Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

lloyd's just not that good.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

I believe B Lloyd will show up this season. He's a great receiver when thrown to. The receiving corps are looking great and healthy. Keep up the support. To answer the question, all players/entertainers deserved to be ridiculed when they aren't playing up to their pay level.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

We're getting way too caught up in this argument over Lloyd's effort on the end zone interception. To me, that's just a small piece of the puzzle.

The bottom line, the guy had one catch for five yards on Sunday. This after last year doing jack squat last year. Randle El struggled last year, and was brought into this offense at the same time as Lloyd, but he seemed to have caught on just fine on Sunday, putting up 5 catches for 108 yards (if you remove the flukey hail mary). What's Lloyd's excuse?

And Daseal, don't give me this crap about him not getting looks. The reason Randle El got the looks is because he ran very precise routes, and JC had confidence he'd be where he was supposed to be. 90% of a WRs job is getting open, making the catch is only 10% of the work. Lloyd just doesn't get open because he doesn't work hard enough to master the playbook, he could care less about learning the intracacies of route-running because all he wants to do is burn dudes deep.

I mean at what point can we just call a spade a spade. If it quacks, it's a duck. Not a hen, not a rooster, not a swan... it's a friggin duck people. Same damn thing happened with Ramsey, and it's happening with Lloyd. People see flashes every now and then, so they think if we just give him more looks, or if we just give him a chance, he'll be OK. No. He sucks. It's not that hard to make the judgment. He's a piece of shit because of his poor work ethic, and it's not going to get markedly better. Book it.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

lloyd isnt great... but we're being a bit harsh... I think we're just tired of reading about him having a piss poor attitude. I dont want a #1 wideout pro-bowler primadona (a la owns, moss, etc...) unless its chad johnson... but I really don't want a guy getting overpaid to be a #3 to have any kind of attitude...


heh... Hard On...hehehe

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

I was at the game and I was watching Lloyd that entire play. He was going deep in the endzone in single coverage, but once he got close to the endzone, he started to slow down. That was right when Campbell threw it, so then Lloyd looked up, started to speed up and ended up being short on the jump.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=canthetuna;350814]lloyd isnt great... but we're being a bit harsh... I think we're just tired of reading about him having a piss poor attitude. I dont want a #1 wideout pro-bowler primadona (a la owns, moss, etc...) unless its chad johnson... but I really don't want a guy getting overpaid to be a #3 to have any kind of attitude...


heh... Hard On...hehehe[/quote]

Dude, he's getting 30 million dollars to perform not like a number one, not like a number 2, not even like a number 3, but like a number 4 receiver. Last year's production was atrocious, and he was atrocious again on Sunday. How can you possibly be harsh ENOUGH on a bum that big?

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

I will go on record, in this very thread. Mods, feel free to archive it. If Brandon Lloyd has any more than 600 receiving yards on the season, I'll donate $100 to the site.

600 yards would actually be a major improvement for him. But it's still CRAZY disappointing for someone with a $30 million contract and was signed to be the #2.

I'll still root for him to get to 600, for a few reasons. The most obvious being it'd help the Redskins, but also, $100 would go nicely towards a new server for these parts. But man, I'll be AMAZED if that happens. The guy sucks, and you can tell the coaches can't stand him.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=steveo395;350817]I was at the game and I was watching Lloyd that entire play. He was going deep in the endzone in single coverage, but once he got close to the endzone, he started to slow down. That was right when Campbell threw it, so then Lloyd looked up, started to speed up and ended up being short on the jump.[/QUOTE]


He had ample opportunity to make a play on the ball in one-on-one coverage. The idea there is, if you can't catch it, you don't let the defense catch it either. I was about 35-49 yds. away from that play, and I witnessed the same thing you did. I don't know how it looked to TV viewers, but being there, it was plain to see he could have done a much better job on the play.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

On TV it just looked the ball was thrown just a bit over his head and he couldn't get his hands on it. Of course the TV is deceptive, so who knows.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=steveo395;350817]I was at the game and I was watching Lloyd that entire play. He was going deep in the endzone in single coverage, but once he got close to the endzone, he started to slow down. That was right when Campbell threw it, so then Lloyd looked up, started to speed up and ended up being short on the jump.[/quote]


That's what I saw on replay as well.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

The thing is, after the season he had last year, with his contract and possibly career riding on this season, Lloyd needs to do a lot more than he did. If anything we are not hard enough on him. See people defending him for reaching for a high pass.....ugh, yeah, that's kind of what professional receivers are expected to do.

This is a guy who alienated everyone on the team from the coach to the lunch ladies last year, who would be gone already if it wasn't for his absurd contract At this point it's up to him to turn perception around.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Being to hard on Lloyd? I'm not sure we're being hard enough.

I jumped off the "I hate Lloyd" bandwagon some time ago, but he has yet to do much of anything. His good plays are few and far between, and he hasn't made much of the opportunity he's had.

I really really really want him to succeed. I think the guy has the potential to be a great receiver, but when a guy comes out and has a bad attitude about things that doesn't fly. Teammates say he turns everyone off from the trainers to the head coaches, he throws his helmet when he gets frustrated, and he's been quoted saying something like "I've had this attitude since I was 5, I see no reason to change it".

I'm willing to give him some chances, but this is year two of the Lloyd experiment.

Let's see some more results... then I'll cut him some more slack.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Wow, the guy sounds about as mature as a little kid. If he doesen't get in gear this year I don't think we will see this guy around. Of course as with any case no matter how bad of an attitude or how bad a player has done before there will always be teams right there to scoop him up.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

he went up and tried to catch the ball. i cant say much for his effort after it was intercepted. but he tried to make the catch. i think the is more a problem with the front office including the hall of famer joe gibbs. he brought this guy here to play and they payed him all this money. gibbs and the crew knew his charater problems and trouble with other players on the 49ers team before they brought him here. it is the first game of the season i think we need to give him a chance to make some plays. he doesnt produce much this year he will probably be gone next year. and if that that happens gibbs has nobody to blame but him self.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Actually listening to Riggo this evening and #44 said the writing is on the wall and if not for Llyod's massive contract he would already be gone and that they could not cut him due to cap reasons in-season. Riggo went on to say with Caldwell being signed it is over for Llyod and he will be cut in the offseason. Two picks and $10+ million later the Skins have finally learned what the 49ers already knew.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Bill B;350841]Actually listening to Riggo this evening and #44 said the writing is on the wall and if not for Llyod's massive contract he would already be gone and that they could not cut him due to cap reasons in-season. Riggo went on to say with Caldwell being signed it is over for Llyod and he will be cut in the offseason. Two picks and $10+ million later the Skins have finally learned what the 49ers already knew.[/quote]


if this is true. then good job joe on trading 2 picks and spending all that money on true character guy. give the guy a chance. the first half of the season last brunell was the QB and then campbell who had ever played before. then through one game of the season we just give up on a guy. i thinks gibbs haslost his judgement on talent a little.we let walt harris go and then he turns into a pro bowler. draft a garbage corner in carlos rogers. hopefully what he saw in campbell is true. not to change subjects but springs is on his way out the door too, we are treating him the same we treated lavar.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=redskins5044;350844]if this is true. then good job joe on trading 2 picks and spending all that money on true character guy. give the guy a chance. the first half of the season last brunell was the QB and then campbell who had ever played before. then through one game of the season we just give up on a guy. i thinks gibbs haslost his judgement on talent a little.we let walt harris go and then he turns into a pro bowler. draft a garbage corner in carlos rogers. hopefully what he saw in campbell is true. not to change subjects but springs is on his way out the door too, we are treating him the same we treated lavar.[/quote]

My hope is that the team will calm down on trading any more picks for "proven" players. Maybe production will finally rule the day and the Skins will stop being the destination for players that "just want a big payday"

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=redskins5044;350844]if this is true. then good job joe on trading 2 picks and spending all that money on true character guy. give the guy a chance. the first half of the season last brunell was the QB and then campbell who had ever played before. then through one game of the season we just give up on a guy. i thinks gibbs haslost his judgement on talent a little.we let walt harris go and then he turns into a pro bowler. draft a garbage corner in carlos rogers. hopefully what he saw in campbell is true. not to change subjects but springs is on his way out the door too, we are treating him the same we treated lavar.[/quote]

I'm sure right now Rexi has a giant "Told you so!" smile on his face.

He warned everyone, and was written off as a lunatic. I heard him out some, and Grim decided to go postal on me.

Amazing how it unfolded exactly like Rexi had said it would.

Let's hope he's still wrong... Because I'd like for a good #3 receiver.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

We brought in Reche because I think he could be a good #3. The guy despite the fact that he dropped that pass in the playoffs is very reliable. He's not going to put up huge numbers but he is reliable.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

we pay this c--- all that money so he can look stylish as he tucks Portis shoulder pads back under his jersey after Portis gets gang tackled.

I think Lloyd is a diva, but am willing to reserve judgement as to whether he will pan out after a few more games. He has put in a little turd of a performance so far.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;350819]I will go on record, in this very thread. Mods, feel free to archive it. If Brandon Lloyd has any more than 600 receiving yards on the season, I'll donate $100 to the site.

600 yards would actually be a major improvement for him. But it's still CRAZY disappointing for someone with a $30 million contract and was signed to be the #2.

I'll still root for him to get to 600, for a few reasons. The most obvious being it'd help the Redskins, but also, $100 would go nicely towards a new server for these parts. But man, I'll be AMAZED if that happens. The guy sucks, and you can tell the coaches can't stand him.[/QUOTE]

Lucky you didn't say that about ARE.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=jsarno;350898]Lucky you didn't say that about ARE.[/quote]

I don't think anybody expected NFL WR2 production out of ARE. With Lloyd I think everyone had reasonable expectations... I don't think even Rexi would have guessed he'd do so poorly on the stat sheet.

At this point, it doesn't really matter what Lloyd is capable of. He's lost the confidence of the coaching staff, and more importantly, he's lost the confidence of his quarterback. If you don't have that as a receiver, you're done.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=dgack;350903]I don't think anybody expected NFL WR2 production out of ARE. With Lloyd I think everyone had reasonable expectations... I don't think even Rexi would have guessed he'd do so poorly on the stat sheet.

At this point, it doesn't really matter what Lloyd is capable of. He's lost the confidence of the coaching staff, and more importantly, he's lost the confidence of his quarterback. If you don't have that as a receiver, you're done.[/QUOTE]

It's only been one week...he could still turn it around. They did throw it to him 2 times, and once in the endzone. Had he caught both, he'd be on his way to a decent season.
If he catches 3 balls for 40 yards and a TD vs the eagles, we'll be talking differently about him.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=jsarno;350907]It's only been one week...he could still turn it around. They did throw it to him 2 times, and once in the endzone. Had he caught both, he'd be on his way to a decent season.
If he catches 3 balls for 40 yards and a TD vs the eagles, we'll be talking differently about him.[/quote]

Sure, I guess I'm just saying that it seems pretty clear that Campbell was looking for Cooley, Moss, and ARE and Lloyd is really the last option. After the perception (deserved or otherwise) that he didn't make the effort to go up and get that INT/pass, why would Campbell look his way again? If anything, JC is going to start throwing the ball away rather than putting it up there for the Amazing Circus Catch Lloyd to go get it.

And really, when you get right down to it, isn't that what this guy's modus operandi was supposed to be? He's not the fastest, known to be a sloppy route runner and fairly lazy in terms of professionalism, but hey, he can go make highlight reel catches...

Except that he isn't doing that. And now he's caught in a negative spiral where he's lost the confidence of coaches and JC, and knows he isn't going to get the ball, so I can pretty much guarantee you he isn't going to be out there giving it his all.

Think back to any time you've shot hoops with a guy who was fire and forget and would never pass. Did you hustle your ass down the court on every rebound after the 25th shot he took, or were you walking up the court? Doesn't matter if it turns out you really just sucked or not, if you don't think you're going to get a chance, you won't hustle. And coaches see you're not hustling, you don't get any more chances.

The only way this cycle gets broken is if a guy has a strong work ethic, and I just don't see that in Lloyd.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=dgack;350911]Sure, I guess I'm just saying that it seems pretty clear that Campbell was looking for Cooley, Moss, and ARE and Lloyd is really the last option. After the perception (deserved or otherwise) that he didn't make the effort to go up and get that INT/pass, why would Campbell look his way again? If anything, JC is going to start throwing the ball away rather than putting it up there for the Amazing Circus Catch Lloyd to go get it.

And really, when you get right down to it, isn't that what this guy's modus operandi was supposed to be? He's not the fastest, known to be a sloppy route runner and fairly lazy in terms of professionalism, but hey, he can go make highlight reel catches...

Except that he isn't doing that. And now he's caught in a negative spiral where he's lost the confidence of coaches and JC, and knows he isn't going to get the ball, so I can pretty much guarantee you he isn't going to be out there giving it his all.

Think back to any time you've shot hoops with a guy who was fire and forget and would never pass. Did you hustle your ass down the court on every rebound after the 25th shot he took, or were you walking up the court? Doesn't matter if it turns out you really just sucked or not, if you don't think you're going to get a chance, you won't hustle. And coaches see you're not hustling, you don't get any more chances.

The only way this cycle gets broken is if a guy has a strong work ethic, and I just don't see that in Lloyd.[/QUOTE]

I agree to what you're saying...however, 1 time is a fluke, 2 times is a trend. I'll wait til the Eagles game before I say anything more about him.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

I hope I'm wrong about the dude for many reasons, not the least of which is that I was fairly vocal about his potential when Rexi was over here talking smack about how bad the deal was. I'll be the first to admit I was WAY wrong about the dude then, so I'd love to be wrong about him now, but I suspect Schneed is right on the $100 bill.

Caldwell is fairly scrubby too, FWIW, but he's at least an amiable scrub.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=dgack;350916]I hope I'm wrong about the dude for many reasons, not the least of which is that I was fairly vocal about his potential when Rexi was over here talking smack about how bad the deal was. I'll be the first to admit I was WAY wrong about the dude then, so I'd love to be wrong about him now, but I suspect Schneed is right on the $100 bill.

Caldwell is fairly scrubby too, FWIW, but he's at least an amiable scrub.[/QUOTE]

Shit, I'm gonna be routing for him extra hard now that Schneed could be $100 down on this deal!!!!

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=jsarno;350927]Shit, I'm gonna be routing for him extra hard now that Schneed could be $100 down on this deal!!!![/quote]

Hell, we could ALL chip in and get EITM or somebody in the DC media to pick up on it, and maybe it motivates Lloyd to prove us wrong! That'd be worth the money if it helped the team win even one game.

But probably, he'd just cut some shitty single called "Haters on the Warpath" or something, instead.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[QUOTE=dgack;350930]Hell, we could ALL chip in and get EITM or somebody in the DC media to pick up on it, and maybe it motivates Lloyd to prove us wrong! That'd be worth the money if it helped the team win even one game.

But probably, he'd just cut some shitty single called "Haters on the Warpath" or something, instead.[/QUOTE]

SOunds good to me...I hear Smootsmack has connections at ESPN. :D

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Another thing to look at is that BLloyd was demoted to 3rd receiver. It was said he could earn his way back to #2. If you look at Sundays game and how it panned out offensively, the image is get in my head is a frustrated Lloyd wanting to perform and didnt get the chance. Usually when this happens he tends to regress back to his half hearted whining ways.

I think the post on what Riggins said is right on the money. I think the coaches need more depth at receiver now that Lloyd is a possible liability. I would not be surprised if the Skins make a move to free up his spot after a couple of weeks. No need to cause a distraction when you are trying to get off to a fast start.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

BL stinks. He was a bad pick up by the skins.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

well its done... i just traded him off of my madden franchise for devin hester...

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Until he proves us wrong, which he hasn't in 17 regular season games now as a Redskin, he's garbage. Those waiting for his magical breakout better be prepared to wait a long time.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;350625]I for one, think we are being FAR too hard on him. He's under an EXTRA critical eye because of what happened last year.

Let's all ALSO remember that last year there wasn't a single receiver who did well, PERIOD. People are too concerned with regurgitating all the "drops" he had last year. If he had so many drops, I'd LOVE to know what games because in my recollection he caught EVERYTHING thrown his way.

He's starting to get the "Carlos Rogers" treatment where everyone just assumes he's bad because someone else said it.[/quote]If you guys paid me $30 million over seven years to post on the Warpath, with $10 mil guarenteed, and I turned out to be a lazy and nonsensical member...I'd hope you all would be ultra critical of me too.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Crazyhorse1;350665][B]The fact is, he's just as good here as he was in San Francisco.[/B] It's just the chemistry is different here and nobody's giving him a look or making him a first option. In SF, he was the looked for receiver. Here, he's got two great receivers ahead of him and a third receiver who's also probably better than he is.[/quote]This is true, but I don't think thats a defense of Lloyd. If anything, this is one of the biggest criticisms against him.

If we brought him in with the idea that he wouldn't improve his production at all, the guy who made that move needs to be fired. It makes sense that we brought him in expecting him to break out, and got exactly what we had seen in SF. Still a bad move, but at least the intent was in the right place.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

Not at all. Hes being paid starter money and not even producing as a number 3. I understand we have been inconsistant at the QB postion, but when given the opprotunity..ie sunday, he shows no effort. I mean, its not his fault we paid him so much money, but at the same time when you sign that contract you have to take everything that comes with it, including the fans being hard on him, am i wrong?

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=dgack;350911]Sure, I guess I'm just saying that it seems pretty clear that Campbell was looking for Cooley, Moss, and ARE and Lloyd is really the last option. After the perception (deserved or otherwise) that he didn't make the effort to go up and get that INT/pass, why would Campbell look his way again? If anything, JC is going to start throwing the ball away rather than putting it up there for the Amazing Circus Catch Lloyd to go get it.

And really, when you get right down to it, isn't that what this guy's modus operandi was supposed to be? He's not the fastest, known to be a sloppy route runner and fairly lazy in terms of professionalism, but hey, he can go make highlight reel catches...

Except that he isn't doing that. And now he's caught in a negative spiral where he's lost the confidence of coaches and JC, and knows he isn't going to get the ball, so I can pretty much guarantee you he isn't going to be out there giving it his all.

Think back to any time you've shot hoops with a guy who was fire and forget and would never pass. Did you hustle your ass down the court on every rebound after the 25th shot he took, or were you walking up the court? Doesn't matter if it turns out you really just sucked or not, if you don't think you're going to get a chance, you won't hustle. And coaches see you're not hustling, you don't get any more chances.

The only way this cycle gets broken is if a guy has a strong work ethic, and I just don't see that in Lloyd.[/quote]

Tremendous post on human nature. Very well said.

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Schneed10;350819]I will go on record, in this very thread. Mods, feel free to archive it. If Brandon Lloyd has any more than 600 receiving yards on the season, I'll donate $100 to the site.

600 yards would actually be a major improvement for him. But it's still CRAZY disappointing for someone with a $30 million contract and was signed to be the #2.

I'll still root for him to get to 600, for a few reasons. The most obvious being it'd help the Redskins, but also, $100 would go nicely towards a new server for these parts. But man, I'll be AMAZED if that happens. The guy sucks, and you can tell the coaches can't stand him.[/quote]

Schneed - you need to lower the yards from 600 to 400 to make it more of a competitive bet - to expect Llyod to more than double his production is a lot to ask!

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

I just watched the play in question on tape about 10 times frame by frame... Brandon gave 100% effort to get the ball. He also had both of his hands on the ball and almost made a really nice catch. Unfortunately the ball went through his hands and basically rested on the DB's facemask and allowed him to make the INT. After the INT Lloyd did not go all out however, could have been becausee the phins safety would have blocked him

Re: Are We Being Too Hard on Brandon Lloyd?
 

[quote=Schneed10;350810]We're getting way too caught up in this argument over Lloyd's effort on the end zone interception. To me, that's just a small piece of the puzzle.

The bottom line, the guy had one catch for five yards on Sunday. This after last year doing jack squat last year. Randle El struggled last year, and was brought into this offense at the same time as Lloyd, but he seemed to have caught on just fine on Sunday, putting up 5 catches for 108 yards (if you remove the flukey hail mary). What's Lloyd's excuse?

And Daseal, don't give me this crap about him not getting looks. The reason Randle El got the looks is because he ran very precise routes, and JC had confidence he'd be where he was supposed to be. 90% of a WRs job is getting open, making the catch is only 10% of the work. Lloyd just doesn't get open because he doesn't work hard enough to master the playbook, he could care less about learning the intracacies of route-running because all he wants to do is burn dudes deep.

I mean at what point can we just call a spade a spade. If it quacks, it's a duck. Not a hen, not a rooster, not a swan... it's a friggin duck people. Same damn thing happened with Ramsey, and it's happening with Lloyd. People see flashes every now and then, so they think if we just give him more looks, or if we just give him a chance, he'll be OK. No. He sucks. It's not that hard to make the judgment. He's a piece of shit because of his poor work ethic, and it's not going to get markedly better. Book it.[/quote]
I love they way you word that ! If he were getting open JC would throw him the ball