Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Bangee7;1139309]But, in looking at the top tier NFC team stats, the common theme I see is they all ran the ball well and they all stopped the run well.

OK, I know we need more sacks right? If we had just 0.5 more sacks per game, then we'd be elite!
Car: 44, Sea: 37, Arz: 36
(Note: Was with 38, had more sacks than Sea & Arz).

OK, OK, it's more total take-aways (Int+Fumbl) that we need to be elite. Getting pressure causes more Int's & Fumbles....
Car: 39, Arz: 33, Sea: 22
(note: Was: 26 had more take-aways than the vaunted Seattle Defense).... [/quote]
Good post, and I agree with most of your points (and have laid out similar stats/observations in another thread).

But I would add that the stats still indicate that getting turnovers is an area we need to improve and a team can never have enough pass rush and that pass rush is more then just sack numbers. I think to get a more accurate look at pass rush you have to look at sacks but also hurries and QB hits.

You are spot on about stopping the run. It's important to stop the run if only to create more all out pass rush opportunities.

The question is how do you think we go about addressing these problems? Which units/personnel do you think are key to solving the problems?

For me I think the quickest way to improve run d is to get better at ILB. And turnovers will improve with better secondary in addition to upgrade at ILB.

I'm not too concerned about the run game though, I think there will always be limits to the quality of the run game in Jays scheme.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1139331]There are a couple facts about Cousins and the Skins:



Cousins will be back next year...whether its a tag or a deal, and I really don't care.



The other fact is Bruce and McC are not doing a stupid contract. Vinny is long gone and even the Bruce contracts, hit or miss, are not bad contracts.



The story of the Cousins contract is gonna get...already actually... annoying this offseason.[/QUOTE]


Agreed on all counts.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/02/16/source-washington-cousins-havent-broken-off-talks/]Source: Washington, Cousins haven’t broken off talks | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;1139339][url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/02/16/source-washington-cousins-havent-broken-off-talks/]Source: Washington, Cousins haven’t broken off talks | ProFootballTalk[/url][/quote]

If they are talking or not, it doesn't effing matter. July 15th is the last day to get a long term deal done. none of this matters

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

My only issue is that I really don't trust Snyder or Allen when it comes to KC. They're probably both still a bit upset that Griffin didn't work out. The other side kind of tells me that this is common. See Russell Wilson last year.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

I don't see how RG3 has anything remotely to do with this.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1139341]My only issue is that I really don't trust Snyder or Allen when it comes to KC. They're probably both still a bit upset that Griffin didn't work out. The other side kind of tells me that this is common. See Russell Wilson last year.[/quote]

This is common. Neither side has much incentive to get this done now (this typically happens with anything NFL-related). And at the end of the day, the Redskins have the tag, which can (and likely will) extend these negotiations into the season.

Once the season gets underway, the pressure will be on Kirk to get the deal done. The tag will give him 20-24 mil for the season, but I believe it is not guaranteed.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=irish;1139318]By overspending I mean giving up all the draft picks. More like over-investing than over-spending. RG had one good year and now looks to be the biggest bust in Skins history. The Skins are reluctant to risk another to over-investment in another potential one and done QB.[/quote]

RGIII had at least one good year, saving him from that bestowed title. Don't worry Heath Shuler, you're still the biggest bust in 'skins history!

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=metalskins;1139344]RGIII had at least one good year, saving him from that bestowed title. Don't worry Heath Shuler, you're still the biggest bust in 'skins history![/quote]

Shuler did not cost three 1st round draft choices and a second round pick

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Irrefutable;1139346]Shuler did not cost three 1st round draft choices and a second round pick[/quote]

Neither did RGIII.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=metalskins;1139348]Neither did RGIII.[/quote]

[url=http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1098467-2012-nfl-mock-draft-rams-redskins-trade-shakes-up-first-round]2012 NFL Mock Draft: Rams, Redskins Trade Shakes Up First Round | Bleacher Report[/url]

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=metalskins;1139348]Neither did RGIII.[/quote]Not this illiterate crap again.

We traded 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder for the Rams 1st round pick.

We used the Rams 1st rd pick on RG3.

Therefore the RG3 pick cost us our 3 1st rounders and our 2nd rounder.

Pick tracking for dummies:

Our 3 1sts 1 2d = Rams 1st = RG3.


----------------------------

Put another way, if RG3 didn't cost us 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder, then please explain who else we drafted with these picks:

1st rd 2012 (#6 overall)

2nd rd 2012 (#39 overall)

1st rd 2013 (#22 overall)

1st rd 2014 (#2 ! overall)

Hint: We got just one guy out of these picks, RG3. If you disagree, name the other players we drafted with any of these picks.

-------------------------------------------------

Just in case anyone still doesn't get it:

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CO9DDTgWwAEhUjE.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1139358]Not this illiterate crap again.

We traded 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder for the Rams 1st round pick.

We used the Rams 1st rd pick on RG3.

Therefore the RG3 pick cost us our 3 1st rounders and our 2nd rounder.

Pick tracking for dummies:

Our 3 1sts 1 2d = Rams 1st = RG3.


----------------------------

Put another way, if RG3 didn't cost us 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder, then please explain who else we drafted with these picks:

1st rd 2012 (#6 overall)

2nd rd 2012 (#39 overall)

1st rd 2013 (#22 overall)

1st rd 2014 (#2 ! overall)

Hint: We got just one guy out of these picks, RG3. If you disagree, name the other players we drafted with any of these picks.

-------------------------------------------------

Just in case anyone still doesn't get it:

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CO9DDTgWwAEhUjE.jpg[/IMG][/quote]



I'll sum it up for everyone once and for all in regards to the impact of the rg3 trade:

Redskins: NFC east championships 2012, 2015. Considered contenders for 2016 season

Rams: 3rd place or last place in the nfc west each season. At the end of the 2015 season was told by their own city, you're a steaming pile of shit, get the fuck out of St. Louis.

So that's who won the fucking trade if anyone wants to ask going forward

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Chico23231;1139359]I'll sum it up for everyone once and for all in regards to the impact of the rg3 trade:

Redskins: NFC east championships 2012, 2015. Considered contenders for 2016 season

Rams: 3rd place or last place in the nfc west each season. At the end of the 2015 season was told by their own city, you're a steaming pile of shit, get the fuck out of St. Louis.

So that's who won the fucking trade if anyone wants to ask going forward[/quote]One could argue everything but 2012 was in spite of the RG3 trade. But I refer you to an earlier post of mine.

[quote=HailGreen28;1139240]Well, we had 2012. The Rams haven't even sniffed success since the trade. Though I guess one could argue we would have been better off last year if we had not done the trade....[/quote]

I just wish people would stop kidding themselves about the actual trade. Getting RG3 cost us 3 1st-rd and 1-2nd picks. End of story.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=30gut;1139337].....

The question is how do you think we go about addressing these problems? Which units/personnel do you think are key to solving the problems?

For me I think the quickest way to improve run d is to get better at ILB. And turnovers will improve with better secondary in addition to upgrade at ILB.

I'm not too concerned about the run game though, I think there will always be limits to the quality of the run game in Jays scheme.[/quote]

For stopping the run, I'd focus on 3 spots...

1) ILB- I'd want someone who's quick & can get off blocks to make a play.
2) NT -I want someone strong, but in shape.
3) SS- big & quick fits the bill for me....a mini linebacker type.
The key for me would be to find more athletic folks at those 3 positions.

To jump start the run, I'd focus on 3 spots...
1) Center - a road grader type
2) RB -someone who can hammer & protect the ball
3) Blocking TE - I'd be looking for quick feet, someone who could motion and change direction quickly

Give me all that & I think it would lead to 2 more wins next year.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Chico23231;1139359]I'll sum it up for everyone once and for all in regards to the impact of the rg3 trade:

Redskins: NFC east championships 2012, 2015. Considered contenders for 2016 season

Rams: 3rd place or last place in the nfc west each season. At the end of the 2015 season was told by their own city, you're a steaming pile of shit, get the fuck out of St. Louis.

So that's who won the fucking trade if anyone wants to ask going forward[/quote]

Perfecto Chico!!! :food-smil

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

it's 2016 and we're talking about the rgiii trade? come on guys. it's over. lesson learned. never trade that many picks for a single player. something about eggs and baskets...

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=That Guy;1139367]it's 2016 and we're talking about the rgiii trade? come on guys. it's over. lesson learned. never trade that many picks for a single player. something about eggs and baskets...[/quote]

Basically, absolutely sick of hearing about this shit.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Bangee7;1139365]For stopping the run, I'd focus on 3 spots...

1) ILB- I'd want someone who's quick & can get off blocks to make a play.
2) NT -I want someone strong, but in shape.
3) SS- big & quick fits the bill for me....a mini linebacker type.
The key for me would be to find more athletic folks at those 3 positions.[/quote]There's gonna be some ILB available through the draft and through FA. Anyone in particular stand out to you? I like Reggie Ragland, Scooby Wright and some other later round down hill thumper types.

For the run defense I'm content with our DL. So I would re-sign Knighton or upgrade via FA in addition to adding youth via the draft.

SS--I fine with Jarrett/Duke but would always be in favor of adding talent via the draft.

[quote]To jump start the run, I'd focus on 3 spots...
1) Center - a road grader type
2) RB -someone who can hammer & protect the ball
3) Blocking TE - I'd be looking for quick feet, someone who could motion and change direction quickly

Give me all that & I think it would lead to 2 more wins next year.[/quote]I don't expect them to be able to address all the issues in 1 offseason. And I don't really expect the run game to become a strength in Jay's scheme so its hard for me to see them allocating top resources to the run game. But I would expect them to draft a center/RB/TE 4th round and down.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=30gut;1139373]There's gonna be some ILB available through the draft and through FA. Anyone in particular stand out to you? I like Reggie Ragland, Scooby Wright and some other later round down hill thumper types.

For the run defense I'm content with our DL. So I would re-sign Knighton or upgrade via FA in addition to adding youth via the draft.

SS--I fine with Jarrett/Duke but would always be in favor of adding talent via the draft.

I don't expect them to be able to address all the issues in 1 offseason. And I don't really expect the run game to become a strength in Jay's scheme so its hard for me to see them allocating top resources to the run game. But I would expect them to draft a center/RB/TE 4th round and down.[/quote]

to be honest, adding athleticism to just 6 positions [U]should[/U] be possible in just one off season, considering none of the positions we're talking about was even close to Pro Bowl level. I'm just looking for improved play, which I think is definitely do-able.

I'm not as close to the draft as you, especially for the later round guys.

But, I know Scott McL & staff are, so I trust that they can improve the positions. We had an ILB(or two) go to IR, so maybe they can come back & be better.

I do think DT, C, & RB upgrades can be found in the draft, if the cards fall the right way.

As far as jarret goes, I like him alot...very versatile. Just not sure he can be a big hitter and stay healthy, but time will tell on that. The 1st year is always tough to judge.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

Everybody relax, we have C covered.

[url]https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2016/02/17/pro-kirk-cousins-tops-redskins-list-of-free-agent-priorities/[/url]

PFF graded McRib positively the last 7 games and is recommending the team bring him back.

Is also recommending resigning Potroast.

Recommending not resigning DY. The article doesn't mention his contributions on all aspects of special teams.

An 8 year old would agree with the other recommendations.

The author speaks with a British accent so he is smart. Just sayin.

EDIT: I personally disagree with all 3 of those, but I'm not British.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[url=http://espn.go.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/23657/redskins-dont-need-to-add-a-starter-along-the-ol-but-will-seek-depth]Redskins dont need to add a starter along the OL, but will seek depth - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN[/url]

Good article bout the Oline and insight to the center position. makes sense if long is given a big opportunity.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

Long at center is a total unknown and wont be a known until well after the draft.
We need to draft a center in the third round.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;1139420]Long at center is a total unknown and wont be a known until well after the draft.
We need to draft a center in the third round.[/quote]

Yep.

My concern with Long at C is he didn't exactly blow people off the line at LG last year. I feel he has to step his game up to be a decent Guard.

Now, mix in that he will be learning a new position....it just seems like a lot to expect.

I'd be grabbing a Center in round 3 if it was up to me.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Bangee7;1139427]Yep.

My concern with Long at C is he didn't exactly blow people off the line at LG last year. I feel he has to step his game up to be a decent Guard.

Now, mix in that he will be learning a new position....it just seems like a lot to expect.

I'd be grabbing a Center in round 3 if it was up to me.[/quote]

Long is plenty strong, big, and mean. He has the physical tools, he was lacking on the technique.

His hands were slow and inconsistent getting into the defender.

Guards need the quickest hands on the OL.

We were one play away from him stepping in as C for a large part of 2015 when McRib was the starter.

I agree it doesn't inspire confidence because there is no history there, but I think the coaches will take a look at him at C this summer.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Bangee7;1139427]Yep.

My concern with Long at C is he didn't exactly blow people off the line at LG last year. I feel he has to step his game up to be a decent Guard.

Now, mix in that he will be learning a new position....it just seems like a lot to expect.

I'd be grabbing a Center in round 3 if it was up to me.[/quote]

Yeah I'm not against grabbing a center in the draft. I'm squarely in the camp of moving on from Kory L regardless. I'd keep my eye on A Reiter who we drafted in the 7th last year as well. That wasn't a throw away pick.

This years center class is top notch. I'd grab one, but I'd put my money on the one we pick have versatility to play guard as well.

I'd thought keim point to say left guard position is wide open is interesting.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

Someone posted SM likes to draft an OL every year as depth and potential...future.
HE is my hero......

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;1139420]Long at center is a total unknown and wont be a known until well after the draft.
We need to draft a center in the third round.[/quote]

Exactly. Third round = HOFer.

Wait what?

I agree with the first part of your statement but idc which round he is drafted in, as long as McC thinks the guy is good.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1139306]RGIII has nothing to do with any of this.[/QUOTE]


Hasnt been part of the equation for a country year now....

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1139433]Exactly. Third round = HOFer.



Wait what?



I agree with the first part of your statement but idc which round he is drafted in, as long as McC thinks the guy is good.[/QUOTE]


Yes ... But ...we need need need to go D heavy. So maybe the first couple rounds should be on lockdown as far as offense. We need secondary and DL/edge rusher / mlb sooooo bad.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=punch it in;1139464]Yes ... But ...we need need need to go D heavy. So maybe the first couple rounds should be on lockdown as far as offense. We need secondary and DL/edge rusher / mlb sooooo bad.[/quote]

Is Martrell Spaight better any ILB that we could take in the . . . round? Certainly not the ILB available in the 1st, but is he better than any 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round ILB?

We might be situated better at ILB than we realize. McLovin and the coaches know what we have at for sure, we are just guessing.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

Spaight is not the answer imo and this draft is loaded on the defensive side. I would imagine that there is a better option in the first few rounds but yes Mclovin will figure it out.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=punch it in;1139464]Yes ... But ...we need need need to go D heavy. So maybe the first couple rounds should be on lockdown as far as offense. We need secondary and DL/edge rusher / mlb sooooo bad.[/quote]

Every team has needs. I'm all about BPA. When Jordan Reed was drafted everyone was like why waste a pick on another TE? Look at him now. Even the SB Champs have needs. For me a win is when you have a need that also coincides with the BPA. But I'd rather take BPA over reaching to fill a need any day of the week.

Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1139468]Every team has needs. I'm all about BPA. When Jordan Reed was drafted everyone was like why waste a pick on another TE? Look at him now. Even the SB Champs have needs. For me a win is when you have a need that also coincides with the BPA. But I'd rather take BPA over reaching to fill a need any day of the week.[/QUOTE]


Totally agree. I will say that when Jordan Reed was drafted we had more needs than a thirsty dog in a desert though. At this point we have the luxury to reach a wee bit further to acquire a need. Im of the firm belief that it is always a happy marriage of need mixed with bpa for any pick in any round. So if say our pick rolls around and there is a stud wr and there is a damn good ilb or dl pick go with the need. We NEED a defense.
I just think that our offense is good enough to go places. Our Defensive talent is what is holding us back. From what i hear we are keeping Garcon n Jackson. I would like very much to see us acquire a center and a rb at some point though.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=punch it in;1139469]Totally agree. I will say that when Jordan Reed was drafted we had more needs than a thirsty dog in a desert though. At this point we have the luxury to reach a wee bit further to acquire a need. Im of the firm belief that it is always a happy marriage of need mixed with bpa for any pick in any round. So if say our pick rolls around and there is a stud wr and there is a damn good ilb or dl pick go with the need. We NEED a defense.[/quote]

What positions (besides special teams) would you pass on a stud that stands heads above other available picks?

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[QUOTE=DYoungJelly;1139470]What positions (besides special teams) would you pass on a stud that stands heads above other available picks?[/QUOTE]


Well I just said that if there was a stud wr available at the same point there was a damn good ilb or dline pick available i would go with the damn good pick. I think our team is capable of taking the next step only if we improve our D. After 25 years Im ready to win.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

We have what the 21st pick in the draft? I dont think there will be any studs that stand heads and shoulders above everybody else at that point. Secure the D at all costs. Center position is the only true real life or death move we need to make this year on offense.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

[quote=punch it in;1139472]We have what the 21st pick in the draft? I dont think there will be any studs that stand heads and shoulders above everybody else at that point. Secure the D at all costs. Center position is the only true real life or death move we need to make this year on offense.[/quote]

Cam Chancellor and Richard Sherman, Russell Wilson were late round picks.

I consider those three guys studs. They are among the best in the league at their positions. (I didn't think Wilson was until this year TBH)

This year won't be different than every other year. There will be studs drafted in every round.

Drafting for need means the team picking after us can get a better football player than we just got. Over time, giving teams picking after us the opportunity to draft better players than we are drafting year in and year out isn't a good long term strategy.

McLovin likes good football players (to the extent his interviews are becoming a little aggravating and repetitive.) He wants the BPA and will worry about where to put them later. He has a track record. I'm all in.

And for those saying he didn't draft BPA in the last draft, his 1st pick played all but one snap this year, and the guy everyone thought he should have taken, while incredibly talented, came into camp out of shape.

I agree that our defense needs urgent attention in all units but I disagree that we should draft lesser players just because they fill a certain position.

All things being equal, make a shopping list and pick the ingredients but rarely are players dead even in an evaluation.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

Totally understood but we still go into every draft assuming the studs are drafted rounds 1-3. Hey i hope like hell we hit on every round! Httr.

Re: Better days ahead. (Off season part 1 thread)
 

I think BPA is great, as long as the people assessing the players are talented and Scott McL and team have proven they are.


Slight change of topics...
I think improving ILB play is a key to stopping the run/improving the defense overall.

I saw Liz Clarke (WP) noted that the 'Skins FO isn't high on moving T Murphy to DE, but mentioned the possibility of moving him to ILB. That seems interesting to me & I'd like to see how that could play out.