Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=dmek25]well,since you insist.it is totally ridiculous to spend that much money on a friggin animal when millions can not get the proper care that they need.sure,the owner has his own money to spend as he pleases but cant he think of a better way to spend it.thjs is the point,the only reason he is spending it is because of the stud fees,period.i have swampland in jersey to sell you if you think for one minute he is doing this out of his pure kindness for the animal.i guarantee that horse had surgery faster than if you or i walked into the emergency room.tell me if something is wrong with that picture[/quote]

Well, Dmek25...if it was simply about the money, they could have laid the horse to rest and collected literally millions and millions from the insurance company. And trust me, they could have and still may. The 50/50 chance of survival they are giving Barbaro is extremely optomistic.

I really think the owner was and still to some extent is distraught over this whole incident. To say that the owner and the trainer are saving the horses' life to capture the stud fees is totally presumptous on our part.

We must remember, these people have been around horses for most of their lives. This is what they do - this is what they know.
Many of these people loved horses long before they became wealthy, and still do.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=dmek25]well,since you insist.it is totally ridiculous to spend that much money on a friggin animal when millions can not get the proper care that they need.sure,the owner has his own money to spend as he pleases but cant he think of a better way to spend it.thjs is the point,the only reason he is spending it is because of the stud fees,period.i have swampland in jersey to sell you if you think for one minute he is doing this out of his pure kindness for the animal.i guarantee that horse had surgery faster than if you or i walked into the emergency room.tell me if something is wrong with that picture[/quote]

Commy!

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

Wasn't Barbaro's owner an Olympic equestrain rider? Considering the way he practically sprinted to the track right after the horse stopped on Saturday, IMO he has more invested in that horse than just money.

My roommate in college had a race horse (actually his uncle did, but he had a vested interest in it) and he was depressed for like a month when they had to put it down following an accident on the track. The horse had been doing well, I think it had just won a big race the week before, and he was making my friend a good deal of money, but that wasn't why he was so upset.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz]Wasn't Barbaro's owner an Olympic equestrain rider? Considering the way he practically sprinted to the track right after the horse stopped on Saturday, IMO he has more invested in that horse than just money.

My roommate in college had a race horse (actually his uncle did, but he had a vested interest in it) and he was depressed for like a month when they had to put it down following an accident on the track. The horse had been doing well, I think it had just won a big race the week before, and he was making my friend a good deal of money, but that wasn't why he was so upset.[/quote]

This is all I'm trying to say - there's much more than financial consideration involved here. And what's being lost here is the fact the horse has no say in the matter. The owner and trainer basically have to come to a very emotional decision to save the horse. Unlike a human athlete, the final decision rests with the individual, an animal is at the mercy of someone else making the decision.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=dmek25]well,since you insist.it is totally ridiculous to spend that much money on a friggin animal when millions can not get the proper care that they need.sure,the owner has his own money to spend as he pleases but cant he think of a better way to spend it.thjs is the point,the only reason he is spending it is because of the stud fees,period.i have swampland in jersey to sell you if you think for one minute he is doing this out of his pure kindness for the animal.i guarantee that horse had surgery faster than if you or i walked into the emergency room.tell me if something is wrong with that picture[/quote]

And now for a semi-serious response: why don't you put spaces in between your punctuation marks and the start of your next thought? Just curious.

And now for a serious response: there's a lot more demand for human healthcare than for animals. We were just talking about it, most owners put the animal down in these situations. Veterinary surgeons have better availability than our docs.

I think money is the main motivator, but unless he's a complete robot, the owner is feeling bad for the horse and doesn't want to see it die. And I am not so cynical to think that he's not feeling anything for the horse.

And besides, what would you have the owner do with his money? Provide healthcare to all the underinsured in our country before providing it to the horse? I guess by that logic we should just tax everyone who can afford healthcare so that there would be enough tax revenue to provide healthcare for everyone. Then nobody would need a good job with good benefits. And pretty soon we'd be basking in the glow of communism. That sh*t doesn't fly. Some people can afford it, some can't. You want to give people opportunities to afford it, but the rich shouldn't have to pay for it.

Healthcare is not a basic human right in my eyes. It costs money for doctors to do what they do, and for Pharm to make drugs, and for nurses to wipe your ass. Healthcare is a privelege, and you should have to earn it.

Maybe if so many Americans stopped dropping out of high school, they'd have the skills to be able to hold down a job that actually provides solid healthcare benefits.

Alright I'm getting way too political and have probably pissed enough people off already. Barbaro is priveleged, he's got an owner who's willing to spend the money. In a horse's case, it's a raw deal for those horses with owners who aren't this able to pay. The horses obviously can't do anything about it, it's just luck of the draw. The difference with people is they can do something about it. They can go to school, get trained, get jobs, and earn their healthcare benefits.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

I think bashing anyone for saving someone's or something's life is embarassing. Sorry if you can't handle the fact that there is money involved but saying the horse should be put down because the money could be spent elsewhere is about the the worst and most heartless thing I can imagine. Everything deserves life if possible. By your standards everyone should go ahead put their pets/race horses/zoo animals/etc... and put all that money towards human healthcare.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=Schneed10]And now for a semi-serious response: why don't you put spaces in between your punctuation marks and the start of your next thought? Just curious.

And now for a serious response: there's a lot more demand for human healthcare than for animals. We were just talking about it, most owners put the animal down in these situations. Veterinary surgeons have better availability than our docs.

I think money is the main motivator, but unless he's a complete robot, the owner is feeling bad for the horse and doesn't want to see it die. And I am not so cynical to think that he's not feeling anything for the horse.

And besides, what would you have the owner do with his money? Provide healthcare to all the underinsured in our country before providing it to the horse? I guess by that logic we should just tax everyone who can afford healthcare so that there would be enough tax revenue to provide healthcare for everyone. Then nobody would need a good job with good benefits. And pretty soon we'd be basking in the glow of communism. That sh*t doesn't fly. Some people can afford it, some can't. You want to give people opportunities to afford it, but the rich shouldn't have to pay for it.

Healthcare is not a basic human right in my eyes. It costs money for doctors to do what they do, and for Pharm to make drugs, and for nurses to wipe your ass. Healthcare is a privelege, and you should have to earn it.

Maybe if so many Americans stopped dropping out of high school, they'd have the skills to be able to hold down a job that actually provides solid healthcare benefits.

Alright I'm getting way too political and have probably pissed enough people off already. Barbaro is priveleged, he's got an owner who's willing to spend the money. In a horse's case, it's a raw deal for those horses with owners who aren't this able to pay. The horses obviously can't do anything about it, it's just luck of the draw. The difference with people is they can do something about it. They can go to school, get trained, get jobs, and earn their healthcare benefits.[/quote]

I like you what you said - it was balanced.

I've been pondering one other thing about the so called "absurdity" (and I'm not taking jabs at anyone here) of spending so much money on an animal's healthcare. In this particular instance, haven't we, and the horseracing community in particular, determined the value of this horse and all for that matter. Everytime we pay to see this horse (just using him as example) race, everytime we place a bet, everytime we tune in to see the next interview or presser we colloectively put a price on this horse.

Sure, he does the actual performing, but the general public drives up his value by pulling out it's own almighty green dollar.
We'll gladly take home a healthy day's winning from the race track, but out the other side of our mouth say the money used to save the horse's life could be better used. We can't have it both ways.

Can you tell this is touching a nerve with me:)

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

schneed , the next time i give a response to any thread youre looking at , please feel free to grade my punctuality .

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

12th i agree with what you are saying. but i do not play the ponies, and really dont consider horse racing a sport. i just get sick of the absurd amount of money that is involved in spoorts now a days, not just horses. i guess im venting alittle

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

If I'm correct the owner paid 500 million for this horse. The insurance money is nothing and depending on how the policy is written putting the horse down might not be covered. How anyone can read this guys mind and say its out of greed is just crazy. Yes it could be greed but can't say its greed unless you know the facts. I do know that after this happened they showed the jocky, trainers, and owner all standing around crying like they just lost a love one. When it comes to the care for these horses I don't think anyone wants to put them down it probably comes down to who can afford to have it done. I have a friend who has spent thousands on their dog which I would have not spent myself if it was my pet. It might sound a little harsh but I'm not spending all my savings on a dog and not my family because they come first. Now if I had the extra cash yes I would spend the money to try and save the dogs life. Also the thing about 40,000,000 Americans cannot afford or cannot get health insurance is not the truth. First alot of young people feel they do not need health insurance. Alot of people buy that new car and cannot afford health insurance after stretching their budget. Some just choose not to buy insurance> The amount of people who realy cannot afford or get coverage is much smaller but what would politicians run on if the truth was known.

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

either way, eventually this horse will be made into kibble and glue...

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[quote=firstdown]If I'm correct the owner paid 500 million for this horse. The insurance money is nothing and depending on how the policy is written putting the horse down might not be covered. How anyone can read this guys mind and say its out of greed is just crazy. Yes it could be greed but can't say its greed unless you know the facts. I do know that after this happened they showed the jocky, trainers, and owner all standing around crying like they just lost a love one. When it comes to the care for these horses I don't think anyone wants to put them down it probably comes down to who can afford to have it done. I have a friend who has spent thousands on their dog which I would have not spent myself if it was my pet. It might sound a little harsh but I'm not spending all my savings on a dog and not my family because they come first. Now if I had the extra cash yes I would spend the money to try and save the dogs life. Also the thing about 40,000,000 Americans cannot afford or cannot get health insurance is not the truth. First alot of young people feel they do not need health insurance. Alot of people buy that new car and cannot afford health insurance after stretching their budget. Some just choose not to buy insurance> The amount of people who realy cannot afford or get coverage is much smaller but what would politicians run on if the truth was known.[/quote]

Nice post. I'm a financial analyst for Temple University Health System in Philadelphia, and you pretty much hit it on the head.

If somebody presents at one of our emergency rooms, NOT ONE OF THEM GETS TURNED AWAY. Last year, we gave away $68 million worth of free care to people who didn't have adequate health insurance. When it comes down to it, a lot of people "can't afford" to pay for insurance. But they still get healthcare. They may not be paying for it, but they're getting it, and hospitals are paying for it.

A lot of people can afford healthcare. When people whine about not being able to afford it, you really have to wonder what the word "afford" means to them. In a lot of cases, they're saying they can't afford it because now the high cost means they can't go out to eat as much. Is the problem that you [B]can't afford[/B] it? Or is the problem that you [B]don't want to pay that much[/B] for it?

Re: Barbaro breaks leg at Preakness
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10]So then because the owner's greed is a motivator, then the horse should be put down even if the surgery gives him a 50/50 shot at survival? I mean it's not like it's a really bleak situation, he's a coin toss to survive.

Most horses in America wouldn't get a chance to have surgery and keep on living, because most owners wouldn't pay for it. But whatever the motivator behind it, shouldn't we be happy that the horse is getting a second chance at life that most horses don't get?

This is one of the rare times when financial interests and the interests of being humane are aligning. Most horses in America don't get this second chance that Barbaro is getting, because of money, and that's the real shame here. Barbaro is the one horse that's getting what all humans deserve: a good chance to regain health.



Yes he'll be in considerable pain until it heals, but if you give me a choice between temporary pain and death, I choose temporary pain. What would you choose?[/QUOTE]


Nice post. I second that. Well said.