Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

mcnabb is a whiney baby

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

Screw McNabb...it's CAMPBELL'S Chunky Soup now! :laughing-

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

If McNabb plays like he did Monday he should be criticized for it. If his receivers suck, then Reid and Lurie should be criticized. If he's still hurt then maybe he shouldn't be playing yet. I can't quite figure out what race has to do with it. Yes there is racism in America. That statement always has been and always will be indisputable. But, in the case of McNabb the one person who ever commented negatively on his race was immediately fired and everyone within a five mile radius of a t.v. camera made sure to get in front of it and denounce Limbaugh as either a know nothing or an outright racist.

Is he saying that the fans in Philadelphia are particularly racist? If so, he should make that clear and leave the rest of us out of it. I remember a time when Schroeder v. Williams was a QB controversey in Redskinland. Everyone I know was decidedly in the Williams camp. Even the guys who think [I]Easy Rider[/I] had a happy ending were vehement supporters of Williams. I've never heard anyone comment on Campbell being black in a negative way and I talk to Redskins fans of nearly every type.

So, I can say with confidence that there is no football racism among the Redskin Nation. And I believe that if McNabb were a Redskin and played like he did Monday, that African American Redskins fans would be yelling for his head along with everyone else. Now, we must all acknowledge that football racism has been made obsolete by the simple desire to win. Everday racism-by which I mean the "I'd like to date your daughter" racism is still much, much too common.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

oh boy........:confused:

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

How come whenever McNabb is doing poorly it is because (his reasoning) black QB's are overly criticized?

It just sounds like a much too convenient "crutch" for him to lean on.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=GTripp0012;354160]QBs that have been more successful than McNabb with equal or less "weaponry":

Matt Hasselbeck
Steve McNair
Brett Favre (pre and post-Walker)
Rich Gannon
Trent Green
Tom Brady
Drew Brees (circa SD)
Chad Pennington (pre shoulder injury)

The argument for McNabb over these guys is that all of these guys for one reason or another have faded in or out of the national spotlight, but all of these guys were better in their prime than Donovan was, and they were so throwing to guys like Darrell Jackson, Derrick Mason, Antonio Freeman, Charlie Garner, Troy Brown, Eric Parker, and Laverneus Coles. James Thrash in his prime was at least as competant as a majority of those guys.

Prior to 03, McNabb never had an elite target. However, by 2004 and 05, he had two. Since then, he's still had Westbrook, who has only gotten better and better since he came into the league.

Receiver play does not excuse average passing. Its an adjustment factor. If McNabb was a deserving 5 time pro bowler, he'd be able to consistently complete more than 60% in a QB friendly offense. By this point in his career its obvious he isn't good enough to do so.

Good for him with his mobility, but it hasn't helped his numbers a whole lot. Maybe it has, but if thats the case, then he is not a very good pocket passer at all. Also, if that is the case, then now that his mobility is limited this year, he won't be a serious threat at all.

Anyway, this is not to take away from what the guy has accomplished (which is quite a bit) in his 8 1/8 years in this league, only to take away from what he hasn't accomplished: become an elite QB.[/quote]

I think your opinions are so hell bent on stats that it clouds your judgement a bit. Just because a guy isn't a 65% passer does mean he is not an elite QB.

I bet if you asked 32 NFL defensive coordinators who would you rather defend. A healthy McNabb or Pennington? 32 out of 32 would say Pennington. Yes Pennington complets 65% but he isn't as good of a QB. McNabb can beat you with his arm and legs.

In a west coast style of offense he should be about a 60% passer or above. He is probably around 57% or 58% for his career. That is good enough to get the job done. Accuracy is not his strength. He is not Carson Palmer. Playmaking is his strength. There is a difference. If you don't understand the difference then so be it.

I think Jason Campbell could probably end up being a McNabb type of QB. He might not ever be a 65% passer like Pennington. But he makes plays that Pennington or Trent Green will never ever make with his downfield arm and mobility. Do you understand the difference????

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

it,s all about playmaking abilities.. for me i much rather face pennigton than mcnabb cause his record against us shows that too.

accuracy is great but playmaking is what seperates the best from the rest..

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

McNabb presser with the Philly media, much of it related to this topic:

[url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/McNabbRemarks9-19-07.htm]ProFootballTalk.com -- The Best Pro Football Scoop on the Internet[/url]

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

Listen...if your not black please [B]at least [/B]try to understand where he is coming from. The first thing people do is try to discredit what he is saying before really assessing WHY he made the statement. Yes, there are plenty of black quarterbacks today. But this is 2007 and I bet you cant name 25 quarterbacks in 75 years of the NFL. So when someone makes a statement that involves how he feels about history, people should not become so defensive and become more understanding as to WHY he said it.
****lets not forget this statement was made weeks before we beat the eagles. So at the time he was considered one of the best in the game****

I could go on & on. But being black there are things that you do have to do better than your white counterparts even in 2007. So I UNDERSTAND his statement but DO NOT USE it as an excuse for poor performance on the field.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

i'm a white man with many black friends who i gladly call my brothers.racism does rear its ugly head very frequent here in the south.i have seen the klan march all over this area,especially when i was younger.but maybe other than the jimmy the greek/linnbaugh examples,i can't ever remember the race issue in i the NFL.i would also stress anybody that has been talked at more than peyton manning till he won the superbowl last year.maybe only john elway,and jim kelly have ever been raked over the media coils more!

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

IMO I don't want to hear him cryin about black QB'S having a tougher time in the NFL, what about the other position's in the NFL? Ratio white to black? There you have it.

He's a big ass crying baby that's been crying this same old tune for far to long, that happens to be INJURY PRONE and CAN'T PLAY LIKE HE ONCE COULD! Can't help it he's black.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

injuries have taken their toll on him,but the eagles coaching staff has never given him a decent reciever other than owens,thrash, and pinkston either.
i think it's more frustration than anything else.he's really gonna cry when he gets benched and kolb comes in for him.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I still feel like this was manufactured news with an unethical stringing of video tape to a result.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I like McNabb as a person and a player. He's a black atlete who worked hard, defied odds and succeeded as a QB in the NFL...he can say what he wants, he has earned the right after managing to play in that City successfully for that long.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

Please oh please don't get Jason Campbell mixed up in all of this crap. Now this from:

[url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm]ProFootballTalk.com -- The Best Pro Football Scoop on the Internet[/url]

'SKINS QUARTERBACK DISAGREES WITH DONOVAN

I hope Florio doesn't make more of JC's comments than necessary. But, given PFT's rep, I wouldn't be surprised to hear more backlash from this.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I think McNabb is 100% right in what he says. Black QB have to be great, not good to keep a job in the NFL.. History in the past 10 years reinforces that. For example, how many black backups are out there? Proven losers or relative no names like Doug Johnson, Kerry Collins, Sage Rosenfels, Trent Edwards, etc. and washed up QB like Vinny Testaverde & Brad Johnson are collecting checks.. Doug Flutie got a 20 year career out of being a novelty act.

It took Byron Leftwich, a career 59% passer with a nearly 2-1 career TD/INT ratio nearly a month to get a contract after he was released. Aaron Brooks, nowhere near a great QB, really not even good but more accomplished than any of the aforementioned white QB (except Brad Johnson) is still out of the NFL. History is littered with good/decent black QB who never got another shot or didn't get the opportunity to hang on as a backup for 10+ years.. For every Anthony Wright, there are 3 Shaun Kings.

There are more black starting QB than there were years ago no doubt, but is Aaron Brooks any worse than 50% of the backups in the league today? That’s where McNabb’s point is being missed by the masses.. Black QB don’t get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to teams taking a chance on them, even as a backup… If Dennis Green took a chance on Randall Cunningham who was out of the league because nobody would bring him into even a training camp, he went on to win 15 games and be within a missed FG of going to the Super Bowl.. Those are the examples McNabb is talking about. JP Losman is in his 4th year of accomplishing nothing in Buffalo and yet there is minmal question or outcry for his job. Steve McNair was a MVP runner up, perennial pro bow QB, Super Bowl QB, had a bad year and fans & media were calling for Billy Volek..

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Paintrain;354628]I think McNabb is 100% right in what he says. Black QB have to be great, not good to keep a job in the NFL.. History in the past 10 years reinforces that. For example, how many black backups are out there? Proven losers or relative no names like Doug Johnson, Kerry Collins, Sage Rosenfels, Trent Edwards, etc. and washed up QB like Vinny Testaverde & Brad Johnson are collecting checks.. Doug Flutie got a 20 year career out of being a novelty act.

It took Byron Leftwich, a career 59% passer with a nearly 2-1 career TD/INT ratio nearly a month to get a contract after he was released. Aaron Brooks, nowhere near a great QB, really not even good but more accomplished than any of the aforementioned white QB (except Brad Johnson) is still out of the NFL. History is littered with good/decent black QB who never got another shot or didn't get the opportunity to hang on as a backup for 10+ years.. For every Anthony Wright, there are 3 Shaun Kings.

There are more black starting QB than there were years ago no doubt, but is Aaron Brooks any worse than 50% of the backups in the league today? That’s where McNabb’s point is being missed by the masses.. Black QB don’t get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to teams taking a chance on them, even as a backup… If Dennis Green took a chance on Randall Cunningham who was out of the league because nobody would bring him into even a training camp, he went on to win 15 games and be within a missed FG of going to the Super Bowl.. Those are the examples McNabb is talking about. JP Losman is in his 4th year of accomplishing nothing in Buffalo and yet there is minmal question or outcry for his job. Steve McNair was a MVP runner up, perennial pro bow QB, Super Bowl QB, had a bad year and fans & media were calling for Billy Volek..[/quote]

That's hard to bite. If that were true the black athlete would not comprise the 80% < > that curretly is the NFL norm. A bunch of second tier white guys would be there instead.
I think the current lack of quality QB's in the NFL is serious, and not lost on NFL management, and coach's. If he can throw the ball, I think Jamal Alvarez Feldman gets a contract this afternoon.
If Mcnabb is trying to help his cause, he's a stupid SOB if does not realize the effect his continued cry baby remarks are having.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Texanskin;354324]I could go on & on. But being black there are things that you do have to do better than your white counterparts even in 2007. So I UNDERSTAND his statement but DO NOT USE it as an excuse for poor performance on the field.[/quote]Good points.

If Donovan had come out and said, "hey guys, don't you think I'm being unfairly critized based on a two game sample under special circumstances," I would be behind him 100%. At the end of the season when the Eagles offense starts producing like they should be and they compete for/make the playoffs, this early season criticism will be far in the mirror.

The problem is that he's trying to project his problem onto african-american quarterbacks around the league to get some extra support. Does anyone here think Steve McNair is being unfairly criticized? Jason Campbell? How about Tavaris Jackson? Byron Leftwich? Well...maybe Leftwich, but because of race?

He really has been overly sensitive to criticizms since the 2005 season and feels the need to defend himself in the media. While ignoring the media coverage is easier said than done, his best bet is to try to keep a low profile for awhile. Don't give pressers and whatnot. Things that you don't mean keep being said, and he may be wearing out his welcome with the mainstream fans.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Paintrain;354628][B]There are more black starting QB than there were years ago no doubt, but is Aaron Brooks any worse than 50% of the backups in the league today?[/B] That’s where McNabb’s point is being missed by the masses.. Black QB don’t get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to teams taking a chance on them, even as a backup… If Dennis Green took a chance on Randall Cunningham who was out of the league because nobody would bring him into even a training camp, he went on to win 15 games and be within a missed FG of going to the Super Bowl.. Those are the examples McNabb is talking about. JP Losman is in his 4th year of accomplishing nothing in Buffalo and yet there is minmal question or outcry for his job. Steve McNair was a MVP runner up, perennial pro bow QB, Super Bowl QB, had a bad year and fans & media were calling for Billy Volek..[/quote]Yes, yes he is. Brooks is terrible.

Look, people look at Losman's passer rating and think that he made a huge improvement in 2006. He didn't, because he threw for a high percentage of his teams TD's and that will heavily skew passer rating. Losman makes a ton of bad decisions, and although his periphials (comp % and Y/A) were pretty good last year, the ridculous jump between his second and third seasons has "fluke" written all over it. So far this year, Losman only has 5.5 y/a passing, not very good.

Scouting error, which is rampant in the NFL, is not evidence that black QBs are undervalued. If anything, QB athleticism is incredibly overvalued, be you black, white, or other. Look at Leftwich's case. The guy has better rushing skills than Carson Palmer, and better pocket mobility than Kyle Boller, but he's out of a job. Because of his race? No, because his coach spends all day on the defensive side of the ball, decides that fat people can't move, and thusly that Garrard is his QB.

Black QBs don't get the benefit of the doubt? Shaun King? Aaron Brooks? Tavaris Jackson? Rodney Peete? Jeff Blake? Anthony Wright?

None of these guys are superstars, but they all hung around as backups (save Jackson) while young prospects got put on the practice squad and then out of the league.

Tony Banks?

Ill agree that Warren Moon had to take the long road because of the era he played in, and Cunningham was met with a lot of criticizm, the type that McNabb thinks he's getting, but I believe that Moon and Cunningham cant be enamored with McNabb's feelings right now.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I think McNabb is right when he says that black QB's have to work harder to prove themselves, but he is wrong when he tries to use that as an excuse for why he gets more criticism.

The bottom line is that even though the NFL as well as many sports is a black majority league, there are certain stigmas for positions and which races should play them. The first part of donovan's statement was made with respect to this and he is right b/c im sure that black QB's have to work hard to shed the stigma that they are also talented passers. Earlier on this thread someone drew a parallel to White RB's which i think is true. Limbaugh got fired b/c he is a racist prick and even though he didn't bring up race directly he was hinting that Donovan's success was some sort of affirmative action enforced by the media. If donovan is an idiot (which i think he is) for making the additional comment that black QB's are criticized more then Rush is equally idiotic for making comments like he did. U can't argue it both ways!

I really don't know why bringing up Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and the NAACP was necessary in any of these discussions. That, to me, sounds like ignorance by some members of this thread about other issues trying to poke its way into a benign discussion.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

Also i have heard the argument that donovan's accomplishments as far as consecutive NFC championship appearances and others, don't matter anymore b/c in the NFL people have a very short term memory. Also people say that Philly is very passionate about their football and that is why they are impatient with donovan. What about Brett Favre? As I recall he went to two superbowls and won 1 (10+ years ago) and people in GB act like he was elected to a position for life. Brett rode the coattails of his defense and RB just as much as Donovan did, if not more and he competed in the abysmal NFC North (then the NFC central with guaranteed wins against the horrible Lions, Bears, and Bucs). GB is every bit as passionate about their football as Philly and if anything has more at stake about the teams success (since each taxpayer owns a portion of the team). Why didn't the media and the fans in GB call for Brett's hide when he threw 4 picks in that playoff game including an unnecessary hail mary with ample time on the clock? I think its partially due to the fact that Brett had the good ol' boy all american look going for him.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;354628]I think McNabb is 100% right in what he says. Black QB have to be great, not good to keep a job in the NFL.. History in the past 10 years reinforces that. For example, how many black backups are out there? Proven losers or relative no names like Doug Johnson, Kerry Collins, Sage Rosenfels, Trent Edwards, etc. and washed up QB like Vinny Testaverde & Brad Johnson are collecting checks.. Doug Flutie got a 20 year career out of being a novelty act.

It took Byron Leftwich, a career 59% passer with a nearly 2-1 career TD/INT ratio nearly a month to get a contract after he was released. Aaron Brooks, nowhere near a great QB, really not even good but more accomplished than any of the aforementioned white QB (except Brad Johnson) is still out of the NFL. History is littered with good/decent black QB who never got another shot or didn't get the opportunity to hang on as a backup for 10+ years.. For every Anthony Wright, there are 3 Shaun Kings.

There are more black starting QB than there were years ago no doubt, but is Aaron Brooks any worse than 50% of the backups in the league today? That’s where McNabb’s point is being missed by the masses.. Black QB don’t get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to teams taking a chance on them, even as a backup… If Dennis Green took a chance on Randall Cunningham who was out of the league because nobody would bring him into even a training camp, he went on to win 15 games and be within a missed FG of going to the Super Bowl.. Those are the examples McNabb is talking about. JP Losman is in his 4th year of accomplishing nothing in Buffalo and yet there is minmal question or outcry for his job. Steve McNair was a MVP runner up, perennial pro bow QB, Super Bowl QB, had a bad year and fans & media were calling for Billy Volek..[/QUOTE]

That's a point that Doug Williams brought up many years ago. About how the perception was that a Black QB had to be good enough to start, and if not he wasn't worth keeping around. Because you can't really teach athleticism, and that's really all the Black QB could offer. They didn't, the perception was, have the mental acuity to be a backup and learn how to be an NFL QB despite less than stellar athletic abilities. Which is, of course, ridiculous and the past two decades I think have shown that this "problem" is going away.

Yes McNabb is criticized (and praised). But any sensible criticism has nothing to do with his race. It's about his injury history, his diminishing skills (as a result of all these injuries), the team's inability to give him the best tools to succeed, and the fact that he's stuck playing amidst a cesspool of Eagles fans.

Now if Eagles fans are racist, that's a damn shame. But don't project that sentiment around the league.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[QUOTE=Rajmahal33;354703]Also i have heard the argument that donovan's accomplishments as far as consecutive NFC championship appearances and others, don't matter anymore b/c in the NFL people have a very short term memory. Also people say that Philly is very passionate about their football and that is why they are impatient with donovan. What about Brett Favre? As I recall he went to two superbowls and won 1 (10+ years ago) and people in GB act like he was elected to a position for life. Brett rode the coattails of his defense and RB just as much as Donovan did, if not more and he competed in the abysmal NFC North (then the NFC central with guaranteed wins against the horrible Lions, Bears, and Bucs). GB is every bit as passionate about their football as Philly and if anything has more at stake about the teams success (since each taxpayer owns a portion of the team). Why didn't the media and the fans in GB call for Brett's hide when he threw 4 picks in that playoff game including an unnecessary hail mary with ample time on the clock? I think its partially due to the fact that Brett had the good ol' boy all american look going for him.[/QUOTE]

There was a lot of anti-Favre backlash. There has been for a few years now.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[QUOTE=Hog1;354679][b]That's hard to bite. If that were true the black athlete would not comprise the 80% < > that curretly is the NFL norm. [/b]A bunch of second tier white guys would be there instead.
I think the current lack of quality QB's in the NFL is serious, and not lost on NFL management, and coach's. If he can throw the ball, I think Jamal Alvarez Feldman gets a contract this afternoon.
If Mcnabb is trying to help his cause, he's a stupid SOB if does not realize the effect his continued cry baby remarks are having.[/QUOTE]

Black players are the majority of 'skill position' players, but the "cerebral positions" center and QB are manned at more than a 90% clip of white players.. I don't see how someone who is uniquely qualified to express his opinon (since nobody here on the board is a black NFL QB) makes him a stupid SOB and cry baby.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[QUOTE=GTripp0012;354697]Yes, yes he is. Brooks is terrible.

Look, people look at Losman's passer rating and think that he made a huge improvement in 2006. He didn't, because he threw for a high percentage of his teams TD's and that will heavily skew passer rating. Losman makes a ton of bad decisions, and although his periphials (comp % and Y/A) were pretty good last year, the ridculous jump between his second and third seasons has "fluke" written all over it. So far this year, Losman only has 5.5 y/a passing, not very good.

Scouting error, which is rampant in the NFL, is not evidence that black QBs are undervalued. If anything, QB athleticism is incredibly overvalued, be you black, white, or other. Look at Leftwich's case. The guy has better rushing skills than Carson Palmer, and better pocket mobility than Kyle Boller, but he's out of a job. Because of his race? No, because his coach spends all day on the defensive side of the ball, decides that fat people can't move, and thusly that Garrard is his QB.

[b]Black QBs don't get the benefit of the doubt? Shaun King? Aaron Brooks? Tavaris Jackson? Rodney Peete? Jeff Blake? Anthony Wright?

None of these guys are superstars, but they all hung around as backups (save Jackson) while young prospects got put on the practice squad and then out of the league.

Tony Banks?[/b]

Ill agree that Warren Moon had to take the long road because of the era he played in, and Cunningham was met with a lot of criticizm, the type that McNabb thinks he's getting, but I believe that Moon and Cunningham cant be enamored with McNabb's feelings right now.[/QUOTE]
To the part bolded, getting a fair opportunity isn't the benefit of the doubt.

I agree that for the most part Brooks is terrible, but is he any worse than Doug Johnson, Drew Henson, Billy Volek, Kerry Collins, Jared Lorenzen, Charlie Frye, Patrick Ramsey (that was for some of you out there :) ), David Carr, AJ Feely? My point isn't that he is good, just he somewhat accomplished as an NFL QB but didn't get a sniff this offseason even as a backup..

For every Shaun King (who took his team to the NFC Championship game & was in the league less than 5 years) there are 2-3 Todd Collins, players who were never starters yet carved out a long career as a backup.. Aaron Brooks holds a lot of Saints passing records (over Archie Manning), Jackson was a second round pick and is still young, Peete was a high draft pick who started for most of his career, Blake & Wright are somewhat exceptions to the rule..

As I orignally posted, black QB have to be great, not good to have a long career in the league.. The criticism they get seems to be quicker and harsher than white QB and the leash is a lot shorter..

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=GTripp0012;354690]Good points.

If Donovan had come out and said, "hey guys, don't you think I'm being unfairly critized based on a two game sample under special circumstances," I would be behind him 100%. At the end of the season when the Eagles offense starts producing like they should be and they compete for/make the playoffs, this early season criticism will be far in the mirror.[/quote]

Just FYI, this interview was taped in August. The airing date was particularly bad timing and I've no doubt that this was not accidental on the part of the show's producers.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I hope the Eagles never win a SB......no matter who their QB is....black, white, asian, Indian, Thai, whatever......Donovan's rant is useless....just go out and play....if you are afraid of or have to cry about criticism, then get a new job....

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=70Chip;354291]McNabb presser with the Philly media, much of it related to this topic:

[URL="http://www.profootballtalk.com/McNabbRemarks9-19-07.htm"]ProFootballTalk.com -- The Best Pro Football Scoop on the Internet[/URL][/quote]

Ok first of all I am not black but a minority and I have experienced racism and I do experience it everyday in small ways. But they key is when I feel it has gone too far or is offensive enough to present on such a large scale I do it in a much more appropriate way.

Just look at that recent presser, and how he is treating the media and those who are just asking questions. I dont really care what you think or believe. When you want to defend a strong position you have to do it properly or you will end up sounding like a complete dumbass, like McNabb.

Whenever they asked him questions, his answers were "Hey I don't know, you guys are the media you all know", and commonly putting in "you know" every two sentences. He sounds like a complete dumbass who is just full of shit. I could care less what the fuck he thinks and I am embarrassed that he is representing minorities in such a demeaning way.

Every time I read anything he has to say it just pisses me off even more. It is obvious this guy doesn't give a crap about anything but himself and when he is asked to properly explain his position he just gets upset.

As people have said the world of sports has integrated and has a much smaller impact of racism, so he needs to shut up and play. He is a freaking distraction to his organization and teammates. Next time, during the offseason do some research, learn some stats, and properly present yourself on this issue McNabb.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=hooskins;354839]Ok first of all I am not black but a minority and I have experienced racism and I do experience it everyday in small ways. But they key is when I feel it has gone too far or is offensive enough to present on such a large scale I do it in a much more appropriate way.

Just look at that recent presser, and how he is treating the media and those who are just asking questions. I dont really care what you think or believe. When you want to defend a strong position you have to do it properly or you will end up sounding like a complete dumbass, like McNabb.

Whenever they asked him questions, his answers were "Hey I don't know, you guys are the media you all know", and commonly putting in "you know" every two sentences. He sounds like a complete dumbass who is just full of shit. I could care less what the fuck he thinks and I am embarrassed that he is representing minorities in such a demeaning way.

Every time I read anything he has to say it just pisses me off even more. It is obvious this guy doesn't give a crap about anything but himself and when he is asked to properly explain his position he just gets upset.

As people have said the world of sports has integrated and has a much smaller impact of racism, so he needs to shut up and play. He is a freaking distraction to his organization and teammates. Next time, during the offseason do some research, learn some stats, and properly present yourself on this issue McNabb.[/quote]

Well said...thats how Ive perceived this exactly.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Rajmahal33;354703]Also i have heard the argument that donovan's accomplishments as far as consecutive NFC championship appearances and others, don't matter anymore b/c in the NFL people have a very short term memory. Also people say that Philly is very passionate about their football and that is why they are impatient with donovan. What about Brett Favre? As I recall he went to two superbowls and won 1 (10+ years ago) and people in GB act like he was elected to a position for life. Brett rode the coattails of his defense and RB just as much as Donovan did, if not more and he competed in the abysmal NFC North (then the NFC central with guaranteed wins against the horrible Lions, Bears, and Bucs). GB is every bit as passionate about their football as Philly and if anything has more at stake about the teams success (since each taxpayer owns a portion of the team). Why didn't the media and the fans in GB call for Brett's hide when he threw 4 picks in that playoff game including an unnecessary hail mary with ample time on the clock? I think its partially due to the fact that Brett had the good ol' boy all american look going for him.[/quote]

Any direct comparison between the people, cities and cultures of GB, and Philly, is absurd.
Sooooo, you are saying that Brett is given a free ride because he is white?

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Paintrain;354738]Black players are the majority of 'skill position' players, but the "cerebral positions" center and QB are manned at more than a 90% clip of white players.. I don't see how someone who is uniquely qualified to express his opinon (since nobody here on the board is a black NFL QB) makes him a stupid SOB and cry baby.[/quote]

He is also "Uniquely Qualified" to repeatedly bear the backlash of such comments to the media, and the questionable judgement of doing so.......repeatedly.
The failure to learn that a certain action, will bring a certain negative reaction, time and again makes him a stupid SOB

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=Paintrain;354741]To the part bolded, getting a fair opportunity isn't the benefit of the doubt.

I agree that for the most part Brooks is terrible, but is he any worse than Doug Johnson, Drew Henson, Billy Volek, Kerry Collins, Jared Lorenzen, Charlie Frye, Patrick Ramsey (that was for some of you out there :) ), David Carr, AJ Feely? My point isn't that he is good, just he somewhat accomplished as an NFL QB but didn't get a sniff this offseason even as a backup..

For every Shaun King (who took his team to the NFC Championship game & was in the league less than 5 years) there are 2-3 Todd Collins, players who were never starters yet carved out a long career as a backup.. Aaron Brooks holds a lot of Saints passing records (over Archie Manning), Jackson was a second round pick and is still young, Peete was a high draft pick who started for most of his career, Blake & Wright are somewhat exceptions to the rule..

As I orignally posted, black QB have to be great, not good to have a long career in the league.. The criticism they get seems to be quicker and harsher than white QB and the leash is a lot shorter..[/quote]

I have to agree with you on 100% on Aaron Brooks. He is better than so many NFL back-ups it's not even funny. Brooks is better than Drew Henson, Jared Lorenzen, Charlie Frye, AJ Feely, Joey Harrington, Doug Johnson, JT O'Sullivan, Bruce Gradkowdski. I'm probably mssing some. But you get my point.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=skinsfan69;355013]I have to agree with you on 100% on Aaron Brooks. He is better than so many NFL back-ups it's not even funny. Brooks is better than Drew Henson, Jared Lorenzen, Charlie Frye, AJ Feely, Joey Harrington, Doug Johnson, JT O'Sullivan, Bruce Gradkowdski. I'm probably mssing some. But you get my point.[/quote]I don't think I'd cut a single one of those guys for Brooks.

I think in a few cases, Brooks is a comprable option. However, he's on the wrong side of 30, and is pretty horrible. Lorenzen, Frye, Harrington, O'Sullivan, and Gradkowski are all still getting better. I think I'd take Brooks over Doug Johnson, but that's pretty much about it.

I don't think the Bengals would be a lot better with Brooks as their No. 2 anyway.

Henson sucks, but hes not in the league, I don't believe.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

I think a point a lot of people are missing is that the majority of black QB's are scrambling qb's. The Majority of white qb's are pocket passers.
I don't think this issues is as much about race as it is style of qb.
Vick was a god in Atlanta and would have had that job for life, and he did nothing to deserve it. Young in Tennessee has been given the key to the freakin city and everyone thinks he's an amazing QB (minus me...I feel he's the most overrated QB in the league). Look at Culpepper...he came off a possible career ending injury, and the Dolphins STILL gave him the full reins and a nice contract even though they had no clue of what they were getting. Leftwich was one of the few pocket passers, and what did he do for jacksonville? Nothing! He never threw for more than 15 td's in a season. Who did they replace him with? A black scrambling QB.
McNabb talked about Manning and Brady...well, in case he forgot, Manning was scrutinized for not being able to win the big game until he won the big game. Brady has won 3...why would he be scrutinized? McNabb needs to shut up and win the big one, then he can ride their bus. Instead is a consistant loser when the playoffs come around!
Pennington was freakin cheered for getting hurt in NY. Eli has been called "sheli". In our own backyard, Brunell took us to the playoffs, and his job was still in jeopardy. Plummer was on his way to the playoffs then got benched for a rookie.
This is not about race people, this is about "what have you done for me lately." White QB's have been scrutinized just as much as black qb's (in recent years, not back in the day). McNabb is living in the past, and it's wrong to assume it's race. It's obviously not when Campbell and Young come out and say what they did. I respect both for saying it, and I appreciate Campbell's stand.
About Favre...he plays in an area that idolizes their players...they have nothing else. He won a super bowl for them, and that's all they needed for life...that signed his ticket.
PS- Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson won super bowls, and where are they now? They did what McNabb can't do, and they lost their jobs shortly after winning. Don't tell me white qb's are not held to the same standards. They are. It's all about what have you done for me lately.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

McNabb is trying to turn the table on this so people don't see just how bad he is in the playoffs. I do not blame the Phily fans for getting restless...they are a perennial playoff team, yet they have not won anything. How is this? Who is the first to be blamed in these cases? The QB!
McNabb has been the reason they lost in 5 playoff games. That's 5 years worth of losses. That's HUGE!
2000- 181 yards, 1td, 1int
2001- 171 yards, 1td, 1int
2002- 243 yards, 0td, 1int
2003- 100 yards, 0td, 3int
2004- 357 yards, 3td, 3int*
*- in the super bowl, those 3int's killed the eagles...he played fairly well otherwise.
In 5 games, he threw for 1052 yards, 5tds, and 9int's. This is a guy that averages a little under 2 td's a game, and a little over .5 int's a game, yet in the playoff losses he averages only 1 td but almost 2 int's a game?
I ask you, what QB in the league has performed this poorly in the playoffs and not gotten any scrutiny? If you ask me, he's lucky to not get more flack from people. He's the true choke artist. Most people don't even get that many chances to prove themselves...he's had ample opportunity and blew it. Again, this is not about race, it's about him, and he's trying to deflect it to be about race.
You want to talk about race in sports, then let's talk about how many white people there are playing basketball.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

McNabb's intense scrutiny is really a product of playing in Philly, not his being black. I went to college in Philly in the 80's, and I vividly recall idiot Philly fans booing Mike Schmidt, perhaps the greatest ballplayer in the 100+ years of their franchise. In Philly, that just comes with the territory. That said, McNabb has labored an entire career with a series of stiffs at WR (T.O. aside), and managed to be one of the better QBs of this generation. Give him Peyton Manning's WRs and Donovan would have two rings by now.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=jsarno;355047]McNabb is trying to turn the table on this so people don't see just how bad he is in the playoffs. I do not blame the Phily fans for getting restless...they are a perennial playoff team, yet they have not won anything. How is this? Who is the first to be blamed in these cases? The QB!
McNabb has been the reason they lost in 5 playoff games. That's 5 years worth of losses. That's HUGE!
2000- 181 yards, 1td, 1int
2001- 171 yards, 1td, 1int
2002- 243 yards, 0td, 1int
2003- 100 yards, 0td, 3int
2004- 357 yards, 3td, 3int*
*- in the super bowl, those 3int's killed the eagles...he played fairly well otherwise.
In 5 games, he threw for 1052 yards, 5tds, and 9int's. This is a guy that averages a little under 2 td's a game, and a little over .5 int's a game, yet in the playoff losses he averages only 1 td but almost 2 int's a game?
I ask you, what QB in the league has performed this poorly in the playoffs and not gotten any scrutiny? If you ask me, he's lucky to not get more flack from people. He's the true choke artist. Most people don't even get that many chances to prove themselves...he's had ample opportunity and blew it. Again, this is not about race, it's about him, and he's trying to deflect it to be about race.
You want to talk about race in sports, then let's talk about how many white people there are playing basketball.[/quote]You're analyzing it backwards. I loosely agree with what you are saying, but the idea is not to take all the playoff loses and try to blame McNabb for them. It's to try to find out who was most responsible for those losses.

My answer: The Bucs, Panthers, and Patriots. McNabb didn't beat those teams because his team was worse than those teams. His numbers in those games reflect the dominances of those defenses. Course that wasn't just McNabb's line against them. That was every QB they played in those seasons.

Re: McNabb says black QBs criticized more
 

If he had lead Philly to a Super Bowl championship or 2 he'd be the toast of the town. Unfortunately he hasnt and the brutal Philly fans are letting him know it. This all seems like sour grapes to me.

Re: And now I don't care about McNabb...
 

[quote=jsarno;355047]McNabb is trying to turn the table on this so people don't see just how bad he is in the playoffs. I do not blame the Phily fans for getting restless...they are a perennial playoff team, yet they have not won anything. How is this? Who is the first to be blamed in these cases? The QB!
McNabb has been the reason they lost in 5 playoff games. That's 5 years worth of losses. That's HUGE!
2000- 181 yards, 1td, 1int
2001- 171 yards, 1td, 1int
2002- 243 yards, 0td, 1int
2003- 100 yards, 0td, 3int
2004- 357 yards, 3td, 3int*
*- in the super bowl, those 3int's killed the eagles...he played fairly well otherwise.
In 5 games, he threw for 1052 yards, 5tds, and 9int's. This is a guy that averages a little under 2 td's a game, and a little over .5 int's a game, yet in the playoff losses he averages only 1 td but almost 2 int's a game?
I ask you, what QB in the league has performed this poorly in the playoffs and not gotten any scrutiny? If you ask me, he's lucky to not get more flack from people. He's the true choke artist. Most people don't even get that many chances to prove themselves...he's had ample opportunity and blew it. Again, this is not about race, it's about him, and he's trying to deflect it to be about race.
You want to talk about race in sports, then let's talk about how many white people there are playing basketball.[/quote]

The reason why more white people are not in basketball is because they are not the best players in that sport. Plain and simple.

Re: McNabb says black QBs criticized more
 

Here's what I'm pissed about--why no black kickers!

J/K, obviously. I agree that there is inherent racism throughout the US, though much of it below the surface. But it's getting better. These things take time.

As for Donovan's stats, etc.--my guess is that many teams in many cities would be happy to get McNabb even now, much less a few years ago. He's kicked our asses enough times for me to appreciate that he's a high quality NFL QB. He hasn't won a SB, so that's gonna dog him for his career unless he manages to do so.

Race is a tough thing, especially here in the US with our long history of race problems. So I think he was correct in his comment. But he no doubt didn't help his standing by making the comment, especially given the timing. But I respect McNabb, and so I give him the benefit of the doubt here. ANY comment about race is going to cause a firestorm. But not speaking up about it is probably worse--getting these things out in the open and debated will help, even if it takes a long time.