Re: All things Middle East related
 

yeah, cause one idiot fires a gun, you have full authority to murder 2000 peaceful protestors (though these guys weren't exactly entirely peaceful).

i'll remember that next time some wack job tries to shoot up a school.

"oh, shots fired - let's just bring in some tanks and blow the entire building apart. those people stuck inside aren't students anymore, they're the enemy"


i'm just glad some of the people in this thread aren't in charge of response teams. you guys are scary and/or crazy and/or not really thinking about what you're suggesting.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=That Guy;939939]yeah, cause one idiot fires a gun, you have full authority to murder 2000 peaceful protestors (though these guys weren't exactly entirely peaceful).

i'll remember that next time some wack job tries to shoot up a school.

"oh, shots fired - let's just bring in some tanks and blow the entire building apart. those people stuck inside aren't students anymore, they're the enemy"


i'm just glad some of the people in this thread aren't in charge of response teams. you guys are scary and/or crazy and/or not really thinking about what you're suggesting.[/quote]


Peaceful? This is a hostile crowd attacking the embassy. You should fire warning shots up in the air and if that doesn't get them to scramble you shoot them in the face. I'm confident this is probably what happened but there was just too many of them.


...and this is coming from someone who has been deemed a liberal on this forum.

As for the stupid comparison to Blackwater, [URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2007/10/05/us-iraq-contractors-report-idUSN0439965120071005"]there is no moral equivalence[/URL].

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=saden1;939948]Peaceful? This is a hostile crowd attacking the embassy. You should fire warning shots up in the air and if that doesn't get them to scramble you shoot them in the face. I'm confident this is probably what happened but there was just too many of them.


...and this is coming from someone who has been deemed a liberal on this forum.

As for the stupid comparison to Blackwater, [URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2007/10/05/us-iraq-contractors-report-idUSN0439965120071005"]there is no moral equivalence[/URL].[/quote]saden and I don't agree on a lot politically, but I'm certainly in line with his Rules of Engagement.

This was a coordinated attack with insider support (at least it appears so in Libya). Response must be to devastate the groups that coordinated these attacks...wherever they are. If the host country does not support our tactical response.....and/or decide to get in the way....they go down too.

These violent extremists only understand force....nothing else.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

LOL...you guys crack me up.
Its been widely reported that Al Qaeda was responsible for this.
Not the civilian mob that was on the scene.
We've been drooping drone poop on them for a long time and will continue to do so.

"They go down too" .....lol

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;939959]LOL...you guys crack me up.
Its been widely reported that Al Qaeda was responsible for this.
Not the civilian mob that was on the scene.
We've been drooping drone poop on them for a long time and will continue to do so.

"They go down too" .....lol[/quote]You understand that there appear to be (at best case) terrorist sympathizers in Libya's security forces that gave away the position of our Ambassador.

[url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57511043/u.s-officials-deadly-libya-attack-likely-planned/]Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambassador J. Christopher Stevens - CBS News[/url]

You are extremely naive if you don't think there's a strong chance there are (again at best case) factions within the Libyan and Egyptian gov't that support these attacks. If we identify the terrorist groups within Libya/Egypt and where to attack....and the Libyan and/or Egyptian gov'ts won't allow us clearance or wind up notifying the terrorists of our plans....then absolutely we strike at their military infrastructure and claim a "stray missle" or something to that effect.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;939966]You understand that there appear to be (at best case) terrorist sympathizers in Libya's security forces that [COLOR="Red"][COLOR="Red"]gave away the position of our Ambassador.[/COLOR][/COLOR]

[url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57511043/u.s-officials-deadly-libya-attack-likely-planned/]Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambassador J. Christopher Stevens - CBS News[/url]

You are extremely naive if you don't think there's a strong chance there are (again at best case) factions within the Libyan and Egyptian gov't that support these attacks. If we identify the terrorist groups within Libya/Egypt and where to attack....and the Libyan and/or Egyptian gov'ts won't allow us clearance or wind up notifying the terrorists of our plans....then absolutely we strike at their military infrastructure and claim a "stray missle" or something to that effect.[/quote]

LOL.....he was in the consulate building. Whats to give away? Every Abdul in the town knows where that is.

And your stray missile comment is amusing.
Where does this stray missile come from?
One of our many training ranges in Egypt?

And regarding your faction comment regarding who supports these attacks, I'd be of the opinion that any swinging dick that reads a Koran fits that description.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=saden1;939948]Peaceful? This is a hostile crowd attacking the embassy. [COLOR="Red"][SIZE="3"]You should fire warning shots up in the air and if that doesn't get them to scramble you shoot them in the face.[/SIZE][/COLOR] I'm confident this is probably what happened but there was just too many of them.


...and this is coming from someone who has been deemed a liberal on this forum.

As for the stupid comparison to Blackwater, [URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2007/10/05/us-iraq-contractors-report-idUSN0439965120071005"]there is no moral equivalence[/URL].[/quote]

Whos going to fire the shots?
There were no Marines at this consulate. They were at the embassy in Tripoli.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;939954]saden and I don't agree on a lot politically, but I'm certainly in line with his Rules of Engagement.

This was a coordinated attack with insider support (at least it appears so in Libya). Response must be to devastate the groups that coordinated these attacks...wherever they are. If the host country does not support our tactical response.....and/or decide to get in the way....they go down too.

These violent extremists only understand force....nothing else.[/quote]

I am glad we agree and I hope we are on the same page in condemning Romney's disgraceful performance in the past 24 hours.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;939977]Whos going to fire the shots?
There were no Marines at this consulate. They were at the embassy in Tripoli.[/quote]

I thought 2 marines were killed in the attack.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;939976]LOL.....he was in the consulate building. Whats to give away? Every Abdul in the town knows where that is.

And your stray missile comment is amusing.
Where does this stray missile come from?
One of our many training ranges in Egypt?

And regarding your faction comment regarding who supports these attacks, I'd be of the opinion that any swinging dick that reads a Koran fits that description.[/quote]Read the link. From the link:

He said Stevens, 52, and other officials were moved to a second building - deemed safer - after the initial wave of protests at the consulate compound. [B][I]According to al-Sharef, members of the Libyan security team seem to have indicated to the protesters the building to which the American officials had been relocated, and that building then came under attack.[/I][/B]

This is a very fluid situation, an updated link:
[URL="http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=117838"]Defense.gov News Article: Official Details Benghazi Attack, Vows to Support Libya[/URL]

Once we've determined who's responsible, missle strikes can be done from our destroyers enroute to the Libyan coast, submarine assets, or other Air Force assets in the region. Special Forces can prepare for an assault and be in region with 24-48 hours.

As far a factions supporting this, I'm specifically speaking about government (or elements within the gov't) support for these attacks by Libya/Egypt.

You've done a bunch of LOL'ing at others, what do you propose we do here?

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=saden1;939983]I thought 2 marines killed in the attack.[/quote]You are correct.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=saden1;939982]I am glad we agree and I hope we are on the same page in condemning Romney's disgraceful performance in the past 24 hours.[/quote]I really wish we weren't in an election season right now. I believe it would've been best for Romney to make a statement condeming the acts forcefully and that we should never apologize for our freedom of speech, without taking shots at the POTUS. Better to wait and point out differences in strategy/position in the foreign policy debate.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;939986]I really wish we weren't in an election season right now. I believe it would've been best for Romney to make a statement condeming the acts forcefully and that we should never apologize for our freedom of speech, without taking shots at the POTUS. Better to wait and point out differences in strategy/position in the foreign policy debate.[/quote]

We agree again.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2012/09/does-not-represent-us-moving-photos-pro-american-rallies-libya/56803/]'This Does Not Represent Us': Moving Photos of Pro-American Rallies in Libya - Politics - The Atlantic Wire[/url]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

yes, the security forces tipped off the violent elements that used the crowd to hide in, and i'm pretty sure we're looking into dealing with as many of those criminal/murderous people as we can. no president loves drone death more than obama. if you can sniff the problem children out and stamp on them, great, but killing those that haven't done anything egregious is a great way to turn the entire country against you very quickly.

so you have to be really careful about shooting into crowds. generally you try to snipe the rpgs/leaders when they start pointing guns at you and that gets the message across really quickly. the thing you don't want to go is encourage anyone who's standing around to go home, get their guns, and come back looking for a fight.