Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=skinsnut;635634]hmm...well, although I'd give Gibbs the benefit of the doubt if he called this...Zorn has no such cover...cause his record is pathetic...
But there is no coach that only calls about 10 plays a game....such as this one that cannot reasonably discern the complete lack of "time" advantage of running a play with about 5 seconds left before the 2 minute warning when a typical passing play takes at least that long.

If he though the defensive coordinator was an idiot (gregg williams...ha!)
Then he could have tried play action to see if he could have suckered them in...of course they'd be looking for the bookleg TE...so...something, anything would have been better....I would have gone for a double TE slant..if it wasn't there, I'd do a late flat relase to the RB.

A run was flat out stupid and was nothing less than playing not to lose....yet again.
Zorn is aggressive at the wrong time and is conservative at idiotic times.
Duh!![/quote]

Still you are disregarding the intangible that were outside of our control. I'm not defending Zorn for the crappy record we're in, but overall he coached this team to within a good kick from beating one of the best team in football.

Now it is up to the coaching staff and eventually the front office to fix the wrongs that came up during this game (coverage issue, kicking, etc.,. etc.)

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=skinsnut;635618]The coach is responsible for W and L...Zorn is it.

I was frankly freaking out...why would a coach run a running play with 2:03 left to go on essentially a 3rd and goal at the 5.
There is no advantage of running to run down the clock..only a moron, or a rookie coach would make such a mistake....especially when you are 3-8 going against a 11-0 team...you attack.....mind numbing.
Say what you want about Swishy...but this game was lost by coaching and lame turnovers....more importantly....it was lost because this team continues to believe no matter the situation, they will lose...that is a leadership issue.
This defense continues to blow 4th quarter leads...this in not a solid defense.
Good defenses are defined by how they play with the game on the line...
3 week in a row...they blow the last drive.
incredible....I am resorting to drinking to deal with my anger....not good AT ALL!![/quote]

Chill..this argument has come up on the radio too but the coaching staff made the right call..At that point you don't need a touchdown. A field goal makes it a two possession game just as a touchdown does. So, the coaches play it safe and just run the ball. If you get a TD great but if you don't its not a big deal. Don't risk a pick or a sack that could cause a fumble or make a longer field goal than you have at the moment. Also, the skins could not run the clock to the 2 minute warning. When the play clock began running the was a 1 second differential bn it and the game clock so they had to run a play there. I don't think playing it safe and putting the game winning score on a 23-yard field goal is bad coaching. It's smart coaching. They ran the clock down as far as they could have and put themselves in a position to have a 10 point lead, giving the ball back to NO with no timeouts left...

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

A 23 yard field goal is basically an extra point. An NFL kicker should make that 99 times out of 100 or maybe even 999 times out of 1000.

Suisham gets paid to be automatic on that kick.

For me that's pretty much the end of the story.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

suisham, moore, and whoever got really conservative at the end.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=SkinsLove24/7;635645]Chill..this argument has come up on the radio too but the coaching staff made the right call..[B]At that point you don't need a touchdown.[/B] A field goal makes it a two possession game just as a touchdown does. So, the coaches play it safe and just run the ball. If you get a TD great but if you don't its not a big deal. Don't risk a pick or a sack that could cause a fumble or make a longer field goal than you have at the moment. Also, the skins could not run the clock to the 2 minute warning. When the play clock began running the was a 1 second differential bn it and the game clock so they had to run a play there. I don't think playing it safe and putting the game winning score on a 23-yard field goal is bad coaching. It's smart coaching. They ran the clock down as far as they could have and put themselves in a position to have a 10 point lead, giving the ball back to NO with no timeouts left...[/quote]

I stopped reading after the bolded line. This coaching staff, this team needs to get a killer attitude. Yes maybe the run was not the end of the world, but right there, at that moment, you take the shot. throw it away, heck take a sack, but take the dang shot into the endzone! one play, one call(probably on lewis) but take it. I understand the logic of the run, but this team needs to get a spark, and settling for the safe route at 3-8, just doesn't cut it. Take the shot, make a play. Let the offense finish what they were doing, they had a good game, and deserved to take the shot to win it.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

If your defense gives up more than 20 and your and your offense scores more than 20 than this one is on the defense. Even though we had some pressure and some sacks from time to time on Brees, he had a lot of time to make throws today and our secondary was susceptible yet again to the double move. Carlos Rogers wasn't even responsible for the one double move and we still got beat. Our defense let us down this week again! It is the second week in a row where all they had to do was stop the other team from scoring a touchdown and they didn't get it done. I say that Suisham deserves a close second because all he has to do is hit a chip shot at home and the game is over, instead he misses and we are now talking about a loss and the Saints moving on to the playoffs.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

I also understand the login of a nail in the coffin to put a team away by scoring a touchdown, and I don't there is a wrong answer here. It's six in one hand and a half-dozen in the other. A touchdown would have been awesome. I wanted to see a 37 on the scoreboard but I think the decision to play it safe and kick also looked worse based on the fact that SS missed the darn kick. Gotta hit that kick to avoid the pointing fingers debate which we got here.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Shaun Suisham

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Shuisham, if we had a better kicker, we would be 5-7 instead of 3-9

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Luxorreb;635567]Landry gave up 2 TDs. Can't blame it all on Suisham. Kareem Moore also gave away another TD. We beat ourselves today. We had the undefeated Saints on the ropes and somehow we hand wrapped them an early Christmas gift. Sellers fumble was also a crucial mistake.[/quote]

I agree, Suisham missed the FG that would have put us up by ten, but there was enough blame to spread around long before that. If you just want to blame somebody, look at Moore, Sellers, Barnes, Campbell, Landry and the list goes on. I'm not willing to place all the blame on Suisham because he missed the kick, it should never have come to that.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

The New Orleans Saints. Just sayin'

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Landry 55%, Suisham 45%

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

We're talking a handful of kicks this year, and maybe this team is .500. No excuses.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

No one person in my book. This was again a rather creative way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. It is a shame however that our qb can never seem to go out and save us from our selves.

F the Redskins!

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Andre Carter. On the Moore strip for a TD, Carter had Brees dead to rights, but Brees stiff-armed him to the ground. Just being different;)

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

I will have to put the blame on Landry. He has proven again the he would be a better fit at strong safety. He is too much of a hot head and worrying about laying the big hit rather than making the big play. The redskins have been burned deep constantly. Man, I really miss Taylor.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

For once Campbell isn't on the chop block.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Darrell_Green_28;635563]why isnt the refs an option?
yeah if suisham had made it whos to say the saints dont do what they did right after that missed kick then recover an onsides kick? if that int would have been called down where he was, then no td before half.. as with that sellers fumble, to me looked like his forarm was down before it came out..[/quote]
Yeah, either they had an angle that the network wasn't showing or they decided that inconclusive was good enough to call it a fumble. At that dead on view it's just too hard to tell, guess they didn't have a side shot?

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

seeing that he was called down first, if it were another team they wouldnt have found enough evidence to overturn it, but seeing it was the skins, they overturned it and gave it to the saints

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Suisham Quote From A Washington Post Article By: Boswell

After the obligatory but sincere mea culpa, Suisham said, "Gee, I sure wish there was something I could do . . .

=========================================

Landry and Suisham. Shaun if you want to do something make the FREAKING KICK!!!!!! 23 yards you got to be kidding me. Make the KICK!!! Landry Free Safety means that you are the last person between the offensive player and the goal line. There is no one behind you to help so you can't let people get behind you Mr. Over Agressive double move taker (twice)!

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Darrell_Green_28;635859]seeing that he was called down first, if it were another team they wouldnt have found enough evidence to overturn it, but seeing it was the skins, they overturned it and gave it to the saints[/quote]

They showed a blow up of Sellers going down and it was clear that the ball was out before his forarm was on the ground. The blow up picture showed the ball cooming out and his forearm off the ground. My pick has to go on SS for missing a chip shot FG.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

I am going to go against the grain and say Landry. Suisam missed 1 FG -- 3 points. Landy got burned TWICE deep on the same double hitch move for 14 points. If either of those TDs don't get made, we win, even with Suisam's shank.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

There's no way it's anyone other than Suisham's fault. Sure, Landry could have made those stops, sure, Sellers could have held onto the ball, but Suisham's miss DIRECTLY correlates to the loss. He hits that, we win, game over.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

I agree with the others who said that Suisham can be blamed totally. That is 100% true. The team came from behind and did everything it reasonably could do to ensure a victory.

Suisham blew it once again. I think Kicker is one of our immediate needs in the offseason. Jason Elam is out there right now...so is Matt Bryant....we need a kicker that has the leg strength to go 50 yards....and accuracy too

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=calia;635933]I am going to go against the grain and say Landry. Suisam missed 1 FG -- 3 points. Landy got burned TWICE deep on the same double hitch move for 14 points. If either of those TDs don't get made, we win, even with Suisam's shank.[/quote]

i agree with you about landry, but shushi screwed us yet again if it was the first time that be one thing, but this isn't the first time, peace f-er

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

Suisham. Yes, Landry got burned, but the Saints burn EVERYONE. Take away the strip for a TD and the Saints were held well below their average of 37 points a game. The D did fine and the O played out of their mind. A lot of games are won the way the Skins had it lined up. 99 out of 100 times, Suisham makes that kick. He along lost the game. Period.

You can point to other plays, but then the Saints can point to plays as well. And you can go back and forth all day re-living plays. What if Smoot didn't drop that interception. What if the Saints didn't drop that INT when the Skins were in the red zone. It all came down to a chippy for our kicker, and he blew it.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

I still think it's funny how everyone wants to blame just one person....."he's a witch, I know he's a witch..." lets burn Suisham.

lets forget:

JC's interception.
Landry's failure to be the stop gap.
Moore's failure to sit on the interception.
Sellers failure to secure the ball.
Suisham of course for failing to hit a 23 yrder.

Don't remember if JC's interception turned into a TD. Suish missing the kick only gave up 3 points. Yes it would have won the game. Yes it would have made it two scores to tie the game or win. However ....Landry gave up 7 points by biting on the double move and not being the last man standing. Moore gave up 7 points by not simply falling down and waiting to be tagged. and lastely Seller's failure to secure the ball eventually led to a FG. There are other's who should be more to blame for giving up more points then Suish.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=SBXVII;636385]I still think it's funny how everyone wants to blame just one person....."he's a witch, I know he's a witch..." lets burn Suisham.

lets forget:

JC's interception.
Landry's failure to be the stop gap.
Moore's failure to sit on the interception.
Sellers failure to secure the ball.
Suisham of course for failing to hit a 23 yrder.

Don't remember if JC's interception turned into a TD. Suish missing the kick only gave up 3 points. Yes it would have won the game. Yes it would have made it two scores to tie the game or win. However ....Landry gave up 7 points by biting on the double move and not being the last man standing. Moore gave up 7 points by not simply falling down and waiting to be tagged. and lastely Seller's failure to secure the ball eventually led to a FG. There are other's who should be more to blame for giving up more points then Suish.[/quote]

The INT led to a missed FG and overtime. The missed FG from XP distance is inexcusable. Landry gave up 14 points by falling for the same move twice. Moore made the right move until he failed to cover up the ball when running in traffic. It would be stupid for him to lay down and wait to be touched.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=SBXVII;636385]I still think it's funny how everyone wants to blame just one person....."he's a witch, I know he's a witch..." lets burn Suisham.

lets forget:

JC's interception.
Landry's failure to be the stop gap.
Moore's failure to sit on the interception.
Sellers failure to secure the ball.
Suisham of course for failing to hit a 23 yrder.

Don't remember if JC's interception turned into a TD. Suish missing the kick only gave up 3 points. Yes it would have won the game. Yes it would have made it two scores to tie the game or win. However ....Landry gave up 7 points by biting on the double move and not being the last man standing. Moore gave up 7 points by not simply falling down and waiting to be tagged. and lastely Seller's failure to secure the ball eventually led to a FG. There are other's who should be more to blame for giving up more points then Suish.[/quote]

with all that said shushi was the only one who actually had the oportunity to kick a fg score three points and win the game, while it is a team game sometimes it comes down to that one play and within the past three games he has blown that chance twice

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=SBXVII;636385]I still think it's funny how everyone wants to blame just one person....."he's a witch, I know he's a witch..." lets burn Suisham.[/quote]

People sure love themselves a scapegoat.

Suisham might be burned at the stake this week, but that won't take away from JC taking the ultimate fall for the entire season.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;636461]People sure love themselves a scapegoat.

Suisham might be burned at the stake this week, but that won't take away from JC taking the ultimate fall for the entire season.[/quote]
I think that the coaching staff and front office have taken some heat off of Campbell.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;635568]I can make a case for Landry.

He was beat twice by a double move. Not only should that not happen to your FS but to do it in a 2 minute drill when your up by a TD is INEXCUSEABLE.


There were many things though that just shouldn't have happened like the Barnes punt turnover, the INT-fumble for TD, the missed short FG. It looked as if it was almost scripted for us to lose...I'm pretty pissed.

Our guys played tough, especially our offense so this loss is hard to swallow. Having this poor season, beating the undefeated Saints would have been memorably inspiring for these guys.


...jeez...I'm too bitter right now to even dwell on this.[/quote]

Good point. Landry made plays all day, but in a 2 minute deep zone, you can't bite on that fake. I think it's accurate to say that giving up a 53 yard TD in the middle of the field w/under 2 minutes left is almost the equivalent of missing a chip shot fg. It would be one thing if the wr caught it & made him miss, but he let him behind him - inexcusable in that situation.

I hate to say it, but it also looks like poor coaching. All season Landry has played w/out discipline, which is a pretty major flaw for a free safety.

In fairness, the late ST had a terrible 2006 but came back & was playing at an all pro level before his death. Landry has a lot of the same tendencies, going for the big hit, biting on double moves, etc.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;636461]People sure love themselves a scapegoat.

Suisham might be burned at the stake this week, but that won't take away from JC taking the ultimate fall for the entire season.[/quote]


Scapegoat Suisham is. Supposedly they are bringing in 3 new kickers to try out today and supposedly whoever is the best of the 3 will knock off Suish. Laymens terms Suish is gone. Everyone gets what they want.

I'm not making excuses for Suish though. I agree he missed two important FG's in two important games. but to point the finger at one person is crazy. We might as well cut Landry also for falling for the double move twice and allowing the other team to put up 14 points. No FS should allow that.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

There's a chance Suisham wins the kick-off though. He's been in this spot before.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Paintrain;636389]The INT led to a missed FG and overtime. The missed FG from XP distance is inexcusable. Landry gave up 14 points by falling for the same move twice. Moore made the right move until he failed to cover up the ball when running in traffic. It would be stupid for him to lay down and wait to be touched.[/quote]

Yes it's crazy to think Moore should have simply laid down and waited to be touched. All most all players would have gotten up and tried to make a play. Yes he should have protected the ball better, but my point is had he simply dropped been touched we would still have the ball with decent field position and control of the clock. The team could eat up the clock and hopefully have scored or made a FG. Instead Moore runs around like a chicken with his head cut off trying to make the big play and as we know the Saints are not stupid. They knew that they needed to get the ball back. So they strip him of the ball and no one to stop them easy 7 points. Even the Sellers play, the ball should have been better protected. Most teams who get the ball first in over time win. The Saints were in panic mode. Intercept, strip the ball, do whatever is needed to get the ball back. Guess what? they did.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=tryfuhl;636469]I think that the coaching staff and front office have taken some heat off of Campbell.[/quote]

I still have issues with JC but I'll agree he played admirably the last few games. Part of this is due to Lewis I think maybe using plays that will work best for JC.

I hate giving props to Cerrato but the last two draft classes have not been to bad. I would challenge that though by saying that he has been with the team for 9 yrs and only gets 2 draft classes right? He needs to go. Bring in a true GM who will tell DS to simply enjoy what he see's and stop meddling, and build this thing up right for years to come.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;636482]There's a chance Suisham wins the kick-off though. He's been in this spot before.[/quote]

sure has and always seems to come out on top, they always say he kicks perfect in practice. maybe zorn should throw some pads at him while he is kicking

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

^ Maybe wrenches? "If you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a FG blocker." ;)

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=SBXVII;636485]Yes it's crazy to think Moore should have simply laid down and waited to be touched. All most all players would have gotten up and tried to make a play. Yes he should have protected the ball better, but my point is had he simply dropped been touched we would still have the ball with decent field position and control of the clock. The team could eat up the clock and hopefully have scored or made a FG. Instead Moore runs around like a chicken with his head cut off trying to make the big play and as we know the Saints are not stupid. They knew that they needed to get the ball back. So they strip him of the ball and no one to stop them easy 7 points. Even the Sellers play, the ball should have been better protected. Most teams who get the ball first in over time win. The Saints were in panic mode. Intercept, strip the ball, do whatever is needed to get the ball back. Guess what? they did.[/quote]
He's a safety, they make plays like that... safeties and CBs don't hit the ground and wait to be touched.. hell a lot of LBs don't. We want defensive scoring, you don't get that by laying down.

Re: Who is most responsible for the Redskins loss?
 

[quote=mlmdub130;636490]sure has and always seems to come out on top, they always say he kicks perfect in practice. maybe zorn should throw some pads at him while he is kicking[/quote]

Let Haynesworth, Orakpo and Carter attempt a block with only 3 linemen blocking....since that group requires at least 4 blockers. :)