Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=dmek25;425593]nice analysis. no need to be an ass, though. i just think there is more to the story, as far as Detroit wanting to unload him[/QUOTE]

Imm with dmek on this one there something to this trade it might be injury related.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

I am pretty sure that we will be agressively making trades. Cerrato said that there will be more trades this year than ever, because the free agent pool will be so over valued. When they start saying they are not going after free agents, that means they will be doing alot of trading. Hopefully, we can thow in Lloyd just to get him of the roster.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

detroit wanting to unload a top tier WR after all of the trouble they had in the draft and how much their franchise was set back by recent first rd wr busts?? it does sound fishy for a 2nd rd pick.. but that is the going rate when Owens was traded from SF to BAL it was for a 2nd round pick..if the chance is there we should take it Roy Williams is an elite WR

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

My question is if Detroit is wanting a second right now, and the Cowboys having Glenn and TO at the end of their careers, why not give up that late first round pick and trump everyone else for Williams?

Not only that, it would give them two, so that way we could at least discern by saying, "No, not that Roy, the good one."

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

I just updated this thread...

Rod Marinelli is responding to rumors:

[url=http://info.detnews.com/redesign/blogs/lionsblog/index.cfm]DETNEWS | Weblog | Lions Blog[/url]

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

i like savin picks too but i dont think i could pass that up

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

i want to keep the picks. plain and simple

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

c'mon people. do you guys honestly think det. is going to give away roy williams for a 2nd round pick? i don't even think matt millen would be stupid enough to make that trade.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[URL="http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2008/02/marinelli_very_confident_that.html"]Marinelli: 'Very confident' that Williams is staying[/URL]

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=Schneed10;425610]My apologies on the snide remark. Was just a little surprised to hear anyone suggest he was anything short of the cream of the crop at his position.

If there's a reason he wants out of Detroit, my guess is he simply thinks the team sucks, and he'd like to push a trade to a team who'd be willing to rework his deal and give him his big signing bonus now (as opposed to him waiting for free agency and the possibility of getting tagged by Detroit).

He's probably afraid of getting stuck in Detroit for his whole career.[/quote]
apology accepted. it just seems like that price tag is way too cheap, for someone that has the talent that Williams has. and i wouldn't want to be stuck there, either

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;425640]c'mon people. do you guys honestly think det. is going to give away roy williams for a 2nd round pick? i don't even think matt millen would be stupid enough to make that trade.[/quote]
Detroit is realy stupid. They draft first every year and suck every year. They gave up Dre Bly for a guy who got benched last year.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

I'd hate to part with our 1st but I'd still give it plenty of thought. He is simply the best WR that is reasonably available and is very good. Our 2nd I would personally wrap and hand deliver for a guy like RW.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=dmek25;425541]i don't understand why everyone is jumping all over Williams for a second round pick. when Hall is available, for a first rounder, and far the more proven player. is there that much of a difference between the 2 picks? in my opinion, we need a corner far more then we need a wide out. and i think there is more to Williams just wanting out of Detroit[/quote]

cause hall's a douche who wants a lot of money and may create locker room issues... and that first pick is our DE for the next 10 years that we'd be trading away.

the difference in value between #21 and #56 (or whatever) is huge.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

RW 4 a 2nd round pick next year no brainer, nobody is denying we need help at DL, OL & CB but if we keep our picks this year & get RW 4 a 2nd next year come on we would have 2 do it.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

All the news is that Snyder is not making any big splashes this year. Wouldn't it be funny if he came up with Williams for next yrs second and Ocho some how with one of this yrs picks? I know you all will say can't possibly do it with the money cap, but Snyder is the capologist.

I doubt we get both but Williams and perhaps Hall? I know they also are thinking about another LB to help out until McIntosh gets completly healthy.

I only mentioned Ocho because for some reason his thread keeps making it to the top.lol. Someone mentioned that we will have him signed by Tues. while we are still trying to get below the 118,000 cap. lol. I wouldn't doubt Snyder to get it done if he wants it but I have a hard time believing by Tues.

I'm betting some trade could be worked out by draft day. Something to entice the Bengals to want to give up Ocho and still allow them to have a replacement for him, but unless some one has inside info about it getting done prior to Tues. we are still struggling to get low. lol.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=cpayne5;425598]Schneed's a stud, huh? It's good to see you guys reconcile. :D

On topic, yes, Roy Williams for a 2nd rounder would be a good trade.[/QUOTE]

LOL...obviously I need to edit that post.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=SBXVII;425696]All the news is that Snyder is not making any big splashes this year. [b]Wouldn't it be funny if he came up with Williams for next yrs second and Ocho some how with one of this yrs picks?[/b] I know you all will say can't possibly do it with the money cap, but Snyder is the capologist.

I doubt we get both but Williams and perhaps Hall? I know they also are thinking about another LB to help out until McIntosh gets completly healthy.

I only mentioned Ocho because for some reason his thread keeps making it to the top.lol. Someone mentioned that we will have him signed by Tues. while we are still trying to get below the 118,000 cap. lol. I wouldn't doubt Snyder to get it done if he wants it but I have a hard time believing by Tues.

I'm betting some trade could be worked out by draft day. Something to entice the Bengals to want to give up Ocho and still allow them to have a replacement for him, but unless some one has inside info about it getting done prior to Tues. we are still struggling to get low. lol.[/QUOTE]

That's more fantasy thought than anything. Moss would then be the highest paid 3rd WR in the league, and Randle El would be the highest paid 4th WR ever, and Lloyd would be the highest paid 5th or 6th or 7th WR ever. Not gonna happen. We can't afford to drop any of them, so if we do get 1 WR, it will be just that...[b]1 WR[/b].

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

his contract expires next year. so his stint with whatever team he will be on next year, will be like donte stallworth on the eagles 2 years ago.

i say keep the picks. the only wr to trade for is OCHO CINCO!!

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=dmek25;425646]apology accepted. it just seems like that price tag is way too cheap, for someone that has the talent that Williams has. and i wouldn't want to be stuck there, either[/quote]

I think the seemingly low price tag is an indication that this will not happen. All we've seen is this one source indicating that a 2nd round pick would do it. I echo the sentiments of other posters in this thread, I don't buy that at all. It will definitely take a 1st rounder to get Roy.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

If it is factual that a 2nd rounder would get him, I would say go fo it. But I honestly doubt they let him go.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;425658]Detroit is realy stupid. They draft first every year and suck every year. They gave up Dre Bly for a guy who got benched last year.[/quote]

Yes they are stupid but not THAT stupid. Bly was a 32 year old corner who is past his prime. Williams is a lot younger and should be coming into the prime of his career. Trust me. It's not gonna happen. Williams is just too good a player to be tossed aside for a 2nd round draft pick. It's going to take a lot more than that, plus he's going to want a new deal. If he's dealt it's going to be a draft pick and a starter.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=jsarno;425705]That's more fantasy thought than anything. Moss would then be the highest paid 3rd WR in the league, and Randle El would be the highest paid 4th WR ever, and Lloyd would be the highest paid 5th or 6th or 7th WR ever. Not gonna happen. We can't afford to drop any of them, so if we do get 1 WR, it will be just that...[B]1 WR[/B].[/quote]

You are 100% correct. All I was saying is it would be awsome to have two talented tall WR. Lloyd should be gone this yr anyway. He has not produced and I doubt he will with Zorn cause he has burned his bridge I believe. Thrash I used to love but he has simply fallen off the chart. Yes he is good on special teams but he used to be good as a 3rd down specialist. He was awsome in his first stint with the skins. His second stint has been nothing special. If I'm not mistaken McCardell was thinking retirment prior to us signing him plus he has 15 yrs on him. Thrash has 10 yrs on him.

I went to the Redskins web site and was shocked at how many WR we have. I immagine or I hope some would work out for us.
Randel El
Espy
Caldwell
Harris
Moss
Thrash
McCardell
Lloyd
Mix at 6-5 235
McMullen at 6-4 215
Mann at 6-1 190
Toler at 6-2 185

I could see us letting Thrash, Lloyd, McCardell go if the last 4 work out well for us. I also hope Espy comes back with a vengence.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=SBXVII;425761]You are 100% correct. All I was saying is it would be awsome to have two talented tall WR. Lloyd should be gone this yr anyway. He has not produced and I doubt he will with Zorn cause he has burned his bridge I believe. Thrash I used to love but he has simply fallen off the chart. Yes he is good on special teams but he used to be good as a 3rd down specialist. He was awsome in his first stint with the skins. His second stint has been nothing special. If I'm not mistaken McCardell was thinking retirment prior to us signing him plus he has 15 yrs on him. Thrash has 10 yrs on him.

I went to the Redskins web site and was shocked at how many WR we have. I immagine or I hope some would work out for us.
Randel El
Espy
Caldwell
Harris
Moss
Thrash
McCardell
Lloyd
Mix at 6-5 235
McMullen at 6-4 215
Mann at 6-1 190
Toler at 6-2 185

I could see us letting Thrash, Lloyd, McCardell go if the last 4 work out well for us. I also hope Espy comes back with a vengence.[/QUOTE]

Long list of no-names but we have 3 or 4 solids there.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

Randle El - good
Espy - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
Caldwell - fine as a 3rd or 4th
Harris - bum
Moss - good
Thrash - borderline bum as a WR, special teamer only
McCardell - too old
Lloyd - bum
Mix at 6-5 235 - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
McMullen at 6-4 215 - bum
Mann at 6-1 190 - bum
Toler at 6-2 185 - bum

Too many bums, and only 2 good ones. And the two who are good are small. The long list does nothing for me. We shouldn't care how many guys we have, we should care who we have who's capable of making serious plays.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

We can probably put this to bed now. Marinelli has stated that the Lions will not trade Roy Williams. Makes sense, why the hell would they? He and CJ can make for the best 1-2 punch in the league.

Lesson learned by the Warpath, just because a blog says it could happen doesn't mean it's legitimate.

[url=http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080225/SPORTS0101/802250341/1004/SPORTS]Marinelli: Williams stays[/url]

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=Gmanc711;425594]I'm all for keeping our picks...but I'd do that for a second rounder in a heartbeat if we had the chance.[/QUOTE]

Me too. I'd rather give up a 2nd rounder NEXT year and Brandon Lloyd for RW.

AS for Hall, I think we need to make a move for him somehow. I first rounder at any point is out of the question. Maybe for s 2nd round pick this year, and a later round pick next year, but as of now we need all of our picks.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=Schneed10;425783]We can probably put this to bed now. Marinelli has stated that the Lions will not trade Roy Williams. Makes sense, why the hell would they? He and CJ can make for the best 1-2 punch in the league.

Lesson learned by the Warpath, just because a blog says it could happen doesn't mean it's legitimate.

[URL="http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080225/SPORTS0101/802250341/1004/SPORTS"]Marinelli: Williams stays[/URL][/quote]

That's the typical knee jerk reaction around here. Some bloger writes that Chad Johnson and Roy Williams are on the block and people freak out. Nevermind that their two head coaches said that neither player isn't going anywhere.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=Schneed10;425782]Randle El - good
Espy - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
Caldwell - fine as a 3rd or 4th
Harris - bum
Moss - good
Thrash - borderline bum as a WR, special teamer only
McCardell - too old
Lloyd - bum
Mix at 6-5 235 - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
McMullen at 6-4 215 - bum
Mann at 6-1 190 - bum
Toler at 6-2 185 - bum

Too many bums, and only 2 good ones. And the two who are good are small. The long list does nothing for me. We shouldn't care how many guys
we have, we should care who we have who's capable of making serious plays.[/quote]

I agree but Mix has only 1 yr under his belt and could turn out to be special in the right scheme. Same with McMullen and Mann...both drafted by other teams and possibly they are no good but maybe in the right scheme they flourish. Lloyd is a bum, Toler = ?, Harris never showed much, Thrash has not produced as a WR as he did in his first stint, McCardell is old, Espy I liked alot but will he play or be injured every yr?, Moss and El are great #2/#3 but sub par #1/#2. We need a legitimate #1 WR who is tall and big to compliment our speed WR and possession WR.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;425783]We can probably put this to bed now. Marinelli has stated that the Lions will not trade Roy Williams. Makes sense, why the hell would they? He and CJ can make for the best 1-2 punch in the league.

Lesson learned by the Warpath, just because a blog says it could happen doesn't mean it's legitimate.

[url=http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080225/SPORTS0101/802250341/1004/SPORTS]Marinelli: Williams stays[/url][/QUOTE]

Yeah. Just gaging the reaction on this board, Williams for a 2nd rounder was just not going to happen. First, as Schneed said, Williams and CJ make a potent receiver combo. Why dump him if they can afford him under the cap? Second. Even if he was trade bait, it is clear that the bidding was going to require a first rounder or multiple picks either this year or next to outbid some of the other teams listed.

While I would have been okay with a 2nd rounder, I would have opposed getting into a bidding war for him. Rather have the picks and take some shots. In fact, I hope we can drop a slot or two in various rounds and pick up some extra picks either this year or next.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=SBXVII;425803]I agree but Mix has only 1 yr under his belt and could turn out to be special in the right scheme. Same with McMullen and Mann...both drafted by other teams and possibly they are no good but maybe in the right scheme they flourish. Lloyd is a bum, Toler = ?, Harris never showed much, Thrash has not produced as a WR as he did in his first stint, McCardell is old, Espy I liked alot but will he play or be injured every yr?, Moss and El are great #2/#3 but sub par #1/#2. [B]We need a legitimate #1 WR who is tall and big to compliment our speed WR and possession WR.[/B][/QUOTE]

I agree with the majority of this assessment but disagree with the bolded part. For those of you with "tall receiver" fascination one name: Steve Smith.

In the receiver dept. what we need is a receiver, regardless of height, who gets open in the endzone inside the redzone and takes some of the coverage away from Cooley. Height is helpful but not determinative. It certainly comes in handy on corner fades and the occasional jump ball, but, other than that, it is short area separation, not height, that is most important.

For whatever reason, neither Moss nor ARE seem particularly suited for the redzone (not sure what their stats there are - but would not be surprised to see the majority of their TD's come from 20 yards or beyond). But M. Harrison, who is not gigantic by any means seems to do well in the short field, ditto Steve Smith.

Not sure where we find the red-zone Cooley compliment that we need. But whereever we look, we should not say that only WR's 6' 2" and over need apply.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;425804]Yeah. Just gaging the reaction on this board, Williams for a 2nd rounder was just not going to happen. First, as Schneed said, Williams and CJ make a potent receiver combo. Why dump him if they can afford him under the cap? Second. Even if he was trade bait, it is clear that the bidding was going to require a first rounder or multiple picks either this year or next to outbid some of the other teams listed.

While I would have been okay with a 2nd rounder, I would have opposed getting into a bidding war for him. Rather have the picks and take some shots. In fact, I hope we can drop a slot or two in various rounds and pick up some extra picks either this year or next.[/quote]I think they will try to get something for him before his free agency year. Sure, they could franchise him, but he's going to leave before that team is competitive, and if they can become competitive faster by dealing him, then it's a good deal for them.

I would also be opposed to a bidding war for him. In any other year, I would give up a 2nd, but with the depth of this draft, the 2nd is far too valuable to trade.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=Schneed10;425783]We can probably put this to bed now. Marinelli has stated that the Lions will not trade Roy Williams. Makes sense, why the hell would they? He and CJ can make for the best 1-2 punch in the league.

Lesson learned by the Warpath, just because a blog says it could happen doesn't mean it's legitimate.

[URL="http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080225/SPORTS0101/802250341/1004/SPORTS"]Marinelli: Williams stays[/URL][/quote]

Put it to bed 2 months before the draft? What GMs & coaches say during this period is usually about 50% true. Marinelli might mean what he says, but has he met w/RW & talked about an extension?

If they feel certain they can't sign him to an extension they may look to deal him. He has 1 yr. remaining on his rookie deal.

Schneed, reading your post reminded me of 04 when Gibbs said it was a "safe assumption" that Champ would be back w/the skins that year. Next thing I hear is that he's going to Denver.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;425525]i would do it for a 1st next year all day. Lets get it done[/quote]Ditto. It'll be late first rounder anyway.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

Basically when a voach says "No trade, no way" it means "Our player is superior and you're going to have to make me an offer that we can't refuse."

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=freddyg12;425818]Put it to bed 2 months before the draft? What GMs & coaches say during this period is usually about 50% true. Marinelli might mean what he says, but has he met w/RW & talked about an extension?

If they feel certain they can't sign him to an extension they may look to deal him. He has 1 yr. remaining on his rookie deal.

Schneed, reading your post reminded me of 04 when Gibbs said it was a "safe assumption" that Champ would be back w/the skins that year. Next thing I hear is that he's going to Denver.[/quote]

Point taken, what a coach says does not always mean it will be the case. But let's just take a step back and evaluate the big picture.

The Lions have been trying desperately to assemble big talent at WR. They drafted Charles Rogers, Roy Williams, Mike Williams, and now Calvin Johnson. They've hit on two of the four. Now, after all that, they'd consider giving up the one who is most proven out of all four of them, for a measly 2nd round pick?

Is it just me, or does that just fail to pass the sniff test?

And saying "the Lions are dumb" is not an explanation. They make boneheaded moves for sure, but one thing's clear: for the past four years they have gone hard after talent at WR. Just doesn't make sense that now they'd decide to change course and trade it away, especially for unequal value.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

Well while we are at it lets play the devils advocate. Is there any way we can play the sniff test with Ocho? Lets look at how the deal could get done and if there is no possible way then it doesn't pass...right.

What would have to happen to keep Cincy from getting hammered with a 8 mil cap hit and still make the trade and how we would be able to accomodate them? A side from picks to entice them how would we get these teams to listen and give up their WR's?

Could CJ have Cincy design a new contract that would accomplish this or is the old contract set in stone and the only changes to be made will not change the cap hit?

If we are only looking at a WR who could deffinitly step up day one and produce. I would like for us to draft all new young players such as how the Patriots have in the past. Have a faster younger team with low cap but sometimes you need to think outside the box and think that whoever we draft will need to get up to NFL speed and HOPEFULLY be productive which might not be their first yr. Perhaps learning the ropes from some one we trade for.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

I know it seems I like CJ and I do. But also look at the other WR that are out there and perhaps someone could explain what it might come close to costing us for each WR prospect that might be good for us. I know I am asking alot.lol. but just best guestimation as to what we would have to pay to get the WR and possibly how it could get done instead of everyone jumping on the "He sucks" and " I like this one better" and "they all have personality issues."

I mentioned CJ cause Snyder is supposed to be enamored with CJ and was wondering if CJ's agent could pull something off what and how would it be. and perhaps how we can get the lions talking trade if they supposedly have closed the door. It seems all the teams are closing the doors on WR. Is it possibly that no team is high on any WR this yr?

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[QUOTE=JoeRedskin;425808]I agree with the majority of this assessment but disagree with the bolded part. For those of you with "tall receiver" fascination one name: Steve Smith.

In the receiver dept. what we need is a receiver, regardless of height, who gets open in the endzone inside the redzone and takes some of the coverage away from Cooley. Height is helpful but not determinative. It certainly comes in handy on corner fades and the occasional jump ball, but, other than that, it is short area separation, not height, that is most important.

For whatever reason, neither Moss nor ARE seem particularly suited for the redzone (not sure what their stats there are - but would not be surprised to see the majority of their TD's come from 20 yards or beyond). But M. Harrison, who is not gigantic by any means seems to do well in the short field, ditto Steve Smith.

Not sure where we find the red-zone Cooley compliment that we need. But whereever we look, we should not say that only WR's 6' 2" and over need apply.[/QUOTE]

No one is saying a small wide receiver can't succeed. Look at Moss a couple years ago. What people are saying, me included, is that you need a tall compliment to a small speedy WR. You mentioned Steve Smith, so look at these numbers:

2006 Panthers 15th in passing yards...had a 6'4" Keyshawn Johnson that caught 70 balls.
2007 Panthers 29th in passing yards...2nd best receiving threat on the team was TE Jeff King.
It's no coincidence that the Panthers passing game went to pot after losing a large target like Keyshawn. Of course the injured Delhomme hurt too, but Smith had 83 catches in 06, and 87 in 07.

You raise a good point about Harrison, however, Peyton could have a crew of midgets and he would make it work. Harrison and Wayne are some of the best route runners in the league.

Still point remains, we're not saying to never pick up small wr's again, but we need one due to the fact that we have small wr's now. They compliment each other. Will it be the end of the world if we don't get one? No, but it will free up Moss and Randle El to do other routes and be more effective for their sizes and our team concept.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;425808]Height is helpful but not determinative. It certainly comes in handy on corner fades and the occasional jump ball, but, other than that, it is short area separation, not height, that is most important.

For whatever reason, neither Moss nor ARE seem particularly suited for the redzone (not sure what their stats there are - but would not be surprised to see the majority of their TD's come from 20 yards or beyond). But M. Harrison, who is not gigantic by any means seems to do well in the short field, ditto Steve Smith.[/quote]
Can't coach height & hops. It's a match-up problem that many teams can't answer if they don't have elite CBs. When you are inside the red-zone everything shrinks, but if you have a big target that can physically outmatch the CBs to the edge, the CBs have to play more outside to defend the fade or out. This which means the zones inside get just a bit bigger to squeeze that stop or slant in there. In addition to being able to throw the fade or stop.

I've looked at some of the red-zone stats for Harrison & Holt (in response to another thread a couple of months ago) their production is good. However they are both Pro Bowl caliber receivers and great route runners, Moss and ARE are not.

IMO we need to see if Mix can develop, even if it's just in the red-zone. From what I read a while back on Mix the folks in NY didn't want to see him go but he only plays X, same as Plaxico so he was pretty much stuck there with no chance to get on the field.

I would love to see Roy Williams here for a 2nd rounder, but it won't happen. Another team will come up with a sweeter deal than we can, and I wouldn't give up a #1 for him.

Re: Roy Williams (WR) for a 2nd Round Pick?
 

[quote=Schneed10;425782]Randle El - good
Espy - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
Caldwell - fine as a 3rd or 4th
Harris - bum
Moss - good
Thrash - borderline bum as a WR, special teamer only
McCardell - too old
Lloyd - bum
Mix at 6-5 235 - bum with A LITTLE long-term promise
McMullen at 6-4 215 - bum
Mann at 6-1 190 - bum
Toler at 6-2 185 - bum

Too many bums, and only 2 good ones. And the two who are good are small. The long list does nothing for me. We shouldn't care how many guys we have, we should care who we have who's capable of making serious plays.[/quote]

Damn..that's a lot of bums!