Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

Gordon's new jersey number.



[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/iQBW1zk.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

i dunno, speeding and some pot isn't exactly a DUI or beating your wife. it's dumb and he should know better, but i'm not going to destroy the guy over it.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=That Guy;1073372]i dunno, speeding and some pot isn't exactly a DUI or beating your wife. it's dumb and he should know better, but i'm not going to destroy the guy over it.[/quote]

im not concerned about pot in general, but to be facing suspension he needs to be smarter. This could affect his appeal process.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

^^ No, it's not that bad and lots of folks in the NFL have done much worse. At the same time, the guy is a mega-million star talent and has already put himself at risk with drug issues. Why even be around it?

Given how much it is likely to cost him in the end, he better be getting some superstar quality weed. Seriously, just looking at it out to give you the munchies and cause you to start contemplating the incredible brilliance of whatever you happen to be thinking.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;1073346]Honestly if we could keep the logo, uniform, etc I would be more then happy to see the team name changed to Warriors.[/quote]

"Warriors"? But then I'd be offended.

The Redskins name is obviously not intended to slur any group, or else the team wouldn't have given THEMSELVES the name.

It has an entirely new meaning nowadays anyway--it refers to Washington's NFL team.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

Reid is the last person that should be arguing for anything. He is essentially the lefts answer to Ted Cruz. Right now a significant portion of the internet is at risk for the sake of benefiting a company who can barely get their stock price over the $50 mark with a virtual monopoly and we're focusing on the name of a football team.

[url=http://freebeacon.com/blog/comcast-is-buying-our-democracy-and-harry-reid-doesnt-care-because-hes-already-been-bought/]Comcast is Buying Our Democracy (And Harry Reid Doesn’t Care Because He’s Already Been Bought) | Washington Free Beacon[/url]
[quote]Then there are the campaign committees. Comcast donations to the Democratic National Committee and Democratic House and Senate committees total more than $1.8 million. And Comcast would certainly be short-changing its shareholders if it hadn’t bought off Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D., Nev.) as well. Don’t worry, they have.

Comcast is the fifth largest contributor to Reid’s campaign committee in the current cycle. The majority leader has received $76,550 from Comcast employees, and $23,000 from the company’s political action committees. He’s received an additional $101,350 from Comcast lobbyists and their family members. That includes $5,800 from Comcast lobbyist Waldo McMillan, a former Reid aide.

Oh yeah, there’s also the fact that Reid’s current chief of staff, David Krone, is a former senior vice president of corporate affairs at Comcast, and a former donor to Reid’s campaign. After joining Reid’s staff in 2008, Krone received a $1.2 million “severance” package from Comcast. More specifically, the company purchased Krone’s condo from him at a price well above the market value.

We already know that Harry Reid takes money from associates of the “un-American” Koch brothers. Now he’s willing to sit by and allow a giant cable corporation to buy our democracy, as long as they continue to fund his campaign/granddaughter’s trinket business. He might as well wear a Comcast insignia on his suit to denote its sponsorship.
[/quote]

[url=http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/27/harry-reid-net-neutrality_n_5399227.html]Harry Reid Speaks Softly On Net Neutrality[/url]
[quote]Reid is the only Democrat who actually controls a chamber -- and thus the only one in place to block House action on net neutrality. But for now, and unlike many of his colleagues, he's mostly keeping quiet.
[/quote]

So in short [URL="http://youtu.be/6_W_xLWtNa0?t=47s"]this is Harry Reid on Net Neutrality[/URL], and [URL="http://youtu.be/6_W_xLWtNa0?t=2m13s"]this is Harry Reid on the Redskins name[/URL]. (Note: Harry Reid is Shy Ronnie in these examples)

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=scowan;1073289]I'm about to open a can of worms I know, but what native americans of TODAY have endured hardships. If they have and are its because of their own choosing. This is like the Black community continuing to blame their struggles on whites when we are 40+ years from the civil rights movement. By the way, I see a black man in the oval office. At what point do you "join" America and take advantage of the freedom to choose you own future and outcome based on your abilty and quit blaming others for your struggles. Its not a perfect world I'll give you that, but there is more opportunity to rise above your condition in this country verses any other I know, but it seems like many want to continue to put the blame on others for their "condition" instead of rising above it through hard work and effort. Ok enough soapbox for me.

Our Congress just wants to continue to find "victims" they can champion. If its not the Redskins it would be another "victim" group. Instead of bringing people together, they just want to make us all hate each other for votes. Its all very sad.[/quote]


I appreciate your candor, but it does show that you don't have much insight into the complex legacy of racial issues in the US. The sad part is that most people not affected don't. I'm not white, black, or Native American - but I appreciate the history, and I've actually been to inner city neighborhoods and also to native american reservations. I won't change your mind in a message board, but I disagree on your views.

Few points:

1) Obama is as much white as he is black.

2) The financial profits for casinos on reservations are overstated (see [URL="http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=95944"]article here[/URL]. Only a few near major cities make substantial profits, and a good portion of Native Americans are still very poor and on welfare. You're essentially completely wrong.

3) Would everyone here be fine renaming the team "Rednecks", "Black Panthers" or "Jihadi's"? I think it's fair to say that a word or name can have powerful connotations to a subset of people. Redskins is such an old term, it has lost much of it's initial meaning, but let's be honest - the initial meaning was not something to be proud of..



Again, I'm actually fine keeping the name Redskins.. but I think the talk on this thread demonstrates the racial insensitivities that prove the other side's points..

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=ethat001;1073401]I appreciate your candor, but it does show that you don't have much insight into the complex legacy of racial issues in the US. The sad part is that most people not affected don't. I'm not white, black, or Native American - but I appreciate the history, and I've actually been to inner city neighborhoods and also to native american reservations. I won't change your mind in a message board, but I disagree on your views.

Few points:

1) Obama is as much white as he is black.

2) The financial profits for casinos on reservations are overstated (see [URL="http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=95944"]article here[/URL]. Only a few near major cities make substantial profits, and a good portion of Native Americans are still very poor and on welfare. You're essentially completely wrong.

3) Would everyone here be fine renaming the team "Rednecks", "Black Panthers" or "Jihadi's"? I think it's fair to say that a word or name can have powerful connotations to a subset of people. Redskins is such an old term, it has lost much of it's initial meaning,[B] but let's be honest - the initial meaning was not something to be proud of..[/B]



Again, I'm actually fine keeping the name Redskins.. but I think the talk on this thread demonstrates the racial insensitivities that prove the other side's points..[/quote]
I take it you have not had an opportunity to review Bruce's letter?

[url]http://files.redskins.com/pdf/letter-from-bruce-allen.pdf[/url]

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

That letter was great, got it in my email the other day.. Thanks, Bruce.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Hog1;1073402]I take it you have not had an opportunity to review Bruce's letter?

[url]http://files.redskins.com/pdf/letter-from-bruce-allen.pdf[/url][/quote]

Some people have honest intentions but as the saying goes the road to hell is paved with good intentions. I feel others like Reid are using it to distract from other more immediate issues facing the country like in the case of Reid net neutrality, the Comcast-Time Warner merger, and the veterans affairs scandal.

Though as BA kind of pointed out with a lot of these Senators so many of them crying foul and willing to go to the mattresses to get the name changed yet for years many of them have been ignoring the more critical issues surrounding basic quality of life on reservations. Doesn't make our view right just that when someones house is on fire you don't focus on someone leaving the lights on.

Honestly if it were up to me I would have it where every Native American that has ever lived on a reservation and is at least 15 years of age be allowed to vote. If the vote comes 70% or more in favor of the team keeping their name then the team should be given a 25 year pass before another vote is held.

Not to sound crass but non-natives can be as offended as they want for Native Americans really the only thing that matters is how Native Americans as a whole feel about this issue. For me personally if more then 30% found the name offensive I would find that as reason enough to change the name. After all you can't just flat out ignore a minority view just because they don't have enough support though by the same token you can't be taken hostage by it either.

The saddest part through of this whole tragedy might be that if the Redskins can hold out past the midterm election that the issue could end up loosing significant momentum until 2016 which in the end would mean that a bunch of politicians were trying to collect votes for the midterm elections.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

The Washington Football Redskins - There's your new name.

The Tomahawks

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Hog1;1073402]I take it you have not had an opportunity to review Bruce's letter?

[url]http://files.redskins.com/pdf/letter-from-bruce-allen.pdf[/url][/quote]

Bruce's letter doesn't mean squat. If many members of race of people are offended by a name, then they are offended.

The name must go. In time, it will go. Dan Snyder is on the wrong side of history on this issue.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

.....Really?
do the Indians that admire and respect the name and team not count?

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Hog1;1073410].....Really?
[B]do the Indians that admire and respect the name and team not count?[/B][/quote]

No, they don't count because they are completely drowned out by voices from the other side, some of whom are Indians, too. Thus the "some Indians take pride in the name" argument, true as it is, is irrelevant. Most folks don't or won't hear it. I'm not saying this situation is right but this is what is.

The noise from the change-the-name crowd will just get more deafening. We might as well cut our losses and change the name sooner rather than later.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

The Washington Washingtons.

Problem solved.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

Maybe....Indians? Shit..taken
"""""[B]I'm not saying this situation is right[/B] but this is what is"""""

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

Anyone ever wonder why KC made their team so similar to the Redskins, I mean the Chiefs with yellow red and white . . . guess they aren't very creative in Kansas.

They shoulda been like the Tinmen, or the Wizards . . . d'oh . . . nevermind.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

The Washington Redskins. Problem solved.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

Apparently john elway raised a son who now throws women out of moving cars.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Chico23231;1073417]Apparently john elway raised a son who now throws women out of moving cars.[/quote]

You sure we're not talking about [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappaquiddick_incident"]Ted Kennedy's kid[/URL]?
[IMG]http://tommcmahon.typepad.com/.a/6a00d834515db069e20115714e8332970b-800wi[/IMG]

#TrueStory

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;1073412]The Washington Washingtons.

Problem solved.[/quote]

Actually the most creative solution I heard recently was Washington Americans. Changing the name while keeping the logo to keep in step with Snyders Original Americans Foundation.

[url=http://boston.cbslocal.com/2014/05/30/a-simple-yet-strong-solution-to-washington-redskins-name-controversy/]Washington Redskins Name Controversy: A Simple Solution « CBS Boston[/url]

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

I'm so tired of this story and it won't go away until Daniel changes the name. I'll still root for the team no matter what they change it to. It sucks to see it unfold like this.
I've always thought about the possibility of Jerry Jones paying people to make the team name an issue. To create controversy and distract.

[IMG]http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/02/7usa3u8y.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/02/a7yzude8.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/02/hyny4etu.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;1073420]Actually the most creative solution I heard recently was Washington Americans. Changing the name while keeping the logo to keep in step with Snyders Original Americans Foundation.

[url=http://boston.cbslocal.com/2014/05/30/a-simple-yet-strong-solution-to-washington-redskins-name-controversy/]Washington Redskins Name Controversy: A Simple Solution « CBS Boston[/url][/quote]

what a terrible terrible name. we already have the patriots. why not just call them the Washington People? that's just as generically stupid and awful.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=TexSkins;1073423]I'm so tired of this story and it won't go away until Daniel changes the name. I'll still root for the team no matter what they change it to. It sucks to see it unfold like this.
I've always thought about the possibility of Jerry Jones paying people to make the team name an issue. To create controversy and distract.[/quote]

Kind of alluded to this last night but the sickest part of this is that there's a decent chance of the issue loosing steam in the short term so long as the Skins hold out past November for the midterm elections (which shouldn't be too hard). Obviously that would be great for us to have the distractions die down for a bit but all it would really mean is that a bunch of Senators were patronizing Native Americans to get support for the upcoming election.

Ironically enough I had been wondering how this controversy which I imagine most of have known about for years suddenly got put into the national spotlight. Then I realized that we were in an election year, not to mention that a decent portion of the 50 senators probably need an issue to get some good press.

Personally I would appreciate it if they focused on getting net neutrality back as even though I know the team name is a real issue I'd have to imagine it kind of pales when compared to net neutrality and two pending mega mergers with Comcast-Time Warner and AT*T-DirectTV

[quote=That Guy;1073425]what a terrible terrible name. we already have the patriots. why not just call them the Washington People? that's just as generically stupid and awful.[/quote]

Well I admit the isn't awesome in and of itself, however I really did think it was neat suggestion to have a team named the Americans with a Native American as their logo. I imagine if someone was writing a TV show or movie with a sports team called the Americans they'd probably use a flag, eagle, solider, etc, basically a whole bunch of other options before the idea of using a Native American even popped into mind.

As far as alternate names go for some reason I still like Warriors, and sadly I think its because its the one that Snyder apparently applied for a trademark for.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

This story is not going away ,I do believe it is stupid the name has been around for too long for it to be offensive now. With that said the only thing I would do if I'm Dan is a small compromise ,go back to the yellow helmet with the R and spear or even make it burgundy keep the colors and just call them the "skins" as in shirts and skins ,done .

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=Mattyk;1073156]Not sure how changing a major brand would result in some sort of financial windfall. A lot of alienated fans wouldn't exactly be lining up to spend their hard earned $$ out of protest.

Think about it with another team. If the Steelers were to change their name and logo does anyone think that would be a good thing for them? A hardcore passionate fan base isn't going to forgive and forget overnight.[/quote]Snyder ultimately has to do right by his fanbase, which is what he's trying to do here. But I think you and I both know that the fans of this organization would absolutely get behind the new name of the team the second they change the name. If 20 years of struggling on the field hasn't weakened the fanbase, what the heck is a name change going to do?

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=ethat001;1073401]I appreciate your candor, but it does show that you don't have much insight into the complex legacy of racial issues in the US. The sad part is that most people not affected don't. I'm not white, black, or Native American - but I appreciate the history, and I've actually been to inner city neighborhoods and also to native american reservations. I won't change your mind in a message board, but I disagree on your views.

Few points:

1) Obama is as much white as he is black.

2) The financial profits for casinos on reservations are overstated (see [URL="http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=95944"]article here[/URL]. Only a few near major cities make substantial profits, and a good portion of Native Americans are still very poor and on welfare. You're essentially completely wrong.

3) Would everyone here be fine renaming the team "Rednecks", "Black Panthers" or "Jihadi's"? I think it's fair to say that a word or name can have powerful connotations to a subset of people. [B]Redskins is such an old term, it has lost much of it's initial meaning, but let's be honest - the initial meaning was not something to be proud of..
[/B]


Again, I'm actually fine keeping the name Redskins.. but I think the talk on this thread demonstrates the racial insensitivities that prove the other side's points..[/quote]

I think that's up for considerable debate. Have not heard a compelling/definitive argument that the initial meaning was offensive.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073434]I think that's up for considerable debate. Have not heard a compelling/definitive argument that the initial meaning was offensive.[/quote]

How many people actually use the word Redskins as a derogatory term? Feels like when the name comes up, people automatically think of the football team.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073434]I think that's up for considerable debate. Have not heard a compelling/definitive argument that the initial meaning was offensive.[/quote]

[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redskin_(slang[/URL])

This is what I think people are referring to when it was used (if ever) in the terms to describe this .Now I know it is not the best or most reliable source but it is what most people go to for info .Thing is it is the only place I find this explanation for a negative connotation to the word .It also talks about the comparison to the word negro but I am sure that has always had a negative slant on it and personally don't think the two are the same .Unfortunately this is beginning to snowball and something will have to be done sooner or later .

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1073409]Bruce's letter doesn't mean squat. If many members of race of people are offended by a name, then they are offended.

The name must go. In time, it will go. Dan Snyder is on the wrong side of history on this issue.[/quote]

I'm sure you're aware that there's a number of high schools here in America with a majority Native-American population that still use the nickname Redskins. Suzan Harjo should perhaps unite her fellow "offended" Native Americans if she wants to succeed.

In addition, there's considerable evidence that the name did not begin as a racist term. And obviously it's not used as a derogatory term today. So why must it go?

[url=http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/hail-to-the-redskins-nfl-must-save-name-image-legacy/25861/]Hail To the Redskins: NFL Must Save Name, Image, Legacy[/url]

[url=http://www.slate.com/blogs/lexicon_valley/2013/12/18/redskins_the_debate_over_the_washington_football_team_s_name_incorrectly.html]Redskins: The debate over the Washington football team's name incorrectly invokes history.[/url]

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;1073433]Snyder ultimately has to do right by his fanbase, which is what he's trying to do here. But I think you and I both know that the fans of this organization would absolutely get behind the new name of the team the second they change the name. If 20 years of struggling on the field hasn't weakened the fanbase, what the heck is a name change going to do?[/quote]

Exactly. If anything a name change might help as it would provide a clean slate after all the years of front office dysfunction and lack of on-field performance.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=mooby;1073436]How many people actually use the word Redskins as a derogatory term? Feels like when the name comes up, people automatically think of the football team.[/quote]

Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"

I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me

[QUOTE=That Guy;1073425]what a terrible terrible name. we already have the patriots. why not just call them the Washington People? that's just as generically stupid and awful.[/QUOTE]


Lol. The Washington People. I love it. Although the animal folks might be offended. So the Washington Creatures of God? Wait the atheists. The Washington Inhabitants of the Planet Earth!

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073441]Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"

I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, [B]but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me[/B][/quote]

Yes well said and not only with this issue, but many others as well.

But with this specific issue, I'd like to know why sudden change which caused them to be offended? When did term "Redskins" suddenly cross the line as derogatory?

Back to your point of "They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made"...that is a good way to put it, because these "little" and "meaningless" victories of today's culture are the easiest. When it comes to the "heavy lifting", this/our generation of people just doesnt get it.

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1073441]Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"



I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me[/QUOTE]


I agree 100 %. They could give two craps about them. I still say that most people think of Indians or Native Americans when you say Redskins. Granted they think of the football team first, but you must quickly assimilate if you have ever seen our emblem no?

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073441]Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"

I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me[/quote]

Well said and I agree.

But I also see the tidal wave of uninformed initiative which will only get louder and more annoying until the name is changed.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073441]Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"

I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, [B]but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me[/B][/quote]

Seems like this is a trending thing nowadays. Also great post, something tells me you're probably right.

Re: Paintrain's all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread (Version 2.0)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1073441]Which was my point earlier. No one thinks Native Americans when they think of "Redskins" because truth be told most people simply don't think of Native Americans. Let's say the name changes, do we really believe all these clamoring for a name change are gonna say "Well'that's just the first step. Let's improve their living conditions, address issues such as illiteracy, alcoholism, poverty in the NA community" No....Hell to the No. They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made!"

I'm not a gung ho keep the name at all costs guy, but the fake sincerity of those that demand the name change irks me[/quote]



/drops mic

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1073443]Yes well said and not only with this issue, but many others as well.



But with this specific issue, I'd like to know why sudden change which caused them to be offended? When did term "Redskins" suddenly cross the line as derogatory?



Back to your point of "They'll just pat themselves on the back and say "Look at the change we made"...that is a good way to put it, because these "little" and "meaningless" victories of today's culture are the easiest. When it comes to the "heavy lifting", this/our generation of people just doesnt get it.[/QUOTE]


As far as the name suddenly becoming offensive. I think - even though we all know its political bs - that the fact that regular people will maybe back the oneida tribe or bob effin costas, etc about it being offensive is just public awareness. Hell it wasnt really that long ago that restrooms had signs for "colored" people. The premise of appeasing all people is wonderful, but as i have said a million times - i dont think its offensive to most native Americans. Bruces letter says it all imo.