Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

Don't get me wrong from the Russ Grimm comment, I think Zorn should get this year and [I]unless he consistently demonstrates that he is completely inept[/I], he should get a third year. So far, he seems to have progressed. He has adopted the shotgun and no-huddle more than originally planned and has gotten the ball moving.

The question is, can he now learn to manage a game "off script" (see GTripp's analysis of the offense) and make the hard choices to bench old reliables (Moss, Betts, Cartwright) for up and comers (Kelly, Mason/Aldridge, Thomas).

If he can do that over the course of this season, and IMHO, he should be back next year.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;594071]

Do we need a hard-nosed disciplinarian who can keep everyone in check?



Discuss[/quote]


The problem with a hard-nosed disciplinarian is that the Skins roster is full of high priced free agents. This can be a deadly combination. Efforts by coaches like that can easily backfire and cause the team to quit. It could work, but it could also have disastrous effects.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Hog1;594161]OH yah, and it has to be someone who STILL has the...........hunger TO WIN!!
Not a damn burn out looking for a home.........[/quote]

This is why I recoil any time the names of retreads like Shanahan, Gruden, Holmgren, etc., are mentioned. Older retread coaches frequently don't work out because they lack the hunger of someone like, say, Rex Ryan.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

I agree with everyone that is saying Zorn should be the redskins head coach. And I think that snyder has matured enough to give him enough time. But for now, we all seem to be frustrated with the way the team's been performing. All of that starts with the head coach. And I don't think it's a matter of just fixing the red zone issues because if it's not the red zone issues then it's another issue.

To answer the question of this thread - the type of head coach that the redskins need is/was a young gibbs. Zorn is not as ready as gibbs because zorn didn't prepare like gibbs before becoming a head coach.

Zorn will probably need to block out all of the feedback from fans and the media and focus on what he needs to do in order to get this team to perform at a high level. Hopefully Zorn has a plan and the confidence in that plan to execute it.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

the word up here in north jersey ,is that jon gruden will be the next redskin head coach..

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Coff;594183]The problem with a hard-nosed disciplinarian is that the [B]Skins roster is full of high priced free agents[/B]. This can be a deadly combination. Efforts by coaches like that can easily backfire and cause the team to quit. It could work, but it could also have disastrous effects.[/quote]

If they arent preforming up to their contracts then they should go. yes we would be in cap hell for awhile but Cowher went through the same with Pittburgh and they built through the draft and it seemed to work out for the best.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;594148]Just throwing it out there - Russ Grimm.[/quote]

It's amazing how many former Redskins from the 80s/early 90s are in coaching/managerial roles around the league, yet not with the Redskins.

I don't know that Grimm will ever get his opportunity here (or anywhere), too many question marks.

I think we need a coach comfortable enough with himself to delegate responsibility

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=bigant;594186]the word up here in north jersey ,is that jon gruden will be the next redskin head coach..[/quote]

Based on what?

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;594075]It just needs a HC that can put points on the board.

Sorry for the obvious take but I still think Zorn has what it takes if he just gets his head out of his ass in the RZ.[/quote]

That's all there is to it if you ask me.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=bigant;594186]the word up here in north jersey ,is that jon gruden will be the next redskin head coach..[/quote]

Does anyone actually listen to what comes out of Jersey?

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Lotus;594184]This is why I recoil any time the names of retreads like Shanahan, Gruden, Holmgren, etc., are mentioned. Older retread coaches frequently don't work out because they lack the hunger of someone like, say, Rex Ryan.[/quote]

Ahh, thank you!! The only retread I would consider would be Dungy.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=warriorzpath;594185]I agree with everyone that is saying Zorn should be the redskins head coach. And I think that snyder has matured enough to give him enough time. But for now, we all seem to be frustrated with the way the team's been performing. All of that starts with the head coach. And I don't think it's a matter of just fixing the red zone issues because if it's not the red zone issues then it's another issue.

To answer the question of this thread - the type of head coach that the redskins need is/was a young gibbs. Zorn is not as ready as gibbs because zorn didn't prepare like gibbs before becoming a head coach.

Zorn will probably need to block out all of the feedback from fans and the media and focus on what he needs to do in order to get this team to perform at a high level. Hopefully Zorn has a plan and the confidence in that plan to execute it.[/quote]

If an abject failure like Norv Turner can have a seven year run here in Washington with teams that more often than not showed very little promise, Jim Zorn deserves at least half that amount of time.

What's even more sad to note, if John Cooke had been successful in gaining control of the Redskins, Norv Turner may still be the coach. I vividly remember the words of his father Jack Cooke when he hired Norv, he said at the time Norv would be the last coach he was going to hire, and I'm sure he also at the time was hoping for a little longer life span.

Fans have been clamoring for coaches like Cower, Gruden, Shannahan and others. Cower had a twelve year run in Pittsburg with one SB trophy to show for his efforts. Would Mr. Snyders' impatient blanket spand that period of time without his coveted prize? Gruden's success in Tampa could be largely attributed to his predecessor Tony Dungy who had aready laid the foundation for his work. Shannahan was not the great coach once John Elway left the game.

Mind you, I'm certainly not knocking any of these very good coaches, what I am saying is that a HC must have time to build a solid program. The Redskins knew what they were getting in Zorn when they hired him , basically "on the job training" a coach with no prior coordinating experience at any level, therefore he deserves the benefit of the doubt. If they had higher expectations then they shouldn't have hired a coach so limited in scope. Given the proper time and support, it's my belief Zorn will become a proficient HC.

my rant is over, thanks for listning.....

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594216]If an abject failure like Norv Turner can have a seven year run here in Washington with teams that more often than not showed very little promise, Jim Zorn deserves at least half that amount of time.

What's even more sad to note, if John Cooke had been successful in gaining control of the Redskins, Norv Turner may still be the coach. I vividly remember the words of his father Jack Cooke when he hired Norv, he said at the time Norv would be the last coach he was going to hire, and I'm sure he also at the time was hoping for a little longer life span.

Fans have been clamoring for coaches like Cower, Gruden, Shannahan and others. [B]Cower had a twelve year run in Pittsburg with one SB trophy to show for his efforts. Would Mr. Snyders' impatient blanket spand that period of time without his coveted prize? Gruden's success in Tampa could be largely attributed to his predecessor Tony Dungy[/B] who had aready laid the foundation for his work. Shannahan was not the great coach once John Elway left the game.

Mind you, I'm certainly not knocking any of these very good coaches, what I am saying is that a HC must have time to build a solid program. The Redskins knew what they were getting in Zorn when they hired him , basically "on the job training" a coach with no prior coordinating experience at any level, therefore he deserves the benefit of the doubt. If they had higher expectations then they shouldn't have hired a coach so limited in scope. Given the proper time and support, it's my belief Zorn will become a proficient HC.

my rant is over, thanks for listning.....[/quote]

True but the Steelers were not a good team when Cowher got there and he was taking them to the playoffs, how many AFC Champ games were they in during his tenure? Gruden won the SB with Tampa but he built up oakland before he was traded to the Bucs. Dungy built up Tampa from a laughing stock to a feared team. Shanahan, yeah he had a great QB and that helped him alot so its hard to get a good grade on how he would do now.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594216]If an abject failure like Norv Turner can have a seven year run here in Washington with teams that more often than not showed very little promise, Jim Zorn deserves at least half that amount of time.

What's even more sad to note, if John Cooke had been successful in gaining control of the Redskins, Norv Turner may still be the coach. I vividly remember the words of his father Jack Cooke when he hired Norv, he said at the time Norv would be the last coach he was going to hire, and I'm sure he also at the time was hoping for a little longer life span.

Fans have been clamoring for coaches like Cower, Gruden, Shannahan and others. Cower had a twelve year run in Pittsburg with one SB trophy to show for his efforts. Would Mr. Snyders' impatient blanket spand that period of time without his coveted prize? Gruden's success in Tampa could be largely attributed to his predecessor Tony Dungy who had aready laid the foundation for his work. Shannahan was not the great coach once John Elway left the game.

Mind you, I'm certainly not knocking any of these very good coaches, what I am saying is that a HC must have time to build a solid program. The Redskins knew what they were getting in Zorn when they hired him , basically "on the job training" a coach with no prior coordinating experience at any level, therefore he deserves the benefit of the doubt. If they had higher expectations then they shouldn't have hired a coach so limited in scope. Given the proper time and support, it's my belief Zorn will become a proficient HC.

my rant is over, thanks for listning.....[/quote]

Good post...it's funny how many people bitch about Snyder and Cerrato, yet they have the following reactions:

- They want to bring in any offensive lineman from free agency without giving a chance to one of the young players we've been developing (and building through the draft)

- They wanted to offer multiple picks for Sanchez now that they see offensive troubles

- They want to fire their 2nd year coach who still has a .500 record, and after winning a game.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;594222]Good post...it's funny how many people bitch about Snyder and Cerrato, yet they have the following reactions:

- They want to bring in any offensive lineman from free agency without giving a chance to one of the young players we've been developing (and building through the draft)

- They wanted to offer multiple picks for Sanchez now that they see offensive troubles

- They want to fire their 2nd year coach who still has a .500 record, and after winning a game.[/quote]

Well, when you put it that way you make it seem so... so... unreasonable. How could that be? We're "knowledgeable fans" here (well, except for irish)!!

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=DBUCHANON101;594220]True but the Steelers were not a good team when Cowher got there and he was taking them to the playoffs, how many AFC Champ games were they in during his tenure? Gruden won the SB with Tampa but he built up oakland before he was traded to the Bucs. Dungy built up Tampa from a laughing stock to a feared team. Shanahan, yeah he had a great QB and that helped him alot so its hard to get a good grade on how he would do now.[/quote]

You're right about Cower and I wanted to include that important fact in my post. Cower was always on the cusp of winning it all for many of those twelve years. Some think that for a good portion of that stretch he stuck with Cordell Stewart too long. Thanks for raising the issue.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594216]fans have been clamoring for coaches like Cower, Gruden, Shannahan and others. Cower had a twelve year run in Pittsburg with one SB trophy to show for his efforts. Would Mr. Snyders' impatient blanket spand that period of time without his coveted prize? Gruden's success in Tampa could be largely attributed to his predecessor Tony Dungy who had aready laid the foundation for his work. Shannahan was not the great coach once John Elway left the game.[/quote]

Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! A man with sense.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

And lets not forget the Neal O Donnell SB performance..

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;594233]Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! Thank you!! A man with sense.[/quote]


SFREDSKIN......I still may be able to get a ticket for you if you decide to come east anytime during the season.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

Im going to combine a few of those. I want a young head coach who maybe had a year or two down in college or a former player who was a leader on his team and is strict and in the players face.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594241]SFREDSKIN......I still may be able to get a ticket for you if you decide to come east anytime during the season.[/quote]

Thank you for the offer, If I do, I will make sure to contact you. Now let's hope JZ resolves the RZ issues and we get going so everyone can stop bitching about the Redskins and Zorn being horrible.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;594071]This isn't about should Zorn be fired, or should Shanahan (whoever) be hired.

This is more about with the current Redskins roster what type of head coach is the best fit?

Do we need a hot-shot, upstart who can relate to the young guys?

Do we need a hard-nosed disciplinarian who can keep everyone in check?

Do we need an experienced offensive mind who can help our rookies and 2nd year players?

Discuss[/quote]

Mike Holmgren is what this team needs. Not the Mike H. who mailed it in last year in Seattle. I want the guy before that, who can be an ass kicker when needed, but knows how to communicate w/ the players and most of all a guy the players RESPECT. He commands respect when he walks in the room. Hell we can hire him and put Zorn at QB coach where he belongs. But it will never happen cause Snyder can't push Holmgren around.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;594198]Ahh, thank you!! The only retread I would consider would be Dungy.[/quote]

Me too. Tony D would be the only retread that I personally would consider. And I'm sure that Danny will phone me up to ask my opinion on this issue.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

The organization needs to go higher up than head coach. What is needed is a total upheaval from top down. The needs a general manager that is responsible for the entire football operations. A head coach that instills discipline. An experienced offensive coordinator. An aggressive defensive coordinator to handle the Redskins best squad.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594216]If an abject failure like Norv Turner can have a seven year run here in Washington with teams that more often than not showed very little promise, Jim Zorn deserves at least half that amount of time.

What's even more sad to note, if John Cooke had been successful in gaining control of the Redskins, Norv Turner may still be the coach. I vividly remember the words of his father Jack Cooke when he hired Norv, he said at the time Norv would be the last coach he was going to hire, and I'm sure he also at the time was hoping for a little longer life span.

Fans have been clamoring for coaches like Cower, Gruden, Shannahan and others. Cower had a twelve year run in Pittsburg with one SB trophy to show for his efforts. Would Mr. Snyders' impatient blanket spand that period of time without his coveted prize? Gruden's success in Tampa could be largely attributed to his predecessor Tony Dungy who had aready laid the foundation for his work. Shannahan was not the great coach once John Elway left the game.

Mind you, I'm certainly not knocking any of these very good coaches, what I am saying is that a HC must have time to build a solid program. The Redskins knew what they were getting in Zorn when they hired him , basically "on the job training" a coach with no prior coordinating experience at any level, therefore he deserves the benefit of the doubt. If they had higher expectations then they shouldn't have hired a coach so limited in scope. Given the proper time and support, it's my belief Zorn will become a proficient HC.

my rant is over, thanks for listning.....[/quote]

The reason I would want a coach like Cower, Gruden or Shannahan is becasue they are the only type of coach that will come in with the clout to make the front office changes that are needed. If the big name is going to come in and accept the current setup like Gibbs did then it won't work and they may as well keep Zorn. It needs to be like when Marty came in and had the authority to fire Vinny after the first time he sat down with him. If one of these guys can get that power Marty had for that 1 year...then we are in an infinitely better position then we are now.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=celts32;594834]The reason I would want a coach like Cower, Gruden or Shannahan is becasue they are the only type of coach that will come in with the clout to make the front office changes that are needed. If the big name is going to come in and accept the current setup like Gibbs did then it won't work and they may as well keep Zorn. It needs to be like when Marty came in and had the authority to fire Vinny after the first time he sat down with him. If one of these guys can get that power Marty had for that 1 year...then we are in an infinitely better position then we are now.[/quote]

But change for the sake of change won't really help either. None of those three have proven themselves to be successful GMs. Can they be? Maybe. Though it doesn't seem like Shanahan was able to do both.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;594949]But change for the sake of change won't really help either. None of those three have proven themselves to be successful GMs. Can they be? Maybe. Though it doesn't seem like Shanahan was able to do both.[/quote]

Only guy I think could do both is Parcells and he is not available nor would I want him.

I think we have to have patience with Zorn. But of all those coaches I would bring in the one who is more offensive minded. Our D will be okay. But if Zorn got fired it would be because of the O not the D.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

Greg Williams.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

Naw, this team ain't too old. Give me a break. I hate to use them as an example, but look at the Patriots. Across the board they are a veteran team. Even the Giants offensive has line has played together for the past four years/five years. Those guys aren't exactly spring chickens either. The Cardinals are another team that comes to mind. Geez Kurt Warner just 700 years old, and both Fitz and Boldin have been in the league around the same length of time as Santana Moss. So the Skins aren't in need of some "youth movement".

We have one of the youngest secondaries in the league. Rocky is young, Orakapo is a rookie, and Fletcher has a lot of milage left him. Besides, the guy never get's injured.

I honestly think Zorn could be the right coach. He's not too young, not too old. I think he relates well. He's just too much of an offensive coordinator. He has the mechanics down, but not the nuance. Play calling is about nuance and imagination. He's not there yet. Without naming a coach, if Zorn doesn't get it done we might have to start from scratch.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;594960]Greg Williams.[/quote]

Nah.

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

The coaches in this clip are exactly the type of coaches we need for the Redskins. Especially the assistant. Relevant part starts at 1:01

[yt]QHf8OHZr5kU.[/yt]

Re: What Type of Head Coach Does This Team Need?
 

[quote=Longtimefan;594175]I agree wholeheartedly with what you're saying. So much I want to see Zorn succeede because every time we change coaches we take two steps backward. When we start getting the ball in the endzone, there'll be no stoping us.

When it comes to changing coaches, many times the grass is not always greener, I believe it takes time, sometimes more than just a year or two to build a solid winner. When Gibbs left this last time, Mr. Snyder said in his first interview when asked what he learned form Gibbs, he said PATIENCE. I think you and I would agree it's time for him to demonstrate he meant what he said.[/quote]

I agree, winning teams dont change coaches as fast as the Skins do. I think a coach needs 4 years minimum to see if its gonna work.

There is no way a hard a$$ disciplinarian coach would work here because with the Redskins the players run the show, not the coaches. I am trying to imagine Portis, Moss, ARE dealing with a tough coach. It wouldnt be pretty but it could be fun to watch.