Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Nice clips, French. I think I posted similar comment in this thread a while ago - the more I look into Wentz, the more I feel like he is the best option for us after failing to get Wilson. In some ways, I'm actually happy that there isn't much of hype with Wentz on the team like there was with Fitzpatrick last year.

I have a feeling we will finally get to see how Turner wants the offense to play this year due to Wentz's abilities. I still have some doubts about him but I know he was in a challenging place in the last 2 years.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1314088]Nice cut ups French, if you notice you can see his WRs did not get much separation.. Those throws are some tough ones to make for any qb[/quote]

Yeah I was surprised by this, I think part of it is scheme, a lot of deep routes/long developing plays, but with Hilton, Campbell and Doyle I was expecting more open guys downfield... it's not like Wentz was missing wide open guys for sure...

It actually made me think Turner may be doing a better job at scheming guys open that what most of us think (including myself).

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=EdmundDorf;1314086]I think it was the owner that had the knee jerk reaction, also had something to do with Wentz not getting the Vaccine I think. The stories coming out afterwards reek of the PR team trying to justify the move t protect he owner and the over inflated reputation of the Indy FO. The press seem to love them. Reich (the Indy HC) contacted Ron after the trade to talk up Carson which speaks volumes to me.

As for the Eagles, they canned their SB winning head coach only weeks after trading Wentz, so there was obviously some internal strife between the FO and Coaching staff which may well have had a significant effect on the players as a whole, especially Wentz if the FO was pushing for Hurts to be played. Only the year before Wentz single handedly took them to the playoffs with absolutely no help on offense.

Bottom line is he is a "Commander" now so [B]I personally am choosing to be up beat about him as there is no benefit to being negative when I cannot change the situation[/B].[/quote]

I think that's a fair way to look at it. I try to be cautiously enthusiastic and objectively optimistic, but so far I really feel like a lot of the bad press on Wentz was some propaganda by the Colts + people loving to overreact (one way or the other) on NFL QBs. These guys are either the next GOAT or the worst bust ever...

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1314091]Yeah I was surprised by this, I think part of it is scheme, a lot of deep routes/long developing plays, but with Hilton, Campbell and Doyle I was expecting more open guys downfield... it's not like Wentz was missing wide open guys for sure...

It actually made me think Turner may be doing a better job at scheming guys open that what most of us think (including myself).[/quote]

I agree with that, lets see what Turner can do now

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Nice work French. ... One game or even a handful of plays doesn't tell the entire body of work. I will stand by that this probably won't work out because I think Wentz is damaged goods. Yeah he is an upgrade over TH but his DNA as a QB will be too tough to rein in. The boom plays are great for highlights, he'll bring back some big plays to the offense, but the bust plays he seems to have are game killers.

Remember this is a 50% passer minus screen plays. 30th in the NFL.

I stand by that Ron needs to draft a back up plan and add quality depth to the position via the draft.

If it works out w/ Wentz then great, you still have TH and a drafted player that's in your system. If it doesn't work you have a guy who may be your starter in 2023 already in place w/ a year of being a back-up.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1314092]I think that's a fair way to look at it. I try to be cautiously enthusiastic and objectively optimistic, but so far I really feel like a lot of the bad press on Wentz was some propaganda by the Colts + people loving to overreact (one way or the other) on NFL QBs. These guys are either the next GOAT or the worst bust ever...[/quote]

I would agree with you about the Colts if this was his first team, but it's not. This is now two teams that have kicked him to the curb.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1312185]This is about the best reaction I can muster up

[IMG]https://c.tenor.com/Zy1i2sM1hpwAAAAC/larry-david-unsure.gif[/IMG][/quote]


Same.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[URL="https://www.nfl.com/news/frank-reich-unfair-to-make-carson-wentz-the-scapegoat-for-colts-disappointing-se"]https://www.nfl.com/news/frank-reich-unfair-to-make-carson-wentz-the-scapegoat-for-colts-disappointing-se[/URL]

"I love Carson. He's a brother to me. I'll always love him, always pull for him," Reich said. "I know he's going to succeed. I believe a lot in him."

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1314120]Nice work French. ... [B]One game or even a handful of plays doesn't tell the entire body of work[/B]. I will stand by that this probably won't work out because I think Wentz is damaged goods. Yeah he is an upgrade over TH but his DNA as a QB will be too tough to rein in. The boom plays are great for highlights, he'll bring back some big plays to the offense, but the bust plays he seems to have are game killers.

Remember this is a 50% passer minus screen plays. 30th in the NFL.

I stand by that Ron needs to draft a back up plan and add quality depth to the position via the draft.

If it works out w/ Wentz then great, you still have TH and a drafted player that's in your system. If it doesn't work you have a guy who may be your starter in 2023 already in place w/ a year of being a back-up.[/quote]

You're absolutely right. And there's no arguing the concerns about his on field performances and intangible issues are legit. But I still think it's quite telling about the overblowing of this whole narrative, that even this supposedly cut inducing awful final game didn't actually look nearly as bad as advertised.
I'll probably go through a couple more games before September, but that's now 2 games, including the supposedly worst one, where I didn't see anything that [I]really concerned[/I] me.

We'll see...

In any case, I wouldn't be opposed to drafting a QB is there's somebody they really like though.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[B]“In having conversations with trusted veterans on the team, when you speak to them in confidence, oftentimes they share really, what’s happening,” Irsay said. “What I found out was very concerning[/B].

“You search for the right chemistry with any team. In football, it’s as important as any sport that there is. If that chemistry is off, if it isn’t there, it can be extremely detrimental and lower performance to a degree that is stunning and shocking.”

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/sports/colts-owner-jim-irsay-blasts-233000036.html[/url]

Irsay publicly saying what players allegedly told him "in confidence".

Seems like a meddlesome owner.

This is just so unnecessary and pointless.

Bash a player not on your team anymore .. what does he get out of it? How did this better the Colts organization in any way?

As an owner you dont give out direct quotes of players on other teams. The reports were already out he didnt like him and didnt think he fit the team.

But to put your name on it and say it out loud to be quoted and reported?

low brow

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Irsay is acting like Wentz made a GI Jane joke about his wife or something... it's become obvious this was primarily an owner driven decision.

Blaming Wentz for the loss to Jax is pretty lame. The Colts D got carved up in that one.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

He is just trying to justify the decision, the harder he tries the more desperate he seems, his head coach did not agree and if they don't get into the playoffs with Matt Ryan it is going to get uncomfortable inside that building

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1314363]Irsay is acting like Wentz made a GI Jane joke about his wife or something... it's become obvious this was primarily an owner driven decision.

Blaming Wentz for the loss to Jax is pretty lame. The Colts D got carved up in that one.[/quote]

I honestly think Irsay's view is skewed by the talent he's become accustomed to at the QB position. When you have 20 years straight of Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck, followed by a still-solid Phillip Rivers, it's easy to see how you could have very high expectations for a QB to put a team on his back and get it done in the clutch.

The team got to the point where it needed Carson to deliver and he vomited all over the field.

But boiling down a 27-7 season to a few moments in the clutch at the end runs the risk of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. When you step back and look at it, Carson's 2021 season had a lot of good, and there was some bad. But I don't think he's going to find it to be any better with Matt Ryan. If anything, it'll be worse because Ryan's a statue.

Irsay viewed Carson as trash compared to what he has enjoyed for so long. Reality is he was 'fine' last year. Fine to one man might be trash, here Fine is like solid gold. We haven't had Fine since Cousins.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

People need to remember if Irsay owned Washington he would be considered the worst owner in sports.

His attitude towards players and off the field BS are the stuff Dan Snyder can only dream of. This is just par for the course what do you say to the man who ridiculed Peyton Manning for only winning one Super Bowl. He is just hard to take seriously.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1314363]Irsay is acting like Wentz made a GI Jane joke about his wife or something... it's become obvious this was primarily an owner driven decision.

Blaming Wentz for the loss to Jax is pretty lame. The Colts D got carved up in that one.[/quote]

Irsay aside...these quotes remind me of what was said when RGIII had "lost it"

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=Redskins247;1314371]Irsay aside...these quotes remind me of what was said when RGIII had "lost it"[/quote]

disagree.

RGIII came in thinking the NFL was easy mode and that he had already made it (and for a year it looked like that might be true). He had an injury history, he got hurt (and maybe didn't put in the study time/people got NFL tape on him) and things fell apart, but there was also his dad being way to involved and some other things.

This just seems like the owner scapegoating a bad season to seem like he's part of the solution and not the cause. (Not that I think Wentz is super amazing, but, for us, he should be a noticeable upgrade).

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1314363]Irsay is acting like Wentz made a GI Jane joke about his wife or something... it's become obvious this was primarily an owner driven decision.

Blaming Wentz for the loss to Jax is pretty lame. The Colts D got carved up in that one.[/quote]

It wasn't just the Jacksonville game. It was over the course of the entire season. If you watched Hard Knocks the vibe seemed to be that they were waiting for Wentz to do more. They were waiting for him to take over a game.

They beat the Pats 27-17 and Wentz went 5-12 w/ an int. How do you complete 5 passes in an NFL game? He had some other games where he wasn't getting close to 200 yards. If Taylor was shut down Wentz didn't seem like he was good enough to carry the team.

Irsay is an a-hole for coming out and saying what he said, but it's not like there isn't any truth to it.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

The Colts' offensive line was terrible when it came to pass-blocking, and had injuries to begin the season on top of that. It's hard for a QB to take over a game when he's running for his life behind the 30th ranked offensive line. Run-blocking was their strength. There's a reason J Taylor led the league in carries. And when they couldn't run the ball - yeah they struggled. But you can't put it all on Carson. This narrative that Carson was holding that team back is just incorrect. It's easy to just look at the QB and his stats and put the blame on him, but if you do that, you're not looking at the whole picture.

To put it in perspective, Washington had the 6th best offensive line and excelled in pass-blocking (even with the injuries). The result: Heinicke had less pass attempts than Carson, was sacked MORE than Carson, had twice as many interceptions, and 25% less TDs.

I think you'll see better results with Carson behind a line that can actually pass block AND run the ball - as is the case with most NFL QBs.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1314463]It wasn't just the Jacksonville game. It was over the course of the entire season. [B]If you watched Hard Knocks the vibe [/B]seemed to be that they were waiting for Wentz to do more. They were waiting for him to take over a game.

They beat the Pats 27-17 and Wentz went 5-12 w/ an int. How do you complete 5 passes in an NFL game? He had some other games where he wasn't getting close to 200 yards. If Taylor was shut down Wentz didn't seem like he was good enough to carry the team.

Irsay is an a-hole for coming out and saying what he said, but it's not like there isn't any truth to it.[/quote]

I watched it, Wentz got it done against AZ.

The one vibe i picked up was Irsay is a whack job, every time he talked in the locker room it was so cringe, it was like "ok everyone our rich drunk uncle is going to talk everyone pretend to smile and act like you care remember he paid for the party".

When he started the sing along to we are the champions; so so so cringe; i was turning red watching it.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=mredskins;1314470]I watched it, Wentz got it done against AZ.

The one vibe i picked up was Irsay is a whack job, every time he talked in the locker room it was so cringe, it was like "ok everyone our rich drunk uncle is going to talk everyone pretend to smile and act like you care remember he paid for the party".

When he started the sing along to we are the champions; so so so cringe; i was turning red watching it.[/quote]

Yeah the vibe around Irsay is definitely weird. Not sure if being a pill addict plays into it or not but I get the sense he's kinda like a mini-Dan in that he wants to be friends with the players and vibe on their level and they just tolerate him because he signs the checks.

Either way this whole thing reeks of him not liking Wentz and that's why they got rid of him.

I don't feel so bad about the draft picks now because the league is so desperate for half-decent qb's now that I'm sure he had another bidder. The price we paid is miniscule compared to what some of these other teams paid.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

We got a legit starting QB for WAY cheaper than some teams have paid for their #1 WR.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[url]https://twitter.com/billbarnwell/status/1515025738629623810?s=21&t=CausF6Yv3WSCZu1oM5KL4Q[/url]

The QB1 is Wentz
QB2 is Josh Allen


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1315041][url]https://twitter.com/billbarnwell/status/1515025738629623810?s=21&t=CausF6Yv3WSCZu1oM5KL4Q[/url]

The QB1 is Wentz
QB2 is Josh Allen


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

Jim irsay “but he didn’t get the vaccine”

Dude, Carson is gonna surprise people here. First guy since Cousins who can effectively push the ball down field.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

I think Wentz will be okay .. at least the Snyder drama will take the heat of him a bit ..

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=Chico23231;1315043]Jim irsay “but he didn’t get the vaccine”

Dude, Carson is gonna surprise people here. First guy since Cousins who can effectively push the ball down field.[/quote]

Agree, he will throw some bad picks here and there but he will also throw some insane dimes also. At the very least he'll be fun to watch.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

2/3 love it, 1/3 ok with it. The price was right, he doesn't throw picks, and he's in Ron's Bible Study [I]Inner Circle[/I].

That reminds me, anyone looking for a new Prayer Chamber and/or Cry Box? I can build both

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[URL="https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/commanders/carson-wentz-responds-jim-irsay-saying-colts-trade-him-was-mistake?cid=sm_npd_rsn_dc_twt_mn"]Wentz responds to Irsay saying Colts’ trade for him was a mistake[/URL]

Thought he handled this quite well, still seems odd to me that the Colts can't shut up about this already

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1316769][URL="https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/commanders/carson-wentz-responds-jim-irsay-saying-colts-trade-him-was-mistake?cid=sm_npd_rsn_dc_twt_mn"]Wentz responds to Irsay saying Colts’ trade for him was a mistake[/URL]

Thought he handled this quite well, still seems odd to me that the Colts can't shut up about this already[/quote]

That dude is a tool... STHU already

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1316769][URL="https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/commanders/carson-wentz-responds-jim-irsay-saying-colts-trade-him-was-mistake?cid=sm_npd_rsn_dc_twt_mn"]Wentz responds to Irsay saying Colts’ trade for him was a mistake[/URL]

Thought he handled this quite well, still seems odd to me that the Colts can't shut up about this already[/quote]

That is what happens when you make a knee-jerk move that is questionable at best. You find yourself constantly trying to justify it. They'll be fine with Matt Ryan, but even he's probably tired of them constantly talking about it.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Ryan knows it's Bush League. Irsay needs to pop a chill pill.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1314463]It wasn't just the Jacksonville game. It was over the course of the entire season. If you watched Hard Knocks the vibe seemed to be that they were waiting for Wentz to do more. They were waiting for him to take over a game.

They beat the Pats 27-17 and Wentz went 5-12 w/ an int. How do you complete 5 passes in an NFL game? He had some other games where he wasn't getting close to 200 yards. If Taylor was shut down Wentz didn't seem like he was good enough to carry the team.

Irsay is an a-hole for coming out and saying what he said, but it's not like there isn't any truth to it.[/quote]

Irsay is trying to say Wentz was a terrible QB, and try to excuse his knee-jerk decision to get rid of him. So no, there isn't any truth to what he says because he's a Snyder-like incompetent owner. I'm pretty sure you would not believe anything Snyder would say about any player.

Wentz has A LOT to prove and knows this is his last opportunity to make something of his career. And I'm not going to drink the Kool Aid in saying that he's going to ball out or ignore potential issues that he brings.

But I also not going to believe anything that Irsay says or cherry pick bad examples of what happened last year.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Glad Carson continues to take the high road on this... Irsay just looks bad. He should drop it and move on already.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1316781]Glad Carson continues to take the high road on this... Irsay just looks bad. He should drop it and move on already.[/quote]

He's like that Ex that keeps digging and digging just to be heard.. Deep down he's not happy with Ryan over Wentz

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1316769][URL="https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/commanders/carson-wentz-responds-jim-irsay-saying-colts-trade-him-was-mistake?cid=sm_npd_rsn_dc_twt_mn"]Wentz responds to Irsay saying Colts’ trade for him was a mistake[/URL]

Thought he handled this quite well, still seems odd to me that the Colts can't shut up about this already[/quote]

Well we are dealing with Irsay a type of person who enabled his side piece death by providing a constant stream of drugs and bought her house eventually killing her. He’s inherited all of his wealth as well and never built any of it. Hunter Irsay.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Wentz will prove alot of people wrong but not me I expect him to play very well

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[URL="https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/06/06/mmqb-carson-wentz-commanders-ryan-fitzpatrick-retirement"]Carson Wentz Is Making the Most of What May Be His Last Shot[/URL]

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1317311][URL="https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/06/06/mmqb-carson-wentz-commanders-ryan-fitzpatrick-retirement"]Carson Wentz Is Making the Most of What May Be His Last Shot[/URL][/quote]

I love how the article mentions a country club in N. Va near the Potomac River. They were at Trump's spot and the article doesn't want to mention it..lol.

I have played there before Trump ran for office. The place is incredible.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1317311][URL="https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/06/06/mmqb-carson-wentz-commanders-ryan-fitzpatrick-retirement"]Carson Wentz Is Making the Most of What May Be His Last Shot[/URL][/quote]

Good article. Man, it’s kinda nice to read an article which isn’t talking about all the negative shit with the org, or the name change, etc

Wentz, with all the background noise we’ve heard, sounds like a decent person. I’m sure with all the smoke before I’m certain there is some truth there…that mistakes were made, shit who doesn’t make them in the league? It’s good too hear he is active with teammates outside of the field and building relationships early.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=MTK;1317311][URL="https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/06/06/mmqb-carson-wentz-commanders-ryan-fitzpatrick-retirement"]Carson Wentz Is Making the Most of What May Be His Last Shot[/URL][/quote]

Finally a piece of journalism that actually offers insight. Great read. Thanks for sharing.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Wentz is going to ball out