Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

Well, their hiring process is ridiculous and drawn out so it's not crazy to assume their firing process is as well. The union makes things sticky too.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=cpayne5;807709]Here's an article that touches the subject...
[URL="http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2007/sep/05/mcain-federal/"]PolitiFact | Firing federal workers is difficult[/URL][/quote]

Thanks that was helpful.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]My brother used to work for a larger engineering firm in the DC area. It wasnt a huge fortune 500 company but it wasnt a small company by any means. Firing someone there was also extremely difficult because they basically determined they would rather pay for a bad employee then take their chances in court or have a civil suit affect their name. He told me a story of this extremely obese lady who was a horrible employee. After years of people wanting to get rid of her she was about to be fired when she was tipped off by another lady in the company. She went home sick that day and immediately filed for disability due to her obesity. The company was too scared to fire her while she was on disability, so they couldn’t do anything until she came back like a year later. I guess my thoughts are its hard for govt to fire people but its can also be hard for large companies to fire people even if for different reasons. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Mattyk;807438]There are incompetent, overpaid and lazy folks in just about every line of work. Why do gov't employees specifically get people so fired up??[/quote]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Because we are forced to pay for them no matter how much hate their services or products. If you hate the customer service you get when you call Dell you can buy an Apple. If you think the nuggets at McDonalds suck you can go to Wendys. If you hate dealing with the DMV, IRS, VDOT or other government agencies you cant do anything but keep paying….. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

The girl who left my office and the reason I started this thread died Friday and I was pretty shocked as she was only 48. From what I heard she had not been feeling well and finally on Thursday she got so bad they took her to the hospital where she went directly on to life support. Some kind of a virus got her and was shutting down her organs.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;806868]LOL. No my wife did the ad and it was in the local paper. We tried Craigs list and only had few response from people who made my spelling and grammer look first class.[/quote]

Thank you for having a sense of humor!! Refreshing.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;812544]The girl who left my office and the reason I started this thread died Friday and I was pretty shocked as she was only 48. From what I heard she had not been feeling well and finally on Thursday she got so bad they took her to the hospital where she went directly on to life support. Some kind of a virus got her and was shutting down her organs.[/quote]

That's terrible. RIP

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

I wonder who has it the hardest. Being younger I've seen the worst part of looking for work being everyone asking for experience. Especially the "entry level" jobs that sometimes ask for two years of RELEVANT work experience. However at the same time I see old timers complaining about how qualified they are for positions yet they keep getting beat out by kids that according to them "don't have enough experience."

I have a decent part time job now and I have a great lead on an outside sales position with a major corporation and maybe even a second company if that falls through but I'm pretty sure that without my connections I would be dead in the water on both opportunities. Probably would have been worse if I didn't come from a financially well off family.

One things for sure though. Possibly the worst part of looking for a job is interviewing well for a position, people telling you how much they like you then all of a sudden you don't hear from them for a week or two, or in the case of a position I flew in to interview for outside DC, a sudden hiring freeze the next day. They apparently liked me a lot as well. However that one might have been a blessing in disguise. Pay looked great on paper and number wise was about what I expected to get in the Southeast, but as most of you know DC is expensive. Factor in cost of living and the difference in pay was about $12,000.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

So I'm interviewing this lady yesterday for a job when her cell phone rings and she answers it. My first reaction was whay did she have her cell phone on and why did she answer the phone The interview had gone pretty well up until that part and it really turn me off. I'll have to add that my wife had done the main interview and I was doing the what we are looking for and need part of the interview. We were pretty much done but the interview was still going on when she answered the phone. My wife thinks I'm making too much out of this. What do you guys think?

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

Maybe she accidentally left her phone on. But no reason for her to answer it. Unless, beforehand she was like listen "my mother is very ill at the hospital, and I may be getting a phone call..." or something like that it's pretty inexcusable.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

Depends on who was calling.

Typically I'd say leaving your phone on during an interview would be a huge no-no. But perhaps she has a sick kid or something?

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

Unless it is a case like SS or Matty mentioned, anything other than her hitting ignore and either turning the phone off or putting it on silent would have ended with a "thank you, don't call us, we won't call you."

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

Sorry I left that out. It was her husband and not an important call. She did tell him she was in an interview and would call him back. The phone rang again and she did not answer it but why the hell would she have left it on.

SS- If she left it on by accident or said she had an emergency and needed to leave on her phone I'd have no problem with that. Just not the case.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Mattyk;824537]Depends on who was calling.

Typically I'd say leaving your phone on during an interview would be a huge no-no. But perhaps she has a sick kid or something?[/quote]

If she said that up front, then no problem. Aside from that though, PEACE.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;824542]Sorry I left that out. It was her husband and not an important call. She did tell him she was in an interview and would call him back. The phone rang again and she did not answer it but why the hell would she have left it on.

SS- If she left it on by accident or said she had an emergency and needed to leave on her phone I'd have no problem with that. Just not the case.[/quote]

Yep. Shows a lack of judgment. NEXT.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Schneed10;824544]Yep. Shows a lack of judgment. NEXT.[/quote]
Yea, I know but finding next has not been that easy.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;824542]Sorry I left that out. It was her husband and not an important call. She did tell him she was in an interview and would call him back. The phone rang again and she did not answer it but why the hell would she have left it on.

SS- If she left it on by accident or said she had an emergency and needed to leave on her phone I'd have no problem with that. Just not the case.[/quote]

I think you can figure this one out on your own. Seems like an easy decision.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;824549]Yea, I know but finding next has not been that easy.[/quote]

Can I work from home or tele-commute. I can be overcompensated and lazy from anywhere and am highly qualified. I'll try not to let my current job get in the way, but from judging by your current applicants I should have just as good of a chance and may even preform better not being there.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Mattyk;824551]I think you can figure this one out on your own. Seems like an easy decision.[/quote]
I know. Cell phones get on my nerves to start with so I was just making sure my distain for them was not clouding my judgement. I actually don't hate cell phones I hate the rude use of them.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;824564]I know. Cell phones get on my nerves to start with so I was just making sure my distain for them was not clouding my judgement. [B]I actually don't hate cell phones I hate the rude use of them[/B].[/quote]

I agree.

When her phone rang the 2nd time I would have ended the interview.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

speaking of which, I'm newly out of the air force and looking now ;) BS in comp sci (summa cum laude) 210 credits at a 3.96, military experience, avionics, pro audio on multiple world tours, lots of volunteer hours and all that ;)

had something lined up, but they got a new super and everything kinda changed. I'll probably end up disappearing into IT/def con/3 letter agency/intel hell, but if you know someone, feel free to let me know.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Schneed10;806696]If you're interested in building anything resembling a meaningful career, the worst thing you can do is stay out of work for an extended period of time.

To prospective employers, the longer you're out of work the worse you're regarded. It says that you either haven't been able to beat out others for available jobs (you're not that good) or that you haven't been looking very hard (that you don't care).[/quote]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]If Obama's lastest jobs bill passes as is i will be able to now sue Schneed if he doesnt hire me for taking my dream sabbatical.....[/FONT][/COLOR]

[URL="http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/obama-proposes-letting-jobless-sue-discrimination-191042168.html"]Obama proposes letting the jobless sue for discrimination | The Lookout - Yahoo! News[/URL]

fd did you hire the cell phone lady or anyone else yet? Do you use the phrase "jobless need not apply" on [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]your grocery store bulletin board ads?[/FONT][/COLOR]

thatguy have you been able to find a job yet? You sound like a pretty well rounded and qualified "guy".

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=mlmpetert;841879][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]If Obama's lastest jobs bill passes as is i will be able to now sue Schneed if he doesnt hire me for taking my dream sabbatical.....[/FONT][/COLOR]

[URL="http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/obama-proposes-letting-jobless-sue-discrimination-191042168.html"]Obama proposes letting the jobless sue for discrimination | The Lookout - Yahoo! News[/URL]

fd did you hire the cell phone lady or anyone else yet? Do you use the phrase "jobless need not apply" on [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]your grocery store bulletin board ads?[/FONT][/COLOR]

thatguy have you been able to find a job yet? You sound like a pretty well rounded and qualified "guy".[/quote]

Wow. Interesting idea on legislation. If it ever passes I would certainly follow the law.

But imagine the number of lawsuits that would stem from this. Talk about a drain. I'd probably err on the side of caution to avoid even the potential of getting the company sued - so if I had two candidates, one unemployed and the other employed, as long as they were even remotely close in qualification I would certainly opt for the unemployed. I think a lot of hiring managers would do the same.

This would act as a form of affirmative action for the unemployed. Maybe that's what Obama wants, but I hate the concept. Hiring should be blind to need, it should be based entirely on what's best for the company hiring.

But like I said, I'm interested in doing the right thing. Even though I hope it doesn't become law, I'd certainly abide if it does.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

This just shows how much Obama lacks understanding business and the real world.

Democratic lawmakers in both the House and the Senate have introduced similar measures. Obama said recently that discrimination against the unemployed makes [B]"absolutely no sense[/B]," especially because many people find themselves out of work through no fault of their own.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;841913]This just shows how much Obama lacks understanding business and the real world.

Democratic lawmakers in both the House and the Senate have introduced similar measures. Obama said recently that discrimination against the unemployed makes [B]"absolutely no sense[/B]," especially because many people find themselves out of work through no fault of their own.[/quote]

Your post lacked a little substance around that, but I see where you are going. He's right, many people lost jobs because an entire company went under, or it suffered so badly in the downturn that it had to cut so deep that they had to lay off even very good employees.

But many does not equate to most. [U]Most (not all)[/U] of those laid off from work were laid off by companies looking to trim costs. When making cuts, companies might cut 5 or 10% of the workforce. To decide who stays and who goes, they go through a basic cost benefit type of thinking. "Management has told me to cut $60,000 in salaries. I could cut Frank and Bill who make $30,000 each. Or I could just cut John who makes $60,000."

If Frank and Bill combined are more productive and useful than John, then Frank and Bill stay. If John alone is more useful than Frank and Bill, then he stays.

So usefulness comes into the thought process. The whole point of layoffs is to reduce costs while maintaining as much capability and productivity as possible. So for those chosen as layoff victims, there's often a usefulness problem. That's where the stigma comes from, and rightly so.

Now, AGAIN, this is the case for most but not all. Obama's trying to do right by those [B]good[/B] employees laid off by no fault of their own. But in doing so he gives the rest of the unemployed a reason to reject the notion that maybe they were laid off because of relative ineffectiveness. And it will all come along with nuisance lawsuits.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Schneed10;841908]This would act as a form of affirmative action for the unemployed. Maybe that's what Obama wants, but I hate the concept. [B]Hiring should be blind to need, it should be based entirely on what's best for the company hiring.[/B]
[/quote]

[COLOR=black]Yeah id like to say its un-American, but Im starting to realize that while that may have been true 50+ years ago it may no longer be, for reasons that are arguably better or worse.[/COLOR]

[COLOR=black]Its also definitely a political thing. If come reelection Obama can say I tried to do many things to get the American people back to work, and cite this as a example, but the Republican Congress has shown they would rather play politics and keep Americans out of work and at home then to compromise. Although Obama may also truly feel the un-employed should be an addition to the protected classes of people. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=black]In this recession and in any other recession I completely agree that many people lost their jobs through no direct fault of their own, but America was founded on the principle that our country offers the pursuit of happiness to everyone, but not a guarantee. Maybe just the promise of a pursuit is a outdated concept, either way im never for discriminating against one group of people so that another group may benefit. [/COLOR]

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Schneed10;841920]Your post lacked a little substance around that, but I see where you are going. He's right, many people lost jobs because an entire company went under, or it suffered so badly in the downturn that it had to cut so deep that they had to lay off even very good employees.

But many does not equate to most. [U]Most (not all)[/U] of those laid off from work were laid off by companies looking to trim costs. When making cuts, companies might cut 5 or 10% of the workforce. To decide who stays and who goes, they go through a basic cost benefit type of thinking. "Management has told me to cut $60,000 in salaries. I could cut Frank and Bill who make $30,000 each. Or I could just cut John who makes $60,000."

If Frank and Bill combined are more productive and useful than John, then Frank and Bill stay. If John alone is more useful than Frank and Bill, then he stays.

So usefulness comes into the thought process. The whole point of layoffs is to reduce costs while maintaining as much capability and productivity as possible. So for those chosen as layoff victims, there's often a usefulness problem. That's where the stigma comes from, and rightly so.

Now, AGAIN, this is the case for most but not all. Obama's trying to do right by those [B]good[/B] employees laid off by no fault of their own. But in doing so he gives the rest of the unemployed a reason to reject the notion that maybe they were laid off because of relative ineffectiveness. And it will all come along with nuisance lawsuits.[/quote]

The problem I have with what Obama said was the highlight part, [B]"absolutely no sense[/B]," So by saying that he thinks that 100% of the people unemployeed are hard at work looking for a new job and its just bad luck they have been without work for a few years.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[B][/B]i think what he is trying to say is that the people [B][B]that are willing to work[/B][/B]....it makes no sense. i guess interpretation is everything

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;841978]The problem I have with what Obama said was the highlight part, [B]"absolutely no sense[/B]," So by saying that he thinks that 100% of the people unemployeed are hard at work looking for a new job and its just bad luck they have been without work for a few years.[/quote]

I think your interpretation of his meaning is incorrect.

"Absolutely no sense" does not mean that he necessarily believes that 100% of unemployed people want to find a job. I think what he was getting at was that allowing any type of discrimination against the unemployed makes no sense because it defeats any efforts aimed at getting them back to work.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

I dont know i could it being interpretation either or both ways:

Sybil Wilkes, a co-host of the "Tom Joyner Morning Show," asked the president about long-term unemployment and businesses that tell applicants, "If you're unemployed, we don't want to hear from you."

Obama noted that the long-term unemployed have a tougher time landing jobs and said a stronger overall economy would make employers less choosy. "But we have seen instances in which employers are explicitly saying we don't want to take a look at folks who've been unemployed," the president said.

"Well, that makes absolutely no sense, and I know there's legislation that I'm supportive of that says you cannot discriminate against folks because they've been unemployed, particularly when you've seen so many folks who, through no fault of their own, ended up being laid off because of the difficulty of this recession."


[URL="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/30/obama-jobless-discrimination_n_942359.html"]Obama: Discrimination Against Jobless 'Makes Absolutely No Sense'[/URL]

Im in favor of what NJ is doing where you cant say "jobless need not apply", but to essentially give affirmative action status to the unemployed makes absolutely no sense to a guy like me.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=Schneed10;842036]I think your interpretation of his meaning is incorrect.

"Absolutely no sense" does not mean that he necessarily believes that 100% of unemployed people want to find a job. I think what he was getting at was that allowing any type of discrimination against the unemployed makes no sense because it defeats any efforts aimed at getting them back to work.[/quote]

Well if he is wanting to pass a law making it illegal then he thinks something along those lines.

Re: I thought So Many People Where Looking For Work
 

[quote=firstdown;842184]Well if he is wanting to pass a law making it illegal then he thinks something along those lines.[/quote]

Well it's ridiculous to think that most people don't want to work. Collecting unemployment is OK but you don't end up collecting more on unemployment than you were paid by the job you were laid off from. Few people want to continue experiencing that lower pay rate, most want to get back to earning what they did before being laid off.

You're right, there are some people that don't. But that's not the issue, and it's not true that MOST don't want to work. Obama just wants to make sure employers don't freeze the long term unemployed out of the workforce.

Again, I don't agree with that in the least, just clarifying his position for you.