Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2010/02/16/market-free-agent-qbs/]FOXNews.com - Thin market for free-agent QBs[/url]

[B]Quarterbacks who should get starter consideration

1. Jason Campbell, Washington Redskins

Status: restricted free agent

Possible suitors: Arizona Cardinals, Buffalo Bills, Denver Broncos, Minnesota Vikings, St. Louis Rams, Washington Redskins

With veteran QB Kurt Warner retiring, the Cardinals need to add at least another quarterback with experience to compete against Matt Leinart. Campbell has 52 starts in his five seasons as a pro.

The Bills literally have no idea who will be their starting quarterback next season, so why not go after Campbell, who would be a clear upgrade?

Depending on what the team does with Kyle Orton, the Broncos could pursue Campbell.

The Vikings will need at least a few alternatives if veteran QB Brett Favre retires. Campbell has experience in the West Coast offense.

The Rams are the one team that will probably look hard at acquiring at least two quarterbacks this year, and, as mentioned above, Campbell does have playing experience with the West Coast offense.[/B]

[url=http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2010/02/23/breakfast_with_12.html?cxntfid=blogs_bevo_beat]Texas Longhorns: Football, Basketball, Baseball and more | Statesman.com[/url]

[B]There are rumors that the St. Louis Rams are interested in getting Jason Campbell from the Washington Redskins. The thought of Sam Bradford ending up a ‘Skin is looking more and more likely.[/B]

There are lots of articles, but those 2 talked about him the most in-depth, IMO

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

When you said "expected", I thought maybe there were some solid details. I am sure Campbell will be looked at by every team in need of a QB, the question is will they offer what the Skins want, and what exactly are the Skins willing to take. If the Rams offered their 2nd round pick, I would imagine we would take that or maybe push for their 4th as well. I don't know, but I hope IF we don't keep Campbell, that we don't give him away cheaply either.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;665112]Latest news this morning says that St. Louis is expected to trade for Campbell.

The eagles are expected to keep Vick on as a backup incase McNabb struggles, and lastly, the redskins look more and more likely to take Bradford....[/quote]

I do not see that happening. JC is the man right now, or at least WILL be around to compete to be the man.

Tampa Bay and STL are talking trade for Josh Johnson though.

[url=http://det.scout.com/2/947712.html]Scout.com: Rams, Buccaneers Blockbuster Possible[/url]

[quote][url=http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&hl=167880&id=4706]Josh Johnson[/url]

[IMG]http://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gif[/IMG]
The Bucs and Rams have reportedly explored a deal that would send the No. 3 overall pick, a third-round pick, and QB Josh Johnson to St. Louis for the first overall selection.

The Bucs would then draft Ndamukong Suh at No. 1. According to Scout.com, the Rams compare Johnson to Michael Vick athletically, and believe he has even more upside as a passer. While Johnson is an intriguing project, he's not close to being ready to start at the NFL level. The proposed deal makes sense for both sides, but wouldn't solve the Rams' quarterback dilemma for 2010.
[/quote]

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;665146]When you said "expected", I thought maybe there were some solid details. I am sure Campbell will be looked at by every team in need of a QB, the question is will they offer what the Skins want, and what exactly are the Skins willing to take. If the Rams offered their 2nd round pick, I would imagine we would take that or maybe push for their 4th as well. I don't know, but I hope[B] IF we don't keep Campbell, that we don't give him away cheaply either.[/B][/quote]

Agreed. Some genius early on said that they'd give Campbell away for a 4th rounder :doh: I would definitely trade Campbell for the Rams' second rounder. I know it may be a reach, but hey I wouldn't mind taking advantage of someone else's miscalculation.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

How about JC for a 3rd and 4th? I would probably go for that.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=Mattyk;665180]How about JC for a 3rd and 4th? I would probably go for that.[/quote]

I really think he ought to have a higher market than that, but if that was the best offer out there, AND, we knew we would get Shanny's choice of QB in the draft, then those picks would come in nice to fill out some position depth. Along those same lines what about this year and next year's 3rd for JC. The value is about the same, but might get a nice player with the extra 3rd next year.

- sidenote -
I am still really excited to see how this new draft format plays out, I think Friday between the first and second/third rounds will have the potential for a lot of wheeling and dealing to get our draft board set up for Friday night and Saturday.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;665185]I really think he ought to have a higher market than that, but if that was the best offer out there, AND, we knew we would get Shanny's choice of QB in the draft, then those picks would come in nice to fill out some position depth. Along those same lines what about this year and next year's 3rd for JC. The value is about the same, but might get a nice player with the extra 3rd next year.

- sidenote -
[B]I am still really excited to see how this new draft format plays out, I think Friday between the first and second/third rounds will have the potential for a lot of wheeling and dealing to get our draft board set up for Friday night and Saturday[/B].[/quote]

The possibility is there to see more trades than we've seen in awhile. I don't think I'd settle for less than a 2nd and 4th for JC.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=Mattyk;665180]How about JC for a 3rd and 4th? I would probably go for that.[/quote]

I was thinking the following trade if it was offered.

Redskins give up:
Jason Campbell, 2011 3rd Rounder, 2010 4th Rounder

Redskins get:
2010 2nd Rounder

I personally don't see anyone giving a straight up 2nd round pick for JC. We'd probably have to sweeten the pot. Still the idea of relying on a rookie QB so soon makes me nervous. We would possibly have to look at veterans to start in the meantime. This type of trade would be really useful especially if it was with the Rams.

I've recently started to scale back on my support for JC (which is constantly on a roller coaster). However in reading something like this I can't help but think that we really won't be that much better:

[quote]2009 Season Outlook
It's unfair to judge Garrard too harshly for his 2008 numbers. The interior of the Jacksonville offensive line, previously a strength, was pummeled by injury early in the season, leading Garrard to the ignominious crown of most knocked-down quarterback of the year. Despite the heat, Garrard managed a decent completion percentage (61.1) and finished 10th in the NFL in passing yards. The Jags have concerns at tackle for '09 but did use their first two picks on Eugene Monroe and Eben Britton, and they should rely heavily on those rookies. But unless Torry Holt finds the Fountain of Youth or another receiver steps up, Garrard won't be a fantasy starter. However, he's a heady decision-maker and could lead the league in rush yards by a quarterback. He's a bye-week quarterback with a high ceiling.[/quote]

I mean to me Campbell seems a lot like Garrard and with that said I see us going only so far with JC at QB. Funny thing though is if we draft Jimmy Clausen our QB will still be JC.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;665185]I really think he ought to have a higher market than that, but if that was the best offer out there, AND, we knew we would get Shanny's choice of QB in the draft, then those picks would come in nice to fill out some position depth. Along those same lines what about this year and next year's 3rd for JC. The value is about the same, but might get a nice player with the extra 3rd next year.

- sidenote -
I am still really excited to see how this new draft format plays out, I think Friday between the first and second/third rounds will have the potential for a lot of wheeling and dealing to get our draft board set up for Friday night and Saturday.[/quote]

omg we need all of the linemen we can get guys should love something like this, but they're typically the ones that want campbell back no matter what

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;665199]I was thinking the following trade if it was offered.

Redskins give up:
Jason Campbell, 2011 3rd Rounder, 2010 4th Rounder

Redskins get:
2010 2nd Rounder

[/quote]

In my opinion, the skins would be ROYALLY screwed over in that trade. Since we don't know the exact position of the 2nd round pick we would be receiving or the position of the skins picks in 2011, its really hard to nail down how much either of those picks are worth. But just as an example, lets say both picks were in the middle of their respective rounds. Here's how your trade would look in the draft value chart:

[U]Redskins give up:[/U]

1) Jason Campbell

2) 2011 3rd rounder, valued as a 2010 2nd rounder (midgrade), 48th overall - 420 pts.

3) 2010 4th rounder - 100 pts.

[U]Redskins get:[/U]
2010 2nd rounder, 48th overall - 420 pts

So basically, for the trade to be "fair," you think Jason Campbell would be worth [B] NEGATIVE 100 points[/B] on the draft value chart.

Lets make a more realistic scenario for us

1) We traded with the Rams, who have the first pick in the 2nd round,
2) the Skins end 2010 in the middle of the pack, and end up with the 16th pick in each round of the 2011 draft. For trading purposes, our 2011 3rd rounder is the equivalent to the last pick in the 2nd round of this years draft, your trade works out this way:

[U]Redskins give up:[/U]
1) Jason Campbell
2) 2011 3rd round pick, valued at 2010 2nd round pick, 48th overall, 420 points.
3) 2010 4th round pick - 100 pts

[U]Redskins get:[/U]
Rams 2010 2nd round pick, 33rd overall, 580 points

In that "realistic" scenario, youre essentially saying that Jason Campbell, generally agreed to be somewhere between the 15th and 25th best QB in the league, is worth only 60 points on the draft value chart. the 21st pick in the 4th round of the draft (117th overall) is worth 60 points. In a year where there's not a single free agent QB worth mentioning. Do you really think Campbell is that horrible of a QB? Its even worse than what Sage Rosenfelds was traded for.

I'm not a Campbell fan by any means, but he's easily worth a low 2nd rounder - high 3rd rounder.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;665199]I was thinking the following trade if it was offered.

Redskins give up:
Jason Campbell, 2011 3rd Rounder, 2010 4th Rounder

Redskins get:
2010 2nd Rounder

I personally don't see anyone giving a straight up 2nd round pick for JC. We'd probably have to sweeten the pot. Still the idea of relying on a rookie QB so soon makes me nervous. We would possibly have to look at veterans to start in the meantime. This type of trade would be really useful especially if it was with the Rams.

I've recently started to scale back on my support for JC (which is constantly on a roller coaster). However in reading something like this I can't help but think that we really won't be that much better:



I mean to me Campbell seems a lot like Garrard and with that said I see us going only so far with JC at QB. Funny thing though is if we draft Jimmy Clausen our QB will still be JC.[/quote]
that sounds like a horrible deal for us

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;665301]

I'm not a Campbell fan by any means, but he's easily worth a low 2nd rounder - high 3rd rounder.[/quote]

Teams don't use that draft chart nearly as much as people think. Look at all the picks that Eli Manning cost the Giants. Then look at Randy Moss being trade for a 4th round pick. Just because Campbell might be worth a 2nd rounder doesn't mean we'll get that for him. If you trade him straight up you probably get an early third round pick if you're lucky which isn't worth trading him in my mind. I'd rather have the first pick in the second round (which is in essence a first round pick) and the 5th pick in the second in exchange for a QB that will most likely be gone after this year.

However you're crazy to think that we'd just get away with a second round pick for Campbell at this point. If that happens I'll be the first to apologize but that rarely happens. Teams have seen to much of Campbell to just trade him for a second round pick.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

BHA i dont understand your comparison of dirtbags proposal vs your "realistic" one.

in dirt's proposal i dont understand why you assign the rams 2010 2nd round pick as being 48th overall when they pick 33rd? isnt your "more realistic" proposal just an accurate recitation of dirt's proposal?

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[quote=over the mountain;665320]BHA i dont understand your comparison of dirtbags proposal vs your "realistic" one.

in dirt's proposal i dont understand why you assign the rams 2010 2nd round pick as being 48th overall when they pick 33rd? isnt your "more realistic" proposal just an accurate recitation of dirt's proposal?[/quote]

I think he was using realistic sarcastically. If I'm right BHA would trade JC for a second round pick straight up. Still I don't get the numbers on the 2011 3rd round pick. I think a 2010 third round pick has the potential to fetch a 2011 second round pick.

However a 2011 third round pick is worth less this year then it will be next year. It's sort of like money. It's present value may be worth X number of points today but next year when it "matures" it'll be worth more. Ironcially I'm thinking that the 2011 3rd rounder should be valued as a 4th round pick this year. Not a second round pick. That would leave a 300 point gap assuming the 2011 pick gets valued correctly as a 2010 4th round pick making it around 100 points.

So with that said BHA I think you owe more me a couple more points for Campbells value :D

Still I'm not that into the trade chart. I think teams use it as more of a guideline.

Re: ESPN: Clayton Expects Skins to Tender Campbell for a 1st and 3rd
 

[U][/U][quote=over the mountain;665320]BHA i dont understand your comparison of dirtbags proposal vs your "realistic" one.

in dirt's proposal i dont understand why you assign the rams 2010 2nd round pick as being 48th overall when they pick 33rd? isnt your "more realistic" proposal just an accurate recitation of dirt's proposal?[/quote]

sorry, i changed my example scenario halfway through (when i read a blurb on extremeskins about the rams being interested in Campbell) and didnt go back and revalue everything. well i did, i just missed a few things... you are right dirtbag, i do owe you a few points. :) i would go back and change what I saw saying, but it would make things even more confusing.

Essentially, if we traded with the Rams, i'd view a fair trade as being:

[U]Rams get:[/U]
Jason Campbell

[U]Redskins get:[/U]
Rams 3rd round pick

OR

[U]Rams get:[/U]
1. Jason Campbell
2. 4th overall pick in the 2010 draft

[U]Redskins get:[/U]
1. 1st overall pick in the 2011 draft

In that scenario, the Rams would get a starting QB and use the 4th overall pick on Okung and the skins would trade down with a team that really wanted Suh or McCoy and nab another teams 1st and 2nd round picks.

If we're going to move Campbell, i'd rather see us trade him for a 3rd, trade down 5-8 spots in the first and pick up another 3rd round pick.