Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;890422]Dan McKlurken says we will outbid Cleveland and get RGIII.[/quote]

who?

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Chico23231;890403]hold on...we arent talking 1st round? sorry even if we move back in the first that's unacceptable. 3rd round would be highest we should consider.[/quote]Cousins as your starting quarterback is a late-first guy. Cousins as not-yet-sure-hes-your-long-term-starter is a late two or early three guy.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

2012 Kirk Cousins=2011 Colin Kaepernick

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;890427]Cousins as your starting quarterback is a late-first guy. Cousins as not-yet-sure-hes-your-long-term-starter is a late two or early three guy.[/quote]

I wouldn't mind him with our 2nd rd pick.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;890429]2012 Kirk Cousins=2011 Colin Kaepernick[/quote]

Why do you think that? Cousins is a more polished passer in my opinion, I remember Kaeprnick being rather raw, but having the physical measurables.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;890426]who?[/quote]

Dan McKlurken

He's a weiner Lions fan that sits in one of our scheduling cubicles.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;890432]Dan McKlurken

He's a weiner Lions fan that sits in one of our scheduling cubicles.[/quote]

So why is his opinion relevant? (or was the post a joke I was too dumb to get? Lol)

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;890400]You don't want to hear the answer[/quote]
I can handle it, I'm a man I'm 40! (well not really 40....)

I've only watched Cousins twice (both against Wisconsin).
Been meaning to get around to watching more of his games but I got nothing against the kid.
I thought he threw the ball well at the combine and answered, at least for me, some concerns about his arm strength.

Specifically, I thought that Foles had a much bigger arm then Cousins and wondered whether Cousins dirve the ball on some of the tougher NFL throws.
I don't think his skill warrants being placed in the same athletic/playmaking category as Tannehill (or Russell Wilson for that matter) but he has a good skill set none the less.

I like to use Andy Dalton as a measuring stick for physical skill set.
Other then coming from more of a pro-style offense Cousins isn't very dissimilar to Dalton.
But then again I didn't think that Dalton's skillset separated him that much form Ricky Stanzi.

When I think of Cousins the spectre of Russell Wilson, whom I think is a better prospect then Cousins, looms large.
If Russell Wilson could be available in the mid to late rounds it makes it hard for me to view Cousins as more then a 3rd round and down type of prospect.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

Dan really isnt relevant and I jokingly throw his name out there to see who bites on it.
He's usually right though.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

Haha nice. Does he have connections or is he more of an idiot savant?

I'm beyond tired of this qb talk and it's not even April? Ugh

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Mahons21;890431]Why do you think that? Cousins is a more polished passer in my opinion, I remember Kaeprnick being rather raw, but having the physical measurables.[/quote]

I meant more in terms of 2nd round pick who's kind of forgotten among the other rookie QBs and doesn't start (or hardly even play) for at least a year. Yet the head coach "loves him"

Wasn't talking as much about skill set

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;890385]The Wise article is mostly garbage aimed at the lowest common denominator. But he does make one really solid point: if the Shanaplan now calls to do what it takes to trade up and make Griffin the face of the franchise, what in the hell was he doing for two seasons?

The argument that Shanahan has taken a measured principled approach to rebuilding the Redskins has never looked more ridiculous than it does right now. The guy is just trying to do what he can to win games, and he may very well believe that Robert Griffin gives him the best chance to do that.

I'll be interested who the first poster to link the McNabb benching to his opinion on RG3 as a prospect is, since everything has been premeditated.[/quote]

Clearing cap space and stockpiling draft picks. Yes, he missed on QB, but everyone does. Being able to use free agency to offset trading away the 2nd and 3rd round picks isn't a terrible situation to be in. The previous regime would have no money to spend and very few draft picks to leverage.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;890451]I meant more in terms of 2nd round pick who's kind of forgotten among the other rookie QBs and doesn't start (or hardly even play) for at least a year. Yet the head coach "loves him"

Wasn't talking as much about skill set[/quote]

Any specific reason why he loves him?

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;890422]Dan McKlurken says we will outbid Cleveland and get RGIII.[/quote]

I hope they draw the line at 1,2,3 this year and next year's 1. Take it or leave it.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

I sure hope we are interested in Nate Potter OT/OG from Boise State. The dude could start at RT right away IMO.

We need RG3 simple as that. Quit trying to go after the lesser guys shanahan! Just give up the picks and get Griffin.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=mbedner3420;890453]Any specific reason why he loves him?[/quote]

Well actually I was talking about Harbaugh loving Kaepernick

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

I know its pointless but whenever a QB from last year's class is mentioned I can't help but think how much different this team's outlook would be if we had somehow drafted (traded up for them).

Looking back its amazing the perception of last years QB class vs this years class and how off base that perception turned out to be.
Imo Colin Kaepernick skillset is easily on the same tier as Luck and Tannehill yet he went in the second round.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

Peter Schrager of Fox Sports has little doubt the Redskins will "end up making the most aggressive (and fruitful) play for RG3" in the draft.

[url=http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/Mock-Draft-post-NFL-Scouting-Combine-Andrew-Luck-Robert-Griffin-III-022812]Schrager: Post-NFL Scouting Combine mock draft - NFL News | FOX Sports on MSN[/url]

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=30gut;890462]Imo Colin Kaepernick skillset is easily on the same tier as Luck and Tannehill yet he went in the second round.[/quote]*sighs*

I know Kaepernick is tall and athletic and throws a good bucket pass, but I'm going to say that lumping him in with Luck is worse than lumping Tannehill with Luck.

I do see Kaepernick and Tannehill though. Very different offensive schemes, but more similar than different in skills.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;890469]*sighs*

I know Kaepernick is tall and athletic and throws a good bucket pass, but I'm going to say that lumping him in with Luck is worse than lumping Tannehill with Luck.

I do see [B]Kaepernick and Tannehill though[/B]. Very different offensive schemes, but more similar than different in skills.[/quote]

I agree Kaepernick and Tannehill are similar, but Kaepernick has no reason to even be honored in the same discussion as Luck or RG3. Watch Kaepernick at Nevada, played against awful defenses, had an odd throwing motion/release. Luck and Griffin played against talented teams and produced week in and week out.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[url=http://draftbreakdown.com/?s=Kirk+Cousins]Draft Breakdown — Search Results — Kirk Cousins[/url]

Some good footage of cousins for those of you with some spare time on their hands.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=GTripp0012;890469]*sighs*

I know Kaepernick is tall and athletic and throws a good bucket pass, but I'm going to say that lumping him in with Luck is worse than lumping Tannehill with Luck.

I do see Kaepernick and Tannehill though. Very different offensive schemes, but more similar than different in skills.[/quote]*sighs* Skill set is not the sum of a prospect.
2 QBs can have the same physical skill set yet grade out completely differently.
For some reason you struggle with the notion of physical skill set being part of a QBs profile yet not the sum of that propsect.
Kaepernik has a much bigger arm then Griffin, Luck and Tannehill and he's at least the athletic equal to Tannehill and superior to Luck.
He's on the same tier as Griffin although not his equal.

But, I guess I should expect this from you since for whatever reason you cannot admit that Tannehill is a better athlete then Luck.
[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/46757-yet-another-qb-rumors-thread-volume-30.html#post889702[/url]

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

For Tannehill and Kaepernick to be equal or surperior athletes to Luck they would have to be equal or surperior to Cam Newton right?

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;890489]For Tannehill and Kaepernick to be equal or surperior athletes to Luck they would have to be equal or surperior to Cam Newton right?[/quote]Nope.
But I guess you would have to think that [I][B]if[/B][/I] you think Luck is an equal or superior athlete to Newton.
I know that is what they tried to push in the media at the combine by touting Luck's unofficial 40 vs Newton's official 40 and forgetting that Newton is also taller, bigger, stronger.
But, to each there own.

Scratching my head as to whether we're all talking about the same Tannehill that was the leading WR for the Aggies 2 years in a row?

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

Are we talking QB skillset or just pure athlete skillset? And will I regret asking this question?

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

Bleacher report is saying the Skins will give up multiple number ones of RG III. That would be utterly moronic. I like the last report about Shanny and the QB situation and that is to trade down to #20 and get Weedan and an extra pick or two. Too many holes to give away so many #1s for one player. Again, it is a 50/50 proposition if RG III can bring home the bacon. And even if he did, we wouldn't be able to surround him with top talent.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=NM Redskin;890322]The big problem I see, is we would be out of position to grab Barkley. The guy is mostly likely gonna go #1 and if we're in the mid teens for our pick, imagine the ammo we would need to move up. I think at 6 this year we're in a perfect position to grab an elite QB at near the top.[/quote]

After hearing about the concerns scouts have with Barkley I think it's pretty safe to say that he would have been the 3rd QB in this draft.

Don't get me wrong, Barkley is a quality prospect and certainly much more promising then the Tannehill's of the world. However he doesn't have the greatest arm and is athletically average if that. RG3 has both the arm and athleticism not to mention he can match Barkley on the intangibles front.

Another thing to remember is Barkley's supporting cast is miles better then what RG3 had at Baylor. I think had the two gone head to head in this draft class Griffin would have gone first.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=30gut;890490]Nope.
But I guess you would have to think that [I][B]if[/B][/I] you think Luck is an equal or superior athlete to Newton.
I know that is what they tried to push in the media at the combine by touting Luck's unofficial 40 vs Newton's official 40 and forgetting that Newton is also taller, bigger, stronger.
But, to each there own.

Scratching my head as to whether we're all talking about the same Tannehill that was the leading WR for the Aggies 2 years in a row?[/quote]

I agree, and even RG3 combine results were overhyped. We already knew he was going to run a fast 40 time, have a good vertical, broad jump, and interview well. The kid is a smart with a good head on his shoulders, nothing new was learned at the combine, just the media needing something to talk about.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;890493]Are we talking QB skillset or just pure athlete skillset? And will I regret asking this question?[/quote]lol it depends on which conversation.
Athletic skillset/athleticism is a part of physical skillset which is subset of QB skillset and we've been discussing all of them at different times I guess.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;890455]I sure hope we are interested in Nate Potter OT/OG from Boise State. The dude could start at RT right away IMO.

We need RG3 simple as that. Quit trying to go after the lesser guys shanahan! Just give up the picks and get Griffin.[/quote]

Why are you ready to give up the bank for one player? I wouldn't give up the bank for Luck either. This team has no depth and most of our starting O line would be backups for the better teams in the league. Yeah go ahead and break the bank for RG III and with no O line to block for him he will result to being Vick in ATL. No thanks. Build the team right for a change. We have broken the bank trying to get the "sexy" pick only to have it blow up in our face all the time. Not knocking RG III, but we have serious holes on our fav team, and giving up mulitple first rounders or even multiple second round picks would be detrimental. Go for Tannehill or Weeden, or even Moore if it means keeping picks or gaining them. We need fresh young talent. What happens to our D if Fletcher leaves, or other stalwarts decide to bolt? Then you are in a big hole without picks in the future. RG III is a very talented guy, but so is Cam Newton and I am not sure Cam is going to win a SB in the near future if at all. A QB can't win a game on his own.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=SmootSmack;890429]2012 Kirk Cousins=2011 Colin Kaepernick[/quote]

Kouz (Pronounced Cuzz) Krusader just doesn't have the same ring as Kaep Krusader... :(

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Mahons21;890485][URL="http://draftbreakdown.com/?s=Kirk+Cousins"]Draft Breakdown — Search Results — Kirk Cousins[/URL]

Some good footage of cousins for those of you with some spare time on their hands.[/quote]


No to any MSU QB plain and simple. I am a Michigander and a Big Ten guy, and see MSU often. I like Cousins, but I don't see him any higher than the rest of the MSU Qbs in the NFL now, backups at best. MSU QBs do well because the program always seems to recruit TO type guys at WR.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=redskins5044;890498]I agree, and even RG3 combine results were overhyped. We already knew he was going to run a fast 40 time, have a good vertical, broad jump, and interview well. The kid is a smart with a good head on his shoulders, nothing new was learned at the combine, just the media needing something to talk about.[/quote]Flame suit on: I was actually dissappointed in Griffin's 40 time considering what he's capable of running.
We're talking about a rare specimen here.
A true to life Olympic caliber sprinter.

Now this has nothing to do with football, its not coming from that persepective at all but from a track prospective.
Marshall Faulk hinted at it but stopped short of explaining it.
I have a little bit of background in track myself and knowing that Griffin ran a 21.46/200m (IIRC) 2 years ago when he was a finalist for the Olympic trials, suggests using simple track logic that he should be around around a low 4.4 without breaking a sweat really.
If Griff really wanted to (i.e. trained) he could/should be capable of a lower 40 time, I'm talking low 4.3's.
And who knows he might put up that number at Baylor's pro day where the track will undoubtedly be faster.
BTW Vick's 4.33 was not ran at the combine so I'm not sure why he gets credit for that as his 'official' time.

end track specific rant back to football....

[QUOTE=30gut;890504]Flame suit on: I was actually dissappointed in Griffin's 40 time considering what he's capable of running.
We're talking about a rare specimen here.
A true to life Olympic caliber sprinter.

Now this has nothing to do with football, its not coming from that persepective at all but from a track prospective.
Marshall Faulk hinted at it but stopped short of explaining it.
I have a little bit of background in track myself and knowing that Griffin ran a 21.46/200m (IIRC) 2 years ago when he was a finalist for the Olympic trials, suggests using simple track logic that he should be around around a low 4.4 without breaking a sweat really.
If Griff really wanted to (i.e. trained) he could/should be capable of a lower 40 time, I'm talking low 4.3's.
And who knows he might put up that number at Baylor's pro day where the track will undoubtedly be faster.
BTW Vick's 4.33 was not ran at the combine so I'm not sure why he gets credit for that as his 'official' time.

end track specific rant back to football....[/QUOTE]

I just don't get why it was big news and all the talk was about how he improved his stock. To sort of quote Dennis green " he is who we thought he was". I am just tired of all these rumors and arguing about who we should draft or sign as QB. I don't even know who i prefer they get anymore, I change my mind everyday. I am glad I don't have to make the decision.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=30gut;890486]*sighs* Skill set is not the sum of a prospect.
2 QBs can have the same physical skill set yet grade out completely differently.
For some reason you struggle with the notion of physical skill set being part of a QBs profile yet not the sum of that propsect.
Kaepernik has a much bigger arm then Griffin, Luck and Tannehill and he's at least the athletic equal to Tannehill and superior to Luck.
He's on the same tier as Griffin although not his equal.

But, I guess I should expect this from you since for whatever reason you cannot admit that Tannehill is a better athlete then Luck.
[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/46757-yet-another-qb-rumors-thread-volume-30.html#post889702[/url][/quote]Pushing falsehoods is not the same as grading quarterbacks. Of course Andrew Luck is a better athlete than Tannehill.

It's an irrelevant argument since you're the only guy here who starts the quarterback discussion with athleticism, and then gets involved in this quarterback virtual reality where Andrew Luck is this unremarkable first round quarterback who anyone with a good build and a good arm gets compared to.

I thought comparing Tannehill and Kaepernick was a useful way to make your point about Kaepernick being undervalued last year, but your desire to make Luck seem like "one of the guys" undermined the argument you were actually trying to make.

I disagree that NFL Network is pushing a conspiracy to compare Luck and Newton as athletes. But Luck is in that kind of class as an athlete. Whether or not he'll be a better QB than Newton is up for debate and won't be answered for many years. But we already know that this is the kind of athlete we're talking about here.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=redskins5044;890506]I just don't get why it was big news and all the talk was about how he improved his stock. To sort of quote Dennis green " he is who we thought he was". I am just tired of all these rumors and arguing about who we should draft or sign as QB. I don't even know who i prefer they get anymore, I change my mind everyday. I am glad I don't have to make the decision.[/quote]I hear yah.
But at the end of the day its the media's job to sell things.
Yelling about Griffin/Luck is an easy way to sell the combine to the casual fan.
Fact of the matter is that coaches/exec/scouts all a test to the fact that the 2 most important events at the combines don't occur on the field: medical and interviews.
The whole 'player X stock rose' is hot air.
And I'm sure real scouts [I]hate[/I] it.
They literally work all year round tracking these players, talking to their coaches, friends, girlfriends, watching film, going to practices the idea that all their work is less important then a few ours in Indy is silly.

The only 'stock' that jumps at the combine is media 'scout' perceptions which are feed by the same coaches/execs/scouts and enter player agents lying throw their teeth to the media 'scouts' to get their message/agenda out there.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=30gut;890504]Flame suit on: I was actually dissappointed in Griffin's 40 time considering what he's capable of running.
We're talking about a rare specimen here.
A true to life Olympic caliber sprinter.

Now this has nothing to do with football, its not coming from that persepective at all but from a track prospective.
Marshall Faulk hinted at it but stopped short of explaining it.
I have a little bit of background in track myself and knowing that Griffin ran a 21.46/200m (IIRC) 2 years ago when he was a finalist for the Olympic trials, suggests using simple track logic that he should be around around a low 4.4 without breaking a sweat really.
If Griff really wanted to (i.e. trained) he could/should be capable of a lower 40 time, I'm talking low 4.3's.
And who knows he might put up that number at Baylor's pro day where the track will undoubtedly be faster.
BTW Vick's 4.33 was not ran at the combine so I'm not sure why he gets credit for that as his 'official' time.

end track specific rant back to football....[/quote]

How fast is Eli? I'll take some of that;)

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;890500]Why are you ready to give up the bank for one player? I wouldn't give up the bank for Luck either. This team has no depth and most of our starting O line would be backups for the better teams in the league. Yeah go ahead and break the bank for RG III and with no O line to block for him he will result to being Vick in ATL. No thanks. Build the team right for a change. We have broken the bank trying to get the "sexy" pick only to have it blow up in our face all the time. Not knocking RG III, but we have serious holes on our fav team, and giving up mulitple first rounders or even multiple second round picks would be detrimental. Go for Tannehill or Weeden, or even Moore if it means keeping picks or gaining them. We need fresh young talent. What happens to our D if Fletcher leaves, or other stalwarts decide to bolt? Then you are in a big hole without picks in the future. RG III is a very talented guy, but so is Cam Newton and I am not sure Cam is going to win a SB in the near future if at all. A QB can't win a game on his own.[/quote]

The result in Atlanta was the #1 rushing attack with a below average offensive line and a QB that wasn't much of a threat to throw due to his inability to put in the time and effort to learn the playbook. A QB who by his very presence alone opened running lanes for the Backs off the cutback lanes.

And keep in mind RG3 went 9-3 at Baylor. A school that typically got the in state leftovers from Texas, A&M, Texas Tech, and TCU while competing with SMU for those final scraps of the Texas High School football landscape.

I can't believe we would pass up the chance to pick a once in a decade QB because we weren't happy with our current situation at RT and LG. It is infinity easier to fill those positions then it is to fill the QB spot.

Heck if our offensive line is as bad as we think it is then we need RG3 as no QB extended and completed more plays last year after protection broke down then RG3. And believe me behind that Baylor O-Line protection broke down plenty.

Quantity does not equal quality.

Re: Yet Another QB Rumors Thread (Volume 9)
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;890513]I can't believe we would pass up the chance to pick a once in a decade QB because we weren't happy with our current situation at RT and LG. It is infinity easier to fill those positions then it is to fill the QB spot.[/quote]This easily falls in the category of nitpicking, but I have a tough time seeing how a once in a decade QB would be available with the second pick in his own draft. And how the team with the second pick would then trade the pick because "you know what, we're good!"