Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;547464]No, he's the "Dirty Sanchez" and after each TD he throws, he will pretend to draw a mustache as a celebration.[/quote]


EEEEEEEWWWWW!!!!



Peter Griffin just got a mustache...I know!

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

Call me crazy but I don't think that drafting Sanchez with the 13th overall pick is that bad of an idea. Best case It would push JC to preform better and if he does we have a situation like San Diego had a couple years back with Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers. If he doesn't play better we have Sanchez who would be ready to step in and play like carson plamer did with the Bengles. The one thing I don't want is for Washington to trade a bunch of picks to trade up and get him though.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Beemnseven;547465]This is exactly what I've been wondering all along. Why wouldn't the Rams take him at #2? Apart from the fact that Spagnuolo is a defensive guy who might use his first pick on defense, I can't figure out why St. Louis wouldn't begin grooming Bulger's replacement.

At least that's what I hope.[/quote]

And the Rams are switching to a West Coast Offense.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;547430]Keep in mind we've reportedly been "smitten" with draft picks out of our range in the past.

[URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/24/AR2007042402340.html"]Snyder: Redskins Are on Right Track - washingtonpost.com[/URL][/quote]

Yeah and didn't Gibbs say that they weren't willing to part with next years picks? If so there's no such control this time around.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;547472]Yeah and didn't Gibbs say that they weren't willing to part with next years picks? If so there's no such control this time around.[/quote]

And when did we come out and say we're willing to part with next years picks for Sanchez?

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

Why does a player's race or ethnic group make a difference? I thought MLK said that we shouldn't judge a person by the color of their skin but by their ability or character, or something along those lines. Who gives a damn? Put the grape ape out there and let him play. We haven't had a purple player yet.

Drafting a QB with an O-line like ours makes no sense what-so-ever! With that said, I know that DS will insist that we draft him. Welcome to the team Sanchez. Take a good look at FedEx field. If your patient, you'll have your head buried in it just like every other Washington QB. Aren't you lucky!

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Skinz4life;547468]Call me crazy but I don't think that drafting Sanchez with the 13th overall pick is that bad of an idea. Best case It would push JC to preform better and if he does we have a situation like San Diego had a couple years back with Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers. If he doesn't play better we have Sanchez who would be ready to step in and play like carson plamer did with the Bengles. The one thing I don't want is for Washington to trade a bunch of picks to trade up and get him though.[/quote]

We can't get Sanchez without trading a bunch of picks.
Imo getting Sanchez would preclude the Skins from improving our greatest areas of needs.

We can't get Sanchez [I]and[/I] improve the OL/Pass Rush/OLB.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

The only way I'd be alright with taking Sanchez is if he fell to #13, which it appears as if there is no way thats going to happen. I personally don't think we have enough picks to fill all the needs we have regardless if we trade for Sanchez or not though.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

Most seem to think Detroit is going w/Stafford, but what if they opt for J. Smith instead? Both Staff. & Sanchez would drop at least a little.


Or, what if they really shocked everybody & signed Sanchez? Would there be a scramble to trade up for Stafford? (Doesn't sound like the Skins are into him at all)

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=30gut]We can't get Sanchez without trading a bunch of picks.
Imo getting Sanchez would preclude the Skins from improving our greatest areas of needs.

We can't get Sanchez and improve the OL/Pass Rush/OLB. [/quote]

As Rich points out, if that happened, we wouldnt be in that much different of a position than every other NFL team.

[url=http://was.scout.com/2/858159.html]Scout.com: Just a Guy[/url]

[QUOTE]...And many, if not most, NFL teams will be in the same boat. You can't fill every starting position with a high draft pick or with a premium free agent. Sometimes you have to go with someone who is just a guy. Should the Redskins not land an offensive tackle that guy could be Jansen or Heyer or maybe Devin Clark, a rookie free agent who spent last year on the practice squad. Wynn, Daniels, and Chris Wilson could be the guys rotating at right DE. H. B. Blades was a guy who filled in at linebacker last year and didn't embarrass himself. Or another guy who could end up starting at the Sam linebacker is the recently-signed Robert Thomas, who has started 50 NFL games in six years in the league...

...But if it's not ideal that doesn't mean that it's a disaster. Nevertheless, Redskins Nation is likely to be fretting and wringing its collective hands on Monday morning, lamenting unfilled needs. Chances are, though, that a few guys will end up working out just fine.
[/QUOTE]

Even if we select one of OL/DE/OLB in the first round, that still leaves us with two holes. Its not like our 3rd round pick could be counted on to be an immediate starter and upgrade over the guys we have. So if your very own personal "worst case scenario" involves the skins trading picks for Sanchez, its not the end of the world. We're already a MUCH better team now than we were when the season ended. As far as i'm concerned, everything we do between now and the regular season is just icing on the cake - to make us even better. Whatever we do with our 1st round pick - OL, DL, LB, QB, RB... whatever - it will certainly be for a player who's better than the guy he's replacing on our roster.

One more random thing - i wouldnt be surprised if, a week from now, Brady Quinn is our defacto starting QB...

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547427]Reading between the lines, i think its probable that Snyder wont package our 2010 first rounder in any trade because he knows Cowher, Shanahan, Holmgreen, or Gruden will want that pick... ugh.[/quote]

Are you saying ugh to another change in general or to those specific options? I think the only legitimate option there would be Gruden. Cowher is very close to Marty-strike one. Shanahan is very close to Jerry Jones-strike two. If we're talking to Holmgren that means we just fired one of his proteges-strike three.

I'd think any move at the QB position would mean that Zorn gets at least 3 more years to develop and try to win with him. You don't draft a rookie QB and then up and fire a QB 'guru' after one season. That's just moronic, even for Snyder standards.

The more I think of it, maybe the Sanchez move is Snyder admitting we're not one player away from a championship and he wants to build from the QB position outward. In a best case scenario, if he drafts Sanchez, combined with the receivers we drafted last year, in a couple of years we could have a dynamic offense with a group of young players (Sanchez, Thomas, Kelly, Cooley, Davis) that can play together for 5-8 years at a high level a la the Colts (Manning, Harrison, Wayne, Clark). I'm not endorsing the move, just trying to think like Snyder. The other thought could be that with Haynesworth and Hall he feels we have enough of a defense to win with a rookie QB not making mistakes just like the Ravens did last year. I think he's fooling himself if he feels our D is on par with theirs but he may think that's the case.

I really hope we don't have the ammo to go get him. If we trade up for anyone I hope it's Orapko.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;547474]And when did we come out and say we're willing to part with next years picks for Sanchez?[/quote]

When did we not say we were willing to part with next years picks? hmmmmmmmm

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;547484]When did we not say we were willing to part with next years picks? hmmmmmmmm[/quote]

Well there's this

[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/04/20/draft/index.html]Mark Sanchez, Daniel Snyder, Scott Pioli pivotal in NFL draft - Peter King - SI.com[/url]

[quote]I spoke to someone close to Snyder over the weekend, and this person said Snyder is not going to allow next year's first-rounder to be put in a trade. Maybe. Maybe not. This person also said he thought it was highly unlikely the Redskins could muster up the ammo to go get Sanchez. If Snyder wants to get up to No. 3 to assure himself the shot at Sanchez, he's going to have to bend and give up the to pick in 2010.[/quote]

But the point is if we actually got every player we were rumored to be smitten with we'd have Briggs, Calvin Johnson, Ocho Cinco, Jay Cutler, Jamarcus Russell

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

We should just sign Philip Rivers next off-season and that should resolve everything

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;547485]Well there's this

[URL="http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/04/20/draft/index.html"]Mark Sanchez, Daniel Snyder, Scott Pioli pivotal in NFL draft - Peter King - SI.com[/URL]



But the point is if we actually got every player we were rumored to be smitten with we'd have Briggs, Calvin Johnson, Ocho Cinco, Jay Cutler, Jamarcus Russell[/quote]

I tip my hat to you sir. Not only have you won the argument but you've also eased my nerves.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;547487]I tip my hat to you sir. Not only have you won the argument but you've also eased my nerves.[/quote]

Of course, now we're going to trade up for Sanchez :)

Seriously though, all we can do is wait.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

Pain, those were exactly my thoughts.

I dont want a coaching change-period. I'm not going to reiterate my questions about Campbell in this system, but if the team drafted a rookie QB, it would "garauntee" Zorn got atleast 2-3 more years. Zorn is the ideal coach to groom a rookie QB and I think, aside from Campbell making a giant leap in his play this year, Zorns only shot of sticking beyond 2009 is to draft and groom his own QB. I fear if we stick with Campbell, both he and Zorn will be fired and we'll start from scratch next year. And by scratch, i mean scratch. I doubt Bugel sticks around for another regime change. The offensive coaches would all be gone if Holmgren, Gruden, or Shanahan were hired, plus those guys would all insist on their own QB. If Cowher were hired, you can kiss our entire defensive staff goodbye when we would move to a 3-4.

i like Zorn alot. He experienced alot of growing pains last year and was responsible for some piss-poor playcalling, but i have confidence that he'll get better each year. I think our teams best chance at having long term success is to stick with Zorn, let him pick his own QB, and then let him groom his own QB - as you said, build this team from the QB position outward (whether thats with sanchez or Quinn)

Our defense will be fine and our o-line, despite its age, will benefit from having Dockery and a healthy Randy Thomas back. I'm a beleiver in Stephon Heyer being solid as well. I'm 90% certain Marcus Washington is coming back, so he, Blades and Thomas can hold down SLB spot. With the DE position, weve got two solid old guys in rotation with the possibility that Buzbee and Jackson improving and getting some action. In short, if we don't draft Ol, DE, or OLB with our 1st round pick, we'll be ok - no matter whos' under center.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

The bottom line on this move is that it does not address the key deficiencies of this team (age and depth). There is absolutely no reason to run out and address the quarterback position. At least if you were going to shoot your wad for Jay Cutler you knew you were getting a supremely talented player who has proven he can play on a high level at the NFL. I would have been extremely upset by the move, but at least you had some idea of the player you were getting on the field.

With Sanchez you are getting a kid that you will have to pay $35 million guaranteed and you really don't know what you are going to get from him. You are scrapping what you had with Campbell and giving up opportunity costs by not drafting a potential starter at OL or LB or DL. It assumes that quarterback was the major reason for the Redskins second half collapse. If they are so dead-set on getting rid of Campbell, just wait until next year, let him walk, and make a move for a QB in a much more QB rich draft. That is the thing that baffles me. Sanchez isn't John Elway (or even Jay Cutler) why are you going to throw tons of draft picks and money away to get the guy? If he falls to you maybe you say you couldn't pass him up, but jumping ten spots to get him makes no sense at all.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;547442]My guess is he likes his confidence and the fact he's a more vocal leader on the field than JC.

A lot of teams are loving him right now, not just the Skins.[/quote]But if Snyder fancies himself a great talent evaluator, why does he not think he can find a QB who is just as good next year? Should be a really strong year for QBs next season.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

Anyway, you guys can count me in the "doubts this will actually get done" category since Snyder isn't just going crazy trying to sell the farm for Sanchez, and you could argue that we don't have a single position of immense need (except Center), but it's a significant handicap to build your team when "next year" is never a consideration to the guy making the calls.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547490]Pain, those were exactly my thoughts.

I dont want a coaching change-period. I'm not going to reiterate my questions about Campbell in this system, but if the team drafted a rookie QB, it would "garauntee" Zorn got atleast 2-3 more years. Zorn is the ideal coach to groom a rookie QB and I think, aside from Campbell making a giant leap in his play this year, Zorns only shot of sticking beyond 2009 is to draft and groom his own QB. I fear if we stick with Campbell, both he and Zorn will be fired and we'll start from scratch next year. And by scratch, i mean scratch. I doubt Bugel sticks around for another regime change. The offensive coaches would all be gone if Holmgren, Gruden, or Shanahan were hired, plus those guys would all insist on their own QB. If Cowher were hired, you can kiss our entire defensive staff goodbye when we would move to a 3-4.

i like Zorn alot. He experienced alot of growing pains last year and was responsible for some piss-poor playcalling, but i have confidence that he'll get better each year. I think our teams best chance at having long term success is to stick with Zorn, let him pick his own QB, and then let him groom his own QB - as you said, build this team from the QB position outward (whether thats with sanchez or Quinn)

Our defense will be fine and our o-line, despite its age, will benefit from having Dockery and a healthy Randy Thomas back. I'm a beleiver in Stephon Heyer being solid as well. I'm 90% certain Marcus Washington is coming back, so he, Blades and Thomas can hold down SLB spot. With the DE position, weve got two solid old guys in rotation with the possibility that Buzbee and Jackson improving and getting some action. In short, if we don't draft Ol, DE, or OLB with our 1st round pick, we'll be ok - no matter whos' under center.[/quote]

I don't share your optimism but I'll go along.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547490]Pain, those were exactly my thoughts.

I dont want a coaching change-period. I'm not going to reiterate my questions about Campbell in this system, but if the team drafted a rookie QB, it would "garauntee" Zorn got atleast 2-3 more years. Zorn is the ideal coach to groom a rookie QB and I think, aside from Campbell making a giant leap in his play this year, Zorns only shot of sticking beyond 2009 is to draft and groom his own QB. I fear if we stick with Campbell, both he and Zorn will be fired and we'll start from scratch next year. And by scratch, i mean scratch. I doubt Bugel sticks around for another regime change. The offensive coaches would all be gone if Holmgren, Gruden, or Shanahan were hired, plus those guys would all insist on their own QB. If Cowher were hired, you can kiss our entire defensive staff goodbye when we would move to a 3-4.

i like Zorn alot. He experienced alot of growing pains last year and was responsible for some piss-poor playcalling, but i have confidence that he'll get better each year. I think our teams best chance at having long term success is to stick with Zorn, let him pick his own QB, and then let him groom his own QB - as you said, build this team from the QB position outward (whether thats with sanchez or Quinn)

Our defense will be fine and our o-line, despite its age, will benefit from having Dockery and a healthy Randy Thomas back. I'm a beleiver in Stephon Heyer being solid as well. I'm 90% certain Marcus Washington is coming back, so he, Blades and Thomas can hold down SLB spot. With the DE position, weve got two solid old guys in rotation with the possibility that Buzbee and Jackson improving and getting some action. In short, if we don't draft Ol, DE, or OLB with our 1st round pick, we'll be ok - no matter whos' under center.[/quote]

BHA, I hear you. While you know we disagree on Campbell's potential here, we agree that with Campbell this is a make or break season and if it's break, then Zorn is going also.

I'm interested in in what scenario do you see Quinn as our starting QB on opening day? How would those trade machinations work out?

I'm also on board (surprisingly) with your assessment of a Sanchez based draft day. That would mean Washington, who hasn't gotten a sniff anywhere else, would come back as the starter at SLB, we've got players who have started for us before with Heyer and Daniels/Wynn who can man the RT and DE spots so we'd be entering the season with some youth, some age but nothing we hadn't seen before at those spots. It's far from the ideal scenario but it's not doomsday either.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547490]Pain, those were exactly my thoughts.

I dont want a coaching change-period. I'm not going to reiterate my questions about Campbell in this system, but if the team drafted a rookie QB, it would "garauntee" Zorn got atleast 2-3 more years. Zorn is the ideal coach to groom a rookie QB and I think, aside from Campbell making a giant leap in his play this year, Zorns only shot of sticking beyond 2009 is to draft and groom his own QB. I fear if we stick with Campbell, both he and Zorn will be fired and we'll start from scratch next year. And by scratch, i mean scratch. I doubt Bugel sticks around for another regime change. The offensive coaches would all be gone if Holmgren, Gruden, or Shanahan were hired, plus those guys would all insist on their own QB. If Cowher were hired, you can kiss our entire defensive staff goodbye when we would move to a 3-4.

i like Zorn alot. He experienced alot of growing pains last year and was responsible for some piss-poor playcalling, but i have confidence that he'll get better each year. I think our teams best chance at having long term success is to stick with Zorn, let him pick his own QB, and then let him groom his own QB - as you said, build this team from the QB position outward (whether thats with sanchez or Quinn)

Our defense will be fine and our o-line, despite its age, will benefit from having Dockery and a healthy Randy Thomas back. I'm a beleiver in Stephon Heyer being solid as well. I'm 90% certain Marcus Washington is coming back, so he, Blades and Thomas can hold down SLB spot. With the DE position, weve got two solid old guys in rotation with the possibility that Buzbee and Jackson improving and getting some action. In short, if we don't draft Ol, DE, or OLB with our 1st round pick, we'll be ok - no matter whos' under center.[/quote]

What has Zorn done the past two months to change your opinion of him? I thought you had said recently hiring him was a dumb move, and next offseason (presumably when he's gone) couldn't come soon enough

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547490]Pain, those were exactly my thoughts.
...
[B] In short, if we don't draft Ol, DE, or OLB with our 1st round pick, we'll be ok - no matter whos' under center[/B].[/quote]

shouldn't your post end "except Campbell"?

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

To me, this whole situation seems very simple:

Acquiring an area of need at #13 (OT, DE, or LB) allows the team to get younger and talented in any of those area. The option of trading down is there, giving us the opportunity to get more young players (i.e. a lower 1st rounder and a 2nd or 3rd rounder)

Keeping Jason Campbell for one season does two things: Allow for true continuity from last year to this year, and put everything squarely on JC's shoulder. Prevent us from losing any future draft picks. If JC does well, then well next year we can continue to build on any success from 2009.

Should Jason Campbell fail, after the 2009 season the team can do a complete overhaul. If we have another mediocre to terrible season, our #1 pick would be a high one, and we would have all of our picks. We can either pick one of the top QBs in next year's draft, or hey maybe Phillip Rivers or Big Ben won't extend with their teams (highly unlikely, but who knows) and we could go after them.

Even if the team fails with JC at the helm, our #13 pick (OT, DE, or LB) in 2009 would be an excellent pick and something we can build on (copyright Herm Edwards) if the team goes through a complete overhaul. But unfortunately the owner is not willing to take that risk, is impatient, and will mortgage the #13 and future picks on Sanchez.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547482]As Rich points out, if that happened, we wouldnt be in that much different of a position than every other NFL team.

[URL="http://was.scout.com/2/858159.html"]Scout.com: Just a Guy[/URL]



Even if we select one of OL/DE/OLB in the first round, that still leaves us with two holes. Its not like our 3rd round pick could be counted on to be an immediate starter and upgrade over the guys we have. So if your very own personal "worst case scenario" involves the skins trading picks for Sanchez, its not the end of the world. We're already a MUCH better team now than we were when the season ended. As far as i'm concerned, everything we do between now and the regular season is just icing on the cake - to make us even better. Whatever we do with our 1st round pick - OL, DL, LB, QB, RB... whatever - it will certainly be for a player who's better than the guy he's replacing on our roster.

One more random thing - i wouldnt be surprised if, a week from now, Brady Quinn is our defacto starting QB...[/quote]Well, what Tandler is saying is it's just a player if we take Sanchez...which is true, until we trade up. Then it's multiple players.

I'm also wondering what role Quinn has in all this. Perhaps if Sanchez is there at 5, the Redskins and Browns will trade, but not for the 5th pick, but with Quinn/Campbell/the 13th.

I'd much rather have Campbell in this offense than Quinn, and they do share similar weaknesses, but buying low is a far smarter approach than buying high.

Ultimately, I think the 13th overall pick is going to be a defensive player as a Redskin, and that will be that.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

I hope that Peter King's source is correct about Snyder being unwilling to move next year's 1st.

Ultimately I don't think this will end up happening for a few reasons:

There's a very good chance our offense will be significantly better in year 2 for Campbell, Zorn, and a handful of young ball-catchers. Plus the O-line will be in better shape. Snyder knows this. It's not like sticking with the current QB situation is a big roll of the dice. It's safe and prudent, and allows us to fix other holes and maintain continuity and growth with a solid QB and system.

Snyder should not go after Sanchez by shipping off multiple picks and/or players and stick with Campbell instead because regardless of the outcome of Zorn/Campbell in '09, Snyder benefits. We all know as Campbell goes, so does Zorn, and vice versa. If they flop this season, Snyder can dump them both, and will have an opportunity at the outstanding 2010 QB draft class. Not to mention the head coaches that'll be available - Holmgren, Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, Billick, etc. He would be giddy about the splash he could make.

And if Zorn and Campbell take a big step forward, Snyder looks great for being patient and allowing continuity to play it's course.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

With the Redskins, you never know when they are serious or not.

It's hard to believe they could chase Cutler as hard as they did, and then decide that because they didn't get him, they're in rebuilding all of a sudden. That's reason number one why I don't see them pulling the trigger on the trade up. If he's there at 13, he'll be a Redskin, but that seems impossible.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=sean"big hurt"taylor;540755]i'm starting to come around on drafting this guy if he's available for us at 13th. Jason could become a good quarterback in the near future but i think this kid could be our franchise quarterback for the next 10 -15 years. Everything i hear about him makes me believe that we may have to draft him if he's there. He always make the right read, takes what the defenses gives him, very accurate even on the move and he's cerebral which he is able to go through the playbook and analyze it. They even say he knows where the blitz is coming from even though that was college not the pros but can be taught by zorn. Usc also runs the west coast offense which is similar to ours per fred davis. I was favoring the linebacker rey but sanchez might need to be the answer. Before i get flack for this thread i know we need oline help as well as lb and de help but franchise quarterbacks brings championships. Guys what do you think?[/quote]

you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=skinfan007;547512]you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . [B]I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan[/B][/quote]

Oh boy. :doh:

Welcome aboard though, I'm sure you'll be welcomed by the Cult of Colt soon.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

I still think this is all a smoke screen, if Det takes an OT, and they think we want a qb, maybe they will trade with us. or even trade ahead of us, thus making sure two qbs are drafted ahead of us, and hopefully leaving an OL/DL option.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/04/20/skins-bluffing-on-sanchez-interest/]ProFootballTalk.com - ‘Skins Bluffing On Sanchez Interest?[/url]

Mike Florio plays up...er down the possibility of us getting Sanchez.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=skinfan007;547512]you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan[/quote]

So Percy Harvin in the 1st, a complimentary running back in the 2nd (which we don't have), we should have grabbed Torry Holt, an old WR or Peters (who wasn't a free agent) in free agency and we should bench Campbell in favor of Brennan. Wow.

Welcome to the board, your week here should be interesting.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule]shouldn't your post end "except Campbell"?[/quote] Lol, i suppose I deserve that, but seriously - I firmly beleive Campbell will be noticably better in 2009 than he was in 2008... I just don't beleive its likely his play will be enough of an improvement for [U]Snyder[/U] to keep Campbell - Hence all my arguments about moving on now: 1) To get compensation for Campbell; 2) to go ahead and start grooming our next (hopefully) franchise QB.


[quote=SmootSmack]What has Zorn done the past two months to change your opinion of him? I thought you had said recently hiring him was a dumb move, and next offseason (presumably when he's gone) couldn't come soon enough[/quote] I like Zorn and I like Campbell - I just dont like them [U]together[/U]. While its possible both Zorn and Campbell have success in 2009 and beyond, i dont think its likely. If you asked me to chose between the two now, i'd chose Zorn, if for no other reason than that if we fired him after 2009 and kept Campbell, Campbell would have to learn [I]another[/I] offense and start from scratch again.

We've kept the same defensive scheme in place 5 years and, with one exception, our defense has been very good for those 5 years. The way i see it, we committed to the WCO and we need to keep it here a minimum of 5 years. Lets keep the system in place and gradually adjust our personnel to suit that system over the course of that timeframe.

BHA, I hear you. While you know we disagree on Campbell's potential here, we agree that with Campbell this is a make or break season and if it's break, then Zorn is going also.

[I]I'm interested in in what scenario do you see Quinn as our starting QB on opening day? How would those trade machinations work out?[/I]

[quote=Paintrain]I'm also on board (surprisingly) with your assessment of a Sanchez based draft day. That would mean Washington, who hasn't gotten a sniff anywhere else, would come back as the starter at SLB, we've got players who have started for us before with Heyer and Daniels/Wynn who can man the RT and DE spots so we'd be entering the season with some youth, some age but nothing we hadn't seen before at those spots. It's far from the ideal scenario but it's not doomsday either. [/quote]

As soon as I read that the skins were in the midst of a 3-way trade with Denver and the Browns, i wondered if Brady Quinn was our true objective and the deal would have sent Cutler to Cleavland, Quinn to DC (Cerrato is a ND boy and loves him some Quinn), and Campbell to Denver... but all the reports indicated we wanted Cutler, so i dismissed the notion.

Then, in his column today, Peter King indicated that the Browns are just as in love with Sanchez as Snyder. I also read a report today (can't remember where) that said the Skins have a tentative deal in place with Browns for a trade if Sanchez falls to Cleavlands spot. Given that Cleavland (evidently) prefers Sanchez and Anderson to Quinn (why are they even looking at Sanchez when they have those two?), it made sense to me that we would be trading for QUINN, after Cleavland selected Sanchez. So, I think its entirely possible that a senario similar to this could happen:

Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards to Washington for our #13 and Fred Davis (and probably another player)

This would also explain why:
1. The Browns are looking at QBs when they just drafted one in the 1st round. (New coach wants to pick his own guy)
2. There were rumors of Cooley being traded to Cleveland (right position, wrong player)
3. The Browns have yet to trade Edwards. (Our deals better)

In the end, the Browns would get rid of two players they dont really want while picking up a 1st rounder and a starter, and we'd get the "franchise" QB and "stud" WR covetted by Snyder for so long, while only giving up our 2009 1st rounder and a starting caliber TE who is stuck behind a pro-bowler. We'd probably have to give up something else (possibly Santana Moss, ARE, or D. Thomas), but in the end, both sides would get what they covet, without having to give up anything they really wanted.

Again, thats all pure speculation, but its just a possibility that occurred to me after reading Kings article today.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;547506]To me, this whole situation seems very simple:

Acquiring an area of need at #13 (OT, DE, or LB) allows the team to get younger and talented in any of those area. The option of trading down is there, giving us the opportunity to get more young players (i.e. a lower 1st rounder and a 2nd or 3rd rounder)

Keeping Jason Campbell for one season does two things: Allow for true continuity from last year to this year, and put everything squarely on JC's shoulder. Prevent us from losing any future draft picks. If JC does well, then well next year we can continue to build on any success from 2009.

Should Jason Campbell fail, after the 2009 season the team can do a complete overhaul. If we have another mediocre to terrible season, our #1 pick would be a high one, and we would have all of our picks. We can either pick one of the top QBs in next year's draft, or hey maybe Phillip Rivers or Big Ben won't extend with their teams (highly unlikely, but who knows) and we could go after them.

Even if the team fails with JC at the helm, our #13 pick (OT, DE, or LB) in 2009 would be an excellent pick and something we can build on (copyright Herm Edwards) if the team goes through a complete overhaul. But unfortunately the owner is not willing to take that risk, is impatient, and will mortgage the #13 and future picks on Sanchez.[/quote]

I hear what your saying, and those would be the positives to look at in a "worst case scenario" situation but the thought of starting over from scratch next year makes me sick. I mean, whens the last time this team has benefited from starting over from scratch?

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;547508]Well, what Tandler is saying is it's just a player if we take Sanchez...which is true, until we trade up. Then it's multiple players.

I'm also wondering what role Quinn has in all this. Perhaps if Sanchez is there at 5, the Redskins and Browns will trade, but not for the 5th pick, but with Quinn/Campbell/the 13th.

I'd much rather have Campbell in this offense than Quinn, and they do share similar weaknesses, but buying low is a far smarter approach than buying high.

Ultimately, I think the 13th overall pick is going to be a defensive player as a Redskin, and that will be that.[/quote]

To be honest, i don't like Quinn at all - atleast not for this team. I just see him as a younger Jason Campbell in terms of skills, but without JCs class. To me, hed be nothing more than a shiny new toy for Snyder, without atleast having the potential and "it" factor that Sanchez would bring.

As to your last point, id love to land Maybin. I think if we stayed at 13, the smartest move would be to take the best DE available, and that could be him. IMO the best way to receive dividends from the enormous investment we made in Haynesworth is to put a pass-rushing beast alongside him. I'd be fine with one of the big 4 OTs at 13, but I would be extremely disappointed if we took a LB there. If we bring Washington back and use a lateround pick on an OLB, our LB corps will be fine for 2009.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;547523]As soon as I read that the skins were in the midst of a 3-way trade with Denver and the Browns, i wondered if Brady Quinn was our true objective and the deal would have sent Cutler to Cleavland, Quinn to DC (Cerrato is a ND boy and loves him some Quinn), and Campbell to Denver... but all the reports indicated we wanted Cutler, so i dismissed the notion.

Then, in his column today, Peter King indicated that the Browns are just as in love with Sanchez as Snyder. I also read a report today (can't remember where) that said the Skins have a tentative deal in place with Browns for a trade if Sanchez falls to Cleveland's spot. Given that Cleavland (evidently) prefers Sanchez and Anderson to Quinn (why are they even looking at Sanchez when they have those two?), it made sense to me that we would be trading for QUINN, after Cleavland selected Sanchez. So, I think its entirely possible that a scenario similar to this could happen:

Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards to Washington for our #13 and Fred Davis (and probably another player)

This would also explain why:
1. The Browns are looking at QBs when they just drafted one in the 1st round. (New coach wants to pick his own guy)
2. There were rumors of Cooley being traded to Cleveland (right position, wrong player)
3. The Browns have yet to trade Edwards. (Our deals better)

In the end, the Browns would get rid of two players they dont really want while picking up a 1st rounder and a starter, and we'd get the "franchise" QB and "stud" WR coveted by Snyder for so long, while only giving up our 2009 1st rounder and a starting caliber TE who is stuck behind a pro-bowler. We'd probably have to give up something else (possibly Santana Moss, ARE, or D. Thomas), but in the end, both sides would get what they covet, without having to give up anything they really wanted.

Again, that's all pure speculation, but its just a possibility that occurred to me after reading Kings article today.[/quote]

It's an interesting premise. It would accomplish a couple of Snyder's long term 'goals'. I think it may be too many moving parts for it to come to fruition but it's interesting nonetheless.

Does anyone miss the relative calm of last offseason when we were just talking about a protracted coaching search, a new unproven head coach, the retirement of an organizational icon and an unprecedented number of draft picks? Ah the good old days! :)

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

BHA, guess I misremembered. I thought you had said you didn't like the hiring of Zorn earlier this year

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

I have no idea how Sanchez has "it" while Quinn and Campbell don't. Seems like an easy way to draw a line between the two with no other good reason to do so.

I agree that Quinn and Campbell are very similar in most respects. One of those respects is that they seem to be stronger players than Sanchez, based at least on the law of averages.

Re: Mark Sanchez at 13th?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;547534]I have no idea how Sanchez has "it" while Quinn and Campbell don't. Seems like an easy way to draw a line between the two with no other good reason to do so.

I agree that Quinn and Campbell are very similar in most respects. One of those respects is that they seem to be stronger players than Sanchez, based at least on the law of averages.[/quote]

I don't know why Collins doesn't have "it"? He's done something that none of these guys have; he's taken us to the play-offs. Of course that doesn't mean anything if you've a lot of money and spend it like a kid in the candy store.

What do I know? I'm just a fan.