Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=mooby;1183621]The right fit would be a college team. Too bad his eligibility is gone. And the Browns are the closest thing to a college team in the NFL, and he couldn't cut it there either.

I think the new "right fit" should be the AFL or CFL.[/quote]

I hear the XFL is making a comeback.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1183611]how much of that did he actually see?[/quote]

About 37 million I do believe. Still a lot of money for a shitty qb cut by the Browns.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;1183619]You make a fair point but i think drafting a QB could potentially follow the Cousins situation:

We draft a QB and get him at a moderate price due to the rookie deal. Couple of years down the road we have the same problem - Redskins don't want to pay the big money to keep him.

I think in all that is going on, some of us don't realize that KC is/was that same drafted QB. We for the first time in a long while drafted & developed a legit starting QB. What assurance do we have that the FO doesn't make the same mistake with whoever they drafted? Can we really say "Oh they learned from the Cousins mistake"? Has this franchise consistently proved that we have learned from any mistakes made??[/quote]

Yeah, they'd probably screw it up, but that would be 4-5 years down the road. Franchising him and kicking the can down the road will just cost us more money and players. Time to marry him or break up with him. Should be interesting.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=SolidSnake84;1183619]You make a fair point but i think drafting a QB could potentially follow the Cousins situation:

We draft a QB and get him at a moderate price due to the rookie deal. Couple of years down the road we have the same problem - Redskins don't want to pay the big money to keep him.

I think in all that is going on, some of us don't realize that KC is/was that same drafted QB. We for the first time in a long while drafted & developed a legit starting QB. What assurance do we have that the FO doesn't make the same mistake with whoever they drafted? Can we really say "Oh they learned from the Cousins mistake"? Has this franchise consistently proved that we have learned from any mistakes made??[/QUOTE]Good points.

One thing though: I think the root of this messing up Kirk's contract situation is that the FO didn't draft him thinking of him as a franchise QB.

Yeah they drafted him but they didn't view him as the guy.

One can hope they'd handle the QB situation better with somebody they drafted to be the guy.

I say that still hoping they sign him long term, even in the high 20s M.

But yeah, marry or break up, don't make us live another year under the tag.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;1183619]You make a fair point but i think drafting a QB could potentially follow the Cousins situation:

We draft a QB and get him at a moderate price due to the rookie deal. Couple of years down the road we have the same problem - Redskins don't want to pay the big money to keep him.

I think in all that is going on, some of us don't realize that KC is/was that same drafted QB. We for the first time in a long while drafted & developed a legit starting QB. What assurance do we have that the FO doesn't make the same mistake with whoever they drafted? Can we really say "Oh they learned from the Cousins mistake"? Has this franchise consistently proved that we have learned from any mistakes made??[/quote]

The big assumption is that the QB the Skins draft ends up working out as well as Cousins did and that's a huge assumption. The Skins history with drafting QBs shows the pick is much more likely to be a bust than what has happened with KC.

The front office seems incapable of learning from any mistakes they make.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[url=http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35033/blaine-gabbert-denver-provide-redskins-reason-to-fear-life-without-kirk-cousins]Blaine Gabbert, Denver trio give Redskins reasons to keep Kirk Cousins - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN[/url]

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

All we ever wanted was a decent QB that can help us win.
Now we have one and our FO outsmarted themselves in negotiations and we could lose him or overpay him. Thank you Allen/Snyder for putting us in this position.
I think I would rather a drunk run our FO. At least we would be making better moves than these two clowns have made.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1183638][url=http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35033/blaine-gabbert-denver-provide-redskins-reason-to-fear-life-without-kirk-cousins]Blaine Gabbert, Denver trio give Redskins reasons to keep Kirk Cousins - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN[/url][/QUOTE]Good read, thanks.

I also think that despite mediocre results, we could have the pieces around Cousins in the foreseeable future.
The defense is coming around and should get some playmakers back from injury.
We have a very competent O line when healthy.
I think our receiving corps has under achieved this season and can do better than that.

Looking at this roster, the only real gaping hope is a true #1 RB (and maybe a capable blocking TE).

Sure there's room for improvement and we could use a WR that can catch.
But my point is if we sign Cousins, manage to stay healthy, and have a good off season, there's no reason to believe we'd have to wait 10 years before being very competitive.

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Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

My money is that he walks. I hope I am wrong, but wasn't he quoted earlier in the year that if Allen was retained he was walking, or something to that effect? Also this is directed at Frenchy. Why do you think our current WR corp is going to get better? Outside of Crowder, they are scrubs or they were this season. I wish they would have played Maurice Harris more. He showed some promise last season in his limited work he had. I would love to see what these younger guys have. Grant isn't going to get any better and Doctson could go either way next year as this was his "rookie" year being able to play at all.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Ivar the Boneless;1183706]My money is that he walks. I hope I am wrong, but wasn't he quoted earlier in the year that if Allen was retained he was walking, or something to that effect? [B]Also this is directed at Frenchy. Why do you think our current WR corp is going to get better?[/B] Outside of Crowder, they are scrubs or they were this season. I wish they would have played Maurice Harris more. He showed some promise last season in his limited work he had. I would love to see what these younger guys have. Grant isn't going to get any better and Doctson could go either way next year as this was his "rookie" year being able to play at all.[/quote]

I don't think they're [B]going to[/B] get better. I just think they can.

I think this receiving corps has to have been awfully coached this season:

-Crowder took a major step back and suddenly had a massive drops issue
-Vernon Davis had a lot of drops too
-Jordan Reed even when healthy was quite absent, we know he's better than that
-I sure think Doctson's disappointingly slow development can be, at least partly, pinned on coaching
-Even Terrell Pryor going from master of catches in traffic in Cleveland to handless turd here points at something not being OK in the WR room...

So yeah, we need to find a #1 WR in FA, a true one. But I think this receiving corps has more potential than this season showed and is not as big as roster hole as it can seem.
I'd love to see a change at WR coach.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

Despite an awful season of injuries, all kinds of OL problems, no true #1 or #2wrs to throw too and his best TE out all yr, Kirk is still on pace for 4000 yards and a top 10 QB season. That is remarkable. Yeah some is the system but still that is insane... Guys that are considered better than him (Dak, Carr, Ryan) are all behind him with way more talent around them.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183725]Despite an awful season of injuries, all kinds of OL problems, no true #1 or #2wrs to throw too and his best TE out all yr, Kirk is still on pace for 4000 yards and a top 10 QB season. That is remarkable. Yeah some is the system but still that is insane... Guys that are considered better than him (Dak, Carr, Ryan) are all behind him with way more talent around them.[/quote]

Carr and Ryan have been disappointing. Man, Kyle Shanny removed from Atlanta has been costly. That offense has been underwhelming.

Carr had the injury but appears to be healthy now. He's been Joe flacco avg at best. Lotta talking heads had him as a top 10 QB going into the season...which turned out to be a false narrative.

Dak to me is the least surprising...He's a great game manager and he's been able to beat below avg teams. He's hasn't been able to win big games against good teams without a run game..he's struggled actually. Dak should get better, but he isn't a top 10 QB.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1183736]Carr and Ryan have been disappointing. Man, Kyle Shanny removed from Atlanta has been costly. That offense has been underwhelming.

Carr had the injury but appears to be healthy now. He's been Joe flacco avg at best. Lotta talking heads had him as a top 10 QB going into the season...which turned out to be a false narrative.

[B]Dak to me is the least surprising...He's a great game manager and he's been able to beat below avg teams. He's hasn't been able to win big games against good teams without a run game..he's struggled actually. Dak should get better, but he isn't a top 10 QB.[/B][/quote]

By that rationale neither is Cousins.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

Carr has a bad back, Ryan is just off this yr which happens.. Dak is what he is and u guys know how I feel about the guy as a QB anyway.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1183609]This idea that he needs to take a discount is ridiculous. The team needs to step up and pay him or he's gone. It's really that simple.[/quote]

I agree that they need to try to sign Cousins to a long term deal but not at all cost. If he is wanting top dollar I say no. If we pay him top dollar then we won't have the money to fix all of the issues. If Cousins is interested in staying here he might take a little less so the team can use some money to get him the help he needs to get to the playoffs as well as the super bowl. Then he can get the money back through endorsements/commercials. If he stays on a long term deal I got best RB available first. Our running game is horrible.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Randall Nestor;1183796]I agree that they need to try to sign Cousins to a long term deal but not at all cost. If he is wanting top dollar I say no. If we pay him top dollar then we won't have the money to fix all of the issues. If Cousins is interested in staying here he might take a little less so the team can use some money to get him the help he needs to get to the playoffs as well as the super bowl. Then he can get the money back through endorsements/commercials. If he stays on a long term deal I got best RB available first. Our running game is horrible.[/quote]

I think that if the Skins get rid of Gruden and his staff and start all over again then it will cost the Skins top dollar to resign KC because at that point KC would know that the team is 2 years minimum from competing if they become competitive at all. He'd only be playing in Washington for the money so he'd want the most he can get and you cant blame him.

I think if KC was to give a "discount" it would be to teams that are on the verge of winning titles. Maybe Denver, maybe Pittsburgh (should Ben retire) or teams like that. He'd know he was going to those teams to win titles immediately not stuck in the same start over carousel that the Skins love to ride.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/if-redskins-lose-kirk-cousins-here-are-8-possible-replacements?utm_content=buffer91050&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer]If the Redskins lose Kirk Cousins, here are 8 possible replacements | NBC Sports Washington[/url]

what do u guys think?

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

We’ll see, I hope he’s right.

[url]https://247sports.com/nfl/washington-redskins/Bolt/Charley-Casserly-believes-Kirk-Cousins-will-be-back--112585076[/url]

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183826][url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/if-redskins-lose-kirk-cousins-here-are-8-possible-replacements?utm_content=buffer91050&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer]If the Redskins lose Kirk Cousins, here are 8 possible replacements | NBC Sports Washington[/url]

what do u guys think?[/quote]

There's one option that I like more than all of those combined. Resign Cousins.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183826][url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/if-redskins-lose-kirk-cousins-here-are-8-possible-replacements?utm_content=buffer91050&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer]If the Redskins lose Kirk Cousins, here are 8 possible replacements | NBC Sports Washington[/url]

what do u guys think?[/quote]

if cousins walks, I want Mayfield as I have said before. Not too enthused with the rest of the list..... And really we would have to see if Jay keeps his job or who gets newly appointed before thinking too much further into it i suppose.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Meks;1183835]if cousins walks, I want Mayfield as I have said before. Not too enthused with the rest of the list..... And really we would have to see if Jay keeps his job or who gets newly appointed before thinking too much further into it i suppose.[/quote]

Mayfield is the last guy I'd want on that list. He's just too small and IMO he's the second coming of Johnny Manzell. Taylor is probably my #1 pick on that not so great list.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1183839]Mayfield is the last guy I'd want on that list. He's just too small and IMO he's the second coming of Johnny Manzell. Taylor is probably my #1 pick on that not so great list.[/quote]

I still don't understand that Manziel comparison... Baker doesn't do coke and get waisted every night.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1183826][url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/if-redskins-lose-kirk-cousins-here-are-8-possible-replacements?utm_content=buffer91050&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer]If the Redskins lose Kirk Cousins, here are 8 possible replacements | NBC Sports Washington[/url]

what do u guys think?[/QUOTE]I think all college prospects are toss ups, not an expert but not sure if the chances of a mid 1st round pick panning out are higher than 50/50.

Among the veterans, I do think Case Keenum could be a viable option at, maybe, a fair price (but we've seen how crazy the market can get with a seemingly good QB). But it's hard to tell based on one good season.

I don't believe Tyord Taylor is a guy that can carry a team to the top, without a very solid team around him. But he has some upside if used correctly.

I don't know how realistic the Dalton option is, at times he has shown he can deliver. I still think Cousins has proven he can be better than him.

Bradford and McCoy simply aren't viable options IMO.

...

Sign him.

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Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=irish;1183839]Mayfield is the last guy I'd want on that list. He's just too small and IMO he's the second coming of Johnny Manzell. Taylor is probably my #1 pick on that not so great list.[/QUOTE]Maybe Taylor could be signed at a pretty low price and give time to a draft choice to develop?

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Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

This conversation just makes me ask is it july yet (the real end of the FT on Cousins discussion forever)

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1183843]This conversation just makes me ask is it july yet (the real end of the FT on Cousins discussion forever)[/quote]

This. I pray this thing comes to an end as soon as humanly possible.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/12/21/john-lynch-49ers-focus-in-the-2018-draft-will-be-putting-pieces-around-jimmy-g/]John Lynch: 49ers’ focus in the 2018 draft will be putting pieces around Jimmy G – ProFootballTalk[/url]

So Kirk to SF is officially dead.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183858][url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/12/21/john-lynch-49ers-focus-in-the-2018-draft-will-be-putting-pieces-around-jimmy-g/]John Lynch: 49ers’ focus in the 2018 draft will be putting pieces around Jimmy G – ProFootballTalk[/url]

So Kirk to SF is officially dead.[/quote]

Looks like Cousins' market is drying up little by little. First the Rams due to Goff's emergence this year, now SF. Kirk himself can't be 100% thrilled because he is seeing is opportunities go out the window one by one. i still believe someone will make a big push for him, maybe it is Denver....

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;1183875]Looks like Cousins' market is drying up little by little. First the Rams due to Goff's emergence this year, now SF. Kirk himself can't be 100% thrilled because he is seeing is opportunities go out the window one by one. i still believe someone will make a big push for him, maybe it is Denver....[/quote]

Denver, AZ, NYJ are the top 3 teams that I believe will make a run if he's available

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183858][url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/12/21/john-lynch-49ers-focus-in-the-2018-draft-will-be-putting-pieces-around-jimmy-g/]John Lynch: 49ers’ focus in the 2018 draft will be putting pieces around Jimmy G – ProFootballTalk[/url]

So Kirk to SF is officially dead.[/quote]

It was dead once they made the trade. Not sure why anyone would think it was still a possibility.

I think you can tell by Cousins comments that he's very open to being here and probably wants to come back.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1183890]It was dead once they made the trade. Not sure why anyone would think it was still a possibility.

I think you can tell by Cousins comments that he's very open to being here and probably wants to come back.[/quote]Jacksonville may be dead too, with Bortles playing very well during the Jags' December push for the playoffs. Cooley/Sheehan had an interesting idea on their show - what if the FO offered a 3 year deal, 100% guaranteed, in the $75-$80M range? Might Kirk consider a shorter term than the typical 5 years given to franchise QB's? It would open the door for another big payday when he's 33-34 years old.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1183890]It was dead once they made the trade. Not sure why anyone would think it was still a possibility.

[B]I think you can tell by Cousins comments that he's very open to being here and probably wants to come back.[/B][/quote]

Agree, and I think he has wanted to be here all along. He's just been slow playing his hand to maximize the pot he rakes at the end. Good advice from the agent. Good media manipulation. And he's about to cash.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=SouperMeister;1183891]Jacksonville may be dead too, with Bortles playing very well during the Jags' December push for the playoffs. Cooley/Sheehan had an interesting idea on their show - what if the FO offered a 3 year deal, 100% guaranteed, in the $75-$80M range? Might Kirk consider a shorter term than the typical 5 years given to franchise QB's? It would open the door for another big payday when he's 33-34 years old.[/quote]

He would be stupid to pass up a 100% guaranteed deal.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1183890]It was dead once they made the trade. Not sure why anyone would think it was still a possibility.

I think you can tell by Cousins comments that he's very open to being here and probably wants to come back.[/quote]

Yeah I don't think its ever been KIRK I think its always been BRUCE

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183896]Yeah I don't think its ever been KIRK I think its always been BRUCE[/quote]

I don't think that is the case. I think Kirk from the outset has wanted to get to this point, that being his name being on the open market. Short of overpaying by a lot, he was not going to sign anything. And I don't think that is wrong of him. He took the risk that he wouldn't play bad, and that he wouldn't sustain a career ending injury, and he survived that risk. Now he can collect.

Nothing that has ever been said by KC sounded like he was going to sign while the FT was in play. I hope make the Skins make it clear that the FT isn't in play this year and that it is a LTD, or we part ways.

From that I hope that KC agrees on a LTD here.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1183897]I don't think that is the case. I think Kirk from the outset has wanted to get to this point, that being his name being on the open market. Short of overpaying by a lot, he was not going to sign anything. And I don't think that is wrong of him. He took the risk that he wouldn't play bad, and that he wouldn't sustain a career ending injury, and he survived that risk. Now he can collect.

Nothing that has ever been said by KC sounded like he was going to sign while the FT was in play. I hope make the Skins make it clear that the FT isn't in play this year and that it is a LTD, or we part ways.

From that I hope that KC agrees on a LTD here.[/quote]

Yeah I say LTD or say goodbye, I'm over this tag shit

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183898]Yeah I say LTD or say goodbye, I'm over this tag shit[/quote]

Agree, and from a team-planning perspective, the Redskins kind of need it to be that way. They need to lock him into a contract so they can understand how much cap space they'll have over the next three years. It informs their planning with regards to resigning their own players and their planning with regards to signing new free agents on the open market.

At some point you need price certainty so you can form a cohesive plan. Right now they're forced to react to the uncertainty of the one year deal.

I bet if they had Cousins under a LTD last year, Zach Brown would have been signed for longer than a one-year. The price-certainty is worth quite a bit when it comes to forming a plan.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

I hope they have space to keep ZB also

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1183902]I hope they have space to keep ZB also[/quote]

That's a guy worth [I]making[/I] space for. We can fit him in, but if it came down to it I could think of several Redskins we'd rather be without than go without Zach Brown. Too damn impactful.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

Kirk should agree to give the Redskins a 10% discount if they fire Bruce Allen, get a deep threat wide receiver, and Snyder issues a public apology for the whole RG3 fiasco.