Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[IMG]https://i.redd.it/9vbes3ndnkr91.jpg[/IMG]

Some of this is Carson, some of this is the o-line, some of this is Turner and Rivera. Overall it's one big shit sandwich.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

This has me so dejected. I was pretty happy with the signing of Carson Wentz, but I am having a hard time supporting the idea of running him out on the field anymore. I'm willing to give CW one more chance against the Titans, but if we see the same results after 1-2 quarters, it's time to make a change. I mean why not, they are 1-3 (0-3 in the NFC and 0-2 in the Division). What do we have to lose at this point. Might as well see if someone else can provide a spark. At least the other two options have some mobility to escape the flood gates that we see on every pass play. I hate to admit it, but so far, I could have done without bringing in CW. Maybe he'll change my mind over the course of the rest of the season, but we honestly might be 2-2 or 3-1 with Heinicke right now, and that really sucks considering what they sacrificed to bring CW in. I hope I'm wrong, but it is sure looking that way right now.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=mredskins;1324413]Give me a break , we are not a QB away from being better and TH is just not a NFL starting QB, i am sorry he is not.[/quote]

No need to apologize you are not wrong. TH is a nice guy and a feel good story, I am sure if the could have pulled out the playoff game against TB Disney would have bought the rights to do a 30 minute short about his life, but that is all. It doesn't matter who is back there right now (with the QBs we have). We are still 1-3 with Heinicke and may be 0-4 with him. The Detroit game is still a loss and I don't see how he is worth 17 points and 16 points respectively with Philly and Dallas.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1324435]This has me so dejected. I was pretty happy with the signing of Carson Wentz, but I am having a hard time supporting the idea of running him out on the field anymore. I'm willing to give CW one more chance against the Titans, but if we see the same results after 1-2 quarters, it's time to make a change. I mean why not, they are 1-3 (0-3 in the NFC and 0-2 in the Division). What do we have to lose at this point. Might as well see if someone else can provide a spark. At least the other two options have some mobility to escape the flood gates that we see on every pass play. I hate to admit it, but so far, I could have done without bringing in CW. Maybe he'll change my mind over the course of the rest of the season, but we honestly might be 2-2 or 3-1 with Heinicke right now, and that really sucks considering what they sacrificed to bring CW in. I hope I'm wrong, but it is sure looking that way right now.[/quote]

Bummed to see you so dejected he the brewer of the kool aid. The problem with the CW trade IMO is we didn't do enough to improve the offense. Two of our best o-line left and what did we replace them with? I think everyone knows CW benefits from protection. FWIW I think GM RR knew what we were getting or the would have restructured and signed him long term, but they didn't help him and he isn't helping himself.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1324435]This has me so dejected. I was pretty happy with the signing of Carson Wentz, but I am having a hard time supporting the idea of running him out on the field anymore. I'm willing to give CW one more chance against the Titans, but if we see the same results after 1-2 quarters, it's time to make a change. I mean why not, they are 1-3 (0-3 in the NFC and 0-2 in the Division). What do we have to lose at this point. Might as well see if someone else can provide a spark. At least the other two options have some mobility to escape the flood gates that we see on every pass play. I hate to admit it, but so far, I could have done without bringing in CW. Maybe he'll change my mind over the course of the rest of the season, but we honestly might be 2-2 or 3-1 with Heinicke right now, and that really sucks considering what they sacrificed to bring CW in. I hope I'm wrong, but it is sure looking that way right now.[/quote]

Rivera should have known that Wentz needs a very strong line to be successful. Moreso than the average QB. What we run out there has been nothing short of a disaster. I would do a Chiefs like overhaul on the line. 4 new starters around Chase. And we need a solid backup C, because Chase keeps getting hurt.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=mooby;1324432][IMG]https://i.redd.it/9vbes3ndnkr91.jpg[/IMG]

Some of this is Carson, some of this is the o-line, some of this is Turner and Rivera. Overall it's one big shit sandwich.[/quote]

Not nearly enough mid range/soft zone throws .. over the LB and before the safeties. Second level throws.
----------

What is it called when you throw the ball on the sidelines to the gap between a corner and safety? Aaron Rodgers used it last year .. the nines? (not 9/go route .. not talking route tree)

We need more of that. I thought Carson was going to be able to drive the ball down field into those spots.

The mid to deep outs.

The throws that Heinike cant make but Carson can.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Can anyone remind me how much playing time Wentz needs before that high 3rd becomes a high 2nd?

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=EdmundDorf;1325071]Can anyone remind me how much playing time Wentz needs before that high 3rd becomes a high 2nd?[/quote]

70% of snaps. Something he should never get close to, unless Rivera is trying to purposely sabotage the team.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

He's been as advertised. Through 5 games, he will hit the deep ball and make big plays with his arm but he is inconsistent in tight windows and makes some boneheaded decisions. He's better than TH but he isn't worth 28M. I doubt he is back next yr unless its a backup role for cheap

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1325073]He's been as advertised. Through 5 games, he will hit the deep ball and make big plays with his arm but he is inconsistent in tight windows and makes some boneheaded decisions. He's better than TH but he isn't worth 28M. I doubt he is back next yr unless its a backup role for cheap[/quote]

Yeah. One thing I will say they did right is to not restructure him before the season. I feel like they knew it was a one year gamble.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1325073]He's been as advertised. Through 5 games, he will hit the deep ball and make big plays with his arm but he is inconsistent in tight windows and makes some boneheaded decisions. He's better than TH but he isn't worth 28M. I doubt he is back next yr unless its a backup role for cheap[/quote]

The dude is a goober. I just don't think he's smart enough to be a successful NFL QB.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

I don't even think Wentz is much better than Taylor. He has a bigger arm but that doesn't make him better. If Taylor were starting we'd still be 1-4.

Also you have to look at the value. Taylor costs no draft picks and makes way less. We'd probably have the same record w/ Taylor, maybe better because you'd keep the 30 million and could get better guys to block, plus you'd have your draft picks for depth.

I knew this stupid ass trade was going to blow up in their stupid ass faces. Going after retread QB's rarely works. It's band aid football. You sign retreads as backups, not give them 30 million and numerous draft picks.

Draft QB's every year or almost every year. Always have a cheap vet around like Taylor or Bridgewater. The #1 reason why this team stinks is a total mismanagement of the QB position.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1325085]I don't even think Wentz is much better than Taylor. He has a bigger arm but that doesn't make him better. If Taylor were starting we'd still be 1-4.

Also you have to look at the value. Taylor costs no draft picks and makes way less. We'd probably have the same record w/ Taylor, maybe better because you'd keep the 30 million and could get better guys to block, plus you'd have your draft picks for depth.

I knew this stupid ass trade was going to blow up in their stupid ass faces. Going after retread QB's rarely works. It's band aid football. You sign retreads as backups, not give them 30 million and numerous draft picks.

Draft QB's every year or almost every year. Always have a cheap vet around like Taylor or Bridgewater. The #1 reason why this team stinks is a total mismanagement of the QB position.[/quote]

THIS!

That's why I say after we lose to CHI lets use that long week to get Howell going. What do u have to lose?? Maybe he ends up as the next RW.. U never know until u try. We know what Wentz is and we know what TH is...

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1325079]The dude is a goober. I just don't think he's smart enough to be a successful NFL QB.[/quote]

He was a stud athlete and thats why he was so good his first few years but injuries have killed his mobility

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1325085]I don't even think Wentz is much better than Taylor. He has a bigger arm but that doesn't make him better. If Taylor were starting we'd still be 1-4.

Also you have to look at the value. Taylor costs no draft picks and makes way less. We'd probably have the same record w/ Taylor, maybe better because you'd keep the 30 million and could get better guys to block, plus you'd have your draft picks for depth.

I knew this stupid ass trade was going to blow up in their stupid ass faces. Going after retread QB's rarely works. It's band aid football. You sign retreads as backups, not give them 30 million and numerous draft picks.

Draft QB's every year or almost every year. Always have a cheap vet around like Taylor or Bridgewater. The #1 reason why this team stinks is a total mismanagement of the QB position.[/quote]

Preach, skinsfan69!

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1325085]I don't even think Wentz is much better than Taylor. He has a bigger arm but that doesn't make him better. If Taylor were starting we'd still be 1-4.

Also you have to look at the value. Taylor costs no draft picks and makes way less. We'd probably have the same record w/ Taylor, maybe better because you'd keep the 30 million and could get better guys to block, plus you'd have your draft picks for depth.

I knew this stupid ass trade was going to blow up in their stupid ass faces. Going after retread QB's rarely works. It's band aid football. You sign retreads as backups, not give them 30 million and numerous draft picks.

Draft QB's every year or almost every year. Always have a cheap vet around like Taylor or Bridgewater. The #1 reason why this team stinks is a total mismanagement of the QB position.[/quote]

Have to have some one to evaluate talent though. We had plenty of cap space even after signing Wentz and did nothing of value with it. Let our only all pro go and replace him with Norwell. The front office error by this current leadership is mind boggling.

Agree we are no better record wise with Heinicke.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1325093]Have to have some one to evaluate talent though. We had plenty of cap space even after signing Wentz and did nothing of value with it. Let our only all pro go and replace him with Norwell. The front office error by this current leadership is mind boggling.

Agree we are no better record wise with Heinicke.[/quote]

Norwell is going to go down as one of my least favorite Redskins/WFT/Commie players of all times. What a bum.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[IMG]https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/900/pass-chart_WEN615770_2022-REG-5_1665347556553.jpeg[/IMG]

Carson had a pretty good game against a not very good defense.

Wish he ended the night w 361 yds, 3 titties and 0 picks

Down 4 w 4:40 left .. we engineered an 18 play drive to get it down to first and goal.

Titans are not a good team, we are not a good team.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Wentz and Heinicke keep me at home.

If Howell starts, I would go watch games solely to watch him.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Wentz isn't the problem, in fact we have 1 win solely on him and that GW Drive he had.

He isn't great but he's way better than TH. Guys we have seen TH for 2 years, he's a nice story but he cant throw downfield. That's why I say Howell because he has a good arm and mobility. So what he's a 5th rd pick.. Throw him out there

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Wentz is 2nd in Yards thrown in the air behind Allen. Meaning Wentz airs it out nit just checking down or throwing screens

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1325226]Wentz is 2nd in Yards thrown in the air behind Allen. Meaning Wentz airs it out nit just checking down or throwing screens[/quote]

This is interesting.

3rd in air yards w 836 yds. Josh Allen leads w 998, G Smith w 907, Matt Ryan 834

27th or so in air yds/attempt w 4.0 yds per.

15th in pass plays over 10 yds

8th pass plays over 20

3rd in pass plays over 30

6th pass plays over 40

2nd in being blitzed (65 times)

1st in "bad passes" w 43, Stafford second w 35

[url]https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/advanced-stats-qb.php[/url]
^ i have no idea about this websites veracity

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Wish we hit on more mid level passes. Its like short pass throwing out of pressure or a long bomb. No intermediate.

No seams to TEs.
No deep outs.
No tiered route running out of bunch formation attacking all 3 levels

Welcome Carson Wentz
 

He is a gunslinger who needs a perfect team around him to be most effective. Look at his best year, that team won with Nick Foles at quarterback. He needs it perfect to use his legs, and his arm. Any breakdown anywhere and he becomes Russian roulette- hit or miss. The Colts were not a good team around him last year, and we are even worse. Basically if you have a great oline that will give you way more then average time to make a decision he is good. You got a good playcaller, and solid weapons to go along with that oline he has the tools to make any throw. He is not the guy who puts a team on his back. He is the cherry not the cake.

We are so far away from being that team he needs. It’s truly a match made in hell. Lol

I definitely had hopes of our oline and weapons being there for him to take his time and then run or sling it but our oline is trash. It was truly one of my biggest worries before the season. It was the 2000 pound gorilla in the room. There was this sense it was good to go but i had strong doubts and they have become reality, sadly.
That being said we dont have the time to build around him so it all must be burnt to the ground.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=punch it in;1325240]He is a gunslinger who needs a perfect team around him to be most effective. Look at his best year, that team won with Nick Foles at quarterback. He needs it perfect to use his legs, and his arm. Any breakdown anywhere and he becomes Russian roulette- hit or miss. The Colts were not a good team around him last year, and we are even worse. Basically if you have a great oline that will give you way more then average time to make a decision he is good. You got a good playcaller, and solid weapons to go along with that oline he has the tools to make any throw. He is not the guy who puts a team on his back. He is the cherry not the cake.

We are so far away from being that team he needs. It’s truly a match made in hell. Lol

I definitely had hopes of our oline and weapons being there for him to take his time and then run or sling it but our oline is trash. It was truly one of my biggest worries before the season. It was the 2000 pound gorilla in the room. There was this sense it was good to go but i had strong doubts and they have become reality, sadly.
That being said we dont have the time to build around him so it all must be burnt to the ground.[/quote]

You drop him behind a top 5 OL, and he can be pretty damn solid. Drop him behind our shitshow and well...1-4.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1325243]You drop him behind a top 5 OL, and he can be pretty damn solid. Drop him behind our shitshow and well...1-4.[/quote]

Yeah he's a good QB when he has time, he has shown that he can make big time throws but man he is just bad when pressure is on him.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1325267]Yeah he's a good QB when he has time, he has shown that he can make big time throws but man he is just bad when pressure is on him.[/quote]

But whoooo, whooooo is responsible for replacing Scherff and Flowers with Turnstile #1 (Andrew Norwell) and Turnstile #2 (Trai Turner)?

Credit to Ron because he stays professional (most of the time, I thought the Jamin Davis/qb remarks weren't professional) but the results are ugly. And in this business you are judged on results.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

I'm not going to shit on Wentz because he is exactly who he has been.
If your line sucks midget balls then you have to get the ball out quicker.

Wentz is stubborn as shit and refuses to adapt his game.
Turner is clueless and has no idea how to adapt.
Ron is a retard who is just here to get jobs for Norv and Jacks sons.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=jamf;1325311]I'm not going to shit on Wentz because he is exactly who he has been.
If your line sucks midget balls then you have to get the ball out quicker.

Wentz is stubborn as shit and refuses to adapt his game.
Turner is clueless and has no idea how to adapt.
Ron is a retard who is just here to get jobs for Norv and Jacks sons.[/quote]

Wentz's game suffered after the injury. He's scared to run now

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1325289]But whoooo, whooooo is responsible for replacing Scherff and Flowers with Turnstile #1 (Andrew Norwell) and Turnstile #2 (Trai Turner)?

Credit to Ron because he stays professional (most of the time, I thought the Jamin Davis/qb remarks weren't professional) but the results are ugly. And in this business you are judged on results.[/QUOTE]


In three years Ron has done so much damage with his personnel decisions it is almost criminal.
Im confused about what you mean by staying professional? After every loss he has blamed a unit or a player. I mean he doesn’t get caught with strippers or making racist remarks but is that how low the bar has become for staying professional? I see nothing but a piss poor coach who is never prepared and has absolutely no eye for talent whatsoever that likes to point fingers. Everyone knows Ron is the problem except for Ron.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1325222]Wentz isn't the problem, in fact we have 1 win solely on him and that GW Drive he had.

He isn't great but he's way better than TH. Guys we have seen TH for 2 years, he's a nice story but he cant throw downfield. That's why I say Howell because he has a good arm and mobility. So what he's a 5th rd pick.. Throw him out there[/quote]

And what has having a QB w/ a bigger arm got you? One win by the skin of your teeth against the Jags. 1-4!!

Wentz is supposed to push you to more wins. This team got 7 w/ Taylor. Right now we may not get that w/ a way more expensive QB w/ a bigger arm and a weak schedule. Also Wentz has better weapons. How do you potentially get worse w/ a supposed better QB? Maybe cause he really isn't all that better.

Howell probably isn't ready. It just sends a terrible message to your team at this point in the season- putting in a 5th round rookie over your 28 mill QB who you gave up draft picks for.

They have to stick w/ Wentz simply because of politics.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/sports/commanders-carson-wentz-already-losing-142700610.html[/url]

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1325340]And what has having a QB w/ a bigger arm got you? One win by the skin of your teeth against the Jags. 1-4!!

Wentz is supposed to push you to more wins. This team got 7 w/ Taylor. Right now we may not get that w/ a way more expensive QB w/ a bigger arm and a weak schedule. Also Wentz has better weapons. How do you potentially get worse w/ a supposed better QB? Maybe cause he really isn't all that better.

Howell probably isn't ready. It just sends a terrible message to your team at this point in the season- putting in a 5th round rookie over your 28 mill QB who you gave up draft picks for.

They have to stick w/ Wentz simply because of politics.[/quote]

You cannot draw conclusions from the QB change in isolation, the collapse of the O line has to be taken into account. It was way better for Heinike last year and the FO failure in that area has all but negated any benefit seen from having a stronger armed QB. We used a 2nd pick on a backup DT , in hindsight a guard (or CB) with that pick would look pretty good right now. Like with all such instances it is difficult to assess the quality of individual players on the roster when there have been wholesale failures in coaching and recruitment across the board.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

The new ESPN article say it was Snyder who pushed for the Wentz signing. He's still not done meddling in player decisions.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=irish;1325349]The new ESPN article say it was Snyder who pushed for the Wentz signing. He's still not done meddling in player decisions.[/quote]

Regrdless, something had to be done at QB. You can't role into a season year 3 of your coaching contract with TH as your starting QB.

This has been beaten to death but Wentz was the best we were ever going get in the off season. He is a upgrade over TH.

Honestly be happy we didn't sell the farm on Wilson that been a real blow.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

Beating a dead horse here but just another further indictment on not utilizing personnel properly.

[url]https://www.hogshaven.com/2022/10/13/23402169/40-pass-attempts-has-never-worked-with-wentzs-he-has-thrown-40-attempts-four-times-with-washington[/url]

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

@WalterPicksApp
Top 10 fantasy QB’s through week 5:

1. Josh Allen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Jalen Hurts
4. Patrick Mahomes
5. Kyler Murray
6. Joe Burrow
7. Geno Smith
8. Carson Wentz
9. Jared Goff
10. Justin Herbert

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=mredskins;1325356]Regrdless, something had to be done at QB. You can't role into a season year 3 of your coaching contract with TH as your starting QB.

This has been beaten to death but Wentz was the best we were ever going get in the off season. He is a upgrade over TH.

Honestly be happy we didn't sell the farm on Wilson that been a real blow.[/quote]

I agree a change needed to be made but the real point is that Wentz is Snyder's guy not Rivera's guy. Once again a coach is being forced to use a QB that he doesn't want.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=irish;1325362]I agree a change needed to be made but the real point is that Wentz is Snyder's guy not Rivera's guy. Once again a coach is being forced to use a QB that he doesn't want.[/quote]

I guess, but who would have been RR's guy (that was available and willing to come here)?

Matt Ryan

Marcus Mariota

Jimmy G

At this point Jimmy G was probably the best to get out of that QB class of trades and FA's but no one wanted to take a chance on his shoulder

The problems of this team run much deeper then the QB spot and Wentz.

At this point i say ride out Wentz and WHEN its clear as day we are out the playoff picture, ( some could argue its pretty much now) then I run Sam a few games to see what we really have in him so we make a sound QB decision for 23/24 season.

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

JP and B Mitch are saying there’s a report that Wentz was a snyder decision

3rd bombshell report today … no idea if this Wentz thing is true

Re: Welcome Carson Wentz
 

[quote=SunnySide;1325398]JP and B Mitch are saying there’s a report that Wentz was a snyder decision

3rd bombshell report today … no idea if this Wentz thing is true[/quote]

Don't wanna believe it, but it wouldn't surprise me.

This franchise has more red flags than China.