Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

A few years back? Right now Flacco is a top 12-15 QB in the league no matter how much people wanna hate on him. JC is a NFL quarterback. Big difference.

[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;891881]A few years back? Right now Flacco is a top 12-15 QB in the league no matter how much people wanna hate on him. JC is a NFL quarterback. Big difference.[/QUOTE]

I'll give u 15

And I don't hate on him I just don't think he's that good

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;891878]He's much better man. It's not even close.[/quote]

I wouldn't say much better. Marginally better. I left out 2010 and 2011 because Campbell played only partial seasons.

Campbell
2009 - 64.5 Comp % - 3618 Yards - 20 TD - 15 INT
2008 - 62.3 Comp % - 3245 Yards - 13 TD - 6 INT

Flacco
2009 - 63.1 Comp % - 3613 Yards - 21 TD - 12 INT
2008 - 60.0 Comp % - 2971 Yards - 14 TD - 12 INT

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

Elite Level QBs:
Brady, Manning, Manning, Rodgers, Brees,

Next Level QBs: (Very Good to Great)
Rivers, Cutler, Stafford, Romo, Vick, Flacco, Ryan, Schaub

Next Level QBs: (Above Average to Good)
Newton, Dalton, Palmer, Hasselbeck, Smith

Next Level QBs: (Average)
Orton, Cassel, JC, Fitzpatrick, Kolb, Sanchez, Bradford, Ponder, Moore, Freeman

Next Level QBs: (Bad to Below Average)
McCoy, Tebow, Gabbert

Next Level QBs: (Why are these guys out there?)
Grossman, Jackson

Flacco is not good to great dude look at his overall numbers and honestly schaub isn't either bc he can't stay healthy. Id take cam over both of those guys anyday

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

I'll stick with my list.

Flacco has a career 86 rating
Jc on shit teams has a career 83 rating not much of a difference

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

What's Tebow career rating?

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

Flacco is not great but gets the job done. The Ravens have been to the playoffs every year he's been their starting QB. He plays in a tough conference, which features a perennial top ten defense (Steelers). He's not elite, but he's not terrible. I don't get people sh*tting on him all the time (including dumb a$$ Ravens fans).

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

flacco is a rich man's scott mitchell

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;891888]Elite Level QBs:
Brady, Manning, Manning, Rodgers, Brees,

Next Level QBs: (Very Good to Great)
Rivers, Cutler, Stafford, Romo, Vick, Flacco, Ryan, Schaub

Next Level QBs: (Above Average to Good)
Newton, Dalton, Palmer, Hasselbeck, Smith

Next Level QBs: (Average)
Orton, Cassel, JC, Fitzpatrick, Kolb, Sanchez, Bradford, Ponder, Moore, Freeman

Next Level QBs: (Bad to Below Average)
McCoy, Tebow, Gabbert

Next Level QBs: (Why are these guys out there?)
Grossman, Jackson[/quote]

Where does Roethlisberger stand on your list? I only ask because him and Manning have had similar careers, 2 SB wins each aided in part by great defense along with opportunistic offense.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

hes elite to me, i dont like the guy but he gets it done

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;891920]Flacco is not great but gets the job done. The Ravens have been to the playoffs every year he's been their starting QB. He plays in a tough conference, which features a perennial top ten defense (Steelers). He's not elite, but he's not terrible. I don't get people sh*tting on him all the time (including dumb a$$ Ravens fans).[/quote]


Sans this years AFC Championship game Flacco doesn't get it done when the game is on the line. Basically Flacco can't put the Ravens on his back and will them a win and that is what makes a great QB IMO.

Raven's fans dislike him becasue he is stuck at average QB and they thought he was the next Johnny U. the Ravens have given him plenty of weapons and he still doesn't dazzle.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mredskins;891967]Sans this years AFC Championship game Flacco doesn't get it done when the game is on the line. Basically Flacco can't put the Ravens on his back and will them a win and [B]that is what makes a great QB IMO[/B].

Raven's dislike him becasue he is stuck at average QB and they thought he was the next Johnny U. the Ravens have given him plenty of weapons and he still doesn't dazzle.[/quote]

And that's why I call him an adequate QB. And he doesn't need to put the Ravens on his back, given that they've always had above average running game and elite defense.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;891973]And that's why I call him an adequate QB. And he doesn't need to put the Ravens on his back, given that they've always had above average running game and elite defense.[/quote]

Exactly he ain't bad but ain't nothing special either.

Folks on here that think he is great what would you trade to get him?

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mooby;891957]Where does Roethlisberger stand on your list? I only ask because him and Manning have had similar careers, 2 SB wins each aided in part by great defense along with opportunistic offense.[/quote]

You have to deduct points for alleged sexual assault.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinzWin;891998]You have to deduct points for alleged sexual assault.[/quote]

You know, I think he did it, which makes him a POS as a person, but in this list on field performance should be the only measurement. Hence why Vick is in the good-to-great category. I still think Vick, whilst saying and doing all the right things in the public eye, probably isn't as sorry as people think he is.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;891920]Flacco is not great but gets the job done. The Ravens have been to the playoffs every year he's been their starting QB. He plays in a tough conference, which features a perennial top ten defense (Steelers). He's not elite, but he's not terrible. I don't get people sh*tting on him all the time (including dumb a$$ Ravens fans).[/quote]

I think the reason people defecate on him is if he was the terrific QB some people make him out to be, with the talent he has surrounding him they should have been going deep into the playoffs every year. But with the exception of his rookie year in 2008 where they won their first two playoff games, the Ravens have been one and done in the playoffs each year since.

Any average quarterback can get a stacked team to the playoffs. Jason Campbell could do that. Buy my point is, how can Flacco be even marginally better than Campbell when their numbers are fairly similar and Flacco has played on stacked teams and Campbell has played on not great teams? In my mind, that makes Flacco look worse than better.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

Flacco is another Jim McMahon. Not really a prolific passer like Elway or Marino, but a QB who has decent wideouts, a powerful running game, and a ferocious defense.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinzWin;892002]I think the reason people defecate on him is if he was the terrific QB some people make him out to be, with the talent he has surrounding him they should have been going deep into the playoffs every year. [B]But with the exception of his rookie year in 2008 where they won their first two playoff games, the Ravens have been one and done in the playoffs each year since.[/B]

Any average quarterback can get a stacked team to the playoffs. Jason Campbell could do that. Buy my point is, how can Flacco be even marginally better than Campbell when their numbers are fairly similar and Flacco has played on stacked teams and Campbell has played on not great teams? In my mind, that makes Flacco look worse than better.[/quote]

You make it sound like we're talking about a 10 year period....but it's been only 4 years. And in those 4 years:

- 2008: Lost to the Steelers in the AFC Championship Game (as a rookie)
- 2009: Lost to the Colts in the 2nd round of the playoffs
- 2010: Lost to the Steelers in the 2nd round of the playoffs (the game where both Boldin and TJ Housh dropped TDs in the 4th quarter)
- 2011: The Ravens were a Lee Evans dropped TD from going to the Superbowl

I'd be curious to see what other average/below average QBs could do with a team like the Ravens. Still, you have to have some talent to be a playoff team four years in a row, including two AFC Championship appearances...or at the do enough to get the team there.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;892019]You make it sound like we're talking about a 10 year period....but it's been only 4 years. And in those 4 years:

- 2008: Lost to the Steelers in the AFC Championship Game (as a rookie)
- 2009: Lost to the Colts in the 2nd round of the playoffs
- 2010: Lost to the Steelers in the 2nd round of the playoffs (the game where both Boldin and TJ Housh dropped TDs in the 4th quarter)
- 2011: The Ravens were a Lee Evans dropped TD from going to the Superbowl

I'd be curious to see what other average/below average QBs could do with a team like the Ravens. Still, you have to have some talent to be a playoff team four years in a row, including two AFC Championship appearances...or at the do enough to get the team there.[/quote]

Ok bottom line would yo uwant him on the Skins over say Peyton or RG3? I would not. I take him over Sanchez.

If you put JF on the Skins between 08 to 11 he would not have had that same success in the playoffs or even had seen the playoffs.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mredskins;892026]Ok bottom line would yo uwant him on the Skins over say Peyton or RG3? I would not. I take him over Sanchez.

If you put JF on the Skins between 08 to 11 he would not have had that same success in the playoffs or even had seen the playoffs.[/quote]

People here are arguing that Flacco is a below average QB on the Ravens. I haven't said that he's elite or anything like that. I just make the argument that he's a good QB on a team with a very good running game and a very good/elite defense. Still, even with all of that, a QB has to have some talent to have the type of success the Ravens have had...or at the least manage the position well enough to have that success.

Who knows if he had had success here with the Redskins. The point is that he's been a good QB in the situation he has been with the Ravens.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;892019]You make it sound like we're talking about a 10 year period....but it's been only 4 years. And in those 4 years:

- 2008: Lost to the Steelers in the AFC Championship Game (as a rookie)
- 2009: Lost to the Colts in the 2nd round of the playoffs
- 2010: Lost to the Steelers in the 2nd round of the playoffs (the game where both Boldin and TJ Housh dropped TDs in the 4th quarter)
- 2011: The Ravens were a Lee Evans dropped TD from going to the Superbowl

I'd be curious to see what other average/below average QBs could do with a team like the Ravens. Still, you have to have some talent to be a playoff team four years in a row, including two AFC Championship appearances...or at the do enough to get the team there.[/quote]

You must not have ready my post. I never said anything about 10 years. I think 4 years is long enough to describe someone's body of work. My point was any average quarterback can go deep in the playoffs with a stacked team. Mark Rypien, Doug Williams, Mark Sanchez, Alex Smith. All of these guys are not top tier QB's yet made it deep in the playoffs because their teams were stacked at skill positions on offense defense and teams.

You said "Still, you have to have some talent to be a playoff team four years in a row." Any average QB in the NFL has some talent. And that is exactly my point, that Flacco is good enough to get them TO the playoffs but not to the Super Bowl. He hasn't been able to beat the elite teams. You have to be the best to be the best. All of the average QB's I listed won or got close to the Super Bowl. Not because they were great, but because their teams were great. You haven't said anything different than what I said really.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinzWin;892037]You must not have ready my post. I never said anything about 10 years. I think 4 years is long enough to describe someone's body of work. My point was any average quarterback can go deep in the playoffs with a stacked team. Mark Rypien, Doug Williams, Mark Sanchez, Alex Smith. All of these guys are not top tier QB's yet made it deep in the playoffs because their teams were stacked at skill positions on offense defense and teams.

You said "Still, you have to have some talent to be a playoff team four years in a row." Any average QB in the NFL has some talent. And that is exactly my point, that Flacco is good enough to get them TO the playoffs but not to the Super Bowl. He hasn't been able to beat the elite teams. You have to be the best to be the best. All of the average QB's I listed won or got close to the Super Bowl. Not because they were great, but because their teams were great. You haven't said anything different than what I said really.[/quote]

I don't think my opinion is that far away from yours. I just don't think Flacco is as terrible as some people make him out to be. I am not going to be naive and say that he's elite and on the same level as Brady/Manning/Brees, but the way some people talk about him (including Ravens fan) it would make you think that he is the QB of a perennial loser.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=Ruhskins;892045]I don't think my opinion is that far away from yours. I just don't think Flacco is as terrible as some people make him out to be. I am not going to be naive and say that he's elite and on the same level as Brady/Manning/Brees, but the way some people talk about him (including Ravens fan) it would make you think that he is the QB of a perennial loser.[/quote]

I understand. I think my main point was simply that you could plug in an average QB to the Ravens and they would most likely still make the playoffs each year.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinzWin;892060]I understand. I think my main point was simply that you could plug in an average QB to the Ravens and they would most likely still make the playoffs each year.[/quote]

Kyle Boller disagrees.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mooby;892064]Kyle Boller disagrees.[/quote]

:laughing-

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mooby;892064]Kyle Boller disagrees.[/quote]

Kyle Boller would have to be an average quarterback first... That would be stretching things a bit.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinzWin;892076]Kyle Boller would have to be an average quarterback first... That would be stretching things a bit.[/quote]

I would say he was about average for that time period, average considering the fact there was a lot of terrible qb's during that time. I would consider Flacco above-average. I don't think it's a coincidence that the Ravens have made the playoffs every year with Flacco under center. He's certainly better than McNair/Boller.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mooby;892093]I would say he was about average for that time period, average considering the fact there was a lot of terrible qb's during that time. I would consider Flacco above-average. I don't think it's a coincidence that the Ravens have made the playoffs every year with Flacco under center. He's certainly better than McNair/Boller.[/quote]

He maybe an average back-up. There is no way he was an average starter in the league even then.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

Boller is garbage; Rex is better then Boller by a mile.

IT been interesting to see how Jason Campbell would have done in B-more over the span of Flacco's career. I bet it be pretty on par. I think Flacco is a little better then JC but not by much.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

Although Boller was not good as a starting quarterback, out of the 32 starting quarterbacks in the NFL in his starting time period, I would rate him as slightly below average. Who would you rather have, him or John Beck at any point in Beck's career? But as far as the original point goes, I still believe Flacco does deserve credit for at least giving them the solid qb play needed to make the playoffs all those years.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SmootSmack;891874]Morris Claiborne and the Bucs seem to be the wild card in all this[/quote]

I see what you mean. The Rams want to guarantee that they can get either Blackmon or Claiborne with the 6th pick. and that might not be possible if the Vikings pick Kalil, the Browns pick Blackmon, and the Bucs Pick Claiborne, which seems like a very likely situation.

What if the skins traded up one spot with the bucs for a 3rd round pick, then packaged the 5th overall pick with next years 1st, and a 4th and 5th round pick this year this year(I think we have 2 4th's and 2 5th's this year due to jason Cambell and Haynesworth trade.

This would guarantee the rams get claiborne or blackmon
Is this even feasible?
If I'm Bruce Allen this is Option number 1

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

depends how bad the Bucs would want Claiborne

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=mauiRedskinbarn;892211]I see what you mean. The Rams want to guarantee that they can get either Blackmon or Claiborne with the 6th pick. and that might not be possible if the Vikings pick Kalil, the Browns pick Blackmon, and the Bucs Pick Claiborne, which seems like a very likely situation.

What if the skins traded up one spot with the bucs for a 3rd round pick, then packaged the 5th overall pick with next years 1st, and a 4th and 5th round pick this year this year(I think we have 2 4th's and 2 5th's this year due to jason Cambell and Haynesworth trade.

This would guarantee the rams get claiborne or blackmon
Is this even feasible?
If I'm Bruce Allen this is Option number 1[/quote]

What the hell man?! We were talking about Flacco and Boller here. Way to ruin the thread before we had the chance to get into Tony Banks and Elvis Grbac!

I don't know how willing the Bucs would be to make that move. I suppose we could move up to #2 and then let the Rams and Browns figure out the move between 4 and 6.

Also, our pick from the Pats is a 2013 5th rounder

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

My bad. Hijack est mort. I can see one of those highly touted top 5 players falling to 6 if we can't work out a trade. Maybe we will get lucky and someone will draft Trent Richardson in the top 5.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

All this talk..., when the draft happens RGIII will be our QB. We have a staff that get things done when needed. No one could have told me last year we would have 12 picks and 90% of those picks would make in impact during the season.

I am a believer in this staff and they "get r done"

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SmootSmack;892214]What the hell man?! We were talking about Flacco and Boller here. Way to ruin the thread before we had the chance to get into Tony Banks and Elvis Grbac!

I don't know how willing the Bucs would be to make that move. I suppose we could move up to #2 and then let the Rams and Browns figure out the move between 4 and 6.

Also, our pick from the Pats is a 2013 5th rounder[/quote]

“You’re not going to remember Albert Haynesworth as a bust”– Albert Haynesworth

Thought everyone might be able to use a laugh. We only got a 5th rounder and it had to be removed by one year. I pretty sure that is negative points on the draft trade card.

Re: And with the 6th pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, the redskins select...........
 

[quote=SkinItup;892367]“You’re not going to remember Albert Haynesworth as a bust”– Albert Haynesworth[/quote]oh man i forgot about that