Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

Is Devin Thomas hurt? Why am I not seeing him on the field?

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=saden1;725040]Is Devin Thomas hurt? Why am I not seeing him on the field?[/quote]

He wasn't hurt MS said he was looking to see certain people today and I guess DT wasn't one of them. IMO this could mean

1. What MS said
2. DT has made the final 53
3. DT will be cut
4. Game 4 will be his final chance to make the team
5. DT will be traded SS bought this up last nite as a JOKE.
6. I'm reading to much into it.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

Thomas is making the team

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=Mattyk;725043]Thomas is making the team[/quote]There is a roster crunch coming that makes me skeptical that the Redskins are going to have space on the roster for everyone they want to keep (and I'm not sure how much Thomas fits in that category), but Thomas is a really great player on special teams, so I would think that if it's just him v. Terrence Austin purely on merit, Thomas would get the nod.

Austin does seem to have some upside as a receiver though.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

I love the way MS has taken charge of this whole show. He is a great coach and we are lucky to have him.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;725008]I hear ya Lotus, but I think it is preseason, and shanny didn't want to risk OT, more than getting the 6pt lead. Besides, our D will actually stop teams in the clutch this year![/quote]

I also think there is a greater potential for injury in a 2 pt conversion than an XP

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

^ I respectfully offer that not only was the 2-point conversion the right call, also we should be working on 2-pointers in the preseason. If we don't practice them in the preseason, when will we get live action practice?

We should have gone for 2 and Shanny missed it.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

Agreed, Armstrong should definitely make the team. No more practice squad for him, I think he has proven his value, esp against the Ravens.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=Lotus;725060]^ I respectfully offer that not only was the 2-point conversion the right call, also we should be working on 2-pointers in the preseason. If we don't practice them in the preseason, when will we get live action practice?

We should have gone for 2 and Shanny missed it.[/quote]

I don't know. If I'm a coach I don't want anyone to have an idea of what me or my players are going to do on a 2 point conversion until I really need it.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

Yeah I do not see a need to go for a 2 point conversion in a preseason game.

Especially when you have grey beard Brunnel under center for the Jets at this point in the game.

And what did the old man do, get sacked and fumble the ball, game over. Why show anything you do not want the other 13 teams we will play in the regular season some game tape of a 2point conversion play?

Lotus I just think you are trying to argue for the sake of having a debate. :)

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;725071]Yeah I do not see a need to go for a 2 point conversion in a preseason game.

Especially when you have grey beard Brunnel under center for the Jets at this point in the game.

And what did the old man do, get sacked and fumble the ball, game over. Why show anything you do not want the other 13 teams we will play in the regular season some game tape of a 2point conversion play?

[B]Lotus I just think you are trying to argue for the sake of having a debate.[/B] :)[/quote]

No I'm not.

To my detractors:
1) although the right move was to hedge bets with a 6 point lead, if the Jets had scored chances are they most likely would have gotten 7. So the argument about overtime does not work.

2) on 4th down on the last play of the game, we could have kicked but we ran the ball instead. If kicking was a way to avoid injury, as argued previously, then we would have kicked on the last play of the game.

3) I never said that we should open up the playbook. Just run off tackle or something. Run the same play which we ran, again, on 4th down the last play of the game.

4) The Jets could have run back the kickoff and we did not know Brunell would fumble. Brunell's gray beard had nothing to do with it.

I'm sorry but proper strategy is to go for 2 points. Other very smart and successful coaches have a handy 2-point chart, so Shanny could, too. Shanny blew the call. If he blows a 2-point call later in the season, you'll hear from me again.

All that said, it was not a big deal.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

If Shanahan goes for 2 points and misses, a touchdown beats you by three. If he goes for 2 and gets it, a touchdown still beats you by one.

Going for two would have been meaningless either way.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=Beemnseven;725085]If Shanahan goes for 2 points and misses, a touchdown beats you by three. If he goes for 2 and gets it, a touchdown still beats you by one.

Going for two would have been meaningless either way.[/quote]

Unless the extra point on the hypothetical Jets touchdown is missed. Good strategy means hedging your bet against that possibility by trying to create a 6-point cushion rather than just moving from a 4 to a 5 point lead.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=Lotus;725096]Unless the extra point on the hypothetical Jets touchdown is missed. Good strategy means hedging your bet against that possibility by trying to create a 6-point cushion rather than just moving from a 4 to a 5 point lead.[/quote]I do believe your "coaches maximize win expectancy in the preseason" assumption is a tad faulty. From a pure W/L perspective, we have absolutely nothing to gain from kicking the extra point there. Might as well take a knee on the PAT try.

But for Shanahan to have made the wrong call there, we have to assume that the goal is to win the preseason game, even if overtime is necessary. On the contrary, there's plenty of evidence that coaches are averse to overtime in preseason situations.

Jeff Fisher, who uses the chart, went for two down by four points in the final four minutes in the preseason's first week vs. Seattle. Of course, this is not what the chart suggests because the chart [U]always[/U] instructs coaches to play for the tie where applicable.

Re: Top to Bottom, Shanahan Takes Charge
 

[quote=GTripp0012;725098]I do believe your "coaches maximize win expectancy in the preseason" assumption is a tad faulty. From a pure W/L perspective, we have absolutely nothing to gain from kicking the extra point there. Might as well take a knee on the PAT try.

But for Shanahan to have made the wrong call there, we have to assume that the goal is to win the preseason game, even if overtime is necessary. On the contrary, there's plenty of evidence that coaches are averse to overtime in preseason situations.

Jeff Fisher, who uses the chart, went for two down by four points in the final four minutes in the preseason's first week vs. Seattle. Of course, this is not what the chart suggests because the chart [U]always[/U] instructs coaches to play for the tie where applicable.[/quote]

The Fisher example supports my argument: why not go for two and get some practice? And none of you naysayers has really responded to the question, "Why not?"

The point is simple: the difference between 4 or 5 points is meaningless, a 6 point lead likely is meaningless but might not be. So, in this case, you take the "might not be meaningless" option. Especially in a preseason game, where practicing scenarios is a good idea (see Jeff Fisher).

In the heat of battle, decision-making can become cloudy. This is why even the best coaches keep 2-point charts. I think I am right about Shanny blowing it, but even if I'm not, the arrogance of the practice of not keeping a chart frightens me.

My point is simple. Whether the point is accepted or not by others, I am done here.