Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=MTK;1187787]Tops in the league in 2016 as far as pass yards in the air...

[url]https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-cousins-went-deep-more-successfully-in-2016[/url]

Hard to blame him much for 2017 with no real deep threats.[/quote]


From watching the games in 2016 pretty sure a lot of those air yards went to D-Jax, losing him had quite an affect.

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1187783]The smear campaign has begun[/QUOTE]I agree though and we all even brought this up during games where he would just eat a sack instead of trying to make a play, also there were reports during the season of his WRs not liking to play with Kirk, maybe the guy is really a douche behind closed doors we don't know

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Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1187791]I agree though and we all even brought this up during games where he would just eat a sack instead of trying to make a play, also there were reports during the season of his WRs not liking to play with Kirk, maybe the guy is really a douche behind closed doors we don't know

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk[/quote]

Never heard Garcon say that .

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1187791]I agree though and we all even brought this up during games where he would just eat a sack instead of trying to make a play, also there were reports during the season of his WRs not liking to play with Kirk, maybe the guy is really a douche behind closed doors we don't know

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]Maybe he's a douche, we don't know... but I don't care.

And neither should his receivers when the ball gets to their hands in games.

Too many dropped balls this season for any Redskins WRs to have the right to voice an opinion about the person throwing the said balls.

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Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[IMG]https://clutchpoints.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/alex-smith-1.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://www.mercurynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/raiders-redskins-football-4.jpg?w=620[/IMG]

Touchdown Skins! Looking forward to about 25-30 of these next season.

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1187793]Maybe he's a douche, we don't know... but I don't care.

And neither should his receivers when the ball gets to their hands in games.

Too many dropped balls this season for any Redskins WRs to have the right to voice an opinion about the person throwing the said balls.

Envoyé de mon SM-J320FN en utilisant Tapatalk[/quote]

Zing!
I agree with you. I am not sure why some are reporting rumor and bashing Cousins to try and make themselves feel better about the trade for Smith.
It is a business. If the Redskins and Cousins could not make a deal, that is a business decisions that did not work on both sides. Let it go. It is over.
After the petulant child that was RGIII, Cousins overall was a good guy. By comparison it was not all bad.
Who could forget this:
[URL="https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/kirk-cousins-redskins-dominate-eagles-win-nfc-east-8-things-to-know/"]https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/kirk-cousins-redskins-dominate-eagles-win-nfc-east-8-things-to-know/[/URL]
"He’s just the fifth Redskins quarterback in franchise history to throw for 25 touchdown passes (joining Sonny Jurgensen, Joe Theismann, Sammy Baugh and Mark Rypien) and he’s probably playing Jay Gruden into some money as well. Considered one of the favorites to get canned before the season, Gruden’s in line for a big raise in Washington after winning the Skins a division title. "
Gruden should thank Cousins.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

Serious question: How many of you do you think Alex Smith is going to keep getting better as he gets older? 2017 was the first year he's accounted for more than 25 td's (27 total). Before that it was 20, 22, 19, and 24. As compared to 31, 29, and 34 for KC in the last 3 years.

It seems to me we are getting a guy who won't make nearly as many mistakes, but also won't account for nearly as many td's either. And Brady aside, most qb's don't get better as they pass their mid 30's. I'm hoping we get a solid 3 year run out of him, and hopefully by then we will have figured out how to find and keep a young qb who is good enough to lead this team deep in the playoffs.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

I believe this is a bridge step. I think Bruce wants to draft the Richmond kid or possibly Rudolph, then let him as an understudy. Our version of trying to create a Jimmy G.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=diehardskin2982;1187806]I believe this is a bridge step. I think Bruce wants to draft the Richmond kid or possibly Rudolph, then let him as an understudy. Our version of trying to create a Jimmy G.[/quote]I agree that the FO should draft a developmental QB, I've been saying it for awhile.

But, you seemed specific about which QBs...do you have some special insight into what Bruce wants or are those just the QBs that you like?

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=mooby;1187802]Serious question: How many of you do you think Alex Smith is going to keep getting better as he gets older? 2017 was the first year he's accounted for more than 25 td's (27 total). Before that it was 20, 22, 19, and 24. As compared to 31, 29, and 34 for KC in the last 3 years.

It seems to me we are getting a guy who won't make nearly as many mistakes, but also won't account for nearly as many td's either. And Brady aside, most qb's don't get better as they pass their mid 30's. I'm hoping we get a solid 3 year run out of him, and hopefully by then we will have figured out how to find and keep a young qb who is good enough to lead this team deep in the playoffs.[/quote]

I don't think he needs to get better. If he can replicate this years production the next 3 years and we do well in FA/draft this team can be very good in 2019/2020.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=diehardskin2982;1187806][B]I believe this is a bridge step.[/B] I think Bruce wants to draft the Richmond kid or possibly Rudolph, then let him as an understudy. Our version of trying to create a Jimmy G.[/quote]

So do I. That's why I wouldn't be surprised if the Skins draft a QB high. Don't get confused - not draft a high QB but draft a QB high.

This post should have come with a corny Manziel joke warning.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=30gut;1187807]I agree that the FO should draft a developmental QB, I've been saying it for awhile.

But, you seemed specific about which QBs...do you have some [B]special insight into what Bruce wants [/B]or are those just the QBs that you like?[/quote]

Bruce graduated from Richmond. Isn't that reason enough for him? I'm not [U]too[/U] biased against Smithers, am I?

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

I just read an article stating that the team is considering tagging Cousins to get something for him in trade. I don’t know how you all feel, but I feel that is just ignorant. Move on people!

[url]http://es.pn/2nGsvEU[/url]


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Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1187802]Serious question: How many of you do you think Alex Smith is going to keep getting better as he gets older? 2017 was the first year he's accounted for more than 25 td's (27 total). Before that it was 20, 22, 19, and 24. As compared to 31, 29, and 34 for KC in the last 3 years.

It seems to me we are getting a guy who won't make nearly as many mistakes, but also won't account for nearly as many td's either. And Brady aside, most qb's don't get better as they pass their mid 30's. I'm hoping we get a solid 3 year run out of him, and hopefully by then we will have figured out how to find and keep a young qb who is good enough to lead this team deep in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]Again stats don't lie but they aren't everything all the time. Smith has always ranked in the top on 3rd downs and completion %. He's also super smart with the football and will throw it away instead of eating up sacks.

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Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[QUOTE=Skinzorz;1187816]I just read an article stating that the team is considering tagging Cousins to get something for him in trade. I don’t know how you all feel, but I feel that is just ignorant. Move on people!

[url]http://es.pn/2nGsvEU[/url]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]If they do they better have a trade partner ready to sign even before they tag Kirk.
If someone is ready to give picks AND a contract that Kirk accepts, fine, but I don't want them to take any risk with it.

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Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

Imagine the Giants saying that they’d do a deal since Eli is at the end of his shelf life, letting the Redskins tag Cousins and then pull out of the deal. That would put a nice dent in a division rival.

I really hope the rumor is unsubstantiated.


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Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

The trade for me has nothing to do w/ Smith really. He's a good QB, nothing more, nothing less. It's more about Fuller and the 3rd rounder. The Redskins had Fuller ranked as a 1st rounder and he slipped cause of the injury. He started to show that 1st round talent last year. So in reality, the Redskins gave up a 1st rounder, the 3rd rounder and paid a 34 year old a ton of money to make up for their screw up w/ failed negotiations w/ Cousins. Should have locked him up after 2015, that is a lack of "forward thinking" as Schneed put it. It's just another loser trade for the Redskins. They panicked cause they needed to have a starting caliber QB going into FA. If they are somehow able to recoup a draft pick for Cousins then that somewhat makes up for it, but there is no guarantee that player will be as good as Fuller is going to be. We'll see...

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1187785]Well Gruden pretty much called Cousins out on not taking enough shots down field.

I think when Cousins first came here, he was way more of a risk taker. In the end it got him benched. So I think there is some truth to what Salisbury is saying.[/quote]

I have not found the statistics for 2014 when KC was benched, but Gruden does want risk takers at QB. Over the last two years AS is slightly less aggressive of a passer than KC.
In 2017 KC was middle of the road while AS was right at the bottom, but in 2016 AS threw 16% of his passes into tight coverage compared to KC 14%.

There are other variables at play such as the receiver's ability to separate from the defender.

[url]https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#aggressiveness[/url]

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

Definitely a fine line between being a risk taker and being aggressive. Early on KC was definitely a risk taker but he cleaned that up.

It will be interesting to see if Smith keeps it up this year with taking the downfield shots.

Gruden definitely doesn’t want a risk taking QB, but he does like a QB that will take shots.

He took some jabs at Cousins this year for not trusting his receivers more.

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=MTK;1187985]Definitely a fine line between being a risk taker and being aggressive. Early on KC was definitely a risk taker but he cleaned that up.

It will be interesting to see if Smith keeps it up this year with taking the downfield shots.

Gruden definitely doesn’t want a risk taking QB, but he does like a QB that will take shots.

He took some jabs at Cousins this year for not trusting his receivers more.[/quote]

I cant blame Kirk when you have guys dropping balls left and right

Re: Redskins Trade for Alex Smith
 

[QUOTE=skinsfaninok;1187986]I cant blame Kirk when you have guys dropping balls left and right[/QUOTE]Yeah, but part of the criticism was that he wouldn't take the shots down field in practice even. That is where he could have been developing the skills, timing, and trust of/with such an inexperienced receiver corps. I'm not saying it definitely would have fixed their issues, but you certainly can't improve if you don't get the reps in practice.

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Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

So, who's buying the first Alex Smith jersey?

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=metalskins;1187997]So, who's buying the first Alex Smith jersey?[/quote]

I dont get jerseys anymore, I was at the skins shop the game against Dallas, the wife wanted to get me a Cousins Salute to service and I said nah, and I AM GLAD i DIDN'T

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=metalskins;1187997]So, who's buying the first Alex Smith jersey?[/quote]

His mom.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1188000]I dont get jerseys anymore, I was at the skins shop the game against Dallas, the wife wanted to get me a Cousins Salute to service and I said nah, and I AM GLAD i DIDN'T[/quote]

I only get jerseys of retired Redskins. My wife got me an RGIII jersey in his rookie year, and after that, I quickly learned why NEVER to buy jerseys for current players unless we're talking about Ryan Kerrigan.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=jamf;1188003]His mom.[/quote]

That's debatable lol!

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[url=http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/02/cleveland_browns_what_happened.html]Cleveland Browns: What happened with Alex Smith? -- Terry Pluto | cleveland.com[/url]

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1188012][url=http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/02/cleveland_browns_what_happened.html]Cleveland Browns: What happened with Alex Smith? -- Terry Pluto | cleveland.com[/url][/quote]

Cleveland missing out on a QB... we've heard this same story too many times.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;1187638]I am saying if you are going to spend that money on a 34 year old, you should be thrilled to spend that same money 2 years ago on a 27 year old, that has a better rating, more yards and more left in the tank than a guy 5 years his senior.

In 2016 Andrew Luck got a deal that was worth 140 million (80 guaranteed). Are you telling me that Cousins was NOT worth half of that in 2015 or 2016?[/quote]

I disagree with the statement 100%. Don’t forget we had just gotten done with a first round pick quarterback who lit up the world in his first season then fizzled out. Now imagine that same thing happens with cousins, who at the time did not have a great body of work. A long term big money contract has a lot more ramifications for the player not working out than a rookie contract

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

"I think they’re ready to put some stuff together," Rodgers said. "They need some help there probably but they got the right piece in place at quarterback."

ARod on AS

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[url]https://arrowheadaddict.com/2018/02/08/clark-hunt-admits-alex-smith-trade-broncos-nope/[/url]

this tells me that AS is not going to be another McNabb, KC still believes he can play at a high level, they just want to get Mahomes career going

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

Had Alex Smith avoided a midseason slump for the Kansas City Chiefs, he would have been much higher this list, because his play to begin and end the year was spectacular and the best he has played in the NFL. Smith ended the season with an overall PFF grade of 87.2 despite that midseason lull and led the league with a passer rating of 131.4 on deep passes.

PFF Elite Stat: Smith’s passer rating on deep passes in 2017 was 131.4, which stood 19.8 points higher than any other signal-caller in the league and was by far his career-best.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

This article by Keim brings up such an interesting discussion point.

[QUOTE]The Redskins' thinking for more than a year has been: If they don’t have Brady or Aaron Rodgers, they don’t want to pay a quarterback at the upper end of the pay scale. So without that sort of quarterback, pay less for a quality QB and build around him. Of course, it’s hard to do the latter, just as it’s hard to find a good starting quarterback.[/QUOTE]

[url]http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35592/jimmy-garoppolos-deal-a-reminder-why-redskins-opted-for-alex-smith[/url]

[B][I]Was Bruce Allen right all along?[/I][/B]

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

I've been happy with it since day 1, I was scared to death that Colt would be the guy but Bruce and Co. fixed that quick

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=Schneed10;1188236]This article by Keim brings up such an interesting discussion point.



[url]http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35592/jimmy-garoppolos-deal-a-reminder-why-redskins-opted-for-alex-smith[/url]

[B][I]Was Bruce Allen right all along?[/I][/B][/quote]

He might be right on the financial part but it's way too early to declare anything about the trade being the smart play. If Kirk goes to Denver or Minny and wins a SB and all we get is 3 years of average qb play for 71+ mil guaranteed it def. ain't a winner.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=mooby;1188243]He might be right on the financial part but it's way too early to declare anything about the trade being the smart play.[/quote]

You're right, ultimately you can't judge this without judging how the Redskins do with Smith at the helm, how well Fuller contributes in KC, and how well Kirk performs with his new team.

At this point all we can really do is wax philosophically about it. How much of your cap (on a % basis) should your QB take up before it ends up hurting you?

And it's really hard to judge based on history. For instance, Stafford and Carr are paid among the highest in the league. Their teams didn't make the playoffs this year. But is that because the QBs are overpaid, or is it because the front office didn't put enough around them with the resources available, or is it because of coaching shortcomings?

It's hard to even form an opinion where the tipping point is for QB salaries because ultimately it's a team game. Maybe that's the biggest case of all in favor of Bruce drawing a line in the sand with Cousins- the thinking being no single player deserves that much money in what is ultimately a team game.

I will undoubtedly miss Fuller. And it remains to be seen what Cousins gets paid. But right now, I'd have to lean towards Smith at $23.5 minus Fuller as being a better deal than keeping Fuller and Cousins at whatever he's going to get on the open market.

I think being the one team willing to draw a line in the sand on QB salaries takes balls, and because it's the Redskins everyone will naturally ridicule the move. But the Redskins [I]might be right[/I].

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

I mean in all honesty Kirk could have said "You know I'll take less to build a winner" yeah I get it, that is not on him and he doesn't owe the skins anything but Romo did it for Dallas, Eli the Giants, Brady the pats... It does happen.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1188248]I mean in all honesty Kirk could have said "You know I'll take less to build a winner" yeah I get it, that is not on him and he doesn't owe the skins anything but Romo did it for Dallas, Eli the Giants, Brady the pats... It does happen.[/quote]

Gotta want to be somewhere to want to help. He didn't want to be here. He was blowing platitudes and smoke up our rears.

So nice to have it resolved early. We can all move on now, including Kirk (don't get greedy and tag him). An extra 3rd rounder next year will be nice.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=Schneed10;1188244]You're right, ultimately you can't judge this without judging how the Redskins do with Smith at the helm, how well Fuller contributes in KC, and how well Kirk performs with his new team.

At this point all we can really do is wax philosophically about it. [B]How much of your cap (on a % basis) should your QB take up before it ends up hurting you?[/B]

And it's really hard to judge based on history. For instance, Stafford and Carr are paid among the highest in the league. Their teams didn't make the playoffs this year. But is that because the QBs are overpaid, or is it because the front office didn't put enough around them with the resources available, or is it because of coaching shortcomings?

It's hard to even form an opinion where the tipping point is for QB salaries because ultimately it's a team game. Maybe that's the biggest case of all in favor of Bruce drawing a line in the sand with Cousins- the thinking being no single player deserves that much money in what is ultimately a team game.

I will undoubtedly miss Fuller. And it remains to be seen what Cousins gets paid. But right now, I'd have to lean towards Smith at $23.5 minus Fuller as being a better deal than keeping Fuller and Cousins at whatever he's going to get on the open market.

I think being the one team willing to draw a line in the sand on QB salaries takes balls, and because it's the Redskins everyone will naturally ridicule the move. But the Redskins [I]might be right[/I].[/quote]

IIRC 14.5%. But it's a moot point as it seems Kirk doesn't want to be here. Remember he wanted to be with a winner, and we weren't a winner under Kirk. If he blames that on everybody else it was doomed from the start of the losing.

Of course we'll know how important winning is to him when he goes elsewhere. If he takes less money to go to Denver or Minny, then yeah he's about that life. If he goes to Cleveland because they outbid everyone else, than he's not.

Re: Redskins trade for Alex Smith
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1188248]I mean in all honesty Kirk could have said "You know I'll take less to build a winner" yeah I get it, that is not on him and he doesn't owe the skins anything but Romo did it for Dallas, Eli the Giants, Brady the pats... It does happen.[/quote]

When did Eli Manning ever take a pay cut for the Giants?

Tony Romo said he would at one point, but did he ever follow through?

Tom Brady is taking less than he could have gotten, after a big contract in 2010. You could say that's Tom Brady, or that's his richer wife.

But rather than ask the extraordinary of Kirk Cousins, why not consider this as proof the Redskins FO lowballed Kirk: They are paying more for Smith this season, around 23 mil, than they could have had Cousins signed for a LTD. As low as 20 mil, But Snyder and Allen rejected it.