Re: Training Camp 2018
 

John Keim
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Aug 27
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For perspective sake (I know, hot takes play better): Sam Bradford has thrown 3 fewer passes than Alex Smith in the preseason. Coming off knee injury/new team/new coach. Key starters DNP in 3rd game. If Skins lose, opener dig deeper than just "preseason snaps/pass attempts."

[url]http://www.espn.com/blog/los-angeles-rams/post/_/id/38788/where-are-you-rams-offense-waiting-for-the-regular-season[/url]
[QUOTE]LOS ANGELES -- The Los Angeles Rams’ offensive starters will open the regular season without having played a single snap in the preseason. The defensive starters will have played seven.[/QUOTE]

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

You can’t just give the Rams a pass because they made the playoffs

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=jamf;1198847]It's more than just preseason games.
The Press has said many times that Gruden runs a soft training camp.

At some point you gotta play football right?

[B]Jordan Reed is going to get killed week 1[/B].[/quote]

Not sure Reed is of great support to your point though: he would get injured in week 1 of the preseason as he would in week 1 of the regular season. I understand taking as little chance as you can with him...

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

This whole Gruden can't win openers thing. Is it really that? Or is it really that Cousins was a spaz during openers?

Because those two go hand in hand, they're correlated, and you have to ask which was the bigger cause.

Cousins was notoriously jumpy in Week 1 games when he was here. This was the writeup from PFF on his Week 1 performance last year against the Eagles:

[QUOTE]Looking at his complete game, Cousins dropped back 47 times. He was sacked four times and ran three times. That leaves 40 pass attempts. The following data comes from Pro Football Focus:

When Cousins faced no pressure, he completed 68 percent of his passes. That falls in line with his completion percentage the last two seasons.

When there was pressure, and against the Eagles there was plenty, Cousins' completion percentage dropped significantly. He completed just six of 15 passes, good for 40 percent, and threw a red zone interception under pressure.

Not all pressure comes from blitzing, as the Philadelphia defensive line was able to generate push on the pocket sometimes without extra defenders. [/QUOTE]

The red zone interception was a killer, and I remember it like it was yesterday. It was a total spaz brain fart under pressure.

I think performance in openers had more to do with Cousins than it did Gruden, personally.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Cousins always seemed to be a slow starter here, it will be interesting to see how he starts this year

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

I just think that Gruden needs to get the guys a little bit more of game action. Especially the QB's and wr's because of the timing. The players (especially Reed) need to get hit a little bit and get ready for 4 quarters of football.

Back in the 80's and early 90's Gibbs had starters playing in the 4th pre season game. Different era obviously but I don't believe there's anything wrong with that. Especially after watching some of our starter tackle last week. They look like they need some game reps.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;1198863]I just think that Gruden needs to get the guys a little bit more of game action. Especially the QB's and wr's because of the timing. The players (especially Reed) need to get hit a little bit and get ready for 4 quarters of football.

Back in the 80's and early 90's Gibbs had starters playing in the 4th pre season game. Different era obviously but I don't believe there's anything wrong with that. Especially after watching some of our starter tackle last week. They look like they need some game reps.[/QUOTE]I would rather see a second scrimmage week against other teams. I think thats the way it will go in the futire

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1198863]I just think that Gruden needs to get the guys a little bit more of game action. Especially the QB's and wr's because of the timing. The players (especially Reed) need to get hit a little bit and get ready for 4 quarters of football.

Back in the 80's and early 90's Gibbs had starters playing in the 4th pre season game. Different era obviously but I don't believe there's anything wrong with that. Especially after watching some of our starter tackle last week. They look like they need some game reps.[/quote]

There could be something to it. But I know we played a very competitive opener against the eventual Super Bowl champs last year, and the game essentially came down to a few mental gaffes by our QB while he was under pressure.

First play of the game, Gruden calls a play action deep bomb on a post route to Pryor. Cousins overthrows it despite Pryor having two steps on his man.

I continue to think the problem in openers was more Cousins than Gruden. This doesn't necessarily mean it will go better this year with Smith. But the strength of the opponent this year (Arizona) is certainly different than it was last year, that much is certain.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=MTK;1198857]Cousins always seemed to be a slow starter here, it will be interesting to see how he starts this year[/quote]

I think he will be the same as usual, good QB for most of the season and have hiccups along the way

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

I had lots of optimism going into camp. Last week's game just deflated me and, yes, I know, its preseason. However, it just seemed to be a microcosm of the general unpreparedness of the Skins going into the regular season.

Gruden wants to run the ball and actually calls plenty of runs. However, we don't run the ball well and haven't for some time. We have this, supposedly, really good line but they just don't seem to get it done. Sure, AP ran hard in preseason - do we really think he is going to do that over 16 games?

At the close of camp, our starters did not look crisp in any part of the game. Sure there is some talent, but I am feeling another mediocre season where we lose some games we should win b/c of poor execution.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=OmahaRedskins;1198569]Right now we have 1. Doctson 2. Richardson and 3 Crowder as starters.

The following are trying to make the team.

Trey Quinn (Rookie), Mo Harris (out with concussion), Brian Quick (will not make the team), Simms: Did I miss anyome?

Doctson has not been practicing due to heal issue.

[B]By week six, Dotson will have played himself into the dog house and Simms will be starting opposite of Richardson[/B].[/quote]

I will make any reasonable wager that this does not occur.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1198889]I will make any reasonable wager that this does not occur.[/quote]

Let me get in on this action too. Even if he is bad (doubtful) a first round pick means he has to be given every opportunity to pan out before they give up on him.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=mooby;1198904]Let me get in on this action too. Even if he is bad (doubtful) a first round pick means he has to be given every opportunity to pan out before they give up on him.[/quote]

Three year is not enough time?

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

I hope I am wrong, and Doctson shows up this year. I haven't seen it in the preseason. Someone will have to fill the void. Maybe it is Mo Harris, but he is out with a concussion.

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[quote=OmahaRedskins;1198912]Three year is not enough time?[/quote]

It is for me but Good Guy Jay Gruden will give Josh every opportunity if healthy.

Jay is out here making friends for life.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=OmahaRedskins;1198912]Three year is not enough time?[/quote]

It's really only been 1, and he has had flashes. I think he gets this full year to show progression.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Alex on Cam:

[url]https://redskinswire.usatoday.com/2018/08/29/alex-smith-big-praise-undrafted-sensation-cam-sims/[/url]

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

The other day Doc Walker was talking about some kid from Indiana, he's a wr. He seemed to be impressed with him. Someone is going to have to step up cause we simply can not count on Doc.

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[quote=OmahaRedskins;1198913]I hope I am wrong, and Doctson shows up this year. I haven't seen it in the preseason. Someone will have to fill the void. Maybe it is Mo Harris, but he is out with a concussion.[/quote]

I have already thrown in the towel. He's already hurt and he's barely been hit. When Doc has an injury it lasts for like the entire year. He heals slower than anyone in the league.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Do we pick up another RB after cut down? Everyone thinks Ameer Abdullah will be cut. He would be an upgrade over Rob Kelly and possibly Bibbs.

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Is Doctson not practicing? Am I missing something? All this pessimism on him is a little out of control.

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[quote=MTK;1198962]Is Doctson not practicing? Am I missing something? All this pessimism on him is a little out of control.[/quote]

I really hope I'm 100% wrong on the guy. But it seems like w/ him, as w/ Reed, it's always going to be something. This is the time of year where you should be 100% healthy or close to it, and he's already hurt.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Gruden is gun shy with injuries. After last year he doesn't want a repeat. So he's babying Reed and Doctson especially. I think it's contributing to the perception that they're injured right now.

I think they're both ready to go. But the impact of Gruden's super cautious approach remains to be seen - you wonder if it contributes to a lack of toughness on the rest of the roster.

I think if they ball out in Week 1, all of this will be forgotten.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=MTK;1198962]Is Doctson not practicing? Am I missing something? All this pessimism on him is a little out of control.[/quote]

The masses need SOMETHING to focus their negativity on.

I think Doctson is a very promising player. Wipe out his Rookie season cause of the injury, just like we are with Guice :mad:, and he's shown he can be productive.

500+ yards and 6 TD's in his first full season is definitely something to build off.

I feel his rookie year is looming in everyone's minds a bit too largely. I've commented on this before in this very thread [URL="http://www.thewarpath.net/showpost.php?p=1196970&postcount=97"]here[/URL].

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1198964]I really hope I'm 100% wrong on the guy. But it seems like w/ him, as w/ Reed, it's always going to be something. This is the time of year where you should be 100% healthy or close to it, and he's already hurt.[/quote]

Plenty of guys are already hurt, he's still practicing though.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=sevier2;1198966]The masses need SOMETHING to focus their negativity on.

I think Doctson is a very promising player. Wipe out his Rookie season cause of the injury, just like we are with Guice :mad:, and he's shown he can be productive.

500+ yards and 6 TD's in his first full season is definitely something to build off.

I feel his rookie year is looming in everyone's minds a bit too largely. I've commented on this before in this very thread [URL="http://www.thewarpath.net/showpost.php?p=1196970&postcount=97"]here[/URL].[/quote]

I wonder if Guice will be under the same scrutiny next year coming off an injury

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=MTK;1198968]I wonder if Guice will be under the same scrutiny next year coming off an injury[/quote]

Yes, RBs should be able to contribute day 1.

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I just wonder if Guice gets nicked up in camp next year people will be crying bust

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[quote=MTK;1198970]I just wonder if Guice gets nicked up in camp next year people will be crying bust[/quote]

injury prone and bust are two diff stories, right? Lol. I think what happened to him was plum bad luck - it sucks

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;1198965]Gruden is gun shy with injuries. After last year he doesn't want a repeat. So he's babying Reed and Doctson especially. I think it's contributing to the perception that they're injured right now.

I think they're both ready to go. But the impact of Gruden's super cautious approach remains to be seen - you wonder if it contributes to a lack of toughness on the rest of the roster.

I think if they ball out in Week 1, all of this will be forgotten.[/QUOTE]Tough players are tough, soft players are soft.

You didn't mention Trent, probably because nobody questions his toughness.

I believe Reed is viewed as tough by the team because of the very painful shoulder injuries he played through. I heard Cooley day they had to cut him out of his pads after one game last year.

Soft players like Doctson are going to be soft no matter how Jay treats him. He can have phantom injuries only because he was a first round draft pick.

His team mates are way more aware of the dynamic than we are. Soft players who are top shelf talent get traded to the Broncos.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

What indication do we have from anyone that Doctson is considered to be soft by his teammates? Phantom injuries? Really?

Again, the guy has been practicing since he came back from the shoulder. What's all the crying about exactly?

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=MTK;1198973]What indication do we have from anyone that Doctson is considered to be soft by his teammates? Phantom injuries? Really?

Again, the guy has been practicing since he came back from the shoulder. What's all the crying about exactly?[/quote]

He's also one of the very few offensive players who played all 16 games last season.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Doctson needs to bring it this year. He was a first round pick, unfortunately that brings expectations.

Fortunately, crowder, healthy Reed, Paul Richardson are here to give him support behind a solid qb. So he shouldn’t feel pressure.

It’s ideal situation for Doctson...so remove all excuses going forward. He needs to produce on the field...

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

He does need to produce. We also should collectively calm down about the injury. I think we have a perception that he's injured, but I don't think he actually has an injury.

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I think that one of the problems with Doctson is the hype he gets from coaches and players. Over the off-season and early in camp, we heard a lot about how he was looking special and making amazing grabs in practice. In the first two preseason games, he didn't really flash. Given the starters limited appearance, however, it wasn't too big a thing. Then he reports come back about "ouchies" and missed practices and the doubters come back. Honestly, I don't remember if he played Friday or not, but, since the offense looked horrible, it wouldn't matter if he did.

To date, he has been hyped as primed for a breakout season but simply hasn't shown anything in the preseason. As with the whole "are we prepared" debate, a good early showing will put most of the doubts to rest.

As to his toughness, and in watching his play, I have seen him throw his body around and take some solid hits that made say "ouch!" Invariably, he has gotten up, shaken it off and been ready for the next play. He may have a soft coach, but I am just not seeing a "soft" player.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

Cam Sims has been the highest graded rookie WR so far this PS (PFF). I don't see any way that he doesn't make the team.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1198973]What indication do we have from anyone that Doctson is considered to be soft by his teammates? Phantom injuries? Really?

Again, the guy has been practicing since he came back from the shoulder. What's all the crying about exactly?[/QUOTE]You're right, there isn't a quote or a story saying he is soft.

I was making an assumption based on how Gruden, Cooley and the players reacted to Reed's injuries compared to the lack of reaction to Doctson's.

Everyone talked up how tough Reed was despite missing so much time.

The lone reaction to Doctson was go see your own Dr. because we can't find anything wrong with you.

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Re: Training Camp 2018
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1198978]Cam Sims has been the highest graded rookie WR so far this PS (PFF). I don't see any way that he doesn't make the team.[/quote]

he better...

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Doctson can shut up his critics by producing on the field.

Re: Training Camp 2018
 

FYI..... Tyler Catalina had surgery, he is out for the season. They need to trade for a 2nd team OL.....a late pick for someone who will be cut