Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]So that's not smart football in your book?

I thought you might be talking about his fumbling or the way he doesn't fair catch it when he should, etc.

But if you're just talking about blowing kisses on a return for a TD, c'mon who cares?[/QUOTE]Oh I was talking about that, too. I just wanted to give an example specific to Mr. Brown. Thrash fielded some punts at bad times, but he's a Redskin, because he is overall a "super-smart football player"

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

I believe Santana Moss has a MUCH better chance of taking a punt back than Mr. Brown.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Of course I'm saying it in hindsight, how else can someone review a game...

Meanwhile you're talking in hypotheticals, what use is that? If this, if that, but the end result is all that matters, and in this case the end result was a win.[/QUOTE]

That's great for LAST game - I'm talking about the next game. Harris is a liability and should be used only when ABSOLUTELY necessary. Using his lapses as examples is important, even if they don't result in scores. Think about it - why aren't defenses ranked solely by points given up? Because it's not just the points they give up that matter, but it's the OPPORTUNITIES they allow for other teams to score. Harris didn't get scored on this time, but, put in the same situation, he is going to give up big plays that will result in scores.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

Walts first year with us wasnt bad, but recently? Good God he his horrible. Gibbs had me shitting on myself with that run,run,run stuff. We could have put them away and he sat on the lead. Now our offense is the laughing stock of the league. Good job. I am happy with the win, but I have waited so long for some respect and we still dont get it. Come on Seattle..........look past us, I dare you!

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=onlydarksets]Harris didn't get scored on this time, but, put in the same situation, he is going to give up big plays that will result in scores.[/QUOTE]

Amen....which is exactly the point of titling the thread "Walt Harris scares me."

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

What I wanna know is......when Harris gives receivers a freaking 30 yd cushion....is that his call or does it have to do with the coverage they're running? To me it seems like he gives receivers way too much cushion.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=hurrykaine]Except, this thread isn't reviewing the game. We're reviewing the play, or lack thereof by one Walt Harris. Using the end result of the game to forgive woefully inadequate coverage skills during key moments before the game has ended isn't exactly balanced.[/QUOTE]

Just curious, what did Galloway's stats look like last week? I'm guessing he must have put up at least 150 considering how horrible Harris is.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Just curious, what did Galloway's stats look like last week? I'm guessing he must have put up at least 150 considering how horrible Harris is.[/QUOTE]

LOL, rest assured that Galloways ordinary stats had nothing to do with Harris' play. In fact, the one big 24 yd completion that Galloway caught was while Harris was covering him.

Defend Harris all you want Matty, and I'm as happy as you are with the end result of the game, but this thread is merely echoing the sentiment that many of us are scared to see this guy fill in for Springs. Sadly, there are few other options available at the moment. That doesn't change the fact that we're scared of him giving up the big play.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

Isn't Springs going to be playing this week? I don't really know why we're so concerned about Walt Harris when we're going to have both Springs and Rogers in the lineup.

Granted Springs will probably still be sore, but having him back makes Harris less of a concern.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=hurrykaine]LOL, rest assured that Galloways ordinary stats had nothing to do with Harris' play. In fact, the one big 24 yd completion that Galloway caught was while Harris was covering him.

Defend Harris all you want Matty, and I'm as happy as you are with the end result of the game, but this thread is merely echoing the sentiment that many of us are scared to see this guy fill in for Springs. Sadly, there are few other options available at the moment. That doesn't change the fact that we're scared of him giving up the big play.[/QUOTE]

Oh so this is all about a 24 yard completion? By the way Galloway exploded for 69 yards on 7 catches, but let's not give Harris any credit for that, after all he did give up a 24 yard catch.

Look, I wouldn't want Harris as my starter for 16 games either, but at this point what's the option? Jimoh?? Please.

My bigger concern in that game was when Taylor left. That's when the Bucs tried to go down the field and came really close a couple of times. Prior to Taylor leaving their deep game was non-existent.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]My bigger concern in that game was when Taylor left. That's when the Bucs tried to go down the field and came really close a couple of times. Prior to Taylor leaving their deep game was non-existent.[/QUOTE]

Exactly...now you're getting it (and not to be condescending, though I won't be surprised if you take it that way). Prior to Taylor leaving, Walt Harris wasn't tested. Galloway wasn't thrown to, hence his paltry stats. Once they started taking shots downfield after Taylor's ejection, Harris' inadequcies were showcased again.

But attributing Galloway's meager stats to the phenomenal job Harris did on him in coverage is pure BS. I was, am, and still remain SCARED OF HAVING HARRIS BACK IN ONE-ON-ONE COVERAGE against a #1 or #2 receiver (the point of this thread)

With Springs back, I'm less worried.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=hurrykaine]Exactly...now you're getting it (and not to be condescending, though I won't be surprised if you take it that way). Prior to Taylor leaving, Walt Harris wasn't tested. Galloway wasn't thrown to, hence his paltry stats. Once they started taking shots downfield after Taylor's ejection, Harris' inadequcies were showcased again.

But attributing Galloway's meager stats to the phenomenal job Harris did on him in coverage is pure BS. I was, am, and still remain SCARED OF HAVING HARRIS BACK IN ONE-ON-ONE COVERAGE against a #1 or #2 receiver (the point of this thread)

With Springs back, I'm less worried.[/QUOTE]

Galloway had 4-35 in the first half and 3-34 in the 2nd half.

Doesn't look like Harris was tested very much in the 2nd half without Taylor to me.

I'm not saying Harris did a great job, but did he do a poor job? Far from it.

You're scared of what could have been, or what could be. Fair enough, but the numbers on the field don't justify your fears, that's all I'm saying.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

I find it strange that the Bucs can get the ball to Galloway 7 times in a game and we can't get it to Moss more than 4 times. Same thing with Carolina. I can not understand why we don't just throw it up there and let him make a play. It works every single time.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Galloway had 4-35 in the first half and 3-34 in the 2nd half.

Doesn't look like Harris was tested very much in the 2nd half without Taylor to me.

I'm not saying Harris did a great job, but did he do a poor job? Far from it.

You're scared of what could have been, or what could be. Fair enough, but the numbers on the field don't justify your fears, that's all I'm saying.[/QUOTE]

Galloways numbers on the field certainly don't justify my fear of Harris. That is something you brought in as a distraction. Those numbers could be as much a function of Rogers and other safeties, and certainly can't be confidently attributable to Harris doing a good job.

Edell Shephard blowing by him does justify my fear of Harris. That's all I'm saying.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=hurrykaine]Galloways numbers on the field certainly don't justify my fear of Harris. That is something you brought in as a distraction. Those numbers could be as much a function of Rogers and other safeties, and certainly can't be confidently attributable to Harris doing a good job.

Edell Shephard blowing by him does justify my fear of Harris. That's all I'm saying.[/QUOTE]

Distraction? I used the numbers to back up my point. Galloway didn't do jack on Saturday, that was my point. So these concerns over Harris's abilities seem a little overblown to me, that's all.

By the way it was Rogers that Shepard toasted on the TD that was ruled incomplete. So should we be worried about Rogers too?

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Distraction? I used the numbers to back up my point. Galloway didn't do jack on Saturday, that was my point. So these concerns over Harris's abilities seem a little overblown to me, that's all.

By the way it was Rogers that Shepard toasted on the TD that was ruled incomplete. So should we be worried about Rogers too?[/QUOTE]

But it was Harris that was roasted on the overthrown TD. And it was Harris and Rogers in coverage on the TD you mention. Atleast Rogers made a play on that one -in fact, some analysts like the idiot Sean Salisbury point to the fact that Rogers was the one that caused the ball to bobble out. I'm not worried about the Rookie.

Pointing to Galloways numbers are a distraction because its not as though Harris was on Galloway the entire evening. Galloway was taken out the game by a plethora of DBs, of which Harris was only one. You talk as though Harris was in one-on-one with Galloway the entire game.

Bottom line, when the game was on the line, 4th and 10, they threw to Shephard who blew by Harris (wasn't even close) and fortunately the ball was long. Whew! That to me was scary.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

So Harris had nothing to do with the fine job our secondary did??

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]So Harris had nothing to do with the fine job our secondary did??[/QUOTE]

Harris got burned. The ball was long. That was scary. I never said that he can't play within the scheme with help. Its when he doesn't have help that he can't be relied upon.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]By the way it was Rogers that Shepard toasted on the TD that was ruled incomplete. So should we be worried about Rogers too?[/QUOTE]

Thank you, Matty. I was wondering if I was going to have to chime in here to correct that.

It was Rogers that was covering Edell Shepard on his dropped touchdown catch, not Walt Harris.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Let's not forget about that great tackle he had, probably saved a score![/QUOTE]

I had to remind a guy of that today. He isn't our first string punter and wasn't the second choice either. He got the job by default once we got in a bind with Groom. The tackle he made makes up for the shank in my book. He didn't just stand there, he ran the guy down and got him.

Harris is a fine nickel corner but will probably find himself fighting for a job during camp next year.

The bottom line is that with Taylor and Springs out our secondary isn't great. That should be expected (don't you think?)

If we are going to get into the "what if" discussions (what if Simms didn't overthorw so and so...) then we should mention that [u][i][b]if[/b][/i][/u] we needed to be in a shootout, Moss would have made some Tampa corners look pretty bad too... even with double coverage.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=bertoskins]cannot risk moss to return punts
better thrash or betts[/QUOTE]
what are you talking about?? this is crunch time, this is why he DIDNT return punts during the year... to protect him FOR the PLAYOFFS. we have to use him 2 or 3 returns a game. we didnt just get him for a wr, we got him for his gamebreaking ability and to help us win, putting him at PR will force short punts for no return or a guy who can take it to the house on a reg punt. YOU HAVE TO USE GUYS FOR WHAT THEY ARE WORTH IN THE PLAYOFFS. OUR MINDSET NEEDS TO BE BETTING HE WILL TAKE IT TO THE HOUSE THEN BETTING IF WE USE HIM THERE HE'S GONNA GET HURT

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=bertoskins]cannot risk moss to return punts
better thrash or betts[/QUOTE]

I've said it before and I will say it again.....MOSS on punt returns is offensive suicide for the team...every player on the other side of the skins in a game is gunning to hit (dirty hit-most likely) Santana and get him out of the game....he is BIG THREAT GUY, I think having on punt returns is tooo huge of a risk.

Stick with Ladell Betts or James Thrash.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

[QUOTE=ladyfan06]I've said it before and I will say it again.....MOSS on punt returns is offensive suicide for the team...every player on the other side of the skins in a game is gunning to hit (dirty hit-most likely) Santana and get him out of the game....he is BIG THREAT GUY, I think having on punt returns is tooo huge of a risk.

Stick with Ladell Betts or James Thrash.[/QUOTE]

I couldn't possibly disagree with this post any more. It's win or go home. I know one thing, if I were the coach and I lost a playoff game, I would want to know that I used everything I had at my disposal, and that I left everything we had on the field.

I would never want to wonder to myself, I wonder if Moss could have made a difference on punt returns. It counts now, for real. Put him back there. I WANT TO WIN.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

I also question exactly how risky it is for someone to be a punt returner. I can't think of one punt returner in the entire NFL who got hurt this year. And I follow the rest of the league religiously. Can anybody else name someone who got hurt while performing punt return duties?

Joe Gibbs used to put Darrell Green back to return punts in the really big games. If putting Moss back there is offensive suicide, then putting a hall of fame CB back must have been absolute defensive lunacy. Sure worked out well though, didn't it.

Re: Obligatory post-game "Walt Harris scares me" thread
 

And for my 3rd post in a row (LOL) I will actually address the topic of the thread, which I'm so good at doing.

Walt Harris is not a great CB. But he did well enough against Tampa. He's the kind of guy that is going to do a solid job, especially in run support, but occasionally get burned. Right now, he's a very average NFL corner. Luckily he didn't get burned against Tampa. If we have to start him against Seattle, that's definitely not my first choice because I think Hasselbeck will find a way to take advantage of Walt a bit better than Simms could. Hasselbeck has more savvy.

But we have what we have. We are what we are. It's not like we're going to sign someone off the street to perform better than Walt. I definitely wouldn't want Ade in there, that's for sure. It doesn't make sense to worry about Walt Harris, we can't control it. We just have to hope our pass rush gets to Hasselbeck before Walt's coverage gives out, we have to hope Sean Taylor helps cover for any mistakes Walt makes, and we have to hope Gregg Williams can devise a scheme to compensate for Walt.

But I think Springs and Rogers are going to play in this one, and both do a fine job. I think Walt is back to nickel in this one.