Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1093080]Respect meaning simply his ability to lead this team and be a great qb?[/quote]

Yes

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

its not like every young QB has to earn it on the field.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1093081]Yes[/QUOTE]


Wow. Smoot what is your opinion? Do you think, based on what you have seen, that he will one day be able to live up to his pricetag?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1093082]its not like every young QB has to earn it on the field.[/QUOTE]


I think they do. I mean if we are talking faith in a guy as the leader. Faith in his ability. Where else do you earn it?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

I think two guys that are not favs of Griffin are Moss and Garcon. I don't think those three are hanging out after practice.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

No talent on D? Skins got equal or better talent than the Cardinals, Todd Bowles is doing more with less in Arizona. Give Baker a chance, he could be our version of Bowles.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

Yeah, I am not buying the "no talent on D" argument. Sure, we have talent holes - safety leaps to mind. However, we also have some solid young talent that has shown ability to make a difference or at least to be above average - Robinson, Amerson, Breeland, Kerrigan. In addition, we have lots of solid - not spectacular - guys some young, some not-so, that every team needs - Baker, Jenkins, Compton, Murphy.

Use what you have correctly, identify and play to their strengths, coach them up to be more diverse, etc.

Just not seeing any of that in Haz.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

^ i second that emotion

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1093083]Wow. Smoot what is your opinion? Do you think, based on what you have seen, that he will one day be able to live up to his pricetag?[/quote]

I don't know that he can here to be honest

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

The effed up thing about yesterday and the D is that Haz came out and said the blitzing was over the top against Dallas. Than against the team without Romo, Bryant and crew - against a poor offense with a rookie QB not only do we not bring the house, we dont even bring an overnight bag. This board was talking about it in the pregame thread. I thought the whole idea of dialing it back against the Vikings was bad and all week I hoped it wouldnt be the case. Typical Haz overthinking things. We never stick with what works. Ever.

Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1093092]I don't know that he can here to be honest[/QUOTE]


Why? His play? The scheme?
Edit: if scheme do you think we build around Roberts strength or bring in a qb who fits?
Edit two: i see what you meant about franchise altering. If Gruden and Griffin cant make it work - who leaves? Jeez.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1093088]No talent on D? Skins got equal or better talent than the Cardinals, Todd Bowles is doing more with less in Arizona. Give Baker a chance, he could be our version of Bowles.[/quote]

Dude you have a man crush on Bowles! But I give it to them, they're missing Dockett, Washington, lost one of their d-linemen to injury, plus Palmer and they're still winning. Cards have a real good team and are well coached.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

SS, can you tell us more about what you mean regarding Gryphon's (possibly not) having his teammates' respect?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

Part of it, I am sure is adjusting expectations. RGIII came in with an offense designed to mask his weaknesses and excelled - was stellar even. Then, injured knee, major off-season drama, bad season in general and poof - all good feelings gone. Add in the price tag, his general propensity for putting his feelings/thoughts out there, and his success will always be judged for immediate results.

Unfortunately, with all of that there will always be drama and pressure to succeed. I say it is unfortunate because I firmly believe he's a good kid who needs to grow. I hope that can be accomplished here b/c I am equally certain it will be accomplished [I]somewhere[/I] and he will be a phenomenal QB.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1093089][B]Yeah, I am not buying the "no talent on D" argument. [/B]Sure, we have talent holes - safety leaps to mind. However, we also have some solid young talent that has shown ability to make a difference or at least to be above average - Robinson, Amerson, Breeland, Kerrigan. In addition, we have lots of solid - not spectacular - guys some young, some not-so, that every team needs - Baker, Jenkins, Compton, Murphy.

Use what you have correctly, identify and play to their strengths, coach them up to be more diverse, etc.

Just not seeing any of that in Haz.[/quote]

We can keep blaming Haz and I think he's part of the problem. But where was Kerrigan for the game saving sack? Riley still gets beat in coverage. Murphy had one sack but was handled the rest of the day. He's strong but to me isn't explosive at all. Bowen and Jenkins got abused on run plays. Clark is slow as a turtle. Hatcher was invisible. To me there are just not enough guys that can win their one on one matchups.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1093094]Why? His play? The scheme?
Edit: if scheme do you think we build around Roberts strength or bring in a qb who fits?
Edit two: i see what you meant about franchise altering. If Gruden and Griffin cant make it work - who leaves? Jeez.[/quote]

I think Griffin is burning a lot of bridges. I think he's sensitive and insecure and while he has the support of the most important person in the organization, if he doesn't produce he'll quickly lose that support.

I understand why he's insecure but he kind of has to get over it

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1093095]Dude you have a man crush on Bowles! But I give it to them, they're missing Dockett, Washington, lost one of their d-linemen to injury, plus Palmer and they're still winning. Cards have a real good team and are well coached.[/quote]

Calais Campbell, Shaunnesy, Abraham and others, playing with backups. And yes, I love Bowles.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1093098]We can keep blaming Haz and I think he's part of the problem. But where was Kerrigan for the game saving sack? Riley still gets beat in coverage. Murphy had one sack but was handled the rest of the day. He's strong but to me isn't explosive at all. Bowen and Jenkins got abused on run plays. Clark is slow as a turtle. Hatcher was invisible. To me there are just not enough guys that can win their one on one matchups.[/quote]

That's the DC job to adjust, Compton is better in coverage than Riley, use him. Put Thomas in there and let him play at S.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1093099][B]I think Griffin is burning a lot of bridges. I think he's sensitive and insecure [/B]and while he has the support of the most important person in the organization, if he doesn't produce he'll quickly lose that support.

I understand why he's insecure but he kind of has to get over it[/quote]

I need to stop reading your comments, they are only depressing me.

Reality sucks.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

Is Doc saying the same thing Russell is saying?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1093102]I need to stop reading your comments, they are only depressing me.

Reality sucks.[/quote]

This.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=Evilgrin;1093103]Is Doc saying the same thing Russell is saying?[/quote]

What is Doc saying?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1093099]I think Griffin is burning a lot of bridges. I think he's sensitive and insecure and while he has the support of the most important person in the organization, if he doesn't produce he'll quickly lose that support.

I understand why he's insecure but he kind of has to get over it[/quote]


I get that he's a prima donna and, sure, he may be insecure (I'll take your word for that). Strikes me as something not unusual in the QB position.

I guess it's just easier to blame RGIII than anyone else for all the other crap that I've seen out of this team. Can't cover passes in a normal scheme. Can't create TOs. Can't block in the middle of the line. Hell, if Garcon is pissed off, why can't he catch the ball that RGIII drops into his breadbasket from 40+ yards? DJax does it.

Losing is awful in many ways. It brings out the worst in many of us. BUt this is the road we're on. The management is committed to RGIII, for OBVIOUS reasons. Are you really gonna cut him loose to preserve locker room harmony among a bunch of guys who most other teams simply do not want? That would be stupid FO thinking, IMO, even if RGIII is insecure and "burning bridges." He's going to be here for another few seasons, until we know for sure he CAN'T play at this level.

As for Gruden and the offensive staff, is there reason to think they do not want RGIII at this point? Really? I don't buy it.

Winning cures all ills, but there's no shortcut, alas, for our team to get to winning on a regular basis. We're still a number of players off, notably at safety, O-line, and D-line (IMO). Stick to RGIII and build. What better course of action do we have? Back to the Jeff Beck era?* No thank you.

edit: John Beck! Lol. One of these guys used to play for us. The other played for the Yardbirds.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1093099]I think Griffin is burning a lot of bridges. I think he's sensitive and insecure and while he has the support of the most important person in the organization, if he doesn't produce he'll quickly lose that support.



I understand why he's insecure but he kind of has to get over it[/QUOTE]


Um...wow....again.
He is insecure because Gruden didnt want to play him?

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1093106]What is Doc saying?[/quote]

I dunno I'm asking, I know Doc can be dismissive of what Russell says.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

Gruden's calling out everyone on his presser (players/coaches), including himself. At the end of the day, this was a team loss. I don't know why fans fail to realize that. If this team is going to have any wins, players have to make plays and coaches have to scheme better. We can't have an offense that starts out very slow and misses scoring opportunities in the first half or a defense that can't make key stops at the end.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1093112]Gruden's calling out everyone on his presser (players/coaches), including himself. At the end of the day, this was a team loss. I don't know why fans fail to realize that. If this team is going to have any wins, players have to make plays and coaches have to scheme better. We can't have an offense that starts out very slow and misses scoring opportunities in the first half or a defense that can't make key stops at the end.[/quote]

It was definately a team loss, you can point a finger at every part of the team.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

Reasons we lost:
1. We're just not very good
2. Rg3 is still learning the system and how to be a pocket passer in general. I was hard on him yesterday when a little (lot) drunk. He played pretty well minus 2 big plays. The int before half and the 4th down McNabb pass in the 4th.
3. Our pass blocking stinks. We need new starters at LG, RG and RT.
4. We have zero pass rush unless we blitz everyone. We need an elite pass rusher.
5. Our safeties can't cover anyone. Neither can the LBs. Backup tight ends were kicking our asses yesterday.
6. Haslett sucks, Dallas was one of his fluke games.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1093112]Gruden's calling out everyone on his presser (players/coaches), including himself. At the end of the day, this was a team loss. I don't know why fans fail to realize that. If this team is going to have any wins, players have to make plays and coaches have to scheme better. We can't have an offense that starts out very slow and misses scoring opportunities in the first half or a defense that can't make key stops at the end.[/quote]

So, seeing the twitter reports from Gruden's presser.

Seems he is calling out RGIII and, essentially, telling him to man up. Paraphrasing Gruden quotes - "gotta have thick skin to play QB in the NFL"; "working hard then reading reports saying how everyone hates him"; "some young Redskins have fragile egos".

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1093119]Reasons we lost:
1. We're just not very good
2. Rg3 is still learning the system and how to be a pocket passer in general. I was hard on him yesterday when a little (lot) drunk. He played pretty well minus 2 big plays. The int before half and the 4th down McNabb pass in the 4th.
3. Our pass blocking stinks. We need new starters at LG, RG and RT.
4. We have zero pass rush unless we blitz everyone. We need an elite pass rusher.
5. Our safeties can't cover anyone. Neither can the LBs. Backup tight ends were kicking our asses yesterday.
6. Haslett sucks, Dallas was one of his fluke games.[/quote]

The refs!!!!!

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

I just joined and figured I'd give my thoughts on this game in my first post.

First, RG3 did great considering his time out of the loop. His stride with Alfred Morris was exciting. His deep throws to Desean Jackson were equally so. I was seeing flashes of 2012 and I'm sure I wasn't the only long term Skins fan to do so. He led the offense to 26 points against a staunch Vikings defense and I could see improvements in his play compared to the Houston game and last year. He threw an interception which lead to the Vikings gaining momentum into the second half. Momentum is huge, especially in a close game. He also under-threw on a drive that could've led us to a shot at victory, when it mattered most. These are things that even the greatest quarterbacks do from time to time. I won't say he's going to be a great quarterback, and I won't go so far as saying he is without question our franchise quarterback. But, given that he was out for as long as he was, and coming off an injury no less, I think blaming him solely for this loss would be willfully ignorant to the entire scheme of things.

This is the NFL though. You are paid -millions- to perform when you need to. That means on 4th down on a drive that you absolutely must execute to win. That means not throwing that interception that turns the tides of the game. Quarterbacks get all the glory and fame and praise in the world when they win, mostly undeservedly. So why, on the flip side, wouldn't they be accused and blamed and questioned for when they don't, even if again, undeservedly. Robert needs to reflect long and hard. He needs to be putting in 120% effort the rest of the season and buckle down. He mentioned a repeat of 2012 when we were 3-6 in the post game conference. If he wants any credibility as a NFL quarterback, he needs to live up to that as best he can.

I feel enough has been addressed as to Haslett and our Defense.

I will say though, I am very confident in Jay Gruden. He has his head in the right place. He's improving as a coach with every game, and we need a franchise coach as much as we need a franchise quarterback. Though I'm too cynical to believe Daniel Snyder's not trying to pull the strings as best he can.

Re: Redskins vs Vikings Gameday thread
 

[quote=Grimm_Reaper;1093127]I just joined and figured I'd give my thoughts on this game in my first post.

First, RG3 did great considering his time out of the loop. His stride with Alfred Morris was exciting. His deep throws to Desean Jackson were equally so. I was seeing flashes of 2012 and I'm sure I wasn't the only long term Skins fan to do so. He led the offense to 26 points against a staunch Vikings defense and I could see improvements in his play compared to the Houston game and last year. He threw an interception which lead to the Vikings gaining momentum into the second half. Momentum is huge, especially in a close game. He also under-threw on a drive that could've led us to a shot at victory, when it mattered most. These are things that even the greatest quarterbacks do from time to time. I won't say he's going to be a great quarterback, and I won't go so far as saying he is without question our franchise quarterback. But, given that he was out for as long as he was, and coming off an injury no less, I think blaming him solely for this loss would be willfully ignorant to the entire scheme of things.

This is the NFL though. You are paid -millions- to perform when you need to. That means on 4th down on a drive that you absolutely must execute to win. That means not throwing that interception that turns the tides of the game. Quarterbacks get all the glory and fame and praise in the world when they win, mostly undeservedly. So why, on the flip side, wouldn't they be accused and blamed and questioned for when they don't, even if again, undeservedly. Robert needs to reflect long and hard. He needs to be putting in 120% effort the rest of the season and buckle down. He mentioned a repeat of 2012 when we were 3-6 in the post game conference. If he wants any credibility as a NFL quarterback, he needs to live up to that as best he can.

I feel enough has been addressed as to Haslett and our Defense.

I will say though, I am very confident in Jay Gruden. He has his head in the right place. He's improving as a coach with every game, and we need a franchise coach as much as we need a franchise quarterback. Though I'm too cynical to believe Daniel Snyder's not trying to pull the strings as best he can.[/quote]

Welcome

Good post

On that note, let's lock this one and move on to the post-game conversation