Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;590138]Your love for Motorhead is well founded. Your love for Moss isn't.[/quote]

Motorhead are as wise as they are noisy.

Moss made my decade with those two catches against Dallas right after the famous 'Parcells is 73-0 when leading by 13 points or more in the 4th Quarter' comment from Al Michaels.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1D1CwuKbrU]YouTube - Memorable Redskins vs Cowboys Moments[/ame]

Throw in a ST highlight hit, Best feeling EVER!*


*[FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=1]Football related[/SIZE][/FONT].

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Glad to hear somebody on the offense with some leadership skills and thinks they played like garbage last week. Dont hear it anywhere else. Glad to hear someone is not ok with the way they played and everyone is accountable. To hear Zorn talk about since the loss, sounds like he is ok with everything. We shall see this weekend.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;590136]You and I must have different definitions of "frequently"[/quote]

Didn't look it up. I stand corrected, but even though we went only 1 time in 7 yrs it still seemed like the team did better then it has the last few yrs. Back then it seemed like we only needed on piece to the puzzle. We would get one piece and lose another. After last Sun. it just feels to me like we have deficiencies all over the place. It didn't look like an ok team taking advantage of our weak spot, they took advantage of our weak...spots.

I have always been the "it's ok we an fix this one thing, or we can fix that one thing, or don't worry we'll be great next yr cause all they need is a QB or something like that. I know it's only one game. I understand I should not panick, and I'm not. What I am, is tired of hearing how close we are when were not. I'll say again that if this team turns out an 8-8 season or less, I would not have any bad feeling about DS letting everyone go. Any one from staff to players. Keep the young players get rid of all the players close to 30y/o. Bring in a bunch of no names for half the cost and drop the ticket prices and hope for the same results or better. Atleast we would have a young team, healthy team, and less costly team.

They say you get what you pay for. The fans have been paying, Snyder is paying and we keep getting the same shitty results. The fans are paying with their ticket prices and parking and DS is paying the players for Mercades and all we keep getting is volkswagon. If we are going to get volkswagon quality then we might as well pay for a volkswagon cause for the last 10+ yrs we have not been getting the Mercades Benz we have been paying for.

I still think their pay should be performance based. The team does well they get paid full price, they lose it drops a %. If they make a mistake during the game they lose another % of their salary. Who would judge it I'm not sure but maybe if the players had something to lose or gain by studing and not making mistakes then maybe they would try harder. Study harder.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;590129]That would confirm to me the quality of his character. I think Malcolm Kelly can do it. ARE is filling in nicely in the slot. From what I see that's where he should've been all along. Mitchell or Thomas are good enough for the other WR position.

Moss needs to man up. Off the field he seems like a cool cat. On the field is a different story. He makes good plays every once in awhile. I'll give him that. He's a great player. He doesn't always live up to his talent because of his mental weakness. I'd rather have a player who doesn't have his talent, a player who is reliable and doesn't hurt his team.[/quote]

Please! elaborate on "mental weakness" when it comes to Moss, exactly what is that?

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;590175]Please! elaborate on "mental weakness" when it comes to Moss, exactly what is that?[/quote]

He has zero ability to turn lead into gold using only his mind or even teleport small muffins across the table at meetings.

Documented FACT!

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=RedskinRat;590177]He has zero ability to turn lead into gold using only his mind or even teleport small muffins across the table at meetings.

Documented FACT![/quote]


I guess that just about sums it up in a nutshell. I'd still like to hear how Trample The Elderly describes it.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;590169]On the pick, both he and the corner were trying to toe tap the line as the ball was actually caught outside the plane of the playing field. The corner had the inside edge on a ball thrown slightly behind Moss as Moss was fighting the momentum carrying him out of bounds. On top of that, the QB was well past the yard marker.

Hard to accuse Moss of giving up on a route that had carried all but his toes out of bounds, thrown slightly behind him, and on which the QB had already gone beyond the line of scrimmage (how can you give up on a pass route when the play can no longer legally be considered a pass??). The pick was all Jason.

Sometimes you guys hate just to hate. I mean jeeez.[/quote]

That was a pretty picture you painted partner but I saw it differently. I saw that Moss was possibly supposed to run an out route. He ran up and started out. He slowed down to almost a walk. When seeing JC scrambling he continued his route at a slow jog and ran toward the side line. At the point JC was scrambling He was only 5yrds off the side line. He had to stop to keep his toes in bounds no doubt. The defender ran into him (which I still think should have been a foul) knocking him out of bounds prior to the interception.

All JC...no. Sorry. When he saw his QB was in trouble he should have came back to the ball, changed his out route to an in route/slant, faked the defender with a stop and go...anything but he didn't. He continued his route to the sideline with little room left to continue. That's atleast half his fault also.

JC on the other hand should have thrown the ball away.

Between the defense trying so hard to punish the Giants with outstanding hits that they missed tackles and the offense trying to hard to make a play we lost.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=RedskinRat;590177]He has zero ability to turn lead into gold using only his mind or even teleport small muffins across the table at meetings.

Documented FACT![/quote]

:laughing2 Well hell, he's just worthless then ain't he? LMAO.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Man, is it Sunday yet??

:doh:

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;590180]I guess that just about sums it up in a nutshell. I'd still like to hear how Trample The Elderly describes it.[/quote]

Grabing a CB's facemask and shoving the back of his head into his shoulders is what I'd call a lack of mental toughness. Punching a guy in the helmet is too. He's also given up on plays. I'm not talking about last Sunday, that was suspect.

Running a route and catching a ball isn't magic. It's not like he's being asked to eat soup with chop sticks.

I'm done. Let's see how he fairs against the Rams.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

It's going to get worse next week.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;590202]It's going to get worse next week.[/quote]

It had better not.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;590200]Punching a guy in the helmet is too. [/quote]

A poor choice of strike.

Hit the solar plexus, it's closer and less protected.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;590200]Grabing a CB's facemask and shoving the back of his head into his shoulders is what I'd call a lack of mental toughness. Punching a guy in the helmet is too. He's also given up on plays. I'm not talking about last Sunday, that was suspect.

Running a route and catching a ball isn't magic. It's not like he's being asked to eat soup with chop sticks.

I'm done. Let's see how he fairs against the Rams.[/quote]

You forgot he shinned his shoes last year.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Done

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Coff;590014]I read Portis's comment differently; he was just saying that the fumble was the difference in the game, not that it was Campbell's fault.

Cooley seems to be suggesting that other players are not doing what they should be. Is this okay? Well, it depends. Sometimes a comment like that can fire up other players, sometimes it can piss them off. It really comes down to how respected the individual is who said it, and in this case we know this shouldn't be a problem as Cooley is a respected player on the team. Nevertheless, I'd rather he make the comment behind closed doors, which he very well may have.[/quote]


Campbell should have stepped up in the pocket. Mistake well one of his many in the game.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=NYCSkin;590157]Moss is the only receiver on this team that commands double teams...you bench him then Campbell would surely face more pressure as teams can just single cover the other WRs. The Giants double teamed him all day. Does he give up on routes--possibly. The bigger issue is that other than ARE and Cooley a bit...[B]Kelly[/B] and Thomas [B]could not get open on the Giants #3/#4/#5 corners (Ross and Dockery were hurt). [/B]So until these other receivers can beat single coverage let's not even get silly and talk about benching our only starting caliber receiver...[/quote]

That's simply not true. Kelly was open a number of times but Campbell either overthrew him, didn't see him, or was locked on to Cooley or ARE. Now, ARE got us quite a few yards, so i'm not criticizing that, but Kelly was doing his job and getting open. Maybe not on every play, but no one gets open on every play. Kelly did his job. ARE did his job. Cooley did his job. Our offensive line did their job. I can't definitively say that about any other offensive player.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Sorry for being a downer. I just hate the effing Giants and that Cross-Eyed Mary QB. It's not fair. He can look strait ahead and see the whole damn field; It's like that she-he runner from Africa.

Eff the Giants and eff the Rams too. I hope we kill those miserable bastards!

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;590202]It's going to get worse next week.[/quote]

If we don't beat the Rams by atleast 14 points, then this team isn't going to win more than 5 games. If we lose to the Rams, Zorn's on notice. If we start out 0-4, Zorn should be fired.

That said, I think we should [U]expect[/U] the skins to be 3-1 in the first quarter of the season. Anything less is simply unacceptable.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;590229]That's simply not true. Kelly was open a number of times but Campbell either overthrew him, didn't see him, or was locked on to Cooley or ARE. Now, ARE got us quite a few yards, so i'm not criticizing that, but Kelly was doing his job and getting open. Maybe not on every play, but no one gets open on every play. Kelly did his job. ARE did his job. Cooley did his job. Our offensive line did their job. I can't definitively say that about any other offensive player.[/quote]I just got through the tape and can safely tell you that you've jumped to a lot of unfounded conclusions based around a single unfounded premise (i.e. Campbell had a terrible game, and subsequent ad homenim attacks).

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;590240]I just got through the tape.[/quote]

Hey GTripp can you tell us what you saw from Kelly? I'm still confused why they didn't look for him very much? Was it simply because the middle of the field options were working so well?

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=wilsowilso;590247]Hey GTripp can you tell us what you saw from Kelly? I'm still confused why they didn't look for him very much? Was it simply because the middle of the field options were working so well?[/quote]Best as I can tell, Kelly was just not a huge part of the gameplan.

He played more than Thomas, but he was not in on the scoring drive at the end of the 4th quarter, and the halftime adjustment Zorn made basically put the passing game between the numbers. Consider that most of our offensive plays came after half, and well, that's the reason.

Kelly ran a LOT of drag routes in this game, got open once, and made a nice third down catch.

Hopefully, he'll be a bigger part of the gameplan next week.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

The other factor, is that Campbell still has a major rapport with Randle El, one that he clearly does not have with either Kelly or Thomas. With Randle El completely schooling Terrell Thomas all game long, the ball was coming out quickly most of the game.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;590229]That's simply not true. [B]Kelly was open a number of times[/B] but Campbell either overthrew him, didn't see him, or was locked on to Cooley or ARE. Now, ARE got us quite a few yards, so i'm not criticizing that, but Kelly was doing his job and getting open. Maybe not on every play, but no one gets open on every play. Kelly did his job. ARE did his job. Cooley did his job. Our offensive line did their job. I can't definitively say that about any other offensive player.[/quote]

Just about every time I saw Kelly he was blanketed.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;590249]Kelly ran a LOT of drag routes in this game, got open once, and made a nice third down catch.

Hopefully, he'll be a bigger part of the gameplan next week.[/quote]

This is what I don't get? Why are we running Kelly towards the center of the field in the first place in a game unfolding like this? Randel El and Cooley were doing great in the middle.

Kelly is perfectly suited for the eight yard hook. Throw him a comeback. He showed that skillset in the preseason. Spread the field wide.
The safety coverage was obviously shifted towards Moss so there is a clear stress point to exploit intermediate wide patterns for the #2 WR yet we didn't try it one time.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Lotus;590264]Just about every time I saw Kelly he was blanketed.[/quote]

That's what I am worried about. If the #2 is getting blanketed in a very favorable matchup that is just unacceptable.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=wilsowilso;590297]This is what I don't get? Why are we running Kelly towards the center of the field in the first place in a game unfolding like this? Randel El and Cooley were doing great in the middle.

Kelly is perfectly suited for the eight yard hook. Throw him a comeback. He showed that skillset in the preseason. Spread the field wide.
The safety coverage was obviously shifted towards Moss so there is a clear stress point to exploit intermediate wide patterns for the #2 WR yet we didn't try it one time.[/quote]


Plus why didn't the team set up and use quick slant routes for Moss. It's just another way to get him the ball and a few yrds.

My other issue the team should have been coaching up someone to fill Moss's shoes if needed. Whether it's injury or he's being taken out of the game by double teams. Had Kelly or Mitchell been coached up in Moss's routes and put the bigger more solid physical WR might have helped against the double teams.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=ChickenMonkey;590111]I agree totally, no one has called Santana out, and he often gives up on routes, and plays...He did that on the Capmbell pick and he did it last yr in a game.....Zorn needs to have the guts to bench him (I'd trade him for picks in 2010)[/quote]\

I definitely remember him doing it (giving up on a play) on "one" of Collins picks in the playopffs game against Seattle.

Speaking of this game. This is the last time I saw Landry play lights out.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=FREE-AG3NT;590127]I'm not saying Cambell played a great game but Cooley single-handedly lost the wildcard game against the Seahawks. Tell me whats worse, a rusty first game against a divisional rival on the road or missing an easy first down catch that stalled a great fourth quarter comeback?
I remember Cooley made the pro bowl that year and it looked like he had a black eye. I wonder which teamate decked him for missing that catch?[/quote]


Oh I guess those picks Collins threw were a non-factor?

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=SBXVII;590134]Ya know your 100% correct. I'm almost missing Norv Turner at this point. He atleast got us to the play offs frequently. It's a crying shame when I'm starting to think that way.[/quote]


I was actually thinking that the other day. We went downhill from there for Danny's knee jerk reaction. Look at San Diegos offense under him.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;590385]\

[B]I definitely remember him doing it (giving up on a play) on "one" of Collins picks in the playopffs game against Seattle.[/B]

Speaking of this game. This is the last time I saw Landry play lights out.[/quote]

I still haven't forgiven Moss for that. It was the playoffs, for gosh sake. And that pick was returned for the score that sealed the game.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;590389]I was actually thinking that the other day. We went downhill from there for Danny's knee jerk reaction. Look at San Diegos offense under him.[/quote]

You mean the SD Chargers that were 8-8 last year, and had one of the worst defenses and whose offense played 6 games against 3 teams whose defenses ranked in the bottom 10 last year. The ones who under Marty were 14-2, and now nearly lost to Oakland. Yeah, lets here it for Norv.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;590389]I was actually thinking that the other day. We went downhill from there for Danny's knee jerk reaction. Look at San Diegos offense under him.[/quote]

You mean the SD Chargers that were 8-8 last year, and had one of the worst defenses and whose offense played 6 games against 3 teams whose defenses ranked in the bottom 10 last year. The ones who under Marty were 14-2, and now nearly lost to Oakland. Yeah, lets here it for Norv. I don't think SD fans would be all that sad if Norv were to leave (don't know that just sorta believe they gotta be tired of him by now).

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;590148]I'm not questioning Moss's ability, just his attitude. Someone has to step up. What if he goes down? Who takes his position?[/quote]


Agreed. Moss has made great play for us. But he has to do that allof the time. Even if he can't make plays all the time. He still has to keep his mind in the game. One that play I woulnd't fault him totally. But in football. I fyou can't catch the ball. You make sure no one else does. If he had a made a strogner play on the ball or even touched dude he wouldn't have gotten his feet down. because he parely did. It was a good defenseive play. But like I said this isn't the first time I've seen Moss do this. I have seen him pout on the field. ON the post game interview. He was in the locker room with his head down. ARE and Cooley had career high catches last year. Moss didn't have a very productive year and ARE had a good game besides that bone head play at the beginning of the game.

I love Moss. But he does act like a diva sometimes and as the number 1 receiver. You can't take plays off. I htink his skill is unquestionable. But his mental game is brittle. I honestly think Webster was messing with his head and took him out the game. Before and after the fight.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;590240]I just got through the tape and can safely tell you that you've jumped to a lot of unfounded conclusions based around a single unfounded premise (i.e. Campbell had a terrible game, and subsequent ad homenim attacks).[/quote]

Good point. Dont make analysis on a game when you only saw it once and are extremely upset. You have to go back and watch the game again. Tivo and DVR will change your mind on a few things when you look at the game again. Somethign I noticed was that on that play when Campbell fumbled. He should have step up and was trying to when the ball got stripped. But I also saw Samuels getting used by a simple shoulder shake move. It was like DE literally shook him off. lol. Campbell needs to step up quicker tho.

But back to what I was saying earlier. Tivo and DVR are your friend when it comes to analyzing a game after watching it the first time

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

The Giants gamble was: if they took away Moss with just one guy (Webster), they could use a safety on Kelly and prevent him from making a play beyond 15 yards. But where they went wrong is that they couldn't keep Randle El from beating them, so the fact that they took away Kelly became irrelevant in the grand scheme.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;590392]You mean the SD Chargers that were 8-8 last year, and had one of the worst defenses and whose offense played 6 games against 3 teams whose defenses ranked in the bottom 10 last year. The ones who under Marty were 14-2, and now nearly lost to Oakland. Yeah, lets here it for Norv.[/quote]


Your right. Our offense is way better than San Diegos. They were 10th in the league on a down year. We were ranked 20th and could hardly score. I am only talking about offense. Norv specialty is offense not defense. You can get a defensive coordinator. OH we had Marty too. Thanks for making my point again.

We can never have things straight across the board. Player, Coaches, FO.

One or two or all are always off somehow.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Putting myself in Moss's shoes:

I'm running a route. The QB is running towards the line of scrimmage and won't throw the ball before crossing the line of scrimmage. I
1) Run towards the line of scrimmage to give him a target to throw to, or
2) Cut off my run hoping to keep the defenders out of the area where the QB will run.

I didn't record the game, so can someone who did tell me if this is a possible scenario?

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;590410]Your right. Our offense is way better than San Diegos. They were 10th in the league on a down year. We were ranked 20th and could hardly score. I am only talking about offense. Norv specialty is offense not defense. You can get a defensive coordinator. OH we had Marty too. Thanks for making my point again.

We can never have things straight across the board. Player, Coaches, FO.

One or two or all are always off somehow.[/quote]

But you are comparing an offense that was playing against three of the worst defenses in the league. Lets see how ours does when we play the AFC West. It may not be stellar, but San Diego's was again an 8-8 team in the AFC West.

Re: Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?
 

Hell Yeah!!!!!! CP and Cooley are the only Pro Bowler caliber guys we have on offense and are always true gamers since day one. Fellas better listen to them too!!! If this crap keeps up we will lose both next time they are up for contract renewal. At some point soon CP and CC are going to want to go out with a ring. Just think Barry Sanders. I agree put in Marko in for Moss more often, etc.