Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

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Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=3rd ID SOLDIER]:coach: let campbell and brunell duke it out in training camp no one for the skins is ever given a starting postion everyone has to earn it all over again may the best qb win! but as far as ramsey goes he is out to much damage has been done![/QUOTE]


Welcome Soldier! Glad you came to the Forum!

Some have mentioned a Brunell retirement, and P. Ram back as #1 or #2.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]I said it before, and I will say it again, we will regreat in the long haul giving up on Ramsey!

Until he's officially out of here I will not give up!!!!!!!! :biggthump[/QUOTE]
I'M with you on this one!!!

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

I can't wait to see Ramsey tear it up elsewhere. ;)

We really haven't come to regret any of the players we've let leave so far under Gibbs, outside of maybe Pierce but Marshall has proved to be a more than capable replacement.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=chuckmcco][b][color=red]If Mark Brunell is our starting QB next season i will not watch the games. I refuse to watch an offense that has to call certain plays because our QB has a diminished skill. Until Jason Campbell is named our starter i am boycotting.[/color][/b][/QUOTE]

Dude - CHILL OUT! We made it to the Divisoanl play off game WITH Brunell. No matter what you say Brunell was a leader. He has experience and he can run and scramble.

You are going to miss A LOT of good games in 06 with that attitude!

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]I can't wait to see Ramsey tear it up elsewhere. ;)

We really haven't come to regret any of the players we've let leave so far under Gibbs, outside of maybe Pierce but Marshall has proved to be a more than capable replacement.[/QUOTE]

I think it's reasonable to say Marshall will be even better next year. Moreover, he's not nearly as expensive as Pierce, which will probably go a long way in us signing some key people this year.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=70Chip]Green has the intangible ability to understand how a play is developing and make the right decision. Montana and Aikman were two of the best you will ever have seen at this. Also I would add Joe Namath and Tom Brady.[/QUOTE]

It's interesting that you would add Joe Namath to that mix. I've heard from several people that Namath was WAY overrated -- famous and memorable only because of his "guarantee" that his Jets would beat the heavily favored Colts in the Super Bowl. The coaches were reportedly so nervous about Namath that they refused to allow him to throw the ball at all in the fourth quarter of that game while the Jets held the lead.


[QUOTE=70Chip]Mark Brunell seems to be able to see about half of the field - usually the left side ... What he can't do well is look off an intermediate receiver on his left and find an intermediate receiver on his right, or vice versa.[/QUOTE]


Exactly. Remember when he tried to throw a pass across the field against Tampa Bay in the Wild Card? The result was disasterous. Without a doubt, even when Brunell and the offense was peaking, it was either Moss or Cooley that enabled the Skins to move the ball through the air, or it just wasn't going to happen. Now, the question remains, was that due to ineptitude from the #2, and #3 wide receivers, one of the flaws of Brunell, or both?

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=Beemnseven]It's interesting that you would add Joe Namath to that mix. I've heard from several people that Namath was WAY overrated -- famous and memorable only because of his "guarantee" that his Jets would beat the heavily favored Colts in the Super Bowl. The coaches were reportedly so nervous about Namath that they refused to allow him to throw the ball at all in the fourth quarter of that game while the Jets held the lead.





Exactly. Remember when he tried to throw a pass across the field against Tampa Bay in the Wild Card? The result was disasterous. Without a doubt, even when Brunell and the offense was peaking, it was either Moss or Cooley that enabled the Skins to move the ball through the air, or it just wasn't going to happen. Now, the question remains, was that due to ineptitude from the #2, and #3 wide receivers, one of the flaws of Brunell, or both?[/QUOTE]

Basically the chicken or the egg debate we've been having here for the past week.

I still believe once we get a bonfied QB running the offense everyone will see how inafective Brunell really is.

Brunell IMO held back this team.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Basically the chicken or the egg debate we've been having here for the past week.

I still believe once we get a bonfied QB running the offense everyone will see how inafective Brunell really is.

Brunell IMO held back this team.[/QUOTE]

Statistically Brunell had a good year. So when you say he held the team back, are you refering to his inability to get the ball downfield??

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=12thMan]Statistically Brunell had a good year. So when you say he held the team back, are you refering to his inability to get the ball downfield??[/QUOTE]


His inability to win, anyone and everyone knows we went to the playoffs because of one reason and one reason only, and that's our defense.

We don't beat Philli to get in if it's not for our defense, and we sure don't beat Tampa for the same reasons, bottom line the defense carried Brunells inability to move the offense. The slightest bit of help from Brunell and were playing Carolina for the championship this sunday!

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

It's time we made a total commitment to the QB situation that's going to benefit the team long term, and not continue to rely on short term fixes. The debate between Brunell and Ramsey has been an ongoing one since the arival of Gibbs, and based on what we know of the present situation, how can one conclude there's any prospect of Ramsey being the QB here at any point in time. He has consistently maintained he wants' to play. With Jason Campbell in line as the projected future starter and Ramsey in the final year of his contract, it's difficult to see where he fits in. It would seem unlikely he would sit for another year, become an unrestricted free agent at the end of next season free to sign with any team and the Redskins not be compensated in any way. It's not likely he's going to be the starting QB here, so it would be incumbent upon the team to seek value in a trade (if possible) rather than see him walk away to the highest bidder.
It's going to be interesting to see how the addition of Al Saunders will impact who will likely be the QB. As much as I have defended Brunell in the past and not completely dismissed him as being ineffective, watching him closely this year still (in my mind) raises some questions about his ability (or lack thereof) to make all the neccessary throws for an offense to consistently sustain drives over a sixteen game season. Without a doubt we will have growing pains starting the young QB and will probably take a slight step back. The question remains then, do we start another season with Brunell as the starter, or be willing to sacrafice maybe a chance at the play-offs in 06 for the sake of development? "TOUGH DECISION"

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]His inability to win, anyone and everyone knows we went to the playoffs because of one reason and one reason only, and that's our defense.[/Quote]

Our defense had a large part in our success this year, but an offense that was ranked #11 after being ranked #30 the previous year - WITH record breakers - makes your statement incorrect.

[QUOTE=offiss]
We don't beat Philli to get in if it's not for our defense, and we sure don't beat Tampa for the same reasons, bottom line the defense carried Brunells inability to move the offense. The slightest bit of help from Brunell and were playing Carolina for the championship this sunday![/QUOTE]

If you're going to put blame on Brunell's inability to move the ball in the playoffs, you might as well put the blame on Portis's inability to establish an effective running game, and Moss's inability to get open on every single play, and Cooley's inability to get open for the big plays in the playoffs. When your offense lives and dies by the running game and you only have one true deep threat receiver, no quarterback is going to be able to move the ball successfully.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]His inability to win, anyone and everyone knows we went to the playoffs because of one reason and one reason only, and that's our defense.

We don't beat Philli to get in if it's not for our defense, and we sure don't beat Tampa for the same reasons, bottom line the defense carried Brunells inability to move the offense. The slightest bit of help from Brunell and were playing Carolina for the championship this sunday![/QUOTE]

No arguing that the defense carried us most of the season, but it certainly wasn't the [b][i]only [/i][/b]reason we were in the playoffs. Sure he had a bad games v. Eagles and Tampa. But I'm sure you would even agree field position was horrible in each of those games, as well as Seattle.

I don't think it's fair to say someone who was one of the better passers in the NFC this year held back his team.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=12thMan]No arguing that the defense carried us most of the season, but it certainly wasn't the [b][i]only [/i][/b]reason we were in the playoffs. Sure he had a bad games v. Eagles and Tampa. But I'm sure you would even agree field position was horrible in each of those games, as well as Seattle.

I don't think it's fair to say someone who was one of the better passers in the NFC this year held back his team.[/QUOTE]


Yes and no, we started out with bad field position, but that turned around, our defense and special team handed him 3 turnovers, we were handed 3 TO's and still lost, that doesn't say much for brunell.

He was vastly outplayed by a kid in Simms, and big time Mike McMahon.

As a QB it's up to him to dig us out of bad field position, he wasen't able to do that.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Yes and no, we started out with bad field position, but that turned around, our defense and special team handed him 3 turnovers, we were handed 3 TO's and still lost, that doesn't say much for brunell.

He was vastly outplayed by a kid in Simms, and big time Mike McMahon.

As a QB it's up to him to dig us out of bad field position, he wasen't able to do that.[/QUOTE]


And you put no blame on Portis? No blame on the OL? That doesn't make any sense! Portis can have a bad game or two and you offer no criticism?

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Yes and no, we started out with bad field position, but that turned around, our defense and special team handed him 3 turnovers, we were handed 3 TO's and still lost, that doesn't say much for brunell.

He was vastly outplayed by a kid in Simms, and big time Mike McMahon.

As a QB it's up to him to dig us out of bad field position, he wasen't able to do that.[/QUOTE]

No, they didn't give Brunell three turnovers, they gave are offense three turnovers.

And I'd bet money you wouldn't take Simms or McMahon over Brunell.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

The offense played a large role in our 11 wins this year.

Last year I would agree the defense carried the team, but this year the offense improved to #11, averaged 22 points per game, produced a 1500 yard RB, a 1400 yard WR, a TE with over 70 catches, and a QB with over 3000 yards and 23 TDs.

The offense has alot of room for improvement obviously, but to totally discount the marked improvement they showed this year is just ridiculous.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=skinsguy]Our defense had a large part in our success this year, but an offense that was ranked #11 after being ranked #30 the previous year - WITH record breakers - makes your statement incorrect.



If you're going to put blame on Brunell's inability to move the ball in the playoffs, you might as well put the blame on Portis's inability to establish an effective running game, and Moss's inability to get open on every single play, and Cooley's inability to get open for the big plays in the playoffs. When your offense lives and dies by the running game and you only have one true deep threat receiver, no quarterback is going to be able to move the ball successfully.[/QUOTE]


You should define records, those were team records, not NFL. If you only throw to 2 guy's that will happen.

Of coarse we improved on offense, but I think it was down right impossible to go backwards.

Our offensive performance in the last 3 games is what makes my statement correct, obviously you get caught up with a stat sheet and can't really see what's actually happening on the field, those stats are misleading and irrelevant, if they had bearing we wouldn't have pounded out the worst offensive performance in a playoff win in the history of the NFL, yes I said NFL record, not team.

Laying the blame on Portis in the Seattle game is ridiculous, did you watch that game, Seattle was sending 7 guys at him where ever he went with no caution to misdirection, why you ask? Could it be they didn't have any real worries about Brunell beating them downfield?

You are not going to run the ball I don't care who you are if you become 1 dimensional, you have to be able to beat a team in the air if they over committ to the run, Brunell never did that.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

offiss, you're baseing your opinion of the offense on 3 games??

C'mon man, the season is 16 games long. Look at the entire body of work and then judge. Portis was 4th in the NFL in rushing, Moss was 2nd in receiving yards...

No one is debating the fact the offense struggled down the stretch, but look at the injuries we had. Thomas, Brunell, Portis, they all started to pile up right at the end.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]You should define records, those were team records, not NFL. If you only throw to 2 guy's that will happen.

Of coarse we improved on offense, but I think it was down right impossible to go backwards.

Our offensive performance in the last 3 games is what makes my statement correct, obviously you get caught up with a stat sheet and can't really see what's actually happening on the field, those stats are misleading and irrelevant, if they had bearing we wouldn't have pounded out the worst offensive performance in a playoff win in the history of the NFL, yes I said NFL record, not team.

Laying the blame on Portis in the Seattle game is ridiculous, did you watch that game, Seattle was sending 7 guys at him where ever he went with no caution to misdirection, why you ask? Could it be they didn't have any real worries about Brunell beating them downfield?

You are not going to run the ball I don't care who you are if you become 1 dimensional, you have to be able to beat a team in the air if they over committ to the run, Brunell never did that.[/QUOTE]

Offiss,

While you say it was impossible for the offense to go backward, you still fail to acknowledge the fact that they went from the bottom to number #11.

How do you account for this, and what parties would you say contributed?

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]You should define records, those were team records, not NFL. If you only throw to 2 guy's that will happen.

Of coarse we improved on offense, but I think it was down right impossible to go backwards.[/QUOTE]

Of course it's possible to go backwards, there is at least 32 teams in the NFL if I remember correctly. We were ranked #30, which means we could have been ranked worse.

[Quote=offiss]
Our offensive performance in the last 3 games is what makes my statement correct,[/Quote]

Right! You'd rather dwell on three games out of the 18 we played this year and ignore the rest.


[Quote=offiss]
Laying the blame on Portis in the Seattle game is ridiculous, did you watch that game, Seattle was sending 7 guys at him where ever he went with no caution to misdirection, why you ask? Could it be they didn't have any real worries about Brunell beating them downfield?[/Quote]

How so? Portis didn't perform well. Why not blame him? You're quick to pick Brunell apart when he doesn't play well, regardless of the reason. By your logic, it's just as correct to blame Portis. How is it that Brunell can't get the ball down the field? Go back and watch the highlight films of this season. Brunell doesn't have a problem with getting the ball downfield.

[Quote=offiss]You are not going to run the ball I don't care who you are if you become 1 dimensional, you have to be able to beat a team in the air if they over committ to the run, Brunell never did that.[/QUOTE]

It's not Brunell's fault that Portis couldn't establish the run. Our offensive philosophy is a run first to set up the pass philosophy. Logically, you must establish the running game to open up the passing game. We couldn't establish the running game, therefore, our passing game suffered as well. When you're put in a position where the majority of the plays have to be pass plays, then the defense can double your ONE receiver down the field. It's not that hard to figure out.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=12thMan]No, they didn't give Brunell three turnovers, they gave are offense three turnovers.

And I'd bet money you wouldn't take Simms or McMahon over Brunell.[/QUOTE]


Your kidding with that statement right? Who runs the offense? So I guess when Brunell throws an INT it's not really him it's the offense, interseting way of looking at things you have there. I guess if you don't understand that the QB is going to get the credit and the blame for the up's and downs of an offense this is kind of a dead end discussion.


I will bet as much money as you can muster that I would take Simms over Brunell.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Your kidding with that statement right? Who runs the offense? So I guess when Brunell throws an INT it's not really him it's the offense, interseting way of looking at things you have there. I guess if you don't understand that the QB is going to get the credit and the blame for the up's and downs of an offense this is kind of a dead end discussion.


I will bet as much money as you can muster that I would take Simms over Brunell.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, it is a very interesting way seeing that 10 other guys line up with Brunell. You're right, it's a very interesting way to see that.

Perhaps this is a dead end discussion.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

So I guess unless you're setting league records you're not doing a good job?

I guess only Shaun Alexander had a good season then.

If you go from the bottom 1/3 of the league in offense to the top 1/3, that's a pretty damn good improvement not matter what way you try to spin it.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]So I guess unless you're setting league records you're not doing a good job?

I guess only Shaun Alexander had a good season then.

If you go from the bottom 1/3 of the league in offense to the top 1/3, that's a pretty damn good improvement not matter what way you try to spin it.[/QUOTE]

Maybe that story doesn't spin good enough for Offiss.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]So I guess unless you're setting league records you're not doing a good job?

I guess only Shaun Alexander had a good season then.

If you go from the bottom 1/3 of the league in offense to the top 1/3, that's a pretty damn good improvement not matter what way you try to spin it.[/QUOTE]


Thank you!! :point:

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=skinsguy]Of course it's possible to go backwards, there is at least 32 teams in the NFL if I remember correctly. We were ranked #30, which means we could have been ranked worse.



Right! You'd rather dwell on three games out of the 18 we played this year and ignore the rest.




How so? Portis didn't perform well. Why not blame him? You're quick to pick Brunell apart when he doesn't play well, regardless of the reason. By your logic, it's just as correct to blame Portis. How is it that Brunell can't get the ball down the field? Go back and watch the highlight films of this season. Brunell doesn't have a problem with getting the ball downfield.



It's not Brunell's fault that Portis couldn't establish the run. Our offensive philosophy is a run first to set up the pass philosophy. Logically, you must establish the running game to open up the passing game. We couldn't establish the running game, therefore, our passing game suffered as well. When you're put in a position where the majority of the plays have to be pass plays, then the defense can double your ONE receiver down the field. It's not that hard to figure out.[/QUOTE]


It is his fault if the defense is stacking the box with no fear of the passing game.

Logically you have to establish 1 or the other, you have to run in order to pass, if a team over committs and stops the run, then you must burn them with the pass to force them out of the box, Brunell couldn't do that.

Portis himself said after the game that he couldn't run because Seattle was stacking the box, you can't ask 5 O-linemen to block 7 and 8 players in the box, it's up to the QB to make them pay for that and Bruenll didn't.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

We ran pretty well all year even when there was 7 or 8 in the box.

Perhaps the loss of Thomas coupled with Portis' banged up shoulders limited our usual effectiveness in the running game.

Nah, let's just blame Brunell.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]It is his fault if the defense is stacking the box with no fear of the passing game.

Logically you have to establish 1 or the other, you have to run in order to pass, if a team over committs and stops the run, then you must burn them with the pass to force them out of the box, Brunell couldn't do that.

Portis himself said after the game that he couldn't run because Seattle was stacking the box, you can't ask 5 O-linemen to block 7 and 8 players in the box, it's up to the QB to make them pay for that and Bruenll didn't.[/QUOTE]

So basically, and correct me if I'm wrong, we should lay [b][i]ALL [/i][/b]offensive[b][/b]failure and success at the feet of Mark Brunell?

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]It is his fault if the defense is stacking the box with no fear of the passing game.[/Quote]

Not it's not. Stacking the box doesn't mean that they ONLY go after the running back. Brunell was pressured all day against Seattle's defense...that's a fact! The persuit stopped our WR screen - which helps to keep the defense honest. Nobody was getting open on a consistant basis. You have Taylor Jacobs playing opposite of Santana Moss..'nuff said.


[QUOTE=offiss]Logically you have to establish 1 or the other, you have to run in order to pass, if a team over committs and stops the run, then you must burn them with the pass to force them out of the box, Brunell couldn't do that.[/Quote]

If and only if the receivers are open and if and only if you're given time to burn the defense deep - both were not true in that game.

[Quote=offiss]Portis himself said after the game that he couldn't run because Seattle was stacking the box, you can't ask 5 O-linemen to block 7 and 8 players in the box, it's up to the QB to make them pay for that and Bruenll didn't.[/QUOTE]

In your theory, we should be able to burn people deep everytime a defense stacks 7 or 8 guys in the box. That doesn't always happen. Just like you said, you can't expect 5 guys to block 7 or 8, so how do you expect 5 guys to pass protect against 7 or 8 guys? It doesn't happen. The best way to counter that is a quick dump off pass. Again - Seattle's persuit was faster than what anybody gave them credit for. It's not Brunell's fault or at least isn't Brunell's fault alone.

Re: Will Saunders Effect Our Qb Situation?
 

[QUOTE=skinsguy]Not it's not. Stacking the box doesn't mean that they ONLY go after the running back. Brunell was pressured all day against Seattle's defense...that's a fact! The persuit stopped our WR screen - which helps to keep the defense honest. Nobody was getting open on a consistant basis. You have Taylor Jacobs playing opposite of Santana Moss..'nuff said.




If and only if the receivers are open and if and only if you're given time to burn the defense deep - both were not true in that game.



In your theory, we should be able to burn people deep everytime a defense stacks 7 or 8 guys in the box. That doesn't always happen. Just like you said, you can't expect 5 guys to block 7 or 8, so how do you expect 5 guys to pass protect against 7 or 8 guys? It doesn't happen. The best way to counter that is a quick dump off pass. Again - Seattle's persuit was faster than what anybody gave them credit for. It's not Brunell's fault or at least isn't Brunell's fault alone.[/QUOTE]

Why has this discussion gone this far?

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

Offiss, what would have been sufficient for you-that we had won the Super Bowl this year...or that we got as far as we did exactly the same way but with Patrick Ramsey at QB?

I don't think I'm alone in thinking that what really bothers you is that Ramsey wasn't playing and that, contrary to what you believed at the start of the season, Brunell is still capable of being the starting QB of a playoff team.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]So I guess unless you're setting league records you're not doing a good job?

I guess only Shaun Alexander had a good season then.

If you go from the bottom 1/3 of the league in offense to the top 1/3, that's a pretty damn good improvement not matter what way you try to spin it.[/QUOTE]

Improvement for the rest of the team not Brunell, as I said before this team outperformed him.

Actually I am not a stat guy, I look at how a player contributes to his team and that can come in many different forms, but to some how say that because a player set a team record makes him elite, well maybe it does and maybe it doesn't, but if he's the only one being thrown to well that might change things a bit don't you think? It also might make a defenses job a little easier to stop us knowing Brunell has a 1 track mind.

Bottom line whoever want's to believe that Brunell is a good QB can, I don't care, that's your buisness, if you some how want to believe that wasen't Brunell out there the last 3 games go ahead. He had 4 big games all season lost 1 and Ramsey played half of the other.

If you feel his performance in the last 3 games is somehow in any way indicative of a quality NFL QB, let alone a QB that is going to lead us to a SB congradulations with that and good luck! :biggthump

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Improvement for the rest of the team not Brunell, as I said before this team outperformed him.[/QUOTE]

Again a false statement. Doesn't matter if you're a stats guy or not, Brunell had one of his better seasons this season and improved by leaps and bounds from last season. Anyone who actually argues that fact needs serious help.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Improvement for the rest of the team not Brunell, as I said before this team outperformed him.

Actually I am not a stat guy, I look at how a player contributes to his team and that can come in many different forms, but to some how say that because a player set a team record makes him elite, well maybe it does and maybe it doesn't, but if he's the only one being thrown to well that might change things a bit don't you think? It also might make a defenses job a little easier to stop us knowing Brunell has a 1 track mind.

Bottom line whoever want's to believe that Brunell is a good QB can, I don't care, that's your buisness, if you some how want to believe that wasen't Brunell out there the last 3 games go ahead. He had 4 big games all season lost 1 and Ramsey played half of the other.

If you feel his performance in the last 3 games is somehow in any way indicative of a quality NFL QB, let alone a QB that is going to lead us to a SB congradulations with that and good luck! :biggthump[/QUOTE]

Well, that's interesting.

Let me jump off track here just a little, Offiss. I, like yourself, am not really a stat guy. But you mentioned earlier that ultimatley we should measure Brunells worth in terms of wins/losses. Tom Brady and Brunell had the same exact records this year. Now if I were to take your statement literally, I would have to believe that you think Tom B. and Mark B. are equals.

Am I correct in assuming that or am I reaching a little too much here?

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

Every team in the league uses the same tactic against good running teams. However, that should not be an excuse for not being able to make plays in the offense. Pittsburgh runs the ball more than any team in the league, they stack the line against them as well but they still run it. They're successful at it because they also make plays in th passing game. JG seeks balance in his offense, and the only way to achieve that the O-line has to be equally adapt at both pass and run blocking, plus you need a QB who is not limited to just certain kind of throws. There are pass plays that Gibbs cannot run in his current offense because our QB lacks the arm strength or accuracy to make the pin-point throws neccessary to make them work. As much as I like Brunell for his leadership and ability to manage the game with limited mistakes, his passes for distance has too much of a hump allowing DB's too much time to react while the pass is in the air.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS]Offiss, what would have been sufficient for you-that we had won the Super Bowl this year...or that we got as far as we did exactly the same way but with Patrick Ramsey at QB?

I don't think I'm alone in thinking that what really bothers you is that Ramsey wasn't playing and that, contrary to what you believed at the start of the season, Brunell is still capable of being the starting QB of a playoff team.[/QUOTE]


You may assume that I don't like Brunell because I am a Ramsey backer, which I know that's true with Brunell backers, you know how many were bashing Brunell after last season and were on the Ramsey bandwagon, but as soon as Gibbs makes a switch right, wrong, or indifferent, they immediatly jump ship for Brunell, which is fine, but don't try to convince me he's a good QB at this point in his carreer.

The only reason I back Ramsey is because I beleive he's our best option to win, and if I didn't feel that way I would say we need a QB, not back him just because Gibbs named him the starter.

If Patrick performed as bad as Brunell did at the end of the season after an entire year in this offense I would be saying the same thing, I don't play favortism above performance, I just feel Patrick hasen't been given a real opportunity to prove himself, and Bruenll has and it's not good.

Do you think Brunell is going to get better next season? Or will he continue to decline? We all saw what he did when we needed him most.

If you can use the word capable about Brunell after watching him the last 3 games we played, the 3 biggest games of the year and say CAPABLE, well your a better man than I. But if that's your definition of capable, then no way is capable winning a SB. Now if your going to tell me he's going to be much better next year then I will listen to your explination why.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

Hey why don't we just bring back the Kilmer-Jurgenson, Theisman-Schroeder debates too! Hell, what about Gus Frerotte-Heath Shuler!

This is stupid.

Cut them both. I'm tired of this debate.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

[QUOTE=offiss]You may assume that I don't like Brunell because I am a Ramsey backer, which I know that's true with Brunell backers, you know how many were bashing Brunell after last season and were on the Ramsey bandwagon, but as soon as Gibbs makes a switch right, wrong, or indifferent, they immediatly jump ship for Brunell, which is fine, but don't try to convince me he's a good QB at this point in his carreer.

The only reason I back Ramsey is because I beleive he's our best option to win, and if I didn't feel that way I would say we need a QB, not back him just because Gibbs named him the starter.

If Patrick performed as bad as Brunell did at the end of the season after an entire year in this offense I would be saying the same thing, I don't play favortism above performance, I just feel Patrick hasen't been given a real opportunity to prove himself, and Bruenll has and it's not good.

Do you think Brunell is going to get better next season? Or will he continue to decline? We all saw what he did when we needed him most.

If you can use the word capable about Brunell after watching him the last 3 games we played, the 3 biggest games of the year and say CAPABLE, well your a better man than I. But if that's your definition of capable, then no way is capable winning a SB. Now if your going to tell me he's going to be much better next year then I will listen to your explination why.[/QUOTE]

Offiss,

How could anyone say with reason Brunell will be better next year. No one, including me, thought he would be as good as he was this year. That's a foolish prediction because so many variables, out of his control, come into play.

If Brunell isn't that good of a quarterback, then I don't know how you define good. And for you to say Patrick would have done better, to get let's say 11 or 12 wins is total conjecture on your part.

Re: Will Saunders Affect Our QB Situation?
 

I think we differ on what "real opportunity" is. I think practices, minicamp, training camp, and preseason games this past year do give Ramsey the opportunity to improve and the coaching staff the chance to evaluate his progress.

But the issue here isn't what will Brunell do in 2006. It's why can't you respect what he did in 2005? His overall body of work, as Matty has said.