 we'll do the GAS UP REDSKIN ONE bs and win the Super Bowl in March and get the fans all fired up. :vomit:

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=Giantone;999579][B]I disagree,the fact they haven't won in the last few years doesn't make the bottom feeders[/B] (your words).Many teams have gone years at being bad,some might say even to a point of a joke(as where the Saints and Bucs for awhile) but all these teams start of with the exact same chance of winning each year.[/quote]

Oakland has not had a winning record or made the playoffs in 10 years. Many of those years were probably 5 wins seasons or less, plus they change coaches every other year. Plus they've had numerous blackouts over the years. What in the world does that make them in your book? To me they're a bottom teir organization and the results are in the W/L record, attendance and constant turnover.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=skinsfan69;999696][QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;999679]I bet DemonBunny came out ALOT during these meetings!

Rich Campbell ‏@Rich_Campbell 11m

[B]Mike Shanahan personally met with the commissioner twice in the last 30 days to discuss salary cap penalty. They, um, disagreed on things.[/B][/quote]

I'm so tired of this. We've spent money in the past and gotten terrible results. How about Mr. Shanahan suck it up, roll up his sleeves and coach up the guys we have? Why are they still crying like babies about this? It is what it is. They obviously violated the spirit of the (behind closed door) rule. Mr. Shanahan, do what you're paid 7 mil a year to do..COACH.

I'm sure in 2014 we'll do the GAS UP REDSKIN ONE bs and win the Super Bowl in March and get the fans all fired up. :vomit:[/QUOTE]
I think Shanahan could have reasonably made the point that all of the crazy cap management took place before BA and MS were running things. He was asked a question(or several questions) and he answered them about what the Skins had tried to do. I never have heard Shanahan say anything more than we have to play with the hand we are dealt, and we have a game plan for success.

Mostly it's the fans that are whining, and I personally think this is one of those things that deserves whining. It was absolutely handled in an unfair manner, and spearheaded by divisional opponents. All that said, it's done, and after this season it will just be a blip on the historical ledger

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=skinsfan69;999696][QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;999679]I bet DemonBunny came out ALOT during these meetings!

Rich Campbell ‏@Rich_Campbell 11m

[B]Mike Shanahan personally met with the commissioner twice in the last 30 days to discuss salary cap penalty. They, um, disagreed on things.[/[/B]QUOTE]

I'm so tired of this. We've spent money in the past and gotten terrible results. How about Mr. Shanahan suck it up, roll up his sleeves and coach up the guys we have? [B]Why are they still crying like babies about this?[/B] It is what it is. They obviously violated the spirit of the (behind closed door) rule. Mr. Shanahan, do what you're paid 7 mil a year to do..COACH.

I'm sure in 2014 we'll do the GAS UP REDSKIN ONE bs and win the Super Bowl in March and get the fans all fired up. :vomit:[/quote]

Because it's the principal of the matter.

#1- the team broke no laws. (unlike the rest of the league)
#2- the NFL APPROVED the contracts.

Instead of punishing the Skins, Goodell should have fired the person who APPROVED the contracts.

Honestly I'm more amazed at the pacifist attitudes regarding this issue. The Skins did nothing wrong, took the punishment, appealed the punishment, acted like gentlemen and requested a reduction, and instead of everyone running around with their pitch forks and torches calling for the nuclear option it's ..... "why are people still so upset over this?" "Lets just move on" "Let it go" "Lets just build from the draft".

Believe me, I'm one of the first to say I'm happy the Cerratto era is over, and am hoping as you are that we can start building through the draft like the Patriots do, but keep in mind the Patriots also pick low priced veterans in the offseason as well. and... most teams have a decent mix of Rookies and Vets.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;999703]I think Shanahan could have reasonably made the point that all of the crazy cap management took place before BA and MS were running things. He was asked a question(or several questions) and he answered them about what the Skins had tried to do. I never have heard Shanahan say anything more than we have to play with the hand we are dealt, and we have a game plan for success.

Mostly it's the fans that are whining, and I personally think this is one of those things that deserves whining. It was absolutely handled in an unfair manner, and spearheaded by divisional opponents. All that said, it's done, and after this season it will just be a blip on the historical ledger[/quote]

Well I for one would like for DS to now go the nuclear option. He's tried being a gentlemen owner. It's not working. Now it's time to be the A-hole owner and go nuclear.

If DS has plans to curl his tail between his legs and do what your asking and not go nuclear I'd atleast like for him to mock the whole issue. Place adds in the newspapers, run radio commercials and TV spots. Heck since the NFL is untouchable and a judge has already deemed that the collusion was not illegal then DS might as well admit via commercial that all the owners colluded against the NFLPA and won. "Hey kids, you CAN break the law and get away with it... just like the NFL did." "Hey kids if you don't go along with your fellow criminals you could get punished....and it's legal."

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

Have any lawyers looked into the Fans bringing about a class action suit against the NFL for the collusion and punishment against the two teams? I think it's the fans money who support the players, fans money that support the stadiums, the fans money that support the owners, fans money that supports the NFL through apparel. I think if I was a season ticket holder I might look into it based off the fact I would be paying for a product and clearly the NFL did not live up to their promise by breaking the law, immoral punishments.

If what the fan is paying for is the "IMAGE" then they failed by leaps and bounds when they illegally broke the law and colluded, then their self rightous immoral punishment.

Re: Good/Bad News for a Change - 2013 18MM cap penalty probably (not) going away
 

[quote=SBXVII;999730]Have any lawyers looked into the Fans bringing about a class action suit against the NFL for the collusion and punishment against the two teams? I think it's the fans money who support the players, fans money that support the stadiums, the fans money that support the owners, fans money that supports the NFL through apparel. I think if I was a season ticket holder I might look into it based off the fact I would be paying for a product and clearly the NFL did not live up to their promise by breaking the law, immoral punishments.

If what the fan is paying for is the "IMAGE" then they failed by leaps and bounds when they illegally broke the law and colluded, then their self rightous immoral punishment.[/quote]

For Pete's sake, LET IT GO...

Reading your rants on this topic is getting old. You really redefine beating a dead horse. It's over, now get over it. Nobody's going over the wall with you, and our ears are starting to bleed from your legal babble.

And yes, I know I can block your posts, but it would be much better if you just cease and desist.