Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;897337]If this were really about a total of THREE contracts by the skins and cowboys, thats what they would have done. Its not like the league is doing this to set a precedent for similar situations in the future - hopefully there will never be an uncapped year again. I'm convinced this is really about something else and the league was looking for an "offense" to justify this particular punishment.[/quote]

Pollian on SC basically said they can't ignore it because at a certain point the league will disapprove contracts. Of course he followed that up with "if you know a good antitrust lawyer I would call him."

I really hope the NFL gets their collective ass handed to them. After all the support we gave the owners during the lockout and this is the S they pull?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=FRPLG;897289]The players were faced with losing 128 million in cap money for players or going along with an unethical and patently unfair scheme to stick it to rich owners spear-headed by a committee whose chair is a direct division rival. If that isn't the epitome of morally bankrupt then I don't what is. It is a monumental day when you can take the road BELOW Dan Snyder and Jerry Jones. It says a lot about the character of some of these owners. They're bad people.[/quote]

So, I don't quite know how Dallas and us got targeted, BUT, this is what I think happened. The NFLPA (mainly D Smith whose election is coming up) could NOT have the salary cap go down after taking what has turned into a patently bad deal for a lot of players (lower cap, lower Franchise tags, deals not seeming to be as big) so the NFLPA pushed for a higher cap this year. By pushing the 1/2 down this year the league allowed for a higher cap, and some more room to all the teams. My guess is that once the NFLPA election is over, and this cap cycle is completed, the remainder of the penalty will be expunged, and the teams that got the credit will get a small debit next year when the cap will definitely go up. I wouldn't even be surprised if both JJ and DS were somehow involved, and some back handed favors will be called in later.

It's pretty convoluted high stakes poker focused on saving DSmith's tail and keeping him as the NFLPA exec now that he and Goodell have an "understanding".

None of this is fact, and ultimately only time will tell.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Monkeydad;897313]I was thinking last night that the salary cap forum has probably had an all-time high in hits yesterday...even more today probably!

I know I have not even clicked on it for YEARS myself![/quote]

You should all be ashamed of yourselves. :mad:

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;897346]You should all be ashamed of yourselves. :mad:[/quote]

Yes he should. Everyone knows you use the front page at thewarpath.net as it list the most recent topics regardless of forum. You don't use thewarpath.net/forum.php unless you're looking for a specific section or you've already been on the site.

This is against the unwritten rule we just made up. Posters who have been purposely ignoring the salary cap section will be docked 30% of their posts. Ergo Buster is being fined 3,517 post.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;897346]You should all be ashamed of yourselves. :mad:[/quote]


Why? I'm not Canadian.
































[IMG]http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRQ2Tl0XhWuO-fA1iCRYYxTAEcFJgGneNCh2vcQphDdmcXnRsjt[/IMG]

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;897346]You should all be ashamed of yourselves. :mad:[/quote]

I'm sorry Canuck. If there's one thing this Redskins FO does extremely well, it's manage the salary cap. Which means we take being able to maneuver around the cap for granted.

Look on the bright side though, look at all the attention you are receiving for the amazing work you do illustrating our cap situation to us. Without this scandal you would've remained a diamond in the rough.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

I haven't gone through all the pages on this thread, but didn't the bears pay Peppers like 35 million that year? How is that any different.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;897344]So, I don't quite know how Dallas and us got targeted, BUT, this is what I think happened. The NFLPA (mainly D Smith whose election is coming up) could NOT have the salary cap go down after taking what has turned into a patently bad deal for a lot of players (lower cap, lower Franchise tags, deals not seeming to be as big) so the NFLPA pushed for a higher cap this year. By pushing the 1/2 down this year the league allowed for a higher cap, and some more room to all the teams. My guess is that once the NFLPA election is over, and this cap cycle is completed, the remainder of the penalty will be expunged, and the teams that got the credit will get a small debit next year when the cap will definitely go up. I wouldn't even be surprised if both JJ and DS were somehow involved, and some back handed favors will be called in later.

It's pretty convoluted high stakes poker focused on saving DSmith's tail and keeping him as the NFLPA exec now that he and Goodell have an "understanding".

None of this is fact, and ultimately only time will tell.[/quote]

Good thoughts. And JJ is apparently a member of the Management Council Executive Committee that handed out this decision.

Something I speculated yesterday a couple of people seem to think might be the case. That the Redskins knew there might be some ramifications, but they had to do what they did to get Haynesworth out of here. And they expected a slap on the wrist, at most.

It's like you're on your way to work but you're running late. And if you don't get there right at 8am, your boss doesn't pay you for the day (and let's say you make $160 for the day). So you decide I can be late and not get paid $160, or I can speed, get pulled over and get a $50 ticket. Next thing you know though you're charged with reckless driving, have to stay in jail overnight, get docked $150 and 2 points...

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=mooby;897355]I'm sorry Canuck. If there's one thing this Redskins FO does extremely well, it's manage the salary cap. Which means we take being able to maneuver around the cap for granted.[/quote]

Apologies accepted. Salary Cap Central is a sausage-fest anyways.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;897362]Apologies accepted. Salary Cap Central is a sausage-fest anyways.[/quote]

But it is a necessary sausage-fest. I don't post often here because I am not the numbers guy that you are. But I do learn a lot from you so thanks for that. Understanding the cap is crucial for understanding the workings of our team.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CrazyCanuck;897362]Apologies accepted. Salary Cap Central is a sausage-fest anyways.[/quote]

Well thats because woman suck at math. They like to do arts and crafts and stuff. By the way what is this sexist word I keep hearing people call me?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

What is the point of having a salary cap if the NFL is just going to have a little meeting and fine you if they think you spent too much at one time. O well nothing is going to be done the NFL basically payed off the players association which I think is interesting.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;897369]Well thats because woman suck at math.[/quote]

Spoken like a true caveman!

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

If, at some point (after we've already taken the 18MM hit), its determined through some sort of arbitration that the penalties were inappropriate, then i dont think giving us back extra caps space in later years would cut it. Id demaind a compensatory 1st round draft pick.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;897374]If, at some point (after we've already taken the 18MM hit), its determined through some sort of arbitration that the penalties were inappropriate, then i dont think giving us back extra caps space in later years would cut it. Id demaind a compensatory 1st round draft pick.[/quote]
Well then we can just front load all of our contracts into that year and just start the cycle all over again.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;897374]If, at some point (after we've already taken the 18MM hit), its determined through some sort of arbitration that the penalties were inappropriate, then i dont think giving us back extra caps space in later years would cut it. Id demaind a compensatory 1st round draft pick.[/quote]

It's got a snowball's chance in hell, but I like the way you think kid.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=FRPLG;897373]Spoken like a true caveman![/quote]

[YT]ubx-6yP-DhQ[/YT]

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;897374]If, at some point (after we've already taken the 18MM hit), its determined through some sort of arbitration that the penalties were inappropriate, then i dont think giving us back extra caps space in later years would cut it. Id demaind a compensatory 1st round draft pick.[/quote]

My thoughts too, only appropriate compensation would be picks.

Not that I 100% agree or disagree with CRedskinsRule's post, giving up what we did to get to 2 and the "cap issues" this year don't sting so bad if you get picks back later as "back handed favors."

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[IMG]https://si0.twimg.com/profile_images/1894437742/goodell.jpg[/IMG]

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Awesome pic :lol:

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Player_HTTR;897379]My thoughts too, only appropriate compensation would be picks.

Not that I 100% agree or disagree with CRedskinsRule's post, giving up what we did to get to 2 and the "cap issues" this year don't sting so bad if you get picks back later as "back handed favors."[/quote]

If we could some way swing some draft picks out of this next year it would actually work out well in our favor. We take a cap hit this year but if we could get some midlevel picks 3rd or so i'd be ok with that.

Have the Skins issued a statement yet? I know they had no formal notice yesterday but was wondering if anything new had come out from Redskins park.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;897310]Adam S just said the skins have not changed any preparation for this free agency[/quote]

This tells me that the Skins are going to fight the penalty. They've already, in effect, said:

1. We've done nothing wrong.
2. Rule? What rule? Show it to us in writing.
3. Notification? What notification? We've received no notification that we broke any rule. If that's the case, put it in writing, NFL.

The logical conclusion from the Redskins POV is that nothing has changed because an unwritten rule cannot be legally enforced.

BTW, what would such a rule be called if it did exist in writing? I guess that there is little chance that it would be called "The NFL Mandatory Collusion in Unfair Labor Practices Rule".

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Good discussion:

[url=http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/22825103/vp/46721182#46721182]NBC Sports Video Player[/url]

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

ChucK † ‏ @Chuck_Wade Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
LMAO RT @AdamSchefter: Calvin Watkins reporting that CB Terrence Newman to visit The Redskins

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;897552]ChucK † ‏ @Chuck_Wade Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
LMAO RT @AdamSchefter: Calvin Watkins reporting that CB Terrence Newman to visit The Redskins[/quote]

Where's that Darth Vader noooooo video when you need it?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=mooby;897555]Where's that Darth Vader noooooo video when you need it?[/quote]
[url=http://nooooooooooooooo.com/]Instant No Button! Star Wars funnies FTW![/url]

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

No to Terrance Newman. This would be such a horrid signing.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Lombardi reporting that we still want Royal too

Newman is old but a solid 3 I guess

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

So I wonder what the outcome was or will be in regards to the Skins conversation with the League....

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/14/league-redskins-talked-about-salary-cap-controversy-on-tuesday/]League, Redskins talked about salary cap controversy on Tuesday | ProFootballTalk[/url]

[QUOTE]As the Redskins were rounding up a bunch of receivers on Tuesday (they landed Pierre Garçon and Josh Morgan, and they’re working on Eddie Royal), the team also was trying to plead its case with the league office regarding Monday’s decision to strip $36 million in cap space from the team for treating the “uncapped year” of 2010 too literally.

Per a league source, the Redskins engaged in a conference call with the league office regarding the situation.

And the conversation, we’re told, included the league conceding to G.M. Bruce Allen that the Redskins violated no rules and did nothing wrong. The league explained that the Redskins’ actions (and the Cowboys’) “affected competitive balance.”

As we’ve previously mentioned, both in print and during Tuesday’s PFT Live, what about the teams that opted to underspend in the year with no salary cap or salary floor? Those teams also necessarily affected competitive balance by choosing to be uncompetitive.

The bottom line is that every team could have done what the Cowboys and Redskins did. The notion that not every team had the cash flow to do it, which was advanced on Tuesday’s NFL Live by former Colts Vice Chairman Bill Polian, is more than a little misleading. The Cowboys, for example, opted to give receiver Miles Austin $17 million in 2010. The Cowboys characterized it as base salary and not as a signing bonus to limit the impact in future years under the cap. That’s not an issue of cash flow. And any team giving a player a signing bonus in 2010 could have used this tactic instead.

Besides, without a salary cap, teams with greater cash flow have the right to try to disrupt competitive balance by spending more money, even if it usually doesn’t work. (Indeed, the Cowboys and Redskins failed to get to the postseason in 2010 or 2011.) A cap is put in place to prevent the spend-to-win arms race, and the cap was removed in 2010 to give the owners an incentive to replace the CBA before risking that teams would try to buy a championship in the uncapped year.

What many in the media are missing is that this entire controversy proves the league engaged in collusion in 2010, and that the Redskins and Cowboys are suffering the consequences now for refusing two years ago to participate in a violation of the labor laws.
[/QUOTE]

I love the last paragraph. So the League of owners agreed to collude which is against National Labor Laws and two owners refused to break the law and now they are getting punished for not breaking the law.

This has got to get the ACLU or other Unions or whoever over sees National Labor Laws attention. Maybe one phone call or a couple of phone calls and guarenteed the League folds on this issue for fear they will be investigated in regards to collusion.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=SBXVII;898454]So I wonder what the outcome was or will be in regards to the Skins conversation with the League....

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/14/league-redskins-talked-about-salary-cap-controversy-on-tuesday/]League, Redskins talked about salary cap controversy on Tuesday | ProFootballTalk[/url]



I love the last paragraph. So the League of owners agreed to collude which is against National Labor Laws and two owners refused to break the law and now they are getting punished for not breaking the law.

This has got to get the ACLU or other Unions or whoever over sees National Labor Laws attention. Maybe one phone call or a couple of phone calls and guarenteed the League folds on this issue for fear they will be investigated in regards to collusion.[/quote]

Nice info but nothing is said of the outcome...if the league admitted that the Redskins and Cowgirls committed no violation, does it mean we get to keep our 36 mil?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

obviously it was the skins who leaked this to the media. I imagine if there was a favorable outcome, they would have leaked that as well. Given there's no mention of any reversals, and the only thing leaked was that the NFL admitted the skins did nothing wrong, i would imagine we're still being assessed the 36MM.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Ruhskins;898482]Nice info but nothing is said of the outcome...if the league admitted that the Redskins and Cowgirls committed no violation, does it mean we get to keep our 36 mil?[/quote]

I doubt it but I was wondering the same thing. Is this maybe how we are able to spend so much right now? Maybe Goodell said he'd give the team its money back and let the Skins voice their complaint to the Execs next month or to the rest of the owners next month and push the punishment to next yr and beyond.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

Any updates on this? CSN Washington was still reporting the cap loss last evening.

It seems like we're ignoring it but since we didn't even make an offer to Jackson or any CBs, I'm not sure if it's affecting our moves or not. I love the WR pickups we've made though.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;898489]obviously it was the skins who leaked this to the media. I imagine if there was a favorable outcome, they would have leaked that as well. Given there's no mention of any reversals, and the only thing leaked was that the NFL admitted the skins did nothing wrong, i would imagine we're still being assessed the 36MM.[/quote]

I'm still baffled as to how they can say there was no rule or law broken, but we want to punish you because other owners who spend their money elsewhere instead of on their teams didn't get a chance to do what you did. So we are going to give your gained CAP money to some less fortunate team. "F" them. If their city does not want to support them in purchasing tickets then move the F-ing team to a more lucrative city who does want a team. I'll admit I was mad when the Colts just up and moved. I felt sorry for the Browns when the team left for Baltimore. But no different then any other business if it's not making money you either move or fold. Their already getting a portion of our gross income % wise to help them monitarily do exactly what the Skins did and they chose not to do it. now they want more? WTF.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=Monkeydad;898499]Any updates on this? CSN Washington was still reporting the cap loss last evening.

It seems like we're ignoring it but since we didn't even make an offer to Jackson or any CBs, I'm not sure if it's affecting our moves or not. I love the WR pickups we've made though.[/quote]

Since this is essentially a cat fight among owners, my guess is that we won't have any real updates on the issue until after the owners' meeting at the end of the month.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

I read that PFT article about us having no violations but we were at an 'uncompetitive advantage'. That tells me that what we did was legal but frowned upon. So they didn't say (or at least from what we've heard from the skins perspective) we have a violation or salary cap reduction so I would keep spending. Also how can the bucs afford these guys? How are they not at an 'uncompetitive advantage'?

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

As a season ticket holder, I think that my tickets have been devalued and that all ticket holders and even fans should bring a class action siut against the NFL and the players association for not standing up for what is right.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;898555]I read that PFT article about us having no violations but we were at an 'uncompetitive advantage'. That tells me that what we did was legal but frowned upon. So they didn't say (or at least from what we've heard from the skins perspective) we have a violation or salary cap reduction so I would keep spending. Also how can the bucs afford these guys? How are they not at an 'uncompetitive advantage'?[/quote]

They can afford players because they like a lot of teams never spend up to the salary ceiling. In fact I believe they were one of several teams that similarly affected competitive balance in 2010 by NOT spending to the previous spending floor.

Re: NFL taking away Redskins cap space
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;898555]I read that PFT article about us having no violations but we were at an 'uncompetitive advantage'. That tells me that what we did was legal but frowned upon. So they didn't say (or at least from what we've heard from the skins perspective) we have a violation or salary cap reduction so I would keep spending. Also how can the bucs afford these guys? How are they not at an 'uncompetitive advantage'?[/quote]

It sounds like from Maske's article in today's Wash Post that there was a sort of gentlemen's agreement not to go overboard with player spending in the uncapped year and the Skins & Cowboys, and to a lesser extent Oak & NO, ignored the agreement. It seems like the Skins really went over the top. I'm not at all surprised those who feel they got F'd over would be upset. Who wouldnt be upset to have someone screw you after you made an agreement? It also sounds like the owners wanted the Skins to lose draft picks but the NFL said no. All in all, it could have been a lot worse.

It seems the NFL feels that the Skins didnt get an advantage in the uncapped year but put themself in a position to gain an advantage when the cap resumed.