Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701559]Here is the wiki link to two excellent books on the FairTax, the first is the FairTax book and the follow on is a response to critics of the plan (most criticisms false or misleading).

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_FairTax_Book]The FairTax Book - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/url]

Here is a link to the FairTax site, on the bottom of the front page are the five most common criticisms of the plan with rebuttals.

[url=http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=about_main]Americans For Fair Taxation:[/url][/quote]

I just ask taht because I don't believe in utopian ideas. If you can't tell me a negative, then a red flag goes up.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[url=http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100517/ap_on_re_us/us_obama_s_aunt]US court grants asylum to Obama's African aunt - Yahoo! News[/url]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Apparently Obama's aunt was recently a illegal immigrant , but astonishingly she was/is also living in public housing. How does a illegal immigrant get free housing? Its not like she has kids (for us) to support. Also it sounds like she has a fair amount of medical problems so i guess she just gets free health care too? Does anyone know if she works?[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]And Obama is pretty rich now, he's just gonna let his aunt live in public housing at the expense of the taxpayer? What the hell is going on in this country?[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

Doesn't sound like he's close to her... should he just pony up for all his relatives?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701597][URL="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100517/ap_on_re_us/us_obama_s_aunt"]US court grants asylum to Obama's African aunt - Yahoo! News[/URL]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Apparently Obama's aunt was recently a illegal immigrant , but astonishingly she was/is also living in public housing. How does a illegal immigrant get free housing? Its not like she has kids (for us) to support. Also it sounds like she has a fair amount of medical problems so i guess she just gets free health care too? Does anyone know if she works?[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]And Obama is pretty rich now, he's just gonna let his aunt live in public housing at the expense of the taxpayer? What the hell is going on in this country?[/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

See liberals want to tax and have others pay for all their social programs and Obama is no different. The dude is president of the USA and his aunt lives in goverment housing draining our system and he does nothing for her from what I can tell. Same thing goes for his half brother that lives in a hut in some 3rd world.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;701602]See liberals want to tax and have others pay for all their social programs and Obama is no different. The dude is president of the USA and his aunt lives in goverment housing draining our system and he does nothing for her from what I can tell. Same thing goes for his half brother that lives in a hut in some 3rd world.[/quote]


right.
cuz all "liberals" ALL think and want the exact same thing. that's a pretty broad brush you're paintin with there my friend. i guess all "conservatives" and/or "republicans" are racists and homophobes cuz i know some that are?

and as someone pointed out, we dont know how close he is with this aunt or the alleged half-brother, not to mention the political dynamite that would go off if he reached out to them in any documented way. just seems like yet another bullshit "gotcha" story that's much a-do about very little.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Mattyk;701598]Doesn't sound like he's close to her... should he just pony up for all his relatives?[/quote]


"In his memoir, "Dreams from My Father: A Story of Race and Inheritance," Obama affectionately referred to Onyango as "Auntie Zeituni" and described meeting her during his 1988 trip to Kenya."

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]It definitely doesnt sound like theyre close, but they’re not estranged either. It doesn’t sound like she came here to chase him down and get something, and back in 2000 Obama didn’t really have big bucks. But at this point I don’t think you allow your immigrant Aunt with health problems to live in public housing, based solely off his financial security. Taking into account that hes also the President makes it even more disturbing to me. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

I really don't see where he owes her anything to be honest.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701608] But at this point I don’t think you allow your immigrant Aunt with health problems to live in public housing, based solely off his financial security. Taking into account that hes also the President makes it even more disturbing to me. [/quote]


dude, he's really busy.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;701606]right.
cuz all "liberals" ALL think and want the exact same thing. that's a pretty broad brush you're paintin with there my friend. i guess all "conservatives" and/or "republicans" are racists and homophobes cuz i know some that are?

and as someone pointed out, we dont know how close he is with this aunt or the alleged half-brother, not to mention the political dynamite that would go off if he reached out to them in any documented way. just seems like yet another bullshit "gotcha" story that's much a-do about very little.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Please name one "liberal" public figure that does not want social programs. That is the basis of their platform. Kelsey Grammer is a "conservative" and i know him to be neither raciest or homophobic, rather quite the opposite. Do you realize how ridiculous and malicious your comparison is?[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;701610]dude, he's really busy.[/quote]


[url=http://www.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/golf/04/20/golf.obama.bush/index.html]President Obama plays more than Bush - CNN.com[/url]


Bush was known for his love of golf, but figures released by Mark Knoller of CBS Radio, the unofficial White House statistician, have revealed that Obama has played golf 32 times during his presidency -- eight times more than his predecessor did during his entire tenure at the White House.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Mattyk;701609]I really don't see where he owes her anything to be honest.[/quote]

If I had a family memeber who came to this country and was dirt poor trying to get by I'd FEEL THE NEED AND THE WANT to help them.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701613][url=http://www.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/golf/04/20/golf.obama.bush/index.html]President Obama plays more than Bush - CNN.com[/url]


Bush was known for his love of golf, but figures released by Mark Knoller of CBS Radio, the unofficial White House statistician, have revealed that Obama has played golf 32 times during his presidency -- eight times more than his predecessor did during his entire tenure at the White House.[/quote]

I mean really carrying Obama's gonads around in your pocket. I mean I ignored and laughed at Bush, but I never carried his gonads around in my pocket. Can you say obsessed?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

Maybe thats why the goverment has not moved in a told BP to pound sand and tried to stop the oil leak. When Obama finds out he cannot fly to a funeral he decides to play golf instead of worrying about a hugh oil leak.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701613][url=http://www.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/golf/04/20/golf.obama.bush/index.html]President Obama plays more than Bush - CNN.com[/url]


Bush was known for his love of golf, but figures released by Mark Knoller of CBS Radio, the unofficial White House statistician, have revealed that Obama has played golf 32 times during his presidency -- eight times more than his predecessor did during his entire tenure at the White House.[/quote]

The real question is how many with Tiger?

JUST KIDDING!

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701612][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Please name one "liberal" public figure that does not want social programs. That is the basis of their platform. Kelsey Grammer is a "conservative" and i know him to be neither raciest or homophobic, rather quite the opposite. Do you realize how ridiculous and malicious your comparison is?[/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]


hahaha! okay, let's play who can be more ridiculous!

i'm not even going to engage your line of thinking cuz "liberal" and "public figure" and "want social programs" is pretty genaral.

and the fact that Kelsey Grammer, Famous Conservative, is allegedly not a homophobe or racist (based on what? his own bio? his wiki page? are you his cousin?) all of a sudden i'm malicious?? my whole point was that NOT all conservatives are racists or homophobes.... which was to illustrate that not all "liberals" are the same. dont fall into this coke vs. pepsi trap, the illusion of choice.

people seem to see President Obama as some radical leftist liberal, while i see him as just another "pragmatic" centrist Clinton Democrat willing to compromise and act like a republican when it's deemed the popular thing to do and wont hesitate to sell out his constituency on the REAL left since he knows they have no where else to to turn and the mainstream not-so-liberal media has convinced him that he must "govern from the middle!"

my point, technically Obama and I are both "liberals" and yet we are pretty different.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=firstdown;701614]If I had a family memeber who came to this country and was dirt poor trying to get by I'd FEEL THE NEED AND THE WANT to [B][I]help [/I][/B]them.[/quote]


you spelled "deport" wrong.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;701621]dont fall into this coke vs. pepsi trap, the illusion of choice.[/quote]but what about New Coke :)

[quote]people seem to see President Obama as some radical leftist liberal, [B]while i see him as just another "pragmatic" centrist Clinton Democrat[/B] [/quote]You must be a little to the left of Mao and Hugo....

Just poking fun :duel:

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701624]but what about New Coke :)

You must be a little to the left of Mao and Hugo....

Just poking fun :duel:[/quote]

haha! true.
but the people held up as hardcore liberal leftists in this country (Obama, Kerry, Ted Kennedy, the Clintons, etc) are all "pragmatic centrists" IMO.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;701623]you spelled "deport" wrong.[/quote]

Funny. Unlike Obama I could file to sponsor the family member which is saying I will watch over them and provide financial assistance. This way the family member would not be drain on the system and could work toward citizeship. I believe in her case she cam here ligally but over stayed her visa which makes it a little easier. Its also how she got goverment assistance and why just handing out green cards is not a great idea.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;701624]but what about New Coke :)

You must be a little to the left of Mao and Hugo....

Just poking fun :duel:[/quote]

I saw the so-called big NRa crowd here in Charlotte. They are old looks like an AARP convention.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

This guy is pretty sweet:

[url=http://www.buzzfeed.com/chrisb11/we-are-better-than-that-12v9]We Are Better Than That! [VIDEO][/url]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;701626]haha! true.
but the people held up as hardcore liberal leftists in this country (Obama, Kerry, Ted Kennedy, the Clintons, etc) are all "pragmatic centrists" IMO.[/quote]

So, who do you consider a "hardcore liberal leftist"? Is anyone who fails to call for the dicatatorship of the proletariat a "pragmatic centerist"?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;700433]I don't think many people would argue the Constitution didn't derive from the Magna Carta, and the effects of English history.

Did Africans from the ivory coast/liberia farm rice and cotton? I ask because I did not know that. Looking online, cotton and rice increased the slave trade due to the need for cheap labor not instructions on farming cotton per se.

Interesting reads on this topic include:

[URL="http://www.slaveryinamerica.org/history/hs_es_cotton.htm"]Slavery in America[/URL]
and

[URL="http://www.answers.com/topic/plantation-system-of-the-south"]Plantation System of the South: Information from Answers.com[/URL]
All that said, your point of incorporating a lot of cultures (melting pot) is true but we didn't succeed as a country by setting up islands of nationalities (didn't work well in Czechoslovakia either), but by the individual nationalities submitting to an identity as a United States citizen.[/quote]I for one, am stunned and impressed that the internet (and those who know how to use it) still find joethiesmanfan's (who i just realized, doesn't even have Thiesmann spelled correctly) statements falsifiable.

It's almost like a desperate attempt for the unproveable, only to later be disproven.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=GTripp0012;701693]I for one, am stunned and impressed that the internet (and those who know how to use it) still find joethiesmanfan's (who i just realized, doesn't even have Thiesmann spelled correctly) statements falsifiable.

It's almost like a desperate attempt for the unproveable, only to later be disproven.[/quote]

GTRIPP that's the point. An identity as a US citizen does not have to mean English speaking caucasians. Te term white didn't always apply to all caucasians. There was a time when Irish were not considered white in America. This is Amercia, we incorporated alot of Mexico into our territory. It's silly to feel threatened by what makes America different than Europe. It's also the reason America is much more powerful and richer than Europe.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=GTripp0012;701693]I for one, am stunned and impressed that the internet (and those who know how to use it) still find joethiesmanfan's (who i just realized, doesn't even have Thiesmann spelled correctly) statements falsifiable.

It's almost like a desperate attempt for the unproveable, only to later be disproven.[/quote]

So where were the English cotton and rice plantations? Actually, it is Senegal where the links between South Carolina and Africa exist to this day. Why not use endentured servants from England, maybe because they didn't know how to "make that money". I have got to give credit to Europe from going from the poorest to the richest continent. Time is fluent, and we are witnessing a European downgrade at the hands of the Arabs and Chinese as we speak. But America is not Europe we don't have Europe's problems.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;701684]So, who do you consider a "hardcore liberal leftist"? Is anyone who fails to call for the dicatatorship of the proletariat a "pragmatic centerist"?[/quote]


no, just people like Kucinich or Feingold.... or even Glenn Greenwald who writes for salon. he's dubbed "a liberal" or "someone on the left," but he has plenty of valid criticism for obama and beltway democrats.

skilled politicians like Clinton and Obama know how to appeal to liberals while governing closer to the center.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

From a California school teacher

"As you listen to the news about the student protests over illegal immigration, there are some things that you should be aware of:

I am in charge of the English-as-a-second-language department at a large southern California high school which is designated a Title 1 school, meaning that its students average lower socioeconomic and income levels

Most of the schools you are hearing about, South Gate High, Bell Gardens , Huntington Park , etc., where these students are protesting, are also Title 1 schools.

Title 1 schools are on the free breakfast and free lunch program. When I say free breakfast, I'm not talking a glass of milk and roll -- but a full breakfast and cereal bar with fruits and juices that would make a Marriott proud. The waste of this food is monumental, with trays and trays of it being dumped in the trash uneaten.

I estimate that well over 50% of these students are obese or at least moderately overweight. About 75% or more DO have cell phones.
The school also provides day care centers for the unwed teenage pregnant girls (some as young as 13) so they can attend class without the inconvenience of having to arrange for babysitters or having family watch their kids.

I was ordered to spend $700,000 on my department or risk losing funding for the upcoming year even though there was little need for anything; my budget was already substantial. I ended up buying new computers for the computer learning center, half of which, one month later, have been carved with graffiti by the appreciative students who obviously feel humbled and grateful to have a free education in America.

I have had to intervene several times for young and substitute teachers whose classes consist of many illegal immigrant students, here in the country less then 3 months, who raised so much hell with the female teachers, calling them "Putas"(whores) and throwing things, that the teachers were in tears.

Free medical, free education, free food, free day care etc., etc, etc. Is it any wonder they feel entitled to not only be in this country but to demand rights, privileges and entitlements?

To those who want to point out how much these illegal immigrants contribute to our society because they LIKE their gardener and housekeeper and they like to pay less for tomatoes: spend some time in the real world of illegal immigration and see the TRUE costs.

Higher insurance, medical facilities closing, higher medical costs, more crime, lower standards of education in our schools, overcrowding, new diseases. For me, I'll pay more for tomatoes.

Americans, We need to wake up.

It does, however, have everything to do with culture: It involves an American third-world culture that does not value education, that accepts children getting pregnant and dropping out of school by 15 and that refuses to assimilate, and an American culture that has become so weak and worried about "political correctness" that we don't have the will to do anything about it.


CHEAP LABOR? Isn't that what the whole immigration issue is about?

Business doesn't want to pay a decent wage.

Consumers don't want expensive produce.

Government will tell you Americans don't want the jobs.

But the bottom line is cheap labor. The phrase "cheap labor" is a myth, a farce, and a lie. There is no such thing as "cheap labor."

Take, for example, an illegal alien with a wife and five children. He takes a job for $5.00 or 6.00/hour. At that wage, with six dependents, he pays no income tax, yet at the end of the year, if he files an Income Tax Return, he gets an "earned income credit" of up to $3,200 free.

He qualifies for Section 8 housing and subsidized rent.

He qualifies for food stamps.

He qualifies for free (no deductible, no co-pay) health care.

His children get free breakfasts and lunches at school.

He requires bilingual teachers and books.

He qualifies for relief from high energy bills.

If they are, or become, aged, blind or disabled, they qualify for SSI. If qualified for SSI they can qualify for Medicaid. All of this is at (our) taxpayer's expense.

He doesn't worry about car insurance, life insurance, or homeowners insurance.

Taxpayers provide Spanish language signs, bulletins and printed material.

He and his family receive the equivalent of $20.00 to $30.00/hour in benefits.

Working Americans are lucky to have $5.00 or $6..00/hour left after paying their bills and his.

Cheap labor? YEAH RIGHT!
THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS WE SHOULD BE ADDRESSING TO THE CONGRESSIONAL MEMBERS OF EITHER PARTY. 'AND WHEN THEY LIE TO US AND DON'T DO AS THEY SAY, WE SHOULD REPLACE THEM .

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=htownskinfan;701813]From a California school teacher

"As you listen to the news about the student protests over illegal immigration, there are some things that you should be aware of:

I am in charge of the English-as-a-second-language department at a large southern California high school which is designated a Title 1 school, meaning that its students average lower socioeconomic and income levels

Most of the schools you are hearing about, South Gate High, Bell Gardens , Huntington Park , etc., where these students are protesting, are also Title 1 schools.

Title 1 schools are on the free breakfast and free lunch program. When I say free breakfast, I'm not talking a glass of milk and roll -- but a full breakfast and cereal bar with fruits and juices that would make a Marriott proud. The waste of this food is monumental, with trays and trays of it being dumped in the trash uneaten.

I estimate that well over 50% of these students are obese or at least moderately overweight. About 75% or more DO have cell phones.
The school also provides day care centers for the unwed teenage pregnant girls (some as young as 13) so they can attend class without the inconvenience of having to arrange for babysitters or having family watch their kids.

I was ordered to spend $700,000 on my department or risk losing funding for the upcoming year even though there was little need for anything; my budget was already substantial. I ended up buying new computers for the computer learning center, half of which, one month later, have been carved with graffiti by the appreciative students who obviously feel humbled and grateful to have a free education in America.

I have had to intervene several times for young and substitute teachers whose classes consist of many illegal immigrant students, here in the country less then 3 months, who raised so much hell with the female teachers, calling them "Putas"(whores) and throwing things, that the teachers were in tears.

Free medical, free education, free food, free day care etc., etc, etc. Is it any wonder they feel entitled to not only be in this country but to demand rights, privileges and entitlements?

To those who want to point out how much these illegal immigrants contribute to our society because they LIKE their gardener and housekeeper and they like to pay less for tomatoes: spend some time in the real world of illegal immigration and see the TRUE costs.

Higher insurance, medical facilities closing, higher medical costs, more crime, lower standards of education in our schools, overcrowding, new diseases. For me, I'll pay more for tomatoes.

Americans, We need to wake up.

It does, however, have everything to do with culture: It involves an American third-world culture that does not value education, that accepts children getting pregnant and dropping out of school by 15 and that refuses to assimilate, and an American culture that has become so weak and worried about "political correctness" that we don't have the will to do anything about it.


CHEAP LABOR? Isn't that what the whole immigration issue is about?

Business doesn't want to pay a decent wage.

Consumers don't want expensive produce.

Government will tell you Americans don't want the jobs.

But the bottom line is cheap labor. The phrase "cheap labor" is a myth, a farce, and a lie. There is no such thing as "cheap labor."

Take, for example, an illegal alien with a wife and five children. He takes a job for $5.00 or 6.00/hour. At that wage, with six dependents, he pays no income tax, yet at the end of the year, if he files an Income Tax Return, he gets an "earned income credit" of up to $3,200 free.

He qualifies for Section 8 housing and subsidized rent.

He qualifies for food stamps.

He qualifies for free (no deductible, no co-pay) health care.

His children get free breakfasts and lunches at school.

He requires bilingual teachers and books.

He qualifies for relief from high energy bills.

If they are, or become, aged, blind or disabled, they qualify for SSI. If qualified for SSI they can qualify for Medicaid. All of this is at (our) taxpayer's expense.

He doesn't worry about car insurance, life insurance, or homeowners insurance.

Taxpayers provide Spanish language signs, bulletins and printed material.

He and his family receive the equivalent of $20.00 to $30.00/hour in benefits.

Working Americans are lucky to have $5.00 or $6..00/hour left after paying their bills and his.

Cheap labor? YEAH RIGHT!
THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS WE SHOULD BE ADDRESSING TO THE CONGRESSIONAL MEMBERS OF EITHER PARTY. 'AND WHEN THEY LIE TO US AND DON'T DO AS THEY SAY, WE SHOULD REPLACE THEM .[/quote]

Sound like any other business corporation to me. Spend the budget or lose the budget.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701824]Sound like any other business corporation to me. Spend the budget or lose the budget.[/quote]
EXCEPT........guess what?? OUR tax dollars paid for it

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

and in most businesses, if the budget doesn't balance they have to cut back, or find a way to balance it.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701888]and in most businesses, if the budget doesn't balance they have to cut back, or find a way to balance it.[/quote]

What business is that? wall street, the banks, Halliburton? Which business? Cut back on the workers an pocket the balance in the form of bonuses. This free market thing you talk about. If you saw you wouldn't recognize it.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=mlmpetert;701667]This guy is pretty sweet:

[url=http://www.buzzfeed.com/chrisb11/we-are-better-than-that-12v9]We Are Better Than That! [VIDEO][/url][/quote]

wanna move to bama? i hate the tide, but i was sold when he pulled out the shotgun

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;701920]What business is that? wall street, the banks, Halliburton? Which business? Cut back on the workers an pocket the balance in the form of bonuses. This free market thing you talk about. If you saw you wouldn't recognize it.[/quote]

How about the thousands of small businesses in the United States, including the one I work at, that operates in a fiscally sound (you do know what that means right?) manner, employs 30 people (including naturalized citizens from many parts of the world) and form a backbone of our culture/economy?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701942]How about the thousands of small businesses in the United States, including the one I work at, that operates in a fiscally sound (you do know what that means right?) manner, employs 30 people (including naturalized citizens from many parts of the world) and form a backbone of our culture/economy?[/quote]

got news for you. You trying to sell me on running a country of 300 million people by the same rules as a business with 30 employees? who's gonna give us our small business tax credits and cuts? Who is gonna provide our 300 million people with healthcare? ar you serious? Do you think you think this is a sane analogy? How long have you been smoking outta Ron Paul's meat pipe? Have any computer simulated models?

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

I am not trying to sell you on anything. You have consistently demonstrated that you have a lot of ideology, and very little knowledge of the economic principles you talk about. I have no expectation that you would begin to understand how the United States economy was shaped from the beginning till now, and certainly wouldn't expect you to think outside of your framework mentality.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

+1 for closing this thread.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

AZ strikes back at LA (lights out, especially with summer coming, not good)

[URL]http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/051810_arizonapdf.pdf[/URL]

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=saden1;701979]+1 for closing this thread.[/quote]Who started this mess of a thread anyway? :)

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;701976]I am not trying to sell you on anything. You have consistently demonstrated that you have a lot of ideology, and very little knowledge of the economic principles you talk about. I have no expectation that you would begin to understand how the United States economy was shaped from the beginning till now, and certainly wouldn't expect you to think outside of your framework mentality.[/quote]

You spout theories as if they are proven facts. People in this thread consistently say we are not a free market economy, why change to something new (free market theory)? You act like what you are talking about has been going on for some time when in fact it has never been done before. Ask Sammy.

Re: Arizona's New Immigration Law
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;702072]AZ strikes back at LA (lights out, especially with summer coming, not good)

[URL]http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/051810_arizonapdf.pdf[/URL][/quote]

AZ is crazy for real. They say all this stuff and want all this attention. That would be like boycotting themselves. I am sure LA does not get power for free from AZ. LA has alot of people. Sounds like a nice wad of cash AZ would be throwing away. Boycotting themsleves. Now if they were providing something for free to LA and then take it away or had an alternative to them then this would work.