Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=skinsfan69;557180]Well it's not that other teams don't make mistakes. It's just the mistakes our FO makes are retarded as hell. The smart thing to do was not to panic and let Evans play. That 2nd round pick could've been used on a potential quality starter.....perhaps at RT. But there is nothing anyone can do about it now and it's time to turn the page on this one.[/quote]

Or it's just that we are more closely attuned to these and don't give a hoot when another teams fan base is just as upset about a move or non-move their teams FO makes.

Lets face it, for good or bad, this FO is going to be aggressive in trying to make this team a contender. Sometimes that will be a great move like MW or bringing JG back, sometimes it will backfire like JT's signing. The only thing we can be sure of is that they are not going to sit on their hands and moan about the condition of the team. Hopefully, each move that backfires teaches DS a little more about football ownership, and that he will learn enough that when he gets to be Al Davis' age he's not grasping at straws.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557182]Well if I recall correctly a pretty large majority of fans approved of the move at the time. If he doesn't get hurt things could have turned out much different.

Retarded moves happen all over the league not just with the Skins.[/quote]

I'm glad someone pointed this out! When JT came last year everybody, including almost all the local commentators and national NFL analysts, applauded the move! Most people thought that getting a future HOF one year removed from being a defenvise POY for a 2nd round pick was a deal! The Fins were asking for a 1st+ leading up to the draft. Now, after he gets hurt and underperforms, everyone has about-faced and is calling the FO stupid for the move....hypocrisy anyone? It didn't work out people...get over it!

Thanks Matty for trying to speak some sense to the nay-sayers and jaded "fans"!

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Son Of Man;557192]I'm glad someone pointed this out! When JT came last year everybody, including almost all the local commentators and national NFL analysts, applauded the move! Most people thought that getting a future HOF one year removed from being a defenvise POY for a 2nd round pick was a deal! The Fins were asking for a 1st+ leading up to the draft. Now, after he gets hurt and underperforms, everyone has about-faced and is calling the FO stupid for the move....hypocrisy anyone? It didn't work out people...get over it!

Thanks Matty for trying to speak some sense to the nay-sayers and jaded "fans"![/quote]So if the national media is stupid about, and later, hypocritical of our front office, that makes dumb moves okay?

Nothing like bad excuses to bad moves.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

A couple of people weren't crazy about it. But the majority loved the move. Plus some that didn't like it felt that way because they thought Taylor was too old to have any true impact anymore and that he was due for a drop in production (which happened of course), so I guess they think he'll flop in Miami too right?

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;557201]A couple of people weren't crazy about it. But the majority loved the move. Plus some that didn't like it felt that way because they thought Taylor was too old to have any true impact anymore and that he was due for a drop in production (which happened of course), so I guess they think he'll flop in Miami too right?[/quote]I don't know if flop is the right word. I think he'll match his sack total from last year. Which at the cost they are paying for him, is pretty good.

But yeah, his days as a top player are over, it looks like.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

The Titans traded us Albert Haynesworth for a third round pick from the league.

Now that is a crazy trade!

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

Well the main reason I wasn't for this trade was JT was not training during the off season, the price was too steep and we had a quality starter that could fill in for Daniels. I just wish the FO would have confidence in the players we have here instead of ALWAYS chasing other teams players.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

Losers.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

I didn't like the trade from the beginning. I would've rather that Evans and Wilson been given a chance and we keep our second round pick. Especially the way Wilson came on at the end the year before. I also didn't like the idea of MW being let go and the thinking that JT could take his spot. That kind of thinking was BS from the get-go. I realize MW wasn't let go because of JT, but thinking he could step in and play his spot was ridiculous IMO. But as misguided as it sometimes is, I still think the FO does what it thinks is best for the team. Unfortunately they thought JT would come in and get 10 sacks and Carter would possibly do the same and it didn't turn out that way. Time to move on. Rock and roll Orakpo! As far as JT goes, I wasn't that much of a fan before he signed with us, even less so now. I don't really care what he does.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

JT is an idiot, he could have made 9 million here instead he is making 1.1 with the dolphins.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557182]Well if I recall correctly a pretty large majority of fans approved of the move at the time. If he doesn't get hurt things could have turned out much different.

Retarded moves happen all over the league not just with the Skins.[/quote]

I liked the move when we made it. And if Taylor hadn't gotten hurt, I would probably still like the trade. But he did get hurt, and while that isn't the fault of FO, we still ultimately got robbed as far as what we gave up for what we got.

I'm not crapping on our FO for this one. I'm just shaking my head while congratulating Parcells for working us over.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=GMScud;557127]Well, it's official. Parcells bent us over. [/quote]

Well one good thing came out of the trade. When we traded for Jason Taylor we lost 2nd (2009) and 6th round (2010) picks. The biggest reason we couldnt trade up and get Mark Sanchez was because the Redskins had no 2nd round pick. The Redskins not being able to move up and get Sanchez lucked out and were able to draft Brian Orakpo with the 13th overall pick.

We did lose the 2nd round pick but it comes down to one thing. Would you rather have Mark Sanchez or Brian Orakpo? Id rather have Orakpo hands down.

I actually think in a weird kinda way Parcells saved us.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

funny how that worked out.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

go home, we dont need you anyways. orakpo, nuff said.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Brian Orakpo;557242]Well one good thing came out of the trade. When we traded for Jason Taylor we lost 2nd (2009) and 6th round (2010) picks. The biggest reason we couldnt trade up and get Mark Sanchez was because the Redskins had no 2nd round pick. The Redskins not being able to move up and get Sanchez lucked out and were able to draft Brian Orakpo with the 13th overall pick.

We did lose the 2nd round pick but it comes down to one thing. Would you rather have Mark Sanchez or Brian Orakpo? Id rather have Orakpo hands down.

I actually think in a weird kinda way Parcells saved us.[/quote]

Yeah weird how it worked out. Could be for the best in the long run. If that ends up being the case giving up that 2nd rounder could be a great move.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

He is a no good Bastard!!!!!!!

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Brian Orakpo;557242]Well one good thing came out of the trade. When we traded for Jason Taylor we lost 2nd (2009) and 6th round (2010) picks. The biggest reason we couldnt trade up and get Mark Sanchez was because the Redskins had no 2nd round pick. The Redskins not being able to move up and get Sanchez lucked out and were able to draft Brian Orakpo with the 13th overall pick.

We did lose the 2nd round pick but it comes down to one thing. Would you rather have Mark Sanchez or Brian Orakpo? Id rather have Orakpo hands down.

I actually think in a weird kinda way Parcells saved us.[/quote]

Eh. Not so sure about all that. There are plenty of hypotheticals you can throw around. I'm not saying I want Sanchez. Not at all in fact. And I'm tired of other teams (Dolphins, Jets, Bears) saving us from ourselves.

You say we lucked out by getting Orakpo, but the guy has done exactly nothing thus far. We'll see how lucky we are (frankly I think he's going to be great if we don't eff around and try to make him a LB).

If Jason Taylor hadn't gotten hurt, he would have likely had double digit sacks for us, which could have opened the flood gates for Andre Carter as well. Given that, maybe we'd have won another game or two (considering how close some of our losses were). In which case we wouldn't be lamenting trading that 2nd round pick. Plus we may have made the playoffs, and then Danny most likely wouldn't be scrambling to trade Campbell. Also, as far as this year's draft goes, with or without Jason Taylor or our 2nd round pick, we'd still need DE/OLB.

My point is, you can "what if" this thing to death. Also, it's totally premature to call us "lucky" for landing Orakpo (especially since we're intent on changing his position. If we wanted a LB we should have drafted one).

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557276]Yeah weird how it worked out. Could be for the best in the long run. If that ends up being the case giving up that 2nd rounder [B]could be a great move.[/B][/quote]

Sure, it could be great because a positive result has a chance of falling in our lap, not because it was part of any sort of plan.

I'd love for us to look smart on purpose for a change.

(Please no one ring off a list of draft picks for me. I know. I'm talking about FA).

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=GMScud;557300]Eh. Not so sure about all that. There are plenty of hypotheticals you can throw around. I'm not saying I want Sanchez. Not at all in fact. And I'm tired of other teams (Dolphins, Jets, Bears) saving us from ourselves.[/quote]

I agree that I wish our front office would make better decisions. I dont think this team will until Snyder lets a real GM handle this team. I got to admit though I think the Phins in the long run will have saved us because we didnt have the 2nd rounder.

[quote=GMScud;557300]You say we lucked out by getting Orakpo, but the guy has done exactly nothing thus far. We'll see how lucky we are (frankly I think he's going to be great if we don't eff around and try to make him a LB).[/quote]

I agree he hasnt done anything for us at this point. Im basing it off of how good I think Orakpo will be and how most fans in general believe we got a steal at 13.

[quote=GMScud;557300]If Jason Taylor hadn't gotten hurt, he would have likely had double digit sacks for us, which could have opened the flood gates for Andre Carter as well. Given that, maybe we'd have won another game or two (considering how close some of our losses were). In which case we wouldn't be lamenting trading that 2nd round pick. Plus we may have made the playoffs, and then Danny most likely wouldn't be scrambling to trade Campbell. Also, as far as this year's draft goes, with or without Jason Taylor or our 2nd round pick, we'd still need DE/OLB.[/quote]

I liked the move to bring Taylor to DC and I believe if he didnt get hurt he would of had alot more games like he did week 16 vs the Eagles.

We would of needed a DE either way but if we didnt trade for Taylor we wouldnt of gotten one. We would of shipped our 1st, 2nd, and maybe more and leaped the Jets to get Sanchez.

[quote=GMScud;557300]My point is, you can "what if" this thing to death. Also, it's totally premature to call us "lucky" for landing Orakpo (especially since we're intent on changing his position. If we wanted a LB we should have drafted one).[/quote]

I dont think im "what if" ing it to death per say. Im just bringing up something that imo is a fact knowing Snyder and from what Cerrato has said. If the Redskins didnt trade for Taylor we would of shipped the 2nd rd pick along with others to land Sanchez. The Skins not having that pick saved us from trading a boatload of picks for a overrated QB and we landed probably one of the top 5 players in the draft instead.

I agree it may be premature to be calling us lucky because he hasnt played a down for the Burgundy & Gold. I do have to say the reason im high on Orakpo and think we were lucky was because I honestly believed before the draft he was the best player in it. For the Skins to be able to finally get a guy who I think can rush the passer and perform at a high level is just mind blowing when you think about how long we have needed a defensive end who could get sacks year in and out.

If im wrong ill be eating crow for years on this board since my screen name is "Brian Orakpo" but I honestly believe he has HOF type potenial (I know that sounds crazy because hes a rookie but its my opinion) if he stays healthy. His combo of power and speed from the defensive end position has me so stoked for this season just to get a little taste of whats to come.

I dont like the Skins playing him at LB on 1st and 2nd down but at the worst its a 1 year deal. He will end up playing defensive end for the Skins for years.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Brian Orakpo;557306]I agree that I wish our front office would make better decisions. I dont think this team will until Snyder lets a real GM handle this team. I got to admit though I think the Phins in the long run will have saved us because we didnt have the 2nd rounder.

I agree he hasnt done anything for us at this point. Im basing it off of how good I think Orakpo will be and how most fans in general believe we got a steal at 13.

I liked the move to bring Taylor to DC and I believe if he didnt get hurt he would of had alot more games like he did week 16 vs the Eagles.

We would of needed a DE either way but if we didnt trade for Taylor we wouldnt of gotten one. We would of shipped our 1st, 2nd, and maybe more and leaped the Jets to get Sanchez.

I dont think im "what if" ing it to death per say. Im just bringing up something that imo is a fact knowing Snyder and from what Cerrato has said. If the Redskins didnt trade for Taylor we would of shipped the 2nd rd pick along with others to land Sanchez. The Skins not having that pick saved us from trading a boatload of picks for a overrated QB and we landed probably one of the top 5 players in the draft instead.

I agree it may be premature to be calling us lucky because he hasnt played a down for the Burgundy & Gold. I do have to say the reason im high on Orakpo and think we were lucky was because I honestly believed before the draft he was the best player in it. For the Skins to be able to finally get a guy who I think can rush the passer and perform at a high level is just mind blowing when you think about how long we have needed a defensive end who could get sacks year in and out.

If im wrong ill be eating crow for years on this board since my screen name is "Brian Orakpo" but I honestly believe he has HOF type potenial (I know that sounds crazy because hes a rookie but its my opinion) if he stays healthy. His combo of power and speed from the defensive end position has me so stoked for this season just to get a little taste of whats to come.

I dont like the Skins playing him at LB on 1st and 2nd down but at the worst its a 1 year deal. He will end up playing defensive end for the Skins for years.[/quote]

I agree with pretty much everything you're saying here. All I was saying is that you can argue hypotheticals for pretty much any situation. I mean, you can easily argue the Jet's would have trumped our offer to Cleveland even if we had that 2nd rounder. With Clemens, Ratliff, and Ainge, their QB situation is way worse than ours. Desperate in fact. Who's to say they wouldn't have shipped off the entire draft for Sanchez? They wanted him BAAAAD.

And IMO we'll look a lot more "lucky" for landing Rak if we make him an every down DE. If ain't broke don't fix it. The same reason Blache is planning on letting Big Al freelance at DT....

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=GMScud;557308]I agree with pretty much everything you're saying here. All I was saying is that you can argue hypotheticals for pretty much any situation. I mean, you can easily argue the Jet's would have trumped our offer to Cleveland even if we had that 2nd rounder. With Clemens, Ratliff, and Ainge, their QB situation is way worse than ours. Desperate in fact. Who's to say they wouldn't have shipped off the entire draft for Sanchez? They wanted him BAAAAD.

And IMO we'll look a lot more "lucky" for landing Rak if we make him an every down DE. If ain't broke don't fix it. The same reason Blache is planning on letting Big Al freelance at DT....[/quote]

Yeah there is still a chance the Jets would of outbid us. I think we would of been able to get Sanchez if we had the 2nd because Snyder would of offered probably another 2nd in 2010 to go with the 1st/2nd in 2009. With Cerrato saying they tried to move up it just makes me believe since we didnt want to give up a 1st in 2010 than if we had the 2nd this year we could of outbid them.

I agree 100% about Orakpo. I understand the teams thinking on why they think its best for the team. I dont understand though why they would risk the development of there 1st round draft pick playing him at OLB. Hes a pure DE and the quicker he gets playing there on all 3 downs the quicker he will develop. Kinda like Mario Williams.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=GMScud;557127]Well, it's official. Parcells bent us over.

[url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/13/jason-taylor-to-re-sign-with-fins/]ProFootballTalk.com - Jason Taylor To Re-Sign With Fins[/url][/quote]

You sure got that right.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;557136]Well good thing the Dolphins will not also be getting any of the Skins 2010 draft picks for the guy. That would really be a punch to the gut ... oh, wait ...[/quote]

Yep. Good one.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=redsk1;557153]We got hosed on this one. Big time. Memo to VC: Please get all the details done on a trade BEFORE you make the trade! Don't change the rules mid way thru. You cost us a 2nd rounder.

JT was never going to do his offseason workouts in DC. You would think we knew this going in.[/quote]

A most valid point.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;557151]I'm sure we'll be talking about this in 2019...the move backfired on us, it sucks, you move on.

Hopefully we will have the same success with the return of Dockery that many are predicting the Dolphins will have with Taylor[/quote]


Yeah, but you don't just move on. First you consider your mistake so as to avoid replicating it, [I]then [/I]you move on. I have little faith that's what's going to happen.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Brian Orakpo;557242]Well one good thing came out of the trade. When we traded for Jason Taylor we lost 2nd (2009) and 6th round (2010) picks. The biggest reason we couldnt trade up and get Mark Sanchez was because the Redskins had no 2nd round pick. The Redskins not being able to move up and get Sanchez lucked out and were able to draft Brian Orakpo with the 13th overall pick.

We did lose the 2nd round pick but it comes down to one thing. Would you rather have Mark Sanchez or Brian Orakpo? Id rather have Orakpo hands down.

I actually think in a weird kinda way Parcells saved us.[/quote]


Well that's interesting. We still need a QB but it's still interesting. Brian O. is the real deal I think.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=GMScud;557302]Sure, it could be great because a positive result has a chance of falling in our lap, not because it was part of any sort of plan.

I'd love for us to look smart on purpose for a change.

(Please no one ring off a list of draft picks for me. I know. I'm talking about FA).[/quote]

So none of our FA's have been smart moves?

How about Fletcher for starters?

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557323]So none of our FA's have been smart moves?

How about Fletcher for starters?[/quote]

Griffin, Springs, Washington, Sellers...

Not to mention smart moves we didn't make-Courtney Brown, Javon Walker, Bryant Johnson...

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Coff;557321]Yeah, but you don't just move on. First you consider your mistake so as to avoid replicating it, [I]then [/I]you move on. I have little faith that's what's going to happen.[/quote]

Well our first mistake was allowing Daniels and Buzbee to be out for the year on the first day of training camp with major injuries...but actually I was speaking more about we fans moving on.

As for the team, seriously what is there to consider here?

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;557324]Griffin, Springs, Washington, Sellers...

Not to mention smart moves we didn't make-Courtney Brown, Javon Walker, Bryant Johnson...[/quote]

There are definitely more positives than negatives when it comes to free agency, but the focus is always more intense on the negative moves.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557326]There are definitely more positives than negatives when it comes to free agency, but the focus is always more intense on the negative moves.[/quote]

And it seems like when we make positive moves it's like we stumbled upon it or the move was so obvious anyone could have made it...but a move that backfires on us is never about bad luck, it's always poor management and planning.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Sonny9TD;557322]Well that's interesting. [B]We still need a QB[/B] but it's still interesting. Brian O. is the real deal I think.[/quote]

You mean the Redskins? How?

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;557329]And it seems like when we make positive moves it's like we stumbled upon it or the move was so obvious anyone could have made it...but a move that backfires on us is never about bad luck, it's always poor management and planning.[/quote]

How many times have we heard the good moves written off as no-brainers?

:doh:

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

if Taylor had 10+ sacks last year, would any of you guys sing the praises of a job well done by Cerrato? i kind of doubt it. we needed a defensive end, and they brought in the best player available( at least in their eyes)

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Ruhskins;557332]You mean the Redskins? How?[/quote]

Don't bother, he's anti-JC all the way

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

I am tired of the FA bashing...

Look around the league. Percentage-wise we are as good as anybody at hitting on these guys. Gross gain we are the best in the league by a wide margin because of our overall volume. Complain about our trading of draft picks. At least that holds water.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;557323]So none of our FA's have been smart moves?

How about Fletcher for starters?[/quote]

I was in a pissy mood last night. The Jason Taylor thing annoyed me, the Caps ruined my night, and I was tired from a really long day.

You and SS are right. More positives than negatives in FA for sure. Some of the negatives are just really, really awful. That's all I was thinking of I guess.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=FRPLG;557354]I am tired of the FA bashing...

Look around the league. Percentage-wise we are as good as anybody at hitting on these guys. Gross gain we are the best in the league by a wide margin because of our overall volume. [B] Complain about our trading of draft picks. At least that holds water.[/B][/quote]

I've been bitching about that for a long time.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=SmootSmack;557151]I'm sure we'll be talking about this in 2019...the move backfired on us, it sucks, you move on.

Hopefully we will have the same success with the return of Dockery that many are predicting the Dolphins will have with Taylor[/quote]

that's a really good point.

Re: Jason Taylor to re-sign with the Dolphins
 

[quote=dmek25;557337]if Taylor had 10+ sacks last year, would any of you guys sing the praises of a job well done by Cerrato? i kind of doubt it. we needed a defensive end, and they brought in the best player available( at least in their eyes)[/quote]Well, remember, the cost was a pretty hefty second round pick. So 10+ sacks alone would not have justified the trade, it would have also been graded on how well he played the run, and whether or not he would have been a factor in 2010.

Orakpo has 10+ sack potential, but if he posts sack totals of: 2, 10, 3, 4, 4 in his first five seasons, most of us will be thinking bust. I'm not predicting that, I'm just saying.

What I'm saying is: it's really hard for Cerrato to win a trade where he sells, out of desperation, a first day pick for a 34 year old smallish end who was a bad scheme fit. If he plays great for two seasons, and everyone agrees that he was great, you can sweep the cost under the rug. If he disappoints expectations at all, the cost hurts.