Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=mredskins;479546]Not true because Reggie Bush did his little mocking thing before the TD and his was assed on the kick off. It is BS![/quote]

Interesting point...but technically accurate.
That touchdown by rule should have been called back...correct?
or is there some sort of stipulation for taunting fouls?

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=rypper11;479553]
"Not true because Reggie Bush did his little mocking thing before the TD"

Taunting is a flagrant foul resulting in a 15 yd penalty but it is always enforced after the play.[/quote]

This answers my question...I should have read the whole tread.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;479666]The replay of the Heyer hit, in my view, clearly showed Heyer pushing the opposing player in the chest to the ground with both hands at the same time that Campbell was releasing the touchdown pass. Players are taught to play to the whistle. This hit was during the play and not to the head. How the hell was that a penalty? Just because the guy wasn't defending himself, does not make it a penalty. He should be playing to the whistle. That's how you get hurt on the football field, lolly gagging and not paying attention. [B]Just because it was away from the ball is crap also.[/B] How is Heyer supposed to know if Campbell was scrambling and taking off running. If Heyer was lolly gagging and his man hustled and hit Campbell from behind, we would be complaining about Heyer not playing until the play was over. This was a B.S. call.[/quote]

Keep in mind, this was a passing play....if Heyer was too far from the play, he'd be downfield....which is a penalty anyways.
Anyone behind of the line of scrimmage will be blocked...period....you do not penalize the offense for doing their job by blocking multiple people during a passing play...the only reason he should be penalized is if it was an illegal block

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;479722][I][B]Burress does that on EVERY play[/B][/I]. I couldn't believe that first one was called. Thomas really got boned... but he'll learn from it and hopefully he can adapt to be more subtle.[/quote]

Totally. It always makes me sick. I mean when he does it, it's TOTALLY blatant.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=skinsnut;479754]Keep in mind, this was a passing play....if Heyer was too far from the play, he'd be downfield....which is a penalty anyways.
Anyone behind of the line of scrimmage will be blocked...period....you do not penalize the offense for doing their job by blocking multiple people during a passing play...the only reason he should be penalized is if it was an illegal block[/quote]

Heyer was definitely not downfield. The replay of the hit was shown from the camera angle used to show Jason throwing the ball. As Jason's throwing, you see Heyer hit the guy in the background. To me, it looked like he hit him in the chest. I just don't see the rule against that. Saying "the ref's were watching" doesn't give them a right to call a foul against a player clocking a guy when he isn't paying attention. If it did, just think of some of the fouls you would see on special teams. If Campbell had to turn around and scramble back, would a pancake block to the chest have been legal? The ref's made up a foul to protect a guy who made a dirty play against Portis and then got clocked, legally, when he didn't play to the whistle.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

has anyone found a video of the play yet? i looked on youtube but its not there. if JC was in the act or just got rid of the ball when heyer hit him then im starting to think it shouldnt have been a foul regardless of whether dockett stopped playing.

from the replay i saw, it doesnt show JC but shows most of the lineman on both sides kinda standing upright not really playing anymore which led me to believe the ball was half way down the field. if JC was in the act of throwing when heyer hit him then imo it was a bad call.

go skins!

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I think the call was crap--can anyone on this site recall a similar penalty? Now, if it was just illegal hand to the face, ok. But if it was hitting an unprotected player, like when a WR gets hit on a high pass or a punter gets nailed on a return, then it's nuts. This was a lineman blocking a rusher DURING A PASS PLAY! So the guy gave up on the play--is that Heyer's fault? People get their clocks cleaned EVERY play on the line. let it go.

THomas played a much better game and JC will be looking to him more and more as he gets used to what he can do. My feeling is when plays break down, Thomas is working hard to get open. Jc will learn that and look his way more often. Pity about the TD, but wins are what matter!

Can't wait to see both Thomas AND Kelly healthy and in synch with JC.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=GoSkins!;479803]Heyer was definitely not downfield. The replay of the hit was shown from the camera angle used to show Jason throwing the ball. As Jason's throwing, you see Heyer hit the guy in the background. To me, it looked like he hit him in the chest. I just don't see the rule against that. Saying "the ref's were watching" doesn't give them a right to call a foul against a player clocking a guy when he isn't paying attention. If it did, just think of some of the fouls you would see on special teams. If Campbell had to turn around and scramble back, would a pancake block to the chest have been legal? The ref's made up a foul to protect a guy who made a dirty play against Portis and then got clocked, legally, when he didn't play to the whistle.[/quote]

I completely agree with this. Campbell still had the ball in his hands AND let's say that Campbell throws the ball across the hashmarks, that block would be instrumental in the play's potential.

It shouldn't matter whether he is actively rushing the passer or not, he should be allowed to be blocked until the play is finished.

The play wasn't even halfway over when Heyer made that block. It was a hard block but that's about it. Completely dumb call.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I finally found a decent replay of it ([url=http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80b02019]NFL Video Galleries[/url], about 2:30 in, thanks to [url=http://misterirrelevant.com/index.php/2008/09/22/in-which-we-attempt-to-understand-why-heyer-was-flagged-on-thomas-td/]In Which We Attempt to Understand Why Heyer Was Flagged on Thomas' TD | Mr. Irrelevant[/url]), and watching it again, Portis hit Dockett, then Heyer no more than 1 second later hit him, with Portis watching on. Leads me to believe even more that it was a questionable call...

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

Thanks for the video. Bad call. Skins should not have been punished. Dockett has to learn not to stand around like a grazing cow during a pass rush, that should be all.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=WaldSkins;479485]Poor Devin Thomas, he gets his first NFL touchdown overturned by a flagrant foul call that had nothing to do with the play. If i was him, i would have started to cry even though Heyer was just retaliating for the way #90 took down Portis two plays earlier.

I dont think that this touchdown should have been overturned and it should have been assessed on the kickoff ala Reggie Bush last week. Thoughts on the call????[/quote]


This makes my first reply as a Warpath registered member.

I don't think we have to pity Devin at all. This guy will make us proud and he will get more opportunities to shine in the glory of the Skins. Thomas and Kelly appear to be bonified WRs that need the throws in their direction as the season progresses. Can't wait for the two of them to be in the same formation along with Santana and Cooley.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=BDBohnzie;479861]I finally found a decent replay of it ([URL="http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80b02019"]NFL Video Galleries[/URL], about 2:30 in, thanks to [URL="http://misterirrelevant.com/index.php/2008/09/22/in-which-we-attempt-to-understand-why-heyer-was-flagged-on-thomas-td/"]In Which We Attempt to Understand Why Heyer Was Flagged on Thomas' TD | Mr. Irrelevant[/URL]), and watching it again, Portis hit Dockett, then Heyer no more than 1 second later hit him, with Portis watching on. Leads me to believe even more that it was a questionable call...[/quote]

I'm going to try to stop obsessing over this but......

I was watching the game again and saw the penalty, again.
Two things:
1. Campbell was tackled by an Arizona defender just AFTER he threw the pass and AFTER Heyer made his hit. If the play was over, that would have been a penalty or a late hit. It clearly was not. Nobody on the field is supposed to quit on the play.
2. No hands to the face. Heyer shoved him (hard) with one hand on the chest and the other on the shoulder pad. Hard to believe that is unnecessary roughness while the play is going on. It's rough, but not illegal or dangerous. We are playing football not golf.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

After watching the video, I don't see what was illegal about that hit. It was during the play, and looked clean. Kick ass, Stephon! I'm glad Thomas is on the field, that 2nd PI call was pretty blatant, though, looked like vintage Michael Irvin.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=Larry Michael is Satan;479966]After watching the video, I don't see what was illegal about that hit. It was during the play, and looked clean. Kick ass, Stephon! I'm glad Thomas is on the field, that 2nd PI call was pretty blatant, though, looked like vintage Michael Irvin.[/quote]
It was a blind side hit that looked dirty, but the play wasn't over and the ref didnt blow his whistle. But you can get called for unnecessary roughness during the play.

It was pretty bad, but should it have been assessed on the kickoff? I am not really sure, does anyone know the specific rules as to when that is done?

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

The Heyer hit reminds me of that Reggie White hit years ago on a Green Bay lineman. Mccarthy and Reggie almost got into a fight. Wasn't that considered a cheap shot, but
also not against the rules?

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

What I like about this play is that it means our team is starting to build cohesion in that Heyer had Portis's back by unloading on that dude....you don't eff with family.

Seems like their building an on field bond. Seeing Portis jumping up and down after that block only makes me laugh because only lord knows what he's saying to Dockett as he goes horizontal.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

Honestly the more I see the play the more I agree it was a BS call. I'm letting Heyer off the hook now.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I thought the hit was perfectly fine, didn't look to me like he hit him from behind, in the head, or after the play was over. Heyer was allowed to hit him.

Does anyone remember the play from 2002 when Warren Sapp hit that offensive lineman on Green Bay? Favre through a pic and the DB on the Bucs was running down the field. Sapp then hit this o-linemen who wasn't paying attention, who was not even near the ball, and knocked him off his feet. The guy had to be carted off the field, he was seriously injured during the hit. No flag was thrown because it was a legal hit

After the game Green Bay's coach went up to Sapp and had some words with him, I think it was McCarthy at the time.

Heyer's hit was similar in that it had nothing to do with the play, but it was still legal.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

holy snickies JC was releasing the ball as heyer hit him. nice video find BD, the nfl videos are real gems.

i hope zorn sends this to the nfl, not to contest or argue it, but to just get a clarification as to what was a foul and why because if this play happens against one of our D lineman and it is not called i will freakin loose it. nothing i hate more than inconsistent officiating. i guess it has flag unneccesary roughness because the ref considered it a "blindside hit" but blindside hits as part of the play are legal right? i know you cant come in and blindside someone if they are standing near a pile up but this is different . ..

just really hope zorn seeks and gets clarification.

go skins!

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

aren't we talking about football? just because someone stops, does that mean you have to stop also? no way that should have been a penalty. and i like the little bit of meanness Mr Heyer showed.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

That was an awful call! Heyer knocked the sh*t out of that Cardinal fair and square...if he wasn't looking thats his problem. JC still had the ball in his hand at the time of the block!

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;480082]What I like about this play is that it means our team is starting to build cohesion in that Heyer had Portis's back by unloading on that dude....you don't eff with family.

Seems like their building an on field bond. Seeing Portis jumping up and down after that block only makes me laugh because only lord knows what he's saying to Dockett as he goes horizontal.[/quote]

I agree Skinny Tee. This group of players are finally becoming a real TEAM. This is going to get good folks. Good to see Heyer play like that. BS call.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I am bummed for Devin Thomas and proud of Heyer. Awful call. Devin's first, second, and third TD will just have to come against Dallas this week.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

well good news for people like me who take this whole pigskin thing way to seriously . . . . coach zorn said yesterday that he did send a request to the NFL for an explanation of the penalty so hopefully a reporter will remember to follow up with it a few weeks later and get a lil clarity of the situation.

if anyone does hear anything about what the NFl said please update this thread.

go skins!!

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I hope Mike Perara talks about this call on NFL Network.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=celts32;480533]I hope Mike Perara talks about this call on NFL Network.[/quote]

I'd definitely like to hear his take on it.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I am sorry but this is football. He hit him from the side and in this league you need to keep your head on a swivel. This DL was cheapshoting people all day and all Heyer did was light him up from the side during the play. When the ball is snapped until the whistle, you play ball and you go hard. He hit him from the side which in my opinion, is legal. The referees had no business negating that touchdown.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

I'm happy to see that Heyer has a nasty streak. I have full confidence in Devin, his timetable to be a legitimate receiving threat is approaching. In about 6 games, watch out world.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

Inside the NFL (now on Showtime) focuses on the battle that was going on in the trenches and also showed what happened on this particular play. The highlights included audio so you could kinda hear what was being said between the players. Although #90 (Darnell Dockett) is local he is an annoying asshole and I can see why Hyer laid his ass out. Even Samuels was talking trash to him and he's not even on Samuels' side of the line.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

[quote=Mattyk72;480539]I'd definitely like to hear his take on it.[/quote]

He almost always backs the referees and defends the decisions when he is on NFLN. Company guy. I doubt he'll discuss and if he did I doubt you would find his discussion satisfying.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

Insider:

Posted at 3:34 PM ET, 09/26/2008
Heyer Draws $5,000 Fine from NFL

From Jason La Canfora

Stephon Heyer was fined $5,000 today by the NFL for unnecessary roughness -- unnecessarily striking an opponent away from the play, according to a source with knowledge of the situation -- in the Washington Redskins' victory Sunday over the Arizona Cardinals.

He drew a 15-yard penalty for striking Arizona defensive lineman Darnell Dockett on a play after Dockett had mixed it up with running back Clinton Portis a few plays earlier. The Redskins believed Dockett might be fined for putting his arm about Portis's neck on one play, but he was not disciplined, according to the source.

The penalty on Heyer negated a touchdown pass to Devin Thomas and was a proper interpretation of that personal foul, team sources said.

Re: Poor Devin Thomas
 

What? Is this punishment for Zorn asking for an explanation? This is BS.