Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=xtrmntr;253109]you've got to question campbell's judgement after watching the carolina game, especially when he got picked off trying to go deep when the redskins were trailing 13-10 in the 4th quarter. let's hope it's nothing more than teething problems. all in all, he hasn't done too badly[/quote]

Hey, a 4:1 TD to INT ratio is awesome for a "rookie" QB.

Delhomme's judgement is the judgement that should be questioned from that game, he SHOULD be better than that with all of the experience he has.

I'm very confident in Campbell.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=Buster;253305]Hey, a 4:1 TD to INT ratio is awesome for a "rookie" QB.

Delhomme's judgement is the judgement that should be questioned from that game, he SHOULD be better than that with all of the experience he has.

I'm very confident in Campbell.[/quote]


I agree, Delhomme had a stinker against the Redskins, he did nothing for my fantasy team. :-) But I don't think that excuses Campbell's poor choice of plays at a crucial point in the 4th quarter when the Redskins were down 13-10, it could've cost Washington the match. As I say, I just hope it's nothing more than teething trouble and not something more fundamental.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

reading NFL defenses separates good qbacks in this league from great ones. its all about experience

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

As for the Duckett trade, I think generally most Falcon fans liked it. I however did not. I thought it was a mistake trading our most potent redzone weapon for a #3 WR. Lelie got off to a good start this year, which seemed to melt away my issues with the trade, but since the middle of the year has settled into the same inept malaise that the rest of our WRs have. I don't think it's a mere coincidence that the Falcons have struggled in scoring in the redzone all year long and not having Duckett on the roster.

I suspect Gibbs will give Duckett a chance this week to make the Falcons look really stupid, by giving him the ball 10-15 times and have him pound it down our throats.

As for the board bickering, doesn't bother me one bit. Over at the FalcFans board, you'll see the exact same thing. In fact, makes me feel a lot more comfortable. ;)

Thanks for the responses on Campbell. I hope the Falcons win, but this team needs a really hard gut check, and I'm not sure going onto the road this week is optimal for it.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Hey Pudge, what's your take on Duckett?

What are his strengths? Weaknesses? Do you think he could be a #1 back in this league?

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hesscl34;252707]No SHIT! I'm out of this thread. It's all yours boys.:tongue[/quote]
Seriously you needa can it with whole "you guys hate me, because you are men" blah blah blahhh. It is getting really old, really fast.

This board is dominated by males and if having logical and rational debates over football is too "male" for you, then don't jump into the arguement.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Sorry to bring that up again lol, I just get into the thread when I am reading it, even if I am a day or so late.

Either way welcome to the board Pudge, you should most here more often, a respectful opposing fan's opinions are always welcomed.


And personally, I think Vick is the better QB, without a doubt. This is simply because Vick has much more experience in the NFL, versus Campbell's two games. He has lead his team to the playoffs a couple times, and he has single handled won games. Even though he is in consistent, you have to go with experience in this case.

That being said, I feel Campbell might have the potential to become a better QB than Vick in the future, but my analysis is based on the present.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Vick is only good in the right offense

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=Pudge;252683]Falcon fan here that will be at the game this week. Just wondering how has Campbell looked in his 2 starts, since I haven't had a chance to see him. From the stat lines he has looked pretty good, but I also noticed that the Redskins really haven't had any big completions in the past 2 weeks from their WRs. Guys are averaging under 10 yards per pass.

I'd like to say I think the Falcons can win this one, but I'm not so confident. While Campbell seemingly has brought fresh air to the Redskins offense, that is exactly what the Falcons are needing, and it doesn't look like it's going to come from Vick.[/quote]

I just don't think Vick is ever going to be a consistent NFL QB. However his WR's are not helping his cause. I personally think the offense would run much smoother if they put in Schaub. Campbell has looked like a QB starting his 2nd NFL game. Some good and some bad. He looks a little rusty simply becasue he has not played a full game since college. But most importantly you can see flashes of his calm pocket presence, and pocket passing skills. These are qualities that I have not seen in Vick on a consistent basis and he's in his 5th or 6th year?

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hooskins;253606]Seriously you needa can it with whole "you guys hate me, because you are men" blah blah blahhh. It is getting really old, really fast.

This board is dominated by males and if having logical and rational debates over football is too "male" for you, then don't jump into the arguement.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]If you are going to bring it up again, then I’m going to reply- There are plenty of men on here that do just what I said - they use sexist statements to light a fire under me. It's the truth and I call it as I see it. I LOVE FOOTBALL and I'll argue all damn day about FOOTBALL, but don't tell me I'm arguing with you because it's a "bad time of the month, or because I'm playing a victim or I'm a drama queen!" All of you on here at one time or another have blown a fuse and unfortunately I can't blame it on the time of the month, or on your “female emotions” ! If you use statements like that, then EXPECT me to say that I'm sick the damn "man card" being played. That's bullshit![/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

wow!

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=Pudge;253602]As for the Duckett trade, I think generally most Falcon fans liked it. I however did not. I thought it was a mistake trading our most potent redzone weapon for a #3 WR. Lelie got off to a good start this year, which seemed to melt away my issues with the trade, but since the middle of the year has settled into the same inept malaise that the rest of our WRs have. I don't think it's a mere coincidence that the Falcons have struggled in scoring in the redzone all year long and not having Duckett on the roster.

I suspect Gibbs will give Duckett a chance this week to make the Falcons look really stupid, by giving him the ball 10-15 times and have him pound it down our throats.

As for the board bickering, doesn't bother me one bit. Over at the FalcFans board, you'll see the exact same thing. In fact, makes me feel a lot more comfortable. ;)

Thanks for the responses on Campbell. I hope the Falcons win, but this team needs a really hard gut check, and I'm not sure going onto the road this week is optimal for it.[/quote]

I didn't get a chance to see if you wrote anything else about Vick. On your Falcons boards I'm assuming there's a huge Vick vs. Schaub controversy. What's the general opinion on Vick? I think a lot of us here know he's not ever going to be a great pocket passer but he CAN win games. While he does the amazing with his feet, he'll never been anything besides an above average QB. But above average QBs CAN and DO win football games.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hesscl34;253693][COLOR=black][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]If you are going to bring it up again, then I’m going to reply- There are plenty of men on here that do just what I said - they use sexist statements to light a fire under me. It's the truth and I call it as I see it. I LOVE FOOTBALL and I'll argue all damn day about FOOTBALL, but don't tell me I'm arguing with you because it's a "bad time of the month, or because I'm playing a victim or I'm a drama queen!" All of you on here at one time or another have blown a fuse and unfortunately I can't blame it on the time of the month, or on your “female emotions” ! If you use statements like that, then EXPECT me to say that I'm sick the damn "man card" being played. That's bullshit![/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]
See the thing is, when we say those "sexist" comments we are joking. When you pull the "man card" it is usually when you are storming away, after you have been owned in an arguement. The thing is, when someone counters a point that you make, either counter it back with facts, aknowledge that they are correct, or do not say anything. Don't come back saying "Oh why do you put down whatever I say??? Its just my opinion, blah blah".

You get way too emotion when someone proves you wrong or goes agaisnt you, but it really is no big deal, its a freaking forum, so that is what is gonna happen. You really shouldn't take everything as personally as you do.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Bullshit you are joking when you pull the female crap. You use those statements to put me down (knowing I’m female) and insult me because you can't come up with a more intelligent response. As for getting WAY too emotional when the bickering ensues, I'm NOT the only one dear. And in that way, we men and women are alike on the Warpath!

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

oh, and as for me taking it personal - using sexist statements is NO different from you using a racial slur. If I were black and you used a racial slur while arguing with me and I got all upset then it would be understood. It's no different because I'm a woman. THAT is the reality.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hesscl34;253850]Bullshit you are joking when you pull the female crap. You use those statements to put me down (knowing I’m female) and insult me because you can't come up with a more intelligent response. As for getting WAY too emotional when the bickering ensues, I'm NOT the only one dear. And in that way, we men and women are alike on the Warpath![/quote]
Why are you boiling it down to men and women, I hate people who can't take a joke on this site regardless if they are guys or girls. You just have this image in your mind that every guy on this site is out there to get you, when in reality they are not.

It is like you think you deserve special treatment bc you are female, and we(members of this forum) can't counter your points, because you get really upset and flip out. Very similar to SBF, I love the dude to death, but he takes things way too seriously.

Either way I know I am not changing your mind, so it doesn't matter. I would continue to prove my point, but it will only upset you more and the Mods. So I am done.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Dude, go back to school. I am NOT asking for special treatment and never have. Up until this year none of you ever knew I was a woman, and I never got any back handed female insult until you did find out!! Stop throwing sexists statements around and we won't have these arguments.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

Go create your own sexism thread, let's talk football

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

On Duckett:

Duckett was a QB in high school and moved to RB at MSU as many know. He came into the league back in '02 with a lot of Bettis comparisons. He had great upside. Unfortunately for him he was picked by the Falcons who had just signed Dunn. Dunn was not a good fit for Reeves offense, but was still a darn good RB, and while Duckett was learning the ropes, he managed to play well enough so that the Falcons couldn't justify benching Dunn.

Then Reeves got fired and the Falcons brought in Greg KNapp & Alex Gibbs, and Duckett is the antithesis of the back that fits in the zone-blocking scheme. He lacks great acceleration. He's a guy that is a good downhill runner, but his vision is only OK, and it takes him forever to get up to speed. But Duckett did manage to improve as a runner during his first 1.5 years under Gibbs, but he totally stunk at the end of 2005. Thus why the Falcons were looking to deal him while they could.

I think Duckett could be a lead back in the NFL, but only for a team like Pittsburgh. He'll never be as good as Bettis, but he coudl be a productive player for a team that loves the "3 yards and a cloud of dust" type runners. Pittsburgh, Carolina, Jacksonville, are 3 teams that like those types of runners. The problem is Duckett is particularly one-dimensional, so unless he went to a team that had that perfect niche for him where all he would have to do is get the tough yards inside, then he's not going to work. His blocking has improved since his rookie year (then he was terrible), but he's only considered mildly competent at blitz pickup. His hands are adequate, but probably in a given year as a starter, he'd only be reliable enough to catch 15-20 passes.

Essentially, he'd be a backup on probably all but a few NFL teams. But he's a competent backup, that is a great complement to a speedy back. Which was evident in Atlanta when it was him and Dunn back in '04.

As for the Vick-Schaub QB controversy:

It's not as big as you may think. There has always been a small vocal minority that have wanted Schaub as the starter ever since he joined the team back in 2004. That minority has grown louder this year, but the vast number of Falcon fans still want to see Vick in there. I'm in that camp too. I am curious to see what Schaub can do, I don't have any notions of him being an improvement to Vick, at least immediately.

The Falcons will have the option of trading him after the season. If they do, then hopefully the Falcons get a high draft pick (#2?) and use it on a good player, perhaps an OL or WR. If not, then it might mean the Falcons are less confident in Vick than it would appear. Schaub has been an insurance policy for his entire tenure in Atlanta, and if he is a Falcon again in 2007, it means the team is a few steps closer to cashing that policy in.

But I don't htink anybody is going to see Schaub this year until 1 or 2 things happen:

1) Vick is hurt
2) The Falcons are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. From my perspective, it would probably take another 2 losses for that to happen.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hesscl34;253861]Dude, go back to school. I am NOT asking for special treatment and never have. Up until this year none of you ever knew I was a woman, and I never got any back handed female insult until you did find out!! Stop throwing sexists statements around and we won't have these arguments.[/quote]

"Dude go back to school"-See right there you are doing what you claim everyone is doing to you. You are getting really emotional and countering with an arguement that does not even make sense. You are proving my points for me.

Stop sweating that you are a woman, just stop doing it lol. Just don't mention it, and don't flip out if someone else does. I promise everything that you "think" is sexist will all go away, plus it will be easier on the mind if you do that.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=Pudge;253866]On Duckett:

Duckett was a QB in high school and moved to RB at MSU as many know. He came into the league back in '02 with a lot of Bettis comparisons. He had great upside. Unfortunately for him he was picked by the Falcons who had just signed Dunn. Dunn was not a good fit for Reeves offense, but was still a darn good RB, and while Duckett was learning the ropes, he managed to play well enough so that the Falcons couldn't justify benching Dunn.

Then Reeves got fired and the Falcons brought in Greg KNapp & Alex Gibbs, and Duckett is the antithesis of the back that fits in the zone-blocking scheme. He lacks great acceleration. He's a guy that is a good downhill runner, but his vision is only OK, and it takes him forever to get up to speed. But Duckett did manage to improve as a runner during his first 1.5 years under Gibbs, but he totally stunk at the end of 2005. Thus why the Falcons were looking to deal him while they could.

I think Duckett could be a lead back in the NFL, but only for a team like Pittsburgh. He'll never be as good as Bettis, but he coudl be a productive player for a team that loves the "3 yards and a cloud of dust" type runners. Pittsburgh, Carolina, Jacksonville, are 3 teams that like those types of runners. The problem is Duckett is particularly one-dimensional, so unless he went to a team that had that perfect niche for him where all he would have to do is get the tough yards inside, then he's not going to work. His blocking has improved since his rookie year (then he was terrible), but he's only considered mildly competent at blitz pickup. His hands are adequate, but probably in a given year as a starter, he'd only be reliable enough to catch 15-20 passes.

Essentially, he'd be a backup on probably all but a few NFL teams. But he's a competent backup, that is a great complement to a speedy back. Which was evident in Atlanta when it was him and Dunn back in '04.

As for the Vick-Schaub QB controversy:

It's not as big as you may think. There has always been a small vocal minority that have wanted Schaub as the starter ever since he joined the team back in 2004. That minority has grown louder this year, but the vast number of Falcon fans still want to see Vick in there. I'm in that camp too. I am curious to see what Schaub can do, I don't have any notions of him being an improvement to Vick, at least immediately.

The Falcons will have the option of trading him after the season. If they do, then hopefully the Falcons get a high draft pick (#2?) and use it on a good player, perhaps an OL or WR. If not, then it might mean the Falcons are less confident in Vick than it would appear. Schaub has been an insurance policy for his entire tenure in Atlanta, and if he is a Falcon again in 2007, it means the team is a few steps closer to cashing that policy in.

But I don't htink anybody is going to see Schaub this year until 1 or 2 things happen:

1) Vick is hurt
2) The Falcons are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. From my perspective, it would probably take another 2 losses for that to happen.[/quote]
Are you sure your post isn't about the rising problem of sexism on internet forums? lol

And about Duckett, thanks for the info that was a nice read. I agree that is basically a really solid backup, a good bruising back if you will.

As for Schaub, the kid is a beast, use to play for Virginia, my school. I have seen alot of film on him, and he is a very accurate pocket passer, who is a great backup, that has the potential of being a starter, but not at the ATL. I think Vick is still your best bet, and I doubt you will see him this year, or ever unless Vick is hurt. Bc if you change a big name player like Vick, it means he is 2nd string automatically.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=TAFKAS;252694]Welcome to the board Pudge.[/quote]

same here welcome pudge i like campbell just needs more time.
it should be a great game..

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

For the love of God!!! I'm not doing ANYTHING different from anyone else – EXCEPT I’m not using racial or sexist slurs!!!!!!!

I really want to tell you to read more, but then I might hurt your feelings again and we'll just continue......

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hesscl34;253874]For the love of God!!! I'm not doing ANYTHING different from anyone else – EXCEPT I’m not using racial or sexist slurs!!!!!!!

[I] I really want to tell you to read more, but then I might hurt your feelings again and we'll just continue......[/I][/quote]
Again another cheap shot, that is not even close to being a valid point.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

I'm trying to communicate and I know cheap shots is something you can understand....

Now back to Football kids....

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

lol "kids"...you are hilarious. Keep it up.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

So Pudge, do you honestly think your team would bench Vick? Ever? I just do not think it would ever happen. I think you guys are gonna have Vick starting until he gets old or hurt.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

I just feel that Vick is a QB who needs to drop back 40+ times a game to really make an impact with both his running and passing. If a game is called that way, then the running backs simply don't have the kind of outcome on a game they need to make THAT offense successful. I'm starting to feel that there are better fits for him than Atlanta. One that comes to mind would be Oakland. A team that has no running game, a good, borderline great defense, and an offensive line that consistently has pressure gaffes.

I believe that an offense will never be great with Vick, but he could take a horrible offense and make it decent no matter who is around him.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=hooskins;253882]lol "kids"...you are hilarious. Keep it up.[/quote]

:sleep: ... nope.... lost interest.....

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=GTripp0012;253886]I just feel that Vick is a QB who needs to drop back 40+ times a game to really make an impact with both his running and passing. If a game is called that way, then the running backs simply don't have the kind of outcome on a game they need to make THAT offense successful. I'm starting to feel that there are better fits for him than Atlanta. One that comes to mind would be Oakland. A team that has no running game, a good, borderline great defense, and an offensive line that consistently has pressure gaffes.

I believe that an offense will never be great with Vick, but he could take a horrible offense and make it decent no matter who is around him.[/quote]
Do you ever see Vick getting a ring? I personally don't because of what you have just mentioned.

Re: Jason Campbell vs. Vick
 

[quote=Mattyk72;252803]Yeah in this case the parents were drunk and the Dad kicked the dog down the stairs, other than that it's just another day in the life of The Warpath. :)[/quote]

:laughing2 you hit it right on the head matty.just another great day on the warpath.

right on..