Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;492201]Everyone should be at least a bit concerned by yesterday's game. That game should have been cake if you look at it statistically, but it was very close. The D is fine, but again, very few turnovers thus far created this season. I rather have the D give up a bit more ypg if it meant getting 2-3 turnovers for our offense. Can't believe with our firepower we can't get into the endzone as of late against weaker competition.[/quote]

I'd wait a couple weeks and look back at this game. Aside from the QB, maybe the Browns aren't that weak.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

yeah the redzone production is a little dissapointing

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;492156]I t may be just me and the commentators but I thought he was going to throw it. It's not a bad idea really, because nobody expects your TE to throw the ball. They just shut the play down too quickly for him. for all the criticism, the Browns defense isn't all that bad.

I agree about the pass rush, but I suspect we were building O in this years draft and looking to next year to pump up the lines on both sides of the ball. The current record may well be something of a bonus to the organisation who I think were looking to next year to get competitive. IF we can pick the right players up in next years draft, imagine how much better we will be? Right now we need Taylor to get his groove back.

As to the passing game, I think Campbell is being deliberately careful and trying to avoid mistakes. Am I alone in thinking I wouldn;t mind seeing him make a few more throws down field and risk the INT?[/quote]

Sorry to say but I'm with Mattyk72 and not with you. Turnover-free football may not be as sexy but it wins.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;492201]Everyone should be at least a bit concerned by yesterday's game. That game should have been cake if you look at it statistically, but it was very close. The D is fine, but again, very few turnovers thus far created this season. I rather have the D give up a bit more ypg if it meant getting 2-3 turnovers for our offense. Can't believe with our firepower we can't get into the endzone as of late against weaker competition.[/quote]

I understand the concern and have expressed as much. However, nyredskinsfan may be right that the Browns may turn out to be better than we thought ("they WEREN'T who they thought they were").

I also have noticed that we haven't been blown out (knock on wood). When the Cowboys and Giants have failed to bring it, they've been blasted. When we fail to bring it, we win or lose close. I think this is a good thing.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Suisham, makes that field goal he missed and we would have been looking good at the end of the game instead of the nail biter. Does anyone know what happened there? Did he slip, or did the new punter muff the hold. A wins, a win. Hail To The Redskins!!!

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

When Portis took off on that last run and I was screaming at the TV - DO NOT FUMBLE THAT BALL. And Wham... that sucked! I'm happy we won, very! It's nice to have things go our way for once.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=nyredskinsfan;492213]I'd wait a couple weeks and look back at this game. Aside from the QB, maybe the Browns aren't that weak.[/quote]


I think the MNF game against the Steelers will tell where we truly are at, but I still rather have a defnse that might give up a little more yardage and create extra opportunities for our offense to put points up. Our passing game overall is vanilla, with the exception of some big gainers to Moss. Can't rely on Clinton every game to come close to having 200yd games all the time either. He is getting dinged up little by little with all of the work h e is getting.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Our passing game won't fire on all cylinders until we have better receivers. The rookie 2nd rounders were supposed to fix this problem but haven't so far. It is still early in their NFL lives, though.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Remember the long bomb to Davis, JC hits that, and are we talking about not blowing them out. We are working out the kinks in the new offense, and I expect the 2nd half of the season that we will be very excited.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;492258] We are working out the kinks in the new offense, and I expect the 2nd half of the season that we will be very excited.[/quote]

I have the same expectations. :headbange

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=Lotus;492251]Our passing game won't fire on all cylinders until we have better receivers. The rookie 2nd rounders were supposed to fix this problem but haven't so far. It is still early in their NFL lives, though.[/quote]

I don't see how receivers are the problem when Moss, ARE, and Cooley are all having very good seasons.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Cooley is a stud hands down.

Moss is not the big receiver that you need to go over the middle and make the clutch 3rd down catch in traffic or to grab the fade in the end zone. He also has trouble getting free when double covered. So do some other receivers, but the great ones find a way to get open, anyway.

Don't get me wrong - I love Randle El - but he really is a third, slot receiver. Not a number 2. Look at it this way: Arizona's 2nd wideout caught 90 balls last year. Randle El caught 50 balls in his best year.

I love Thrash for his character and his special teams play but he just is not that productive as a number 3 receiver.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Bottom line production wise: Cooley, Moss, and ARE are all on pace for at least 69 catches each. That's pretty damn good. The passing game will continue to develop as they all gain more experience in the offense. I don't think talent is the problem.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I looked it up and Boldin only caught 70 balls last year, not 90. Sorry, I misremembered. He has caught 100 balls before, though.

Randle El is on his way to his best year. Nonetheless, if you look over time, you see that his norm is a 30 catch year.

I completely agree that the passing game will get better as the season goes on.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I'd love for the rookie receivers to get more involved too, but at this point I'm losing hope for any of them to have a major impact this year.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=Lotus;492342]I looked it up and Boldin only caught 70 balls last year, not 90. Sorry, I misremembered. He has caught 100 balls before, though.

Randle El is on his way to his best year. Nonetheless, if you look over time, you see that his norm is a 30 catch year.

I completely agree that the passing game will get better as the season goes on.[/quote]

Dude AZ is the expectation not the rule to 2nd WR production. Fitz and Boldin would be number one on almost any other team. I would not use them as your bench mark.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=Lotus;492334]Moss is not the big receiver that you need to go over the middle and make the clutch 3rd down catch in traffic or to grab the fade in the end zone. He also has trouble getting free when double covered. So do some other receivers, but the great ones find a way to get open, anyway.[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Someone is obsessed with size... [/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Moss is a pro-bowl receiver and we are blessed to have him. He does get open.. just not on every play. He has had the clutch 3rd down catch. I saw that many times when Brunell was QB and we had fewer options at WR. Getting open often is hard to do when you have 2 or 3 defenders covering you, and why should JC throw into coverage when he has other options? The only reason you say he isn't getting open is because JC doesn't chance it that often. He is safe. Which would explain the no INTs. Moss deserves a great deal of respect, IMO.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I figured I'd get hammered for saying something critical...

mredskins, Arizona was just one clear example of a team with a fine #2 receiver.

hesscl34, I am not obsessed with size. But it is in fact an advantage in the NFL. Look at how many grabs Randy Moss (just one example) makes simply because he is taller than the db covering him.

I'm not saying anything that Zorn and VC didn't say in the run-up to the draft. Why do you think we spent our first 3 picks on pass catchers?

Matty, I think that you are right that the rooks will not produce much this year. I'm hoping that they turn a corner in the second half of the season. Nonetheless I stand by my claim that the passing game would improve with better receivers.

HTTR

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I know everyone is obsessed with big receivers but Santana Moss and Antwaan Randle-El run the West Coast offense very well. Because they are run well after the catch, they fit into this offense perfectly. The big receiver is needed on the goal line for the fade route. That's the only play where a big receiver is advantageous.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;492390]I know everyone is obsessed with big receivers but Santana Moss and Antwaan Randle-El run the West Coast offense very well. Because they are run well after the catch, they fit into this offense perfectly. The big receiver is needed on the goal line for the fade route. That's the only play where a big receiver is advantageous.[/quote]

A big possession receiver is great for plays between the hashes, although we do have Cooley to help with that.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I wouldn't be so quick to praise rock.... the man can run through some holes, but when the hole colapses he's screwed. He had a couple runs where he was tackled for a lose. Thats why he is what he is (a #3 back)

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=Lotus;492388]
hesscl34, I am not obsessed with size. But it is in fact an advantage in the NFL. Look at how many grabs Randy Moss (just one example) makes simply because he is taller than the db covering him.
HTTR[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I think you need to go back and watch film. Moss has had some of the best grabs in the NFL over these last few years. His ability to leap in the air and run at incredible speed makes up for his height. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngxIGQJjYaA&NR=1]YouTube - santana moss gots hops 42 in vertical(watch in high quality)[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGSZGvUQDIw&feature=related]YouTube - Santana Moss highlights[/ame]

(Yes, I heart Moss!!) ... :)

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I could find even cooler highlight reels of Brandon Llody catching the ball, still doesn't mean he is a good reciever. Size is definitly an advantge in the NFL.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=mredskins;492438]I could find even cooler highlight reels of Brandon Llody catching the ball, still doesn't mean he is a good reciever. Size is definitly an advantge in the NFL.[/quote]

It's an advantage for some, but Moss doesn't need it.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

i hear ya hessy. there are alot of posters around here that have huge man crushes on receivers like Anthony Mix( just because he is tall) don't make a bit of difference to me. if you can play.... and Santana, and Steve Smith are perfect examples of this

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

I like Santana a lot and am happy he is on our team. I do not have "man crushes" on any one, including Mix.

It is simple physics. A 6'4" guy who can run fast and jump high is going to get to more balls than a 5'10" guy who can run fast and jump high.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=Lotus;492478]I like Santana a lot and am happy he is on our team. I do not have "man crushes" on any one, including Mix.

It is simple physics. A 6'4" guy who can run fast and jump high is going to get to more balls than a 5'10" guy who can run fast and jump high.[/quote]

Moss is more talented than most of those 6'4" guys. He can run faster and jump higher regardless of his height. That's the point I'm making.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Nobody remember The Smurfs? What about Gary Clark - 5' 9". The Marks brothers in Miami?

Yes height is an advantage in some respects, but there are plenty of short players who made it big in the NFL especially at WR. Speed, agility and good hands are most important.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Horton gets better with every game he plays, and so does Evans. I would vote for Fletcher for defensive player of the month.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

Remember those short WR's that Dan Marino used to throw to? And remember the Fun Bunch of the '80's? They won a lot of games for the Redskins.

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=JLee9718;492510]Remember those short WR's that Dan Marino used to throw to? And remember the Fun Bunch of the '80's? They won a lot of games for the Redskins.[/quote]

Err see my post - the Marks Brothers was the nickname of Mark Clayton and Mark Duper, those short WR's...

And the Fun Bunch was the TD celebration the Skins did. The group of short WR's was nicknamed The Smurfs. Err as I posted.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but are YOU actually old enough to remember them? :)

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

[quote=hesscl34;492487]Moss is more talented than most of those 6'4" guys. He can run faster and jump higher regardless of his height. That's the point I'm making.[/quote]

I'm just going to add this

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=3654424]ESPN - In wake of Welker, teams turning to tinier targets - NFL[/url]

Re: The Not So Obvious From the Browns Game
 

mix is a good tall recirever and familiar with jason.