Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=DBUCHANON101;678116]Be had a great D,and Rogers has one of the best wr corps in the league[/quote]

This is true, but the franchise QB is an absolute necessity in this league. If you don't have one, your best hope is for one season of success, and then failure again. Dilfer and Grossman come to mind.

This is a passing league now, and we need a passer. You cannot win consistently without one.

And if we don't get one now, what are we going to have to give up next season to get one? Multiple picks like the Bears did for Cutler?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678114]Ben won the SB without being protected.

Aaron Rodgers took GB deep with terrible protection.

We have had one of the best LTs in the entire league for ten years now. It hasn't taken us anywhere.[/quote]

As much as I want to draft a QB, arguing that Rodgers and Ben didn't have protection is not the way to go. They had enough protection to complete seven step drops and throw a lot of deep balls. The fact that they were so effective at running those type of plays left them more exposed to hits on the QB. Jason could barely finish a 3 step drop.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678122]This is true, but the franchise QB is an absolute necessity in this league. If you don't have one, your best hope is for one season of success, and then failure again. [B]Dilfer and Grossman come to mind.
[/B]
This is a passing league now, and we need a passer. You cannot win consistently without one.

And if we don't get one now, what are we going to have to give up next season to get one? Multiple picks like the Bears did for Cutler?[/quote]

they had great defenses...and you cant pass with the QB on his rearend.. you want to use the number 4 for David Carr part II ?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;678120]Cleveland could still jump us to get to Bradford. Holmgren has publicly said he doesn't care for Clausen...[/quote]

Yeah the Browns are definitely the team to watch out for

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;678123]As much as I want to draft a QB, arguing that Rodgers and Ben didn't have protection is not the way to go. They had enough protection to complete seven step drops and throw a lot of deep balls. The fact that they were so effective at running those type of plays left them more exposed to hits on the QB. Jason could barely finish a 3 step drop.[/quote]

You can have the best left tackle in the game, and still not do anything. Like us for the last decade.

If you have the best QB in the game, you are going places.

Both are important, but a QB is absolutely critical. Much more important than a left tackle.

And, don't believe that if we draft Bradford, we are giving up on a LT. We can get both.

We still have plenty of other options to get one. Including packaging up players like one of our TEs, Landry, or even JC together to get one.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

Wish we knew about this before. Perhaps we could have planned to more aggressively pursue the FA left tackles, to prepare for drafting Bradford.

This could be interesting. We may have Campbell, Grossman, and Bradford. Who knows how that will shake out by the end of the season.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=SmootSmack;678125]Yeah the Browns are definitely the team to watch out for[/quote]

That would be a bit of nightmare situation if Okung and Bragford are gone by four. Could we actually take the DT that falls?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678126]You can have the best left tackle in the game, and still not do anything. Like us for the last decade.

If you have the best QB in the game, you are going places.

Both are important, but a QB is absolutely critical. Much more important than a left tackle.

And, don't believe that if we draft Bradford, we are giving up on a LT. We can get both.

We still have plenty of other options to get one. Including packaging up players like one of our TEs, Landry, or even JC together to get one.[/quote]

Dude, you're making an argument that's been beaten to death here, so don't be surprise if someone bites your head off for it.

That being said, I think at this point the smart thing would be to draft down, if the Browns don't jump us and trades down with Tampa Bay. I believe that our FO now could be in a position to get multiple picks out of our #4.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=12thMan;678094]If true this means that the Rams aren't 1000% sold on Bradford's shoulder and they are definitely trying to make a playoff run sooner rather than later.

And the possibility of Bradford falling to us just increased, but it still doesn't mean we'll draft him.[/quote]

I think the Rams not having the owner firmly in place has as much to do with not wanting to invest in a QB at 1st overall as concerns about his shoulder

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=SmootSmack;678131]I think the Rams not having the owner firmly in place has as much to do with not wanting to invest in a QB at 1st overall as concerns about his shoulder[/quote]

Financially, is there much of a difference between drafting a QB over a DT? Just wondering.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=DBUCHANON101;678124]they had great defenses...and you cant pass with the QB on his rearend.. you want to use the number 4 for David Carr part II ?[/quote]

Drafting Bradford in no way means that we can't still address our terrible O-line.

It doesn't have to be one or the other. It can be both.

If we don't get our franchise QB now, when are we going to get one? Next season, when we are likely drafting lower than now?

Do you want to use one first on a QB this season, or risk having to spend two first round draft picks to get one next year?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

Yeah lets take a QB with a bad shoulder that we cant protect....hhhmmm am i the only one who smells a potential problem with this?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=SmootSmack;678131]I think the Rams not having the owner firmly in place has as much to do with not wanting to invest in a QB at 1st overall as concerns about his shoulder[/quote]

Maybe Spago figures that he better start to win now and prove to new ownership he's the guy for the Rams future. Would have a better chance with a vet QB.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678133]Drafting Bradford in no way means that we can't still address our terrible O-line.

It doesn't have to be one or the other. It can be both.

If we don't get our franchise QB now, when are we going to get one? Next season, when we are likely drafting lower than now?

Do you want to use one first on a QB this season, or risk having to spend two first round draft picks to get one next year?[/quote]

I'm not willing to bet the farm on a single player, when there's the possibility of trading down to get multiple picks.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Ruhskins;678132]Financially, is there much of a difference between drafting a QB over a DT? Just wondering.[/quote]

I would say so

All indications by the way, just addressing the general public, are that Bradford's shoulder is fine. His shoulder isn't bad (not as bad as Drew Brees') it's more so that he came back too soon from his injury. People act like he had his arm amputated or something

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Ruhskins;678137]I'm not willing to bet the farm on a single player, when there's the possibility of trading down to get multiple picks.[/quote]

Multiple picks would be great. I personally believe we are still going to unload a few players to get some more picks in this draft. The first round is absolutely loaded this year.

But that still doesn't fix the QB situation. If we want to see our team in the playoffs almost every season, we need a franchise QB.

And interesting stat: 2nd round QBs almost always bust. In the last decade, only one has been great--Drew Brees.

Ten years of busts besides that one exception.

The next best 2nd rounders of the last decade? Chad Henne, Tavaris Jackson and Kevin Kolb. That isn't pretty.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

I like this move for all the eagle fan's who bitched and complained about McNabb all these years. I live in PA and there are a bunch of em. I tell them that he is one of the best QB's their franchise has ever seen and coming from a fan of a team who has been looking for a QB for over a decade they should just be happy.

Here's hoping that Kolb Sucks eggs!!!

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678139]
And interesting stat: 2nd round QBs almost always bust. In the last decade, only one has been great--Drew Brees.

Ten years of busts besides that one exception.

The next best 2nd rounders of the last decade? Chad Henne, Tavaris Jackson and Kevin Kolb. That isn't pretty.[/quote]

Yeah, here's a good article about exactly that - 2nd/3rd round QB's. matt Shaub is another good one (rd 3).
[url=http://www.draftcountdown.com/features/23qb/23qbs.php]Draft Countdown - 2nd & 3rd Round Quarterbacks[/url]

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=ethat001;678142]Yeah, here's a good article about exactly that ][/quote]

Great article, thanks for sharing it.

Take a look at those second round QB busts. You either have to go in the first, or pray to God for a Tom Brady miracle in the sixth.

We are in the first, with the fourth pick. This is our shot.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

It would be interesting if Bradford becomes a skin after all. I would imagine after he is picked up campbell is immediately shipped to Buffalo.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=ethat001;678101] Funny -- when the Rams looked like they were drafting him, I wanted him. Now that he may slip to us, I'm concerned about his shoulder again... The grass is always greener...[/quote]

haha, this was my exact reaction as well. we shall see.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678139]Multiple picks would be great. I personally believe we are still going to unload a few players to get some more picks in this draft. The first round is absolutely loaded this year.

But that still doesn't fix the QB situation. If we want to see our team in the playoffs almost every season, we need a franchise QB.

And interesting stat: 2nd round QBs almost always bust. In the last decade, only one has been great--Drew Brees.

Ten years of busts besides that one exception.

The next best 2nd rounders of the last decade? Chad Henne, Tavaris Jackson and Kevin Kolb. That isn't pretty.[/quote]There's been 11 second round picks in the decade. That's one per year, a very small sample. You're also counting guys who have never started for their teams as busts. Which is a different argument about why first rounders are different from second rounders, and one that I believe is benefical (if the hit rates are the same, drafting a "bust" in the second round costs fewer wins).

I would agree with the point that the second round features a bunch of reaches and not many steals at the QB position. The simple way to manage this downside would be to not draft a guy you have rated as a midrounder in the second round.

I guess my point that just because the rate of first round talents dropping to the second round is limited doesn't mean we shouldn't draft McCoy if he's available in the second round. That would be poor cause and effect. Rather, it suggests that McCoy might go a lot higher than people believe, because, if he's infact a second round talent, his draft position might get inflated into the first round.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=SmootSmack;678104]Looks like this is going to happen, but what I wonder is a) how much longer does McNabb plan on playing and b) might the Rams still take a QB anyway? My guess is no since it's the no. 1 overall pick we're talking about[/quote]

I'm trying to understand why the Rams would trade for McNabb when they're in position to take (arguably) the best QB in the draft. There's no long term future in McNabb unless the Rams intentions are to draft a QB despite the trade. If it happens, does a trade of this nature raise any concerns about Bradford, if so what are they?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=NM Redskin;678129]That would be a bit of nightmare situation if Okung and Bragford are gone by four. Could we actually take the DT that falls?[/quote]

The Buc's want a defensive playmaker (ie McCoy or Berry). Hopefully they don't want to risk missing out on either one.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

And as to the rumor from the OP.....this story has legs.

The Philly Inquirer is confirming a deal is on the table.

I am unable to post the link, due to my low post count. But I will cut and paste a few sentences here. And maybe someone else can post the link:



ORLANDO -- Donovan McNabb could be in a Rams uniform by the end of the day, possibly by the end of the week.

The Eagles have an offer on the table that would give them St. Louis' second-round draft pick (33d overall) and free safety Oshiomogho Atogwe in exchange for McNabb. That deal, however, is "not yet completed," according to a league source.

McNabb would be willing to go to the Rams if he was given a contract extension, according to a source close to the situation. He would not be willing to play for Buffalo or Oakland, two moribund franchises that might be willing to take McNabb without an extension.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=GTripp0012;678150]
I guess my point that just because the rate of first round talents dropping to the second round is limited doesn't mean we shouldn't draft McCoy if he's available in the second round. That would be poor cause and effect. Rather, it suggests that McCoy might go a lot higher than people believe, because, if he's infact a second round talent, his draft position might get inflated into the first round.[/quote]

You sound like you favor McCoy. I have nothing against him, and apologize if it sounded like I do.

I would just suggest that there are reasons why Bradford is expected to be the first picked, and Colt is lower.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Longtimefan;678151]I'm trying to understand why the Rams would trade for McNabb when they're in position to take (arguably) the best QB in the draft. There's no long term future in McNabb unless the Rams intentions are to draft a QB despite the trade. If it happens, does a trade of this nature raise any concerns about Bradford, if so what are they?[/quote]

It makes sense from the standpoint of trying to keep your job as a head coach and getting the player you really want at the top of the draft. Spags obviously broke out with the Giants D-Line. With Robbins, Suh, Long, and maybe even Little they would have one of the best D-Lines in the league and get the QB they so desperately need. The thing I like about this though is that no longer will Bradford be on another NFC team. It's either us or the Browns. Personally I didn't want to risk facing him in the playoffs at least before the Super Bowl.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=McD5;678159]You sound like you favor McCoy. I have nothing against him, and apologize if it sounded like I do.

I would just suggest that there are reasons why Bradford is expected to be the first picked, and Colt is lower.[/quote]I think there are reasons, mostly with prospective future value to an offense in seasons 4-7 of their career. Which is a decision that needs to be analyzed in this draft, and that's hard to do.

What I was trying to suggest is that "second round talents" productive in the pros or not, end up usually going in the first round. So when you analyze second round prospects as a group, you can see how a guy like Brees isn't like the others. That doesn't mean that future second rounders won't be like Brees, it means that, for organizations that are going to suffer turnover, drafting a QB in the second tends not to save you from your fate. And it ends up being a wasted pick when a new organization comes in. Of course, that's no different from first round draft picks: first round picks that are made with job security in mind are likely poor investments, worse than second rounders.

If a really good quarterback is expected to be available in the second round, then it makes sense to wait and select him. There's really no way that Bradford is going to be the guy who can most help the team at No. 4, considering that there are more than four guys who can help the team immediately -- and in the future. As a future projection, it doesn't really matter whether he's the fourth pick or the thirty seventh, but the type of impact player available at No. 4 simply will not be at 37. Which is the biggest issue.

I don't think a team that takes the best player on their board at No. 4 is forcing itself to draft for need in the second round.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

Am I the only one who hates this trade as far as the Skins are concerned? We all knew that McNabb would hang it up sooner or later, but this gives them an impact player at safety AND another potentially great player.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

Unless Suh and McCoy go #1 and #2, I don't foresee TB trading down because they really need an anchor for their DL and the first team (other than the Redskins) that might trade with them to get Bradford is Cleveland at #7. KC and Seattle both need QB's but KC somehow doesn't seem to think they do and Seattle made a pathetic trade for Charlie Whitehurst, a #3 QB who wasn't even good in college.

Anyway, Suh and McCoy are rated far above the other DL in the draft and they both would be gone by #7, so I don't think that TB would risk losing one of them if one of them is still on the board when TB drafts.

If St. Louis trades for McNabb and Suh and McCoy go #1 and #2, then TB just might trade down but we'll probably need to wait until they are on the clock on draft day to find that out.

Mike Holmgren is on record as saying that he doesn't like to take a QB in the first round of the draft, for what that's worth. But if Suh and McCoy are already gone when TB drafts, then TB might trade down with Buffalo if Cleveland isn't interested.

My point is that if the Skins want Bradford, a trade of McNabb to St. Louis would not ensure that they would be able to draft him. If the McNabb trade happens, then the Skins would still need to trade up with TB if they want to make sure they get Bradford.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;678165]Am I the only one who hates this trade as far as the Skins are concerned? We all knew that McNabb would hang it up sooner or later, but this gives them an impact player at safety AND another potentially great player.[/quote]

I wouldn't hate this trade at all.

That being said, the Rams GM is out right now claiming this rumor is totally false. He says that they haven't had any discussions with Philly.

It is hard to ascertain if he is completely lying, or if this was some ploy by McNabb's agent in an effort to drive his price up.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

If this trade falls through, expect Bradford to be a redskins on April 22nd.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

If this rumor is true, it certainly takes the luster, the sheen, and the brightness off of our Grossman signing!


:tongue

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;678168]KC and Seattle both need QB's but KC somehow doesn't seem to think they do and Seattle made a pathetic trade for Charlie Whitehurst, a #3 QB who wasn't even good in college.
[/quote]

You're a pathetic trade. Anyway hold back on judgement until you get a chance to see Whitehurst play. The man is a magician.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;678175]You're a pathetic trade. Anyway hold back on judgement until you get a chance to see Whitehurst play. The man is a magician.[/quote]

Huh?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;678165]Am I the only one who hates this trade as far as the Skins are concerned? We all knew that McNabb would hang it up sooner or later, but this gives them an impact player at safety AND another potentially great player.[/quote]

No you're not. I am not a fan. That is the first time I heard the FS included in the deal. I wanted that guy. I thought this team would greatly benefit from a true FS roaming around in the backfield. This does give philly to much, and who knows maybe with the pick Philly uses it to snag up the OT or another Olinemen we wanted.

Just a thought. Don't like the deal. I do like the Mcnabb for thier 33nd pick. Not Mcnabb for the 33nd and the FS.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;678177]Huh?[/quote]

[IMG]http://cdn1.gamepro.com/blogfaction/images/to_crying.gif[/IMG]

Thats my teammate....my Quarterback.

Actually long story short I played with him in high school so I'm ultra senstive when people use words like pathetic, unproven, etc :D

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;678180][IMG]http://cdn1.gamepro.com/blogfaction/images/to_crying.gif[/IMG]

Thats my teammate....my Quarterback.

Actually long story short I played with him in high school so I'm ultra senstive when people use words like pathetic, unproven, etc :D[/quote]

:laughing2 This never fails to make me laugh!

Do you really know the guy?

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=celts32;678092]The Philadelphia Daily News reports the Eagles, indeed, have an offer on the table that would send Donovan McNabb to the Rams in exchange for the No. 33 overall pick in the 2010 NFL Draft.

According to Eagles beat writer Jeff McLane, McNabb "could be in a Rams uniform by the end of the day, possibly by the end of the week." An NFL source says the deal is "not yet completed," but McNabb has OK'd the trade if St. Louis extends his contract. He is not willing to play in Buffalo or Oakland. Mar. 24 - 5:04 pm et

[URL="http://www.rotoworld.com/content/HeadLines.aspx?sport=NFL&hl=170410"]Fantasy Football, Baseball and Basketball - draft guide, news, projections, cheatsheets, depth charts and more. Rotoworld.com[/URL][/quote]

Why would Philly trade one of the top QB's in the NFL with a proven track record for a high 2nd round pick? It just doesn't make sense.

Re: Rumor: Eagles and Rams Finalizing Trade Involving McNabb
 

[quote=warpaint;678183]:laughing2 This never fails to make me laugh!

Do really no the guy?[/quote]

Yeah, when I was a sophomore in high school we were given the option to go up to Varsity after our JV season was over, mainly to be dummies for the scout team. At the time I went up Charlie was the QB. I remember being in awe at how fast he was able to throw a football. Of course at the time I figured that all decent QB's being recruited had arm strength like that but as it turned out he was definitely above average in that category. The next year he went to Clemson and surprised everyone, especially given that he was a 3 star prospect going into college.

Right now from what I hear he's being coveted for his physical tools (height, arm strength, etc).