Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

Gibbs' teams always play well in December, the only exception I can think of was the 88-9 season after we'd won the super bowl in 88. Even in 04, we finished the season 3-2 to go 6-10. Gibbs has always emphasized playing well at the end of the year & for a no. of reasons.
I would rather finish 8-8 & have a sense of momentum & pride to build on for next year. Maybe having super bowl expectations every year is bad for a team, but having no expectations in the offseason is worse. This team needs some emotional healing, and the only way it will come is to start turning things around.
As for the draft, I pray that we trade our #1 for some additional picks, I'd love to see our 1 for 2 #2s. Probably won't happen given our habit of giving away valuable picks just to move up in the draft.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

maybe there's 1 exception that's ok - I'll only root against us if it means keeping the cowpokers, g-men or iggles out of the playoffs or home field.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

If the Skins play consistently well for the rest of the season, but lose every game due to the other team playing out of their gourd, I would prefer that to winning a bunch of games where the Skins look like absolute crap and show no signs of gelling, but the other teams "give" the games away.

However, I would not prefer the Skins losing games just to get a higher draft pick. We'd probably just trade it to Denver for Mike Bell, anyway.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=mike340;256452]I think the guy is asking a reasonable question in a calm manner.

If I understand it, he wants to win emotionally and cheers for the 'Skins, especially on game day, and he doesn't want them to "tank". He doesn't care about the playoffs because he feels we are not good enough this year to do anything meaningful if we got there.

Here's a related question:
If you could choose one of the following, which would it be?
1) The Redskins win the remaining games while playing badly, but winning because the other team was worse. (penalties, interceptions, bad calls, etc.)
2) The Redskins lose the remaining games while playing very well. (Campbell on the money, good D, etc, but the opposing team has "career" days, like when a basketball team shoots over 70% for a game.)

The first scenario puts more importance on the record this year. The second puts more emphasis on the possibilities for next year.

To revert to the question which originated this thread, I believe what he is trying to ask is:
If we were to look only at our final record (ignoring the emotional impact of winning or losing on game day) what would you prefer?
1) Finishing 8-8 (no playoffs)
2) Finishing 4-12
In the first scenario we have a better record this year, but next year we get a (much) worse draft pick (after an exchange with Denver.)
In the second we have a more embarrassing record, but we would get a very high draft pick (and probably too high to have to exchange with Denver.)

So I think he is asking which is more important to us: a better record this year (when we aren't going anywhere) or a better draft pick next year. A corresponding personnel question would be:
If we had a backup who is currently worse than our starter but could become better than our starter with some starts under his belt, should we keep playing the current starter to have a better record this year, or should we start the backup so we're better next year?
This is a reasonable question, and I think our coaching staff has shown its decision.[/quote]

Yes, but losing our remaining four games would:

1) Mean we made no progress throughout the year, leaving us all in serious doubt about even getting back to .500 next year.

2) Mean that Jason Campbell has A LOT of work to do.

3) The coaching staff probably would have lost the respect of the players.

4) Increase the chances that Danny might get pissed and start messing around.

I would feel a TON better about next year if we finished 8-8 this year, and drafted somewhere around 15th overall. I'd think we have no chance next year if we finish 4-12 and draft within the top 5. We're not one player away, this team needs to show progress and some chemistry. They need to show that they have fight in them and that they won't quit. Otherwise, it's just going to be proof that this team doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to get it done next season.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=Schneed10;256474]Yes, but losing our remaining four games would:

1) Mean we made no progress throughout the year, leaving us all in serious doubt about even getting back to .500 next year.

2) Mean that Jason Campbell has A LOT of work to do.
[/quote]
Not under the hypo that mike340 posted. We could play great, but simply be outplayed.

[quote=Schneed10;256474]3) The coaching staff probably would have lost the respect of the players.

4) Increase the chances that Danny might get pissed and start messing around.[/quote]
These are two very valid concerns that I hadn't considered. I think the first is less of a concern if we actually played well and improved each week, even if we lost some heartbreakers. The second, however, is always a possibility, but hopefully would be tempered by Gibbs showing Danny-boy that we are playing well.

[quote=Schneed10;256474]I would feel a TON better about next year if we finished 8-8 this year, and drafted somewhere around 15th overall. I'd think we have no chance next year if we finish 4-12 and draft within the top 5. We're not one player away, this team needs to show progress and some chemistry. They need to show that they have fight in them and that they won't quit. Otherwise, it's just going to be proof that this team doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to get it done next season.[/quote]

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

Winning is always the goal no matter what the circumstances of the season are.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=onlydarksets;256490]Not under the hypo that mike340 posted. We could play great, but simply be outplayed.[/quote]

With the talent on this team and the quality of the coaching staff, if we play "well" or "great", there's no way we should lose four games in a row. If we finish 4-12, the only possible conclusion we can draw is that the team is a mess. It's impossible to play "well" and lose four in a row. If you lose 4 in a row, then you by definition have not played well ENOUGH.

Did we play "well" against the Titans or the Vikings? Those were two tough losses to swallow. If we can't show the ability to close games out and win them, then exactly how much hope do we have?

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;256491]Winning is always the goal no matter what the circumstances of the season are.[/quote]

[U]Sustained[/U] winning is the goal. Of course you [U]want[/U] to win every game, but the team sometimes makes decisions that sacrifice the short term for the long term (e.g., starting a rookie QB). It's the right decision, even if it lowers our odds of winning in a particular game.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=Schneed10;256492]With the talent on this team and the quality of the coaching staff, if we play "well" or "great", there's no way we should lose four games in a row. If we finish 4-12, the only possible conclusion we can draw is that the team is a mess. It's impossible to play "well" and lose four in a row. If you lose 4 in a row, then you by definition have not played well ENOUGH.

Did we play "well" against the Titans or the Vikings? Those were two tough losses to swallow. If we can't show the ability to close games out and win them, then exactly how much hope do we have?[/quote]

It's just a hypo...

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=Schneed10;256474]Yes, but losing our remaining four games would:

1) Mean we made no progress throughout the year, leaving us all in serious doubt about even getting back to .500 next year.

2) Mean that Jason Campbell has A LOT of work to do.

3) The coaching staff probably would have lost the respect of the players.

4) Increase the chances that Danny might get pissed and start messing around.

I would feel a TON better about next year if we finished 8-8 this year, and drafted somewhere around 15th overall. I'd think we have no chance next year if we finish 4-12 and draft within the top 5. We're not one player away, this team needs to show progress and some chemistry. They need to show that they have fight in them and that they won't quit. Otherwise, it's just going to be proof that this team doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to get it done next season.[/quote]

well summarized. I was just thinking back to losing seasons where we finished strong & of those I remember we did well the next year.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

You [B]never, ever [/B]want to lower your expectations to achieve a short term goal, no matter what. The course has been chartered, stay the course.

On paper, the Redskins have what it takes to be successful. However, no matter how smart you are, it takes time to adjust to a new system. Use the next 4 weeks to fine tune some of the intracacies of the offense, so that next season, Al Saunders can come out full guns a'blazin'. You can always trade up if that is what you seek...

Edit: Bold added for emphasis. The point being that you don't want to tank the season just to gain a few spots in the draft.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

I disagree completely, and I think that's the problem that Danny-boy has had over the last 8 years - he wants the team to improve, but does not want to be patient and let it happen organically. He has consistently tried to "win now" without substantive rebuilding.

Sometimes, like with Campbell, you have to take a step back to take two steps forward.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=BDBohnzie;256507]You never, ever want to lower your expectations to achieve a short term goal, no matter what. The course has been chartered, stay the course.

On paper, the Redskins have what it takes to be successful. However, no matter how smart you are, it takes time to adjust to a new system. Use the next 4 weeks to fine tune some of the intracacies of the offense, so that next season, Al Saunders can come out full guns a'blazin'. You can always trade up if that is what you seek...[/quote]

As I reread your post, maybe we are saying the same thing. I agree completely that you don't want to lower expectations to achieve a [U]short[/U] term goal. As far as the long term, that is where I think we need to be willing to look at the positive if we play very well but lose.

FWIW, I also agree that there is virtually no chance in the NFL that you can actually play well [U]and[/U] lose 4 games in a row.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

I live in NJ, the Giant and Cowboy games are the biggest no matter what the teams' records are. If the Skins don't beat the Giants on the 30th, I'm going to hear about it until next September. I will never hope the Skins lose under any circumstance.

As for draft picks, The Texans perennially get the number 1 pick in the draft. How's that working out for them?

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[QUOTE=onlydarksets;256511]I disagree completely, and I think that's the problem that Danny-boy has had over the last 8 years - he wants the team to improve, but does not want to be patient and let it happen organically. He has consistently tried to "win now" without substantive rebuilding.

Sometimes, like with Campbell, you have to take a step back to take two steps forward.[/QUOTE]

I think he has gotten better at it, but I think when he first took over he approached the team as if he were still just a fan. I think now he realizes he's more than just a fan of the team

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

Every week, I am happy or sad depending on if the redskins are victorious on Sunday. I always want them to win, it may not be the superbowl, but a win is a win, and a Redskin win makes my week regardless of the circumstances. Anyone who doesn't agree, just doesn't care enough about the team i guess. We don't need the #1 draft choice, we aren't taking a QB anyway.

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

[quote=Manusky91;256547]I live in NJ, the Giant and Cowboy games are the biggest no matter what the teams' records are. If the Skins don't beat the Giants on the 30th, I'm going to hear about it until next September. I will never hope the Skins lose under any circumstance.

As for draft picks, The Texans perennially get the number 1 pick in the draft. How's that working out for them?[/quote]

First of all, they missed picked, and second of all, that number one pick significantly helped their defense (even though they still suck), And second of all.............The saints got the number two, the titans got the number three, the jets got the number four, San Fran got number 5, The Packers got their best LB with the number 6, The raiders (defense) got number 7, The Lions got their best LB with the number 9, The Cardinals got their starting QB with the number 10, The Broncos got their starting QB with number 11, and I dont remember stuff after that, but how is that working out for those guys?

Re: Do you want the Redskins to win?
 

i think they can win the next game.and i think redskinds are not the best team in the whole world, but i still like them very much.