Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=ronnieo;573468]I like Zorn, but unfortunately good coach or not, he will be replaced at the end of the season. Too many high profile coaches out there for DS to sink his teeth into and he will not be able to resist unless we make the Super Bowl this yea!!!!!![/quote]

If Zorn takes the team to the playoff, his job will be safe.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Take a look at the production of rookie wr's & you'll see that D. Thomas had about an avg. year. Some rookies light it up, but they're the exception.

Zorn's 6-2 start indicated that he could win & get the team to pull out some tough, close games on the road. Sure things might've been in his favor w/strategy & other teams not sure how this O would look, but the important thing from those games is that he got his players to step up. That's the biggest factor for a head coach, being able to motivate.

So, if improvements to personel are made (we'll see about the o line) I do believe Zorn has the will to motivate his players to win. I also think his system, while he was stubborn w/it at times, will work if the O line can hold up (that is a big if, I'm quite concerned myself).

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

How can you say he is a great coach after one year at 50/50. If anything we watched him in the second half of the season let the team slump. Right now I can only hope that Zorn has what it takes but to call him a great coach is just plan crazy.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

This should be titled, JZ may become a great head coach. Right now he's a 8-8 coach.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Lotus;573477]Unless the team utterly flops this year, I hope that we stick with Zorn and don't get impatient. I think that Zorn can be a very fine head coach, whether that is clearly evident this year or not, and this team needs continuity.[/quote]

That's what I'm screaming. The one thing that this team has lacked on offense is consistency. I think that DS has to give Z some time. If he doesn't, none of the other "proven" coaches will have the comfort of knowing they'll not be fired after two seasons. DS has to live down his reputation. I think three to four years should be long enough for any coach to turn a team around, not one or two.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=wilsowilso;573352]He is a teacher. He was a player. He has a great passion for the game.

He knows how to talk and listen to the team. It's a quality many NFL coaches don't have.

The key to this season is the development of the offense and we all know that. The burden rests on Zorn's shoulders.

I just wanted to say that I think that Jim Zorn is moving this team in a very positive direction. We are lucky to have him. He is going to be the next great coach of the NFL!

That is my [B]prediction[/B].[/quote]

Maybe you should have titled the thread "I predict Zorn will become a great head football coach" so people wouldn't get their panties all tied up in a bunch wilsowilso. :)

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=53Fan;573508]Maybe you should have titled the thread "I predict Zorn will become a great head football coach" so people wouldn't get their panties all tied up in a bunch wilsowilso. :)[/quote]

No kidding.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=44Deezel;573418]At least Gibbs was a very good offensive coordinator in San Diego before joining the Skins and [B]even though he started out 0-5, he was able to right the ship enough to finish the season 7-9. [/B] THAT was a sign of potential greatness to come. Starting 6-2 and ending 2-6 gives the exact opposite impression. But we'll see soon enough.[/quote]

I like your points, but the original post on Gibbs' first year record was actually the correct one--he did finish 8-8, not 7-9.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=BringBackJoeT;573514]I like your points, but the original post on Gibbs' first year record was actually the correct one--he did finish 8-8, not 7-9.[/quote]

I stand corrected.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Mattyk72;573449]1. All over the league? I think you may be generalizing just a bit. I guarantee there were many more rookies that struggled vs. those that made a smooth transition and contributed meaningful numbers in their first years.

2. & 4. You're contradicting yourself here. First he pounds Portis into the ground and then he's miffed at him and takes away goal line carries? If he was so miffed at him why did he give him 342 carries? And CP still had a respectable 9 TDs, so these points really make no sense.

3. If you can't master the basics you probably shouldn't be running gimmicks. Besides, not sure how tossing it to the backs would have made the offense any more "creative".

5. There are plenty of coaches that are off the league's radar that turn into fine coaches, just as there are plenty of hot prospects that flop.[/quote]

Ditto

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482]How do you score points with an OL devastated by injury, against the Giants, Ravens, Steelers, Cowboys, Eagles..[/quote]

Umm, good coaching? They weren't exactly lighting it up on offense when the O line wasn't "devastated" and they couldn't even score against the Rams and Lions (needed a punt return to win that game). It's one thing to struggle, it's another thing to score 12 points a game.



[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482] Kelly - injured. Davis - How do you get him into the game when you have a Pro Bowl TE and haven't had time to install a complete offensive package. Thomas - not an issue with "can't" it was a matter of "wouldn't" read the playbook. His attitude appears changed this year. To me his motivation is an issue that should've been handled by the position coach or OC (S. Smith) [/quote]

Time? Several teams had new head coaches, new offensive coordinators and/or new QBs and they found a way to "install" their offense and get rooks to produce at least a little. The Skins had an excuse for every rookie. Even Chris Horton, as good as he was, would have ridden the pine all year if it hadn't been for Doughty going down. 1 out of 10 draft picks contribute???

I am not inclined to give the coaching staff the benefit of the doubt until they prove they deserve it. If our rooks can't get on the field playing for one of the worst offenses in the league, then they are either worthless, which is an indictment of the FO, or the coaching staff sucks at player development. Could be a little bit of both.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482] When the run game was working Zorn fed Portis. Any good coach does that. When the running game was struggling Portis got less carries to not wear him down. Team/carries Steelers/13, Cowboys/15, Seahawks/29, Giants/11, Ravens/11, Bengals/25, Eagles/22, 49ers/29 (this is the only game late in the year where the YPC was low and Portis had a heavy workload). The only opponents during this stretch that had a somewhat balanced workload for their backs were the Giants (Jacobs/Ward), Ravens (Mclain/McGahee), 49ers (Gore/Foster). If Zorn put Betts in and he fumbled in a key situation, the Negative Nancy crowd would be screaming Zorn is a bad coach for putting Betts in.[/quote]

Fine. Feed him. But why not develop him into a passing threat as well, especially since our WRs are so mediocre? And I don't know how anyone could expect Portis to hold up all year with the recent injuries and his overall tread. Because they relied so much on Portis, no one was able to step up when he and the O line started to wear down. Dallas has a balanced running attack and a home run hitter in Felix Jones. I think he was injured in the second half. The Eagles pass 70% of the time and have a multi-dimensional back who can score from anywhere on the field, whether the ball is handed to him or thrown to him. All I'm saying is we have 2 1000 yard backs and a guy like Rock who can make things happen when he gets the ball in space (as evident from his kick-off returns for TDs). And Portis fumbles too, so big whoop. I think and hope Zorn will mix things up this year.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482] It's been said before, Zorn didn't have his whole package in. If you remember correctly Gibbs' retirement and the coaching search was pretty sudden. Our offensive system change was a major overhaul in the passing game. How do you execute a no-huddle when the offense is still being learned? .[/quote]

Exactly how many games are required to throw in a no-huddle series every now and again to keep the defense off-balance? Again, several teams experienced significant change and still did more with what they had. If the players couldn't figure out Zorn's offense when only a third of it was installed, then I shudder to think what's going to happen when he unleashes his entire scary offensive repertoire. As much as I hate the Ravens, they had a new HC, rookie QB and new offensive coordinator and their offense was prolific during the second half of the year and they successfully ran trick plays on a regular basis. And I know, I know. Their D and their O line... blah blah.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482]
Here's some numbers for you: Redskins - 20% of passes to RB/FB.
Dolphins - 26%
Chargers - 33%

Team X - 18.4%
Team Y - 16.8%

Are the OC's of team X & Y bad OCs? I'm sure you guessed by now who Team X & Y are? X - Cardinals, Y - Steelers.

[/quote]

The Dolphins and Chargers do it by design and for long gains, while the Skins checked down for 5 yard gains on 3rd and 10. In the playoff game against the Ravens, the Dolphins went 80 yards for a score on the opening drive without throwing a single pass to a WR (all passes went to RBs, including their third back). Portis falling down to catch a 5 yard dink counts in your stats, but it doesn't tell the true story of our offense.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482]
Possibly. Or, he believed his 270+ lb Pro Bowl FB could get in from the 1. For the record though, I agree that was a bad couple of playcalls. Sellers isn't a ball carrier. He's a blocker and decent receiver out of the backfield. But do we say Zorn sucks because he made one mistake at a crucial point? I don't believe so. [/quote]

And he would believe this because? When has Sellers shown the skills to be a goal line back? And if LBS is all that counts, then give the ball to Samuels. Zorn did it to spite Portis. And I don't think Zorn sucks. I think there's more evidence to indicate he WILL suck than there is to indicate he will be GREAT. Like I said, I hope I am wrong.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482]
If I remember correctly during the HC search, most of the HC candidates mentioned Zorn as a very good OC candidate. The FO track record over the last 4-5 years is far superior to the first 5 years. We'll find out this season, but if DT & Rinehart gain starting roles, Kelly/Davis produce, and we get solid play from Orakpo and Barnes I'd say the FO is doing pretty good.
[/quote]

Agreed.

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;573482]
I believe you will be proven wrong. IMO the 2-6 finish had a lot more to do with OL injuries/age and the defense's inability to stop people in the 4th Qtr and create turnovers than Zorn's coaching ability.[/quote]


I hope you are right.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=53Fan;573508]Maybe you should have titled the thread "I predict Zorn will become a great head football coach" so people wouldn't get their panties all tied up in a bunch wilsowilso. :)[/quote]

Agreed, since apparently it's ok to exaggerate a negative thing about our team (the o-line is in ruins, AH will be a bust, JC is done, etc., etc.) but exaggerating positive things (like your thread) will not be tolerated.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

May I remind some of you that the Redskins went undefeated in three games against the two teams that played in the NFC Championship game last year.

Last season was a roller coaster for sure and there are many questions we all want answered, but is it so hard to project a significant step forward from the offense this year?

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

If he proves out the way I think he will, THE Dan will be the genious for elevating a .........mere position coach

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

somewhere down the line i want russ grimm to coach this team.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=skinsfan69;573560]somewhere down the line i want russ grimm to coach this team.[/quote]

Dude can't seem to land a HC job anywhere else so it means he's probably an ideal fit here.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;573503] I think three to four years should be long enough for any coach [B]to turn a team around[/B], not one or two.[/quote]

Note:
Jim Zorn inherited a playoff team...there wasn't much to "turn around"
He only needed to do as well or 2 wins better to be considered a good coach...not to mention, he didn't touch the defense, special teams...and even the runnning game.
That is a pretty light load for a new head coach, but understandable considering how light of a rookie he was.

Ask yourself this question...if Gibbs had this team with a 6-2 start, would they have missed the playoffs?....doubtful...I don't care who is injured....he'd probably make seller a RT to make it happen...it would be ugly...and he'd be launching deep passed to Moss to make it happen...but it is rare that a great coach wins 75% of his games only to finish 500.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=skinsnut;573636]Note:
Jim Zorn inherited a playoff team...there wasn't much to "turn around"
He only needed to do as well or 2 wins better to be considered a good coach...not to mention, he didn't touch the defense, special teams...and even the runnning game.
That is a pretty light load for a new head coach, but understandable considering how light of a rookie he was.

Ask yourself this question...if Gibbs had this team with a 6-2 start, would they have missed the playoffs?....doubtful...I don't care who is injured....he'd probably make seller a RT to make it happen...it would be ugly...and he'd be launching deep passed to Moss to make it happen...but it is rare that a great coach wins 75% of his games only to finish 500.[/quote]

The Skins used to have a "system" much like the Patriots have today. Guys put on the Pats jersey and somehow play better than they did with the jersey they wore the year before. That's how they can overcome truly "devastating" injuries like losing Tom Brady (losing line men is something most teams have to deal with every year). The Skins used to be the same way. Lose the starting QB and still make it to the Super Bowl. Take marginal talents like Ricky Ervins and Ricky Sanders and turn them into Super Bowl legends. Guys like Rypien and Gary Clark would go to different teams and wouldn't be near the players they were when they were with the Skins.

If Zorn can build a system like that, one that gets the most out of its players, one that can overcome injuries, and one that wins championships, he will be great.

Of course, Gibbs didn't have Cerrato and Snyder to deal with;)

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=53Fan;573508]Maybe you should have titled the thread "I predict Zorn will become a great head football coach" so people wouldn't get their panties all tied up in a bunch wilsowilso. :)[/quote]

This forum would be boring if people weren't getting their nuts twisted from time to time;)

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=44Deezel;573537]Fine. Feed him. But why not develop him into a passing threat as well, especially since our WRs are so mediocre? And I don't know how anyone could expect Portis to hold up all year with the recent injuries and his overall tread. Because they relied so much on Portis, no one was able to step up when he and the O line started to wear down. Dallas has a balanced running attack and a home run hitter in Felix Jones. I think he was injured in the second half. The Eagles pass 70% of the time and have a multi-dimensional back who can score from anywhere on the field, whether the ball is handed to him or thrown to him. All I'm saying is we have 2 1000 yard backs and a guy like Rock who can make things happen when he gets the ball in space (as evident from his kick-off returns for TDs). And Portis fumbles too, so big whoop. I think and hope Zorn will mix things up this year.



The Dolphins and Chargers do it by design and for long gains, while the Skins checked down for 5 yard gains on 3rd and 10. In the playoff game against the Ravens, the Dolphins went 80 yards for a score on the opening drive without throwing a single pass to a WR (all passes went to RBs, including their third back). Portis falling down to catch a 5 yard dink counts in your stats, but it doesn't tell the true story of our offense.



And he would believe this because? When has Sellers shown the skills to be a goal line back? And if LBS is all that counts, then give the ball to Samuels. Zorn did it to spite Portis. And I don't think Zorn sucks. I think there's more evidence to indicate he WILL suck than there is to indicate he will be GREAT. Like I said, I hope I am wrong.
[/quote]A lot of these assertions contradict each other. You can't claim lack of creativity on offense and then question Zorn's desire to turn Mike Sellers into a GL back...because he's never been a goal line back before. That's what creativity is, it's not necessarily about being unconventional, just about doing different things to try to maximize the value of your personnel. In this respect, I think Zorn is quite creative.

What evidence do you have to defend the claim that the Skins checked down more often than other teams? Speicifally, how are they different than the Dolphins or Chargers in this respect (outside of the misbelief that some teams use their backs aggressively, but when other teams do the exact same thing they are being too conservative)?

Just to throw a stat out there, the Redskins passing game was up to a yard per attempt more effective when they blocked with 6 as opposed to 5. So if you are wondering why the Redskins don't always use Portis as a receiving threat, I think that might be a good place to start. Not that you can't use both Portis and Betts in obvious passing situations, but if you do, you lose the ability to get one of your young receivers into the game in a critical situation.

I also think you are understating the value of the Betts injury on our offense. I'm really not the biggest Betts fan, and despite the fact that he does all the small things well, he doesn't offer anything that Portis doesn't, but when he went down, you lose a lot of trick play ability in the offense. Zorn was using them together in packages, but once you lose one of them, it's understandable that they moved away from these packages. By the time Betts came back for the Seattle game, you could understand how a team on a two game losing streak was not so worried about trying to get two running backs on the field together (especially since Kelly was healthy for the first time).

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=skinsnut;573636]Ask yourself this question...if Gibbs had this team with a 6-2 start, would they have missed the playoffs?....doubtful...I don't care who is injured....he'd probably make seller a RT to make it happen...it would be ugly...and he'd be launching deep passed to Moss to make it happen...but it is rare that a great coach wins 75% of his games only to finish 500.[/quote]If it was Gibbs AND Gregg Williams, I don't think they would have missed the playoffs.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Man there are alot of good points in this thread

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=44Deezel;573643]The Skins used to have a "system" much like the Patriots have today. Guys put on the Pats jersey and somehow play better than they did with the jersey they wore the year before. That's how they can overcome truly "devastating" injuries like losing Tom Brady (losing line men is something most teams have to deal with every year). [B]The Skins used to be the same way. Lose the starting QB and still make it to the Super Bowl. Take marginal talents like Ricky Ervins and Ricky Sanders and turn them into Super Bowl legends.[/B] Guys like Rypien and Gary Clark would go to different teams and wouldn't be near the players they were when they were with the Skins.

If Zorn can build a system like that, one that gets the most out of its players, one that can overcome injuries, and one that wins championships, he will be great.

[B]Of course, Gibbs didn't have Cerrato and Snyder to deal with[/B];)[/quote]Nor did he have to deal with a salary cap and Free Agency

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

sounds more like you think he's a great guy

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=GTripp0012;573649]If it was Gibbs AND Gregg Williams, I don't think they would have missed the playoffs.[/quote]To be fair, the players were still asimilating Zorn's offense and between that, a beat up Portis/O-line, and the quality of defenses we faced in the 2nd half (including the Ravens and the Steelers), the Skins were a team ripe for a collapse down the stretch.

One mark of Gibbs 2.0 was his horrendous record the 3rd quarter of each season. He rallied the team to the playoffs down the stretch in 2005 and 2007, but his 2nd half record in 2004 and 2006 was comparable to Zorn's last year.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

He seems to have a "grand vision" of what he wants the team to look like - which a great coach needs. Here's to hoping it translates to success.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Unfortunately, Zorn has a couple things going against him:

1. A poor owner and mediocre GM
2. Doesn't have the power to hire and fire coaches or players due to item #1.
3. He has just 1-2 years to prove himself. Snyder is itchy to get a big name coach.
4. Zorn is tied to Jason Campbell's performance, even though he didn't pick the guy

BL - Zorn must do well this season to continue here. Being a great guy, excellent teacher, Christian, gutsy play-caller, etc just isn't everything you need to stay as a HC in the NFL. I think he's got to win 8-9 games to continue with this owner. Many others think he'll need even more to stay. Some say he's got to get deep into the playoffs to get another year.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=steveherrin;573781]He seems to have a "grand vision" of what he wants the team to look like - which a great coach needs. Here's to hoping it translates to success.[/quote]

I agree. I think he knows exactly what he wants and what it takes to get it. He's a great teacher and the players seem to buy into what he's selling. Welcome to the board!

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Zorn matched Gibbs first season win/loss percentage. Unfortunately he was eaten alive once teams figured out his MO.

Zorn is going to have to get this offense moving this season or Snyder will bring in someone like Shannihan. It's not fair but this is the owner we have.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Can't make this type of statement with only one season under his belt(a mediocre one at that). You could say he is a great HC after this season though if the chips do fall into place and the offense does click. Not saying Coach isn't a good coach, just saying that after one season you can't say he is a great HC yet based on his rookie season as HC.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=dmek25;573375]i really like the fact that Snyder didnt grab one of the old retread coaches. hopefully he will give Zorn enough time to find out if he can coach in this league[/quote]

Sure, but if Vegas had odds on it, the money would be on Snyder to grab an old retread when the '09 season ends.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Ijaeger;573400]Zorn = 8:8 1st season
Gibbs= 8:8 1st season
...only time will tell[/quote]

Gibbs: 8-3 in the final 11 games of his first season
Zorn: 2-6 in the final 8 of his

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

I think Zorn's a good coach, Not a Great coach, but Not a Bad coach.
This season, I'll be able to how good he really is. I think that he should throw the ball more, do more trick plays, and not be so Ned Flanders like.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=steveherrin;573781]He seems to have a "grand vision" of what he wants the team to look like - which a great coach needs. Here's to hoping it translates to success.[/quote]

Excellent statement. But along with the grand vision, he has had excellent role models in mike holmgren and, I think, joe gibbs. He also has excellent resources available to him, in joe gibbs, jerry gray, and the things being the head coach of the washington redskins get you access to. Finally he has an owner who will put what tools he asks for in place.

If zorn doesn't succeed I think it will only be on his shoulders.

I think he will.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

Gibbs ended his first season on the "up" escalator" - Zorn the other way.

Zorn has got to win footballs games this season to stay longer. He has some good qualities but he started to fade quickly in the second half of the season.

Also, due to his age, if he gets fired here, he may not get another HC chance anywhere else.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=Coff;573939]Gibbs: 8-3 in the final 11 games of his first season
Zorn: 2-6 in the final 8 of his[/quote]

Gibbs 0-5 in his first.
Zorn 4-1.

We can play this game all day and still have to wait and see.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

I love Zorn.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=GTripp0012;573648]A lot of these assertions contradict each other. You can't claim lack of creativity on offense and then question Zorn's desire to turn Mike Sellers into a GL back...because he's never been a goal line back before. That's what creativity is, it's not necessarily about being unconventional, just about doing different things to try to maximize the value of your personnel. In this respect, I think Zorn is quite creative.

[B]What evidence do you have to defend the claim that the Skins checked down more often than other teams? [/B]Speicifally, how are they different than the Dolphins or Chargers in this respect (outside of the misbelief that some teams use their backs aggressively, but when other teams do the exact same thing they are being too conservative)?

Just to throw a stat out there, the Redskins passing game was up to a yard per attempt more effective when they blocked with 6 as opposed to 5. So if you are wondering why the Redskins don't always use Portis as a receiving threat, I think that might be a good place to start. Not that you can't use both Portis and Betts in obvious passing situations, but if you do, you lose the ability to get one of your young receivers into the game in a critical situation.

I also think you are understating the value of the Betts injury on our offense. I'm really not the biggest Betts fan, and despite the fact that he does all the small things well, he doesn't offer anything that Portis doesn't, but when he went down, you lose a lot of trick play ability in the offense. Zorn was using them together in packages, but once you lose one of them, it's understandable that they moved away from these packages. By the time Betts came back for the Seattle game, you could understand how a team on a two game losing streak was not so worried about trying to get two running backs on the field together (especially since Kelly was healthy for the first time).[/quote]

I was wathcing NFL Network a month or two ago and Solomon Wilcotts broke down Jason Campbell and said that the Redskins were almost dead last in the NFL in passes completed over 10 yards. He also showed several instantces where JC had the time to throw, had wr's open downfield but checked the ball down instead. But I didn't need him to tell me that cause I watched the games and already knew it.

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=skinsfan69;574268]I was wathcing NFL Network a month or two ago and Solomon Wilcotts broke down Jason Campbell and said that the Redskins were almost dead last in the NFL in passes completed over 10 yards. He also showed several instantces where JC had the time to throw, had wr's open downfield but checked the ball down instead. But I didn't need him to tell me that cause I watched the games and already knew it.[/quote]

Oh boy the infamous Wilcots video. This has become like the Zapruder film...well now you've done it. Now you've subjected us to several pages of Tripp posts

Re: I think Jim Zorn is a great head football coach.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;574272]Oh boy the infamous Wilcots video. This has become like the Zapruder film...well now you've done it. Now you've subjected us to several pages of Tripp posts[/quote]

It's in the video!! It's in the video!!