Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;1110493]Agree 100%![/quote]unless the wr has a bigger impact than jerry rice; i agree 100%.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=SirLK26;1110489]At the same time, where Watt was drafted tells you we can trade back and still get an elite player.[/quote]ding ding ding

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

All I can say is trading UP did not help us!

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[QUOTE=los panda;1110494]unless the wr has a bigger impact than jerry rice; i agree 100%.[/QUOTE]

To me that kind of thinking is really short sighted. In two years, our WR corps will be In need of a complete rework. If Cooper is there, he could be a WR1 for years to come.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1110478]As soon as I get out of this meeting I will explain my side[/quote]

Don't shoot from the hip Quake, it's not a good look. Put some thought into your posts, you're a bright dude so I know you can bring it, you just tend to post before thinking about what you're saying.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1110499]To me that kind of thinking is really short sighted. In two years, our WR corps will be In need of a complete rework. If Cooper is there, he could be a WR1 for years to come.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk[/quote]short sighted as in garcon and jackson won't turn 30 until the 2017 season...

um, ok i kept my sights 3+ years into the future instead of 2...

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

and at the same time i agree 100% about your cooper comment.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

In 2016 Garcon and D. Jax cost ~20M in cap charges. Having a guy who can step in as a WR1 (like Cooper) for 500k makes gives us a lot of flexibility.

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Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1110504]In 2016 Garcon and D. Jax cost ~20M in cap charges. Having a guy who can step in as a WR1 (like Cooper) for 500k makes gives us a lot of flexibility.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk[/quote]i thought you meant from an age stand point, my bad j-red, you're right.

they can't get any younger, but they can restructure/renegotiate.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[url=http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/165599/amari-cooper-kevin-white-could-give-redskins-trade-options-in-draft]Amari Cooper, Kevin White may give Washington Redskins trade options - NFL Nation - ESPN[/url]

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1110499]To me that kind of thinking is really short sighted. In two years, our WR corps will be In need of a complete rework. If Cooper is there, he could be a WR1 for years to come.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk[/quote]

If Scot has Cooper as his highest-rated player without input from Bruce, your argument is a very good one. BPA thinking for the long-term.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

I want and hope they pick Fowler or Beasly. An ideal situation would be to trade back a spot with the Jets and add an extra 3rd rounder and still get Fowler or Beasly. A few other trade back scenarios i would like to see us if Clevsland wanted to jump to #5 and gives up their 2 first rounders. Or if SD trades us Rivers and their 1st and something else for the 5th pick. Other than that i hope they stay in the top 10.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

I don't want no stinkin' WR at #5. I'd rather trade down than take a WR.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1110522]I don't want no stinkin' WR at #5. I'd rather trade down than take a WR.[/quote]


I agree, take Stephon Diggs in the 3rd/4th round- use the high picks on LM /OLB

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

I think best case scenario is Leonard Williams falls to us at 5. damn beast

[url=http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft2015/story/_/page/hotread150401/versatile-usc-defensive-lineman-leonard-williams-persevered-become-top-draft-prospect]Versatile USC defensive lineman Leonard Williams persevered to become top draft prospect[/url]

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

Top WRs last season and where they were drafted:

1. Antonio Brown (6th rd)
2. Demaryius Thomas (1st rd, 22nd pick)
3. Julio Jones (1st rd, 6th pick)
4. Jordy Nelson (2nd rd)
5. Emmanuel Sanders (3rd rd)
6. TY Hilton (3rd rd)
7. Golden Tate (2nd rd)
8. Dez Bryant (1st rd, 24th pick)
9. Jeremy Maclin (1st rd, 19th pick)
10. Odell Beckham Jr. (1st rd, 12 pick)

Given Scot McC's reputation of being an excellent talent evaluator, I think he can find a starting caliber WRs in the later rounds.

I don't think taking a WR at #5 is terrible; however, referring to a question JoeRedskins posted not too long ago, I'd rather have a safe pick in an area of need. I feel that taking a WR that high, you are taking them with the idea that they'd become a dominant playmaker. I don't think our team's fortunes can be turned around with one playmaker.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1110525]Top WRs last season and where they were drafted:

1. Antonio Brown (6th rd)
2. Demaryius Thomas (1st rd, 22nd pick)
3. Julio Jones (1st rd, 6th pick)
4. Jordy Nelson (2nd rd)
5. Emmanuel Sanders (3rd rd)
6. TY Hilton (3rd rd)
7. Golden Tate (2nd rd)
8. Dez Bryant (1st rd, 24th pick)
9. Jeremy Maclin (1st rd, 19th pick)
10. Odell Beckham Jr. (1st rd, 12 pick)

Given Scot McC's reputation of being an excellent talent evaluator, I think he can find a starting caliber WRs in the later rounds.

I don't think taking a WR at #5 is terrible; however, referring to a question JoeRedskins posted not too long ago, I'd rather have a safe pick in an area of need. I feel that taking a WR that high, you are taking them with the idea that they'd become a dominant playmaker. I don't think our team's fortunes can be turned around with one playmaker.[/quote]

McCloughan is known as being an excellent talent evaluator partly because of the results he gets by simply taking the best player available. If he believes Cooper or White are BPA when we pick at 5, he'll pounce on it.

He doesn't sit there and say oh I can find a WR later in the draft. He picks the best player, regardless of need.

And thus he hits on late rounders. If a WR isn't BPA when we pick in the late rounds, he won't take one.

It has to be blind to position. Best football player, period. That's all that matters.

You fill needs in free agency. In the draft you stock your core with the best possible guys you can find.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1110522]I don't want no stinkin' WR at #5. I'd rather trade down than take a WR.[/quote]

I agree. If it were me, I'd trade down or, lacking a good trade partner, take Fowler. Our hotshot young receiver would have no one to throw to him, as things stand now.

But the WR argument is not as bad as some make it to be. It makes football sense in the salary cap era.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Irrefutable;1110523]I agree, take Stephon Diggs in the 3rd/4th round- use the high picks on LM /OLB[/quote]

Diggs was a disappointment at Maryland. Never lived up to the hype. Has the talent though.

I'd prefer to take Tyler Lockett. Big time production at wr and punt returner. I watched a few K. State games (Baylor, UCLA and TCU) cause I was betting. Could not believe how ridiculous this kid was. Reminds me of a younger Deshawn Jackson except maybe better. He'll go in the mid rounds and it will be a steal.

This is why taking wr's high IMO is a waste. Always can find good value in the later rounds.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Schneed10;1110526]McCloughan is known as being an excellent talent evaluator partly because of the results he gets by simply taking the best player available. If he believes Cooper or White are BPA when we pick at 5, he'll pounce on it.

He doesn't sit there and say oh I can find a WR later in the draft. He picks the best player, regardless of need.

And thus he hits on late rounders. If a WR isn't BPA when we pick in the late rounds, he won't take one.

It has to be blind to position. Best football player, period. That's all that matters.

You fill needs in free agency. In the draft you stock your core with the best possible guys you can find.[/quote]

SM himself said that need factors into his draft day decisions. For the true BPA on his board to be selected, that player would either play a position of need or be considered by SM to be a much better player than the next player on his list who does play a position of need.

In this draft, if SM considers an OLB or OL to be close in ability to a WR, I don't think SM would take the WR. If SM believes that a WR is a much better player than an OLB or OL, then I think he would take the WR.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1110532]Diggs was a disappointment at Maryland. Never lived up to the hype. Has the talent though.

I'd prefer to take Tyler Lockett. Big time production at wr and punt returner. I watched a few K. State games (Baylor, UCLA and TCU) cause I was betting. Could not believe how ridiculous this kid was. Reminds me of a younger Deshawn Jackson except maybe better. He'll go in the mid rounds and it will be a steal.

This is why taking wr's high IMO is a waste. Always can find good value in the later rounds.[/quote]

Diggs had an inaccurate QB and a piss-poor Offensive Coordinator. He has big play ability. I think he's underrated and will surprise.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Lotus;1110528]I agree. If it were me, I'd trade down or, lacking a good trade partner, take Fowler. Our hotshot young receiver would have no one to throw to him, as things stand now.

But the WR argument is not as bad as some make it to be. It makes football sense in the salary cap era.[/quote]

If Fowler were on the board, there is no way I'd trade down. I would take him. I think Fowler will be a stud in the NFL. Also, from what I've read about Fowler, he seems to be just the kind of player SM loves to have on his team.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Lotus;1110518]If Scot has Cooper as his highest-rated player without input from Bruce, your argument is a very good one. BPA thinking for the long-term.[/quote]

Any chance you can set aside your BA hatred for the rest of the offseason. You are a great poster here, and I think everyone here knows your done 50 times over with BA, your sig says it all. But, going forward, let's let the actions speak to the new climate at Redskins Park. If - at the end of this year - BA has proven to be a road block to progress then we can rant together against him, but he's here for this year, and it's just tiring to see the consistent rant.

Just a thought, Thanks for your consideration of the point.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1110539]Any chance you can set aside your BA hatred for the rest of the offseason. You are a great poster here, and I think everyone here knows your done 50 times over with BA, your sig says it all. But, going forward, let's let the actions speak to the new climate at Redskins Park. [B]If - at the end of this year - BA has proven to be a road block to progress then we can rant together against him,[/B] but he's here for this year, and it's just tiring to see the consistent rant.

Just a thought, Thanks for your consideration of the point.[/quote]

I hear your point my friend.

BA already has a five year track record of being a road block to progress. I respectfully offer that your very post shows lack of awareness of this fact, so there is reason for me to bring up the point.

But, since my views are so unpopular, I'll make sure not to mention Bruce.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Lotus;1110540]I hear your point my friend.

BA already has a five year track record of being a road block to progress. I respectfully offer that your very post shows lack of awareness of this fact, so there is reason for me to bring up the point.

But, since my views are so unpopular, I'll make sure not to mention Bruce.[/quote]

I just don't think it's that the views are unpopular, I have very little feelings one way or the other if he is here or not. Being the contrarian I am I know that I have sided with him in dialogs with you, but if he were gone I wouldn't be crying. It's mainly that we have the cards we've been dealt for the season, and that does include BA in some vague Presidency role, for better or for worse.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1110536]Diggs had an inaccurate QB and a piss-poor Offensive Coordinator. He has big play ability. I think he's underrated and will surprise.[/quote]

I do agree, Diggs does have ability and the QB situation didn't help him. I just think this kid from K State is better.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

^I like their QB as a late rounder.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1110542]I do agree, Diggs does have ability and the QB situation didn't help him. I just think this kid from K State is better.[/quote]

I was just commenting on your point that he was a disappointment. I didn't see him as a disappointment. I think that he wasn't able to express his talent as well as he could have in better circumstances.

I have no idea which of the two WR's you mentioned is better. I'll take your word for it.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

Marcus Mariota I just have a gut feeling

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1110504]In 2016 Garcon and D. Jax cost ~20M in cap charges. Having a guy who can step in as a WR1 (like Cooper) for 500k makes gives us a lot of flexibility.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk[/quote] We can draft a wr second, third, or even fourth round. Not to mention, Cooper doesn't have the size to warrant being drafted that high. We got way to many holes on this team to invest the 5th overall into a wr. We got to go pass rusher.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

The Fowler Kool-Aid runneth within me

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

I know "draft a receiver at #5" is one of the most popular "out-on-a-limb" statements among Skins fans this offseason, but I would be beyond surprised if it happened. Everyone acts like Scot means purely the most talented player available when he says "BPA", but I don't think that's what he means. He's going to take the most talented player available who also makes the biggest impact. Is that player going to be a receiver when there's such a great group of pass rushers available? If he stays at #5, the answer is almost certainly no.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

IF they are both there, which one do you take?
I like Beasley's sack totals and 'had at least one sack in eight consecutive games from 2013 (2) to 2014 (6).' That kind of production is hard to beat.
But Fowler's size, strength and kick anyones ass physicality is as close to can't miss as you can get.
I would be happy with either one.

[url=http://www.clemsontigers.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=28500&ATCLID=205529390]Vic Beasley Biography - Clemson Tigers Official Athletics Site[/url]

[url=http://www.gatorzone.com/football/bios.php?year=2012&player_id=334]Dante Fowler, Jr. - 2012 Gator Football Roster - GatorZone.com[/url]

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Defensewins;1110708]IF they are both there, which one do you take?
I like Beasley's sack totals and 'had at least one sack in eight consecutive games from 2013 (2) to 2014 (6).' That kind of production is hard to beat.
But Fowler's size, strength and kick anyones ass physicality is as close to can't miss as you can get.
I would be happy with either one.

[url=http://www.clemsontigers.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=28500&ATCLID=205529390]Vic Beasley Biography - Clemson Tigers Official Athletics Site[/url]

[url=http://www.gatorzone.com/football/bios.php?year=2012&player_id=334]Dante Fowler, Jr. - 2012 Gator Football Roster - GatorZone.com[/url][/quote]

Same height. Weights listed at 235 and 277.

Not saying it can't be done but 235 is not a lot of ham to stop an off tackle run.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=DYoungJelly;1110709]Same height. Weights listed at 235 and 277.

Not saying it can't be done but 235 is not a lot of ham to stop an off tackle run.[/quote]

Beasley weighed in at 246 in February NFL Combine. He'll probably be even bigger and stronger by start of Trainning Camp, still months away. Neither of these two (Beasley or Fowler) have ever been man handled much, not sure why any scout brings it up? Probably just trying to invent a possible weakness for two guys that have few weakness', if any.
Our top 2 OLB's Kerrigan & Trent Murphy are not considered quick first step, SPEED pass rushers. We really do not have one, even at DE. So we have a bit of a need there.
Beasley is more of that quick first step edge speed pass rusher than Fowler. Not taking anything away from Fowler who is rated slightly higher than Beasley overall, because Fowler is both a physical beast and can also rush the passer very well like Kerrigan.
But great defenses like Seattle have both speed edge pass rushers and physical set the edge run stopper to compliment each other. We do not have a speed rusher....yet!
I'll be happy with either Beasley or Fowler.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Defensewins;1110710]Beasley weighed in at 246 in February NFL Combine. He'll probably be even bigger and stronger by start of Trainning Camp, still months away. Neither of these two (Beasley or Fowler) have ever been man handled much, not sure why any scout brings it up? Probably just trying to invent a possible weakness for two guys that have few weakness', if any.
Our top 2 OLB's Kerrigan & Trent Murphy are not considered quick first step, SPEED pass rushers. We really do not have one, even at DE. So we have a bit of a need there.
Beasley is more of that quick first step edge speed pass rusher than Fowler. Not taking anything away from Fowler who is rated slightly higher than Beasley overall, because Fowler is both a physical beast and can also rush the passer very well like Kerrigan.
But great defenses like Seattle have both speed edge pass rushers and physical set the edge run stopper to compliment each other. We do not have a speed rusher....yet!
I'll be happy with either Beasley or Fowler.[/quote]

Any thoughts on how an extra 30 pounds might affect Beasley's game?

Besides the size, Fowler had the versatility to line up all over the place and play well.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

[quote=Defensewins;1110710]
I'll be happy with either Beasley or Fowler.[/quote]

Ditto.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

There's no film on Beasley playing at 246 lbs. That bothers me a little. On the other hand, I think he is a superb athlete with a big time motor. His production is college is unquestioned. But can he be effective carrying that much weight and can he keep his weight up over a 16 game season? He's going to need more power to go against big, talented LOTs in the NFL. Nevertheless, the more film I see on him the more it seems to me like he could do anything on a football field. Worst case, he could be moved to ILB where he would be a beast. But then we wouldn't have the edge rusher we crave.

Fowler has a bigger frame than Beasley. There is plenty of film on him playing at 260 lbs. and dominating people. He seems to have the better build for an NFL 3-4 LB. I have no doubt that he'll be an effective pass rusher in the NFL.

It's a good, tough choice to have between these two players.

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

I wouldn't go 34 OLB at pick 5.

In keeping with BPA none of the pass rushers at 5 rate higher then Cooper or White for me. Heck none of them rate better then Schreff or Waynes ( would prefer to trade down to select one of those 2).

Re: With the 5th pick in the draft the Washington Redskins select...
 

It's funny, everyone talking Fowler and Beasley. How about Shane Ray?