Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

I dont think there is anyone on our team that would be attractive trade bait for more picks. Maybe Cooley or Davis. Other than that, who could we get anything for that we dont really need. AH won't get traded because everyone will be waiting for us to drop him.

If this organization takes anything other than the best Olineman in the draft with its first pick, then they need to get rid of whom ever makes that decision. I dont care who you have catching balls, throwing balls, running balls, you can't do any of those when the Oline is a swinging gate. Picking up FA olineman hasn't worked out as well as we planned. We need to stop going after the flashy picks and make a good sound decision for the future of this team. If we have a 1st and 2nd, then take the Oline with both, or if something unbelievable falls to the 2nd you have to take a look. But ultimately, you should be able to get 2 starting lineman in the first two rounds.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;760099]I mean you said Chad's over the top rant and rave reflected your thoughts yet now you're saying keep the faith. Doesn't seem like someone would be saying keep the faith so shortly after saying give me my damn money back[/quote]

As a fan I have the right to be pissed off and vent, especially since this franchise hasn't done squat for the last 19 years. I've been patient like most diehard Redskins fans, but when you see this team get embarrassed again and again you hit the boiling point and blow up. Yes, I say keep the faith that's all I got left as a fan as I am an optimist. I will give Shanahan his shot, he deserves it, but Haslett that's another story.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

These are the threads that I stay away from in the offseason and now I have to deal with avoiding them during the regular season? Seriously? WTF?!

If you think it's that ****ing bad then stop watching the games and posting on this site until the god damn offseason.

****! Why don't you just go and hook up with a chick that suffers from manic depression? You were made for each other.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

I'm coming around to the trade Cooley idea... but I don't know that other teams value him as highly as we do. We'd be lucky to get a 2nd and 4th. Still, that would be great in terms of filling some holes, provided we use the picks wisely. Anybody watch the Gators? How has Pouncey's brother look?

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

We have to draft for one or both of the lines first. That's where you start, and we need to finally get started.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;760191]I'm coming around to the trade Cooley idea... but I don't know that other teams value him as highly as we do. We'd be lucky to get a 2nd and 4th. Still, that would be great in terms of filling some holes, provided we use the picks wisely. Anybody watch the Gators? How has Pouncey's brother look?[/quote]

Yeah, we'd be very lucky to get a 2nd, let alone a 4th with it. I'd be happy with a 3rd. That said, Cooley is the guy that needs to go, before Davis. Not that Davis is better, he's just younger and cheaper.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;760191]I'm coming around to the trade Cooley idea... but I don't know that other teams value him as highly as we do. We'd be lucky to get a 2nd and 4th. Still, that would be great in terms of filling some holes, provided we use the picks wisely. Anybody watch the Gators? How has Pouncey's brother look?[/quote]

I think we'd be lucky to get a 4th for him. I agree, he's a very good TE, but I think we overvalue him a bit.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

KC got a 2nd for Tony Gonzalez and he's on the downside of his career. Cooley is still in his prime and a better blocker. I wouldn't take anything less than a 3rd and a 4th. A second would be enough on its own to get the deal done, imo.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Landry44;760008]This season appears to be over for us at this point even though we're still in the hunt. Anyway, where do you guys think we should go in the draft?[/quote]

I think we should start looking to Canada for talent maybe even 3rd world countries and outsource our scouting to a certain Notre Dame asset name Vinny.

It's November right?

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Landry44;760015]I'm just being honest about our situation. Right now, our team is getting worse with each week. Our oline sucks, our qb suck, our rbs suck, our wrs suck, our dline sucks, our lbs suck, and a secondary suck. The 4 games that we won was by skin or our teeth to bad football teams. So forgive me if I have lost faith in us turning it around this season.[/quote]


Maybe instead of draft you should have made it plural and said [draft's] With all the sucking you just mentioned, it's going to take more than a draft to un-suck all that. Think multiple.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;760138]Not sure there is a good NT in the 1st round

On a separate note, as solid as Luck may appear I think it's safe to say the Elway comparisons are only because they both went to Stanford[/quote]


There is not a solid NT in the first round, but second round is when you would get the 'best' one, and that is Jerrell Powe of Ole Miss.

Andrew Luck is considered, from what I heard, to be the next Peyton Manning. The Elway comparison, from what I understand, is yeah just because they both went to Stanford.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;760296]There is not a solid NT in the first round, but second round is when you would get the 'best' one, and that is Jerrell Powe of Ole Miss.

Andrew Luck is considered, from what I heard, to be the next Peyton Manning. The Elway comparison, from what I understand, is yeah just because they both went to Stanford.[/quote]

From what I've seen the guy is tough (you should see his blocks) smart and a great player. His dad was Oliver Luck (WV QB back in the late 70's early 80's) born in DC. Stanford is ranked 7th in the country and are 9-1, 2 reasons, Andrew Luck and Jim Harbaugh.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Landry44;760015]I'm just being honest about our situation. Right now, our team is getting worse with each week. Our oline sucks, our qb suck, our rbs suck, our wrs suck, our dline sucks, our lbs suck, and a secondary suck. The 4 games that we won was by skin or our teeth to bad football teams. So forgive me if I have lost faith in us turning it around this season.[/quote]

SO GB, CHI, PHILLY are bad teams? Do you even watch Football man?

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;760020]Have at it.

[URL="http://walterfootball.com/draft2011.php"]WalterFootball.com: 2011 NFL Mock Draft[/URL]

Not much we can do for immediate help Draft-wise, we've got our 1 & 2, but our 3 & 4 are gone.[/quote]

Chicago wouldn't trade Cutler for McNabb lol Where do these Idiots come up with shit like this? I swear you can write about anything anymore.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

That Walter Football site is mess. I cant find anything over there.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Dread-Skin;760261]I think we should start [B]looking to[/B] Canada for [B]talent maybe even 3rd world countries[/B] and outsource our scouting to a certain Notre Dame asset name Vinny.

It's November right?[/quote]

MAYBE...........
[url=http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/nl/pirates/2008-11-24-indian-pitchers-sign_N.htm]Novice pitchers from India sign with Pirates - USATODAY.com[/url]

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;760099]I mean you said Chad's over the top rant and rave reflected your thoughts yet now you're saying keep the faith. Doesn't seem like someone would be saying keep the faith so shortly after saying give me my damn money back

As for the draft, I think they go DE in the first round (depending on where they draft) and I'm going to start touting Ponder in the 2nd round

As for WR, I'm curious to know what their plans for Austin are, I know they still have very high hopes for Kelly, and they'll certainly pursue Vincent Jackson

[B]As for the OL, i think Capers and or Cook is elevated to the active roster. The big questions are on the right side-will Brown be healthy and will we hold onto him, and one that we have all forgotten about, is Big Mike Williams ready to come back and reclaim his starting RG job. All indications are that he may just be[/B][/quote]

If that resembles the plan for the Oline Im very nervous. Im not there to see the development of Capers or Cook, but lord Capers in the Preseason...wow everytime he was on the field he was the worst player out there. It was easily seen how he fell from a 2nd round prospect to a 7th round pick.

Your right the questions on the right side...id say we lucky to get both back playin healthy again.

Hey what is the news on Big Mike...progress? He plans on playing?

Id say a prospect for us to take a look at will be Florida Pouncey at Guard. I dont think a Guard is a 1st round pick, but a second is for sure. Id like to see a good, young line in DC again.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;760344]Chicago wouldn't trade Cutler for McNabb lol Where do these Idiots come up with shit like this? I swear you can write about anything anymore.[/quote]

I'll believe it when I see it. It obviously makes an iota of sense, but at this point it's nothing more then anonymous internet people making random predictions that they won't cop to when they don't come to pass.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Chico23231;760379]If that resembles the plan for the Oline Im very nervous. Im not there to see the development of Capers or Cook, but lord Capers in the Preseason...wow everytime he was on the field he was the worst player out there. It was easily seen how he fell from a 2nd round prospect to a 7th round pick.

Your right the questions on the right side...id say we lucky to get both back playin healthy again.

Hey what is the news on Big Mike...progress? He plans on playing?

Id say a prospect for us to take a look at will be Florida Pouncey at Guard. I dont think a Guard is a 1st round pick, but a second is for sure. Id like to see a good, young line in DC again.[/quote]

Anyone know what we have in regards to draft picks? Do we have a 2nd?

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

We do have a 2nd

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;760205]KC got a 2nd for Tony Gonzalez and he's on the downside of his career. Cooley is still in his prime and a better blocker. I wouldn't take anything less than a 3rd and a 4th. A second would be enough on its own to get the deal done, imo.[/quote]

That's a good point. Gotta have a buyer though.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

I know I am going to get heckled for this 1) because I am new here, and 2) I am from PA but two things I want to comment on here.

Cooley has been great to our team over the last few years, but something happened to him and he is having an off year. Fred Davis has proven he can step up. Let Cooley go, for a good price (either a 2nd or a 3rd and 4th) and use the picks to build our weak areas.

A player that, unless I missed it, has not been talked about on here that I would like to see us draft is Stefen Wisniewski from Penn State. I have watched him play over the last couple years and he is a beast on the OL. He can play Center really well but his natural position is Guard. Both are weak points on our OL. I have seen him run downfield on screens and lay people out. He has good speed for a OL, great strength and a really good football mind. He gets overlooked a lot in regards to national media because Penn State is not known for producing OL but he is definitely an exception to the rule.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=scott.sharrer;760441]I know I am going to get heckled for this 1) because I am new here, and 2) I am from PA but two things I want to comment on here.

Cooley has been great to our team over the last few years, but something happened to him and he is having an off year. Fred Davis has proven he can step up. Let Cooley go, for a good price (either a 2nd or a 3rd and 4th) and use the picks to build our weak areas.

A player that, unless I missed it, has not been talked about on here that I would like to see us draft is Stefen Wisniewski from Penn State. I have watched him play over the last couple years and he is a beast on the OL. He can play Center really well but his natural position is Guard. Both are weak points on our OL. I have seen him run downfield on screens and lay people out. He has good speed for a OL, great strength and a really good football mind. He gets overlooked a lot in regards to national media because Penn State is not known for producing OL but he is definitely an exception to the rule.[/quote]

Welcome Scott! I don't think anyone will heckle you more than they do the others. The idea of trading Cooley has been thrown out there the last year or so on this board.

Personally, I think to say Cooley is having a bad year isn't accurate. I agree w/GTripp (another poster here) in that Cooley is having a bad [I]recieving[/I] year, in part due to the new system & McNabb forcing the ball to him. Otherwise, Cooley is blocking better than ever. He used to get dominated by bigger LBs at the line, but he really is one of the most dependable pieces on the OL now. People often forget about the TEs when mentioning the OL, but they're part of it.

I think Cooley is too valuable as a playmaker, blocker & vet leader (by example) to trade. And his contract is good value. Of course, if someone offered multiple high picks it would be foolish not to consider it, but I don't see that happening.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=freddyg12;760449]

I think Cooley is too valuable as a playmaker, blocker & vet leader (by example) to trade. And his contract is good value. Of course, if someone offered multiple high picks it would be foolish not to consider it, but I don't see that happening.[/quote]

I am a fast learner, and I have now learned to fully explain my point to avoid misconception. And thank you for the welcome!

I agree Cooley is very valuable as a player in regards to blocking and helping the OL. I wouldn't say he is having a bad year, just an off year (better describes my opinion). He is a great asset but, IMO, having a good back up behind him does allow some room to move him.

Honestly though, I would be just as apt to go for trading Davis. He will have some value, not as much as Cooley, but his pass play abilities would get a little value (I would guess around a 4th round pick). I just don't think with all the upgrades we need, we should keep two starting caliber TEs on the roster unless they decide to go to two TE sets next season.

:food-smil

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=scott.sharrer;760441]I know I am going to get heckled for this 1) because I am new here, and 2) I am from PA but two things I want to comment on here.

Cooley has been great to our team over the last few years, but something happened to him and he is having an off year. Fred Davis has proven he can step up. Let Cooley go, for a good price (either a 2nd or a 3rd and 4th) and use the picks to build our weak areas.

A player that, unless I missed it, has not been talked about on here that I would like to see us draft is Stefen Wisniewski from Penn State. I have watched him play over the last couple years and he is a beast on the OL. He can play Center really well but his natural position is Guard. Both are weak points on our OL. I have seen him run downfield on screens and lay people out. He has good speed for a OL, great strength and a really good football mind. He gets overlooked a lot in regards to national media because Penn State is not known for producing OL but he is definitely an exception to the rule.[/quote]

You've had some really solid posts to start here. Good to see. It's been a lonnnnng time since we've added quality members

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;760455]You've had some really solid posts to start here. Good to see. It's been a lonnnnng time since we've added quality members[/quote]

Thank you. I have followed the Redskins for nearly 30 years. I was an analyst in the Navy for 8, so I am highly prone to do research before making any statements.

I know this is off topic, but I have a new blog (it will be a running blog) going at xanga.com. The running blog is titled "A truthful look at the History of the Washington Redskins". Do a search by my name there and you will find it. The research for it took me 6 months.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

Yahoo's top 30 FA list:

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Ar1.PzrVOMIjRlwXfgL7lCpDubYF?slug=jc-freeagents111810]Top 30 free agents in class of 2011 - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/url]

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

if you thnk we should draft anything but OL in the first ound...ur nuts. 1st...RT....2nd...C....draft a QB in 2012 draft

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

You don't need to draft an OL if there's not a good one where you're picking just to say you drafted an OL in the first round.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=scott.sharrer;760441]I know I am going to get heckled for this 1) because I am new here, and 2) I am from PA but two things I want to comment on here.

Cooley has been great to our team over the last few years, but something happened to him and he is having an off year. Fred Davis has proven he can step up. Let Cooley go, for a good price (either a 2nd or a 3rd and 4th) and use the picks to build our weak areas.

A player that, unless I missed it, has not been talked about on here that I would like to see us draft is Stefen Wisniewski from Penn State. I have watched him play over the last couple years and he is a beast on the OL. He can play Center really well but his natural position is Guard. Both are weak points on our OL. I have seen him run downfield on screens and lay people out. He has good speed for a OL, great strength and a really good football mind. He gets overlooked a lot in regards to national media because Penn State is not known for producing OL but he is definitely an exception to the rule.[/quote]

I agree with you - Cooley is the first name that comes to mind when I think of players to trade. Truly, I would consider trading every single player we could, except Trent Williams, to stockpile picks. Unfortunately, that list is short.

Landry is great, but if we could trade him and draft a starting OL, I'd do it. Same goes for Orakpo. They're great players and they're going to be even better, but they are worthless if we have no lines.

The lines should be #1 priority. Use every draft pick on linemen, hire a panel of experts, bribe people -- whatever they have to do, I don't care. Nothing else should matter more, IMO.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

Why RT in the first when it is our OG and C that are getting abused every week. We already have a draft pick invested in our current RT and no OG or C need to be drafted in the first round. first round pick should be used on Skill position player or another Orakpo or a QB to groom.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

With the issues the team currently has at so many different positions, I feel the Skins need to just start drafting the best available player regardless of position. We certainly aren't stacked anywhere, so it wouldn't hurt. I few players I feel could be great for us but in no particular order are:

Nick Fairley DT Auburn. That guy is a beast and would look good at DE.

Nate Solder OT Colorado. He's a 6'9" converted TE. He has the athleticism to play in the zone/one cut rushing scheme.

Rodney Hudson G/C FSU. He lacks size, but is agile/quick and has been a long time starter for the Seminoles.

Marvin Austin DT UNC. I don't know how far he'll drop due to his getting kicked of the team at UNC, but his skills are many. If he falls pretty far, might be worth taking a shot at.

Stefen Wisniewski C/G PSU. Previous poster spelled it out pretty well.

Phil Taylor DT Baylor. He transferred from PSU due to lack of PT. He's massive at 6'4" 340 and would be a good fit in our 3-4 as a later round pick.

Leonard Hankerson WR Miami. Has excellent size and has been very productive at the U. We haven't had much luck with drafting wr's lately though so I'm not too excited by the idea of taking one very early.

Alex Wujack LB UMD. I don't know that he'll blow anyone away with his measurables, but I'd love to see him as an ILB wearing Burgandy and Gold. At 6'3" 250, he has pretty good size and is a tackling machine.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;760525]I agree with you - Cooley is the first name that comes to mind when I think of players to trade. Truly, I would consider trading every single player we could, except Trent Williams, to stockpile picks. Unfortunately, that list is short.

Landry is great, but if we could trade him and draft a starting OL, I'd do it. Same goes for Orakpo. They're great players and they're going to be even better, but they are worthless if we have no lines.

The lines should be #1 priority. Use every draft pick on linemen, hire a panel of experts, bribe people -- whatever they have to do, I don't care. Nothing else should matter more, IMO.[/quote]

Cooley is by no means over the hill but he's in his 7th season, no spring chicken by nfl standards. He's got some good years left, maybe 3-4 more w/60+ catches or so. But he's not likely to go for any higher than a 4th round pick. I really question the value of trading him unless someone were to make an offer we couldn't refuse.

His contract isn't an issue for us, is it?

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=scott.sharrer;760453]I am a fast learner, and I have now learned to fully explain my point to avoid misconception. And thank you for the welcome!

I agree Cooley is very valuable as a player in regards to blocking and helping the OL. I wouldn't say he is having a bad year, just an off year (better describes my opinion). He is a great asset but, IMO, having a good back up behind him does allow some room to move him.

Honestly though, I would be just as apt to go for trading Davis. He will have some value, not as much as Cooley, but his pass play abilities would get a little value (I would guess around a 4th round pick). I just don't think with all the upgrades we need, we should keep two starting caliber TEs on the roster unless they decide to go to two TE sets next season.

:food-smil[/quote]

I agree with everything you said but some things that you can't disregard are -- Cooley is popular with players, coaches, and fans ; and has good character; and has been one of the faces of the team since he was drafted (and one of the last few that you can count on to continue to represent the team).

All of these off field factors matter as much as (or maybe moreso than) anything that transpires with him on the field.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=warriorzpath;760589]I agree with everything you said but some things that you can't disregard are -- Cooley is popular with players, coaches, and fans ; and has good character; and has been one of the faces of the team since he was drafted (and one of the last few that you can count on to continue to represent the team).

All of these off field factors matter as much as (or maybe moreso than) anything that transpires with him on the field.[/quote]

I didn't even mention all that in my earlier post, but was thinking it too. A lot of Skins fans would be upset if he were traded. Aside from that you list a lot of other attributes that are good for the team.

Aside from his popularity, I think he's still too valuable to an offense that doesn't have many weapons. We've all been yearning for he & Davis to line up in 2TE sets but Davis isn't getting the reps & calls that Cooley has. There may be a no. of reasons for that, but Cooley is still the starter.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

We all keep asking for it, but the truth is that the game today is moving towards more spread out sets, not this max protect, 22 personnel stuff. I think we can safely conclude that we will not be seeing Cooley AND Davis on the field at the same time with any sort of regularity. We have a true lack of talent on the offensive side of the ball this year, if there was ever a time to get both of them out there, this would be it... and it's not happening.

Was anyone else surprised by how sluggish Davis looked on that long pass against the Eagles? Hopefully he doesn't become the third 'Skin with "cardiovascular issues."

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=freddyg12;760579]Cooley is by no means over the hill but he's in his 7th season, no spring chicken by nfl standards. He's got some good years left, maybe 3-4 more w/60+ catches or so. But he's not likely to go for any higher than a 4th round pick. I really question the value of trading him unless someone were to make an offer we couldn't refuse.

His contract isn't an issue for us, is it?[/quote]

I don't know the details of his contract, but I'm in the position where I think if we could get a starting lineman (defense or offense) for Cooley, then that's just something we need more. The question I ask myself is: would I trade Cooley for a starting lineman? Would I trade those 60+ catches per year for running lanes and pass protection, or sacks and stuffs? Yes. Same goes for any other player on the team worth trading that is not a lineman.

I agree that Cooley wouldn't demand high picks in a trade, but I think it's possible to get a starter in the 4th, so I'd do it. Multiple picks would be nice though, like 4th and 5th, because that could turn into two starters. However, BB brought up a good point about Gonzales getting a 2nd. I don't think it would happen for Cooley, but it does indicate the market a bit.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

Why don't we use Cooley or Davis or both in a manner much like the Colts use Dallas Clark. Either Cooley or Davis would be an upgrade over Galloway. Would be a much more versatile offense if you think about it. But what do I know lol...

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

[quote=Terpfan76;760571]With the issues the team currently has at so many different positions, I feel the Skins need to just start drafting the best available player regardless of position. We certainly aren't stacked anywhere, so it wouldn't hurt. I few players I feel could be great for us but in no particular order are:

...

Leonard Hankerson WR Miami. Has excellent size and has been very productive at the U. We haven't had much luck with drafting wr's lately though so I'm not too excited by the idea of taking one very early.

[/quote]

I agree about Hankerson. He's extremely physical, shown big play ability, and is great after the catch. He's played well on a poor team with a terrible QB and is often double teamed. He will be very good in the NFL. I've dreamt about him being a late round Redskins pick. He could be very much like Brandon Marshall was for Shanny in Denver, and hopefully, he wouldn't punch a TV.

Re: 2011 NFL Draft
 

Does anyone know what the best draft websites are? I'm not asking for the websites that you guys agree with, no offense but I have no idea who is a good evaluator of talent on this site. I'm talking about the websites that have the highest percentage of evaluating talent. I feel like there should be statistics about this on the internet, but I couldnt find any.