Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Chico23231;1158943]So it was Preston Smith on that play? No surprise. WTF is he even on the field at this point? Trent Murphy should be getting all his playing time.[/quote]

To me that's a coaching failure. Smith has to know his assignment, but the coach's job is to drill it into their head and instill discipline not to miss it. It's not happening.

I fucking hate Joe Barry.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=HailGreen28;1158944]Thought in Breland situation above, if two guys are uncovered, you are
supposed to cover the deep man (Sproles in this case)[/quote]

Would have been a TD either way, if he took Sproles away Wentz would have had the shallow guy open.

Can't make up for a brain fart.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1158945]For the sake of argument only, let's assume that Smith had tried to pick up the man he was assigned on that play. Well, he's too slow and not quick enough to cover anybody anyway.

I said it in another thread and I'll say it again here: the only hope we have of getting any value out of Smith is to have him gain weight and play DE. He's just too slow to play OLB.

That was a terrible 2nd Round pick. On Smith's college tape, it was crystal clear that he lacked quickness and now we know he's just plain slow. That wasted pick is on Scot M. Scot needs to start appreciating speed and quickness a lot more than he seems to now.

Also, I can't think of an NFL team that doesn't have ILB's and saftey's who are faster and quicker than the ones we have. Our ILB's can't cover TE's because they're too slow. Our saftey's can't help the CB's because they're too slow.
[B]
It really doesn't matter whether or not a player knows the playbook or is a good citizen or is nice to his mother if he can't get to where he needs to be to make a play.
[/B]
I'm as sick and tired of our slow-ass ILB's and saftey's, as I am with Smith. We desperately need more speed on defense. Scot needs to find us some people at those positions who can run.[/quote]

Haha I'm with you on that one.

I would say Foster isn't that bad of a coverage guy though, he made some plays.
Not saying he's Luke Kuechly but I really think he's a guy we'd be fine with if guys around him were better (DL, safeties, Compton...).

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1158948]Haha I'm with you on that one.

I would say Foster isn't that bad of a coverage guy though, he made some plays.
Not saying he's Luke Kuechly but I really think he's a guy we'd be fine with if guys around him were better (DL, safeties, Compton...).[/quote]

It's super hard to judge our ILB because our dline line doesn't do there job and allow guys to move to the second level. Oline get to foster and wil too easy.

I think foster is superior to wil...wil just isn't quick enough around the line and can't shed. Cravens should be starting next to foster next year.

Ricky jean has played better since the bye, but we need 2 new starting dlinemen...and Chris baker shouldn't slide inside, keep him at out de. We need a fat mutherfucking badass in the middle.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

I think we win the turnover battle in this one. We force a key turnover in the 4th quarter.

Skins 27
Carolina 23

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Chico23231;1158949][B]It's super hard to judge our ILB because our dline line doesn't do there job and allow guys to move to the second level. Oline get to foster and wil too easy. [/B]

I think foster is superior to wil...wil just isn't quick enough around the line and can't shed. Cravens should be starting next to foster next year.

Ricky jean has played better since the bye, but we need 2 new starting dlinemen...and Chris baker shouldn't slide inside, keep him at out de. We need a fat mutherfucking badass in the middle.[/quote]

Yop, that's why I think DL and safeties really are a priority, because as bad as our defense looks, I'm confident we are just a few pieces away from being a totally decent defense.

A playmaker or 2 at DL, just a solid guy or 2 at safety, and we are contenders imo. I say that being completely aware how bad they look right now.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1158951]Yop, that's why I think DL and safeties really are a priority, because as bad as our defense looks, I'm confident we are just a few pieces away from being a totally decent defense.

A playmaker or 2 at DL, just a solid guy or 2 at safety, and we are contenders imo. I say that being completely aware how bad they look right now.[/quote]

Good post, imo we need a big dominant NT, at least one new safety, and maybe another corner if Breelands not the guy. Some of our young guys will be better next year, Cravens, Fuller, Smith, Ioannidis, could all turn into nice pieces. And if Galette returns we have an athletic pass rusher to rotate in instead of the plodders we have now. We could actually be solid on defense next year

Edit: Oh and of course a new D coordinator is a must

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

Our defense is bad, real bad, but here' something I found interesting...

Q: How do KC (10-3),Oakland (10-3) and Atlanta (8-5) defenses compare?
A: 1) Their Defenses are all rated lower than the 'Skins.
2) They all have fewer sacks than the 'Skins: KC-27, Oak-22, Atl-28
Wash has 34 sacks, 4th in the NFL
3)[B] All have more Interceptions than the 'Skins:[/B] KC-14, Oak-12, Atl-9
Wash has 8
4) [B]They all have more Passes Defended than the 'Skins[/B]
KC-85, Oak-64, Atl-61....Wash has just 54

We get enough sacks & we all know we've missed many other opportunities.

But, we don't Intercept the ball enough & we definitely don't defend the pass strongly enough. So where's the real issue lie?

Is it with our poor Defensive calls (Joe Barry), poor secondary coaching/techniques (Perry Fewell) or is it really just a lack of talent on the Def side (Scott McL)?

I think the real answer is some portion of All of the Above.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1158939]You've been in the Detroit area too long. Or maybe not long enough to know their playoff history. My point is that the Detroit Lions are the choking dogs of NFL playoff football. Of course we would beat them in the playoffs.[/quote]

Times change and so do teams. I moved from
Lanham to Downriver Detroit when I was 4. Lions always blew the close games for decades, now they win them. Last time we beat the Lions was when Zorn was the HC I believe. Times change there bud. You better hope for a Lions' victory this weekend or this whole discussion is moot. I don't see 3 teams from the east making it, unless the
Buccaneers really take a dive. Still
I would love the Skins to get redemption beating the Lions in a rematch!!!!!

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158956]Our defense is bad, real bad, but here' something I found interesting...

Q: How do KC (10-3),Oakland (10-3) and Atlanta (8-5) defenses compare?
A: 1) Their Defenses are all rated lower than the 'Skins.
2) They all have fewer sacks than the 'Skins: KC-27, Oak-22, Atl-28
Wash has 34 sacks, 4th in the NFL
3)[B] All have more Interceptions than the 'Skins:[/B] KC-14, Oak-12, Atl-9
Wash has 8
4) [B]They all have more Passes Defended than the 'Skins[/B]
KC-85, Oak-64, Atl-61....Wash has just 54

We get enough sacks & we all know we've missed many other opportunities.

But, we don't Intercept the ball enough & we definitely don't defend the pass strongly enough. So where's the real issue lie?

Is it with our poor Defensive calls (Joe Barry), poor secondary coaching/techniques (Perry Fewell) or is it really just a lack of talent on the Def side (Scott McL)?

I think the real answer is some portion of All of the Above.[/quote]

Mostly lack of talent and lack of imagination with the play calling in trying to hide that lack of talent are the big reasons the D sucks. The lunacy of the
Doctson pick hurts. We now need to draft 2 linemen instead of just one. Defense heavy draft is in order. I would draft a wr late though. Get a tall guy so when McVay calls a fade it might work for a change!

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158956]Our defense is bad, real bad, but here' something I found interesting...

Q: How do KC (10-3),Oakland (10-3) and Atlanta (8-5) defenses compare?
A: 1) Their Defenses are all rated lower than the 'Skins.
2) They all have fewer sacks than the 'Skins: KC-27, Oak-22, Atl-28
Wash has 34 sacks, 4th in the NFL
3)[B] All have more Interceptions than the 'Skins:[/B] KC-14, Oak-12, Atl-9
Wash has 8
4) [B]They all have more Passes Defended than the 'Skins[/B]
KC-85, Oak-64, Atl-61....Wash has just 54

We get enough sacks & we all know we've missed many other opportunities.

But, we don't Intercept the ball enough & we definitely don't defend the pass strongly enough. So where's the real issue lie?

Is it with our poor Defensive calls (Joe Barry), poor secondary coaching/techniques (Perry Fewell) or is it really just a lack of talent on the Def side (Scott McL)?

I think the real answer is some portion of All of the Above.[/quote]

To me its not about interceptions, sacks, or yards, its about keeping the other team from scoring and the Skins D gives up too many points. It puts a lot of pressure on the O to have to score 30 points each game just to eek out a win.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=irish;1158963]To me its not about interceptions, sacks, or yards, its about keeping the other team from scoring and the Skins D gives up too many points. It puts a lot of pressure on the O to have to score 30 points each game just to eek out a win.[/quote]

Getting off the field on 3rd down. End of story. Games are decided on 3rd down.

Only Cleveland is worst then us.

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url]

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[QUOTE=mredskins;1158964]Getting off the field on 3rd down. End of story. Games are decided on 3rd down.



Only Cleveland is worst then us.



[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url][/QUOTE]



I definitely agree this has been our biggest problem on D, by far.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=mredskins;1158964]Getting off the field on 3rd down. End of story. Games are decided on 3rd down.

Only Cleveland is worst then us.

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url][/quote]

I agree. Unlike other stats I think this stat is directly related to the D giving up too many points.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=MTK;1158965]I definitely agree this has been our biggest problem on D, by far.[/quote]

How many times have we seen them do well on 1st and 2nd and its 3rd and say 7? then boom 10 yard pick up. Fawk even on 3rd and super long they give it up. So frustrating.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=mredskins;1158967][B]How many times [/B]have we seen them do well on 1st and 2nd and its 3rd and say 7? then boom 10 yard pick up. Fawk even on 3rd and super long they give it up. So frustrating.[/quote]

Too many. Way too many.

Part of it is lack of talent (speed), part of it has to be playcalling, but I'd also say part of it is not playing angry enough.

When you play defense, and it's 3rd down, you have to play like your life depends on it, like those guys want to get into your house and F your dog! I'm not seeing that attitude from our D.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url]

This really tells the story of the tape with our defense. In the last 3 games the opp has converted the 3rd down 55% of the time, only Philly is close to use at 54% and they have basically given up on their season. That is why we are 1 and 2 over the past 3 weeks.

Last year we were at 37% that would have put at a tie for 7th place this year. Why such a major drop off from last year? To me 3rd down is a lot about coaching and this just shows Barry has gotten worst. I would be in favor of a new DC next year with an infusion of some more talent, even if that means hitting the FA market.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=mredskins;1158964]Getting off the field on 3rd down. End of story. Games are decided on 3rd down.

Only Cleveland is worst then us.

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url][/quote]

spot on...I agree, 3rd down on defense has bout killed this team just like our red zone offense.

Except the red zone makes less fucking sense because of our ability to move the ball. I think its McVay and Gruden is to blame

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Chico23231;1158970]spot on...I agree, 3rd down on defense has bout killed this team just like our red zone offense.

Except the [B]red zone[/B] makes less fucking sense because of our ability to move the ball. Red offense makes absolutely no fucking sense and I think its McVay and Gruden responsibility.[/quote]

Well lets visit that.

Drum roll......the Skins are also near dead last in that category (this stat determines if you score a TD).

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/red-zone-scoring-pct[/url]

We are at 45% for the year and we have shown some improvement in the last 3 at 50%. Last year we were at 58%; again a decline.

I feel like 3rd down and Red Zone is coaching guys. We are doing a good job on 1st and 2nd downs defensively so this shows me we have the talent to at least compete (it is normal a long drive that kills us, not a quick bing bang boom score from the opp). The Red Zone is even worst we move the ball like a hot knife through butter then when we get to the red zone and the brakes lock up.

To me McVay and Gruden stay and figure the red zone out but the defense needs a overhaul, IMO.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=SirLK26;1158953]Good post, imo [B]we need a big dominant NT[/B], at least one new safety, and maybe another corner if Breelands not the guy. Some of our young guys will be better next year, Cravens, Fuller, Smith, Ioannidis, could all turn into nice pieces. [B]And if Galette returns we have an athletic pass rusher[/B] to rotate in instead of the plodders we have now. We could actually be solid on defense next year

Edit: Oh and of course a new D coordinator is a must[/quote]

Last offseason the Giants did exactly what you said. They spent big in FA and they got a dominant DT and an elite Edge Rusher. We criticized them a lot here for spending so much on those positions but they had the last laugh because their defense is much better.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1158973]Last offseason the Giants did exactly what you said. They spent big in FA and they got a dominant DT and an elite Edge Rusher. We criticized them a lot here for spending so much on those positions but they had the last laugh because their defense is much better.[/quote]

Giants' D went from dead last in yards/game last to being a really solid defense (14th in yards/game), their performance against the cowboys was really impressive! Great defensive game. So yeah I guess that's well spent money.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

I guess it had to work out sometime, why not in our division right? :P

Us, Eagles, etc. etc.

We should have tons of cap space to be able get a couple of blue chippers next year without getting into cap hell.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=SirLK26;1158953]Good post, imo we need a big dominant NT, at least one new safety, and maybe another corner if Breelands not the guy. Some of our young guys will be better next year, Cravens, Fuller, Smith, Ioannidis, could all turn into nice pieces. And if Galette returns we have an athletic pass rusher to rotate in instead of the plodders we have now. We could actually be solid on defense next year

Edit: Oh and of course a new D coordinator is a must[/quote]

yup...I wouldn't stop at 1 D-Lineman. We need 2 and to resign Swaggy Baker. I would spend money on a NT/DT and draft a DE.

Id watch the situation in Cincy...If Marvin Lewis is finally fired, then Paul Guenther will be coming to DC. Him and Gruden are close friends and Barry hasn't done enough to retain his job. Guenther will change the defense to a 4-3, no question.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

Coaches are high on Lanier's potential and also like Iaonnidis, this is their first year, I expect both to be on the team next year. Jenkins and Hood are ready for the retirement home. Draft 2 DL or sign one on FA in addition to Baker and we'll be fine. S and a stud ILB in addition to DL will solve our problems.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

I like Hood as a backup.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[QUOTE=SFREDSKIN;1158977]Coaches are high on Lanier's potential and also like Iaonnidis, this is their first year, I expect both to be on the team next year. Jenkins and Hood are ready for the retirement home. Draft 2 DL or sign one on FA in addition to Baker and we'll be fine. S and a stud ILB in addition to DL will solve our problems.[/QUOTE]



I hated the Iaonnidis pick. We need speed. I guess he could potentially help plug the run.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=MTK;1158978]I like Hood as a backup.[/quote]

Me too.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[QUOTE=KI Skins Fan;1158984]Me too.[/QUOTE]



Me three. He has been a small flicker of a bright spot up the middle.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=punch it in;1158983]I hated the Iaonnidis pick. We need speed. I guess he could potentially help plug the run.[/quote]

Matt's formula for success: Eat like a pig, work out like a maniac, get up to 330-340 pounds, and dominate the LOS as a NT.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

ZiggY Hood at best is a back up, He is not disrupting enough up front.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

So it looks like Spaight is going to get his first start.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1158974]Giants' D went from dead last in yards/game last to being a really solid defense (14th in yards/game), their performance against the cowboys was really impressive! Great defensive game. So yeah I guess that's well spent money.[/quote]

The question is will it be well-spent money a couple of years from now? The cap ramifications this year are not nearly what they are three years from now.

But at the same time they're not mortgaged to the hilt. They just need Vernon and Jenkins to continue this play, or else.

We were appropriately aggressive in going for Norman. I hope we find another like that this coming offseason. Bennie Logan would be worth a good offer.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1158973]Last offseason the Giants did exactly what you said. They spent big in FA and they got a dominant DT and an elite Edge Rusher. We criticized them a lot here for spending so much on those positions but they had the last laugh because their defense is much better.[/quote]

I would hardly call Vernon an elite pass rusher. Nice player, not on Miller's level. Giants totally overpaid for him, as we did for Norman. That's free agency.

The Giants defense had nowhere to go but up. Yeah they're better, but I don't see them having a great defense or anything.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=mredskins;1158964]Getting off the field on 3rd down. End of story. Games are decided on 3rd down.

Only Cleveland is worst then us.

[url]https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/opponent-third-down-conversion-pct[/url][/quote]

And while we're at it, let's cut down on letting the other team score!

The discussion is [B]what does it take to make that happen[/B]?

What has to happen to get off the field on 3rd down? Just get a new Def Coord & we get massively better?

Our secondary (even with Josh Norman) seems to have regressed. Our safeties suck (again), Breeland & Dunbar regressed and Fuller doesn't seem like he's improving. Is Perry Fewell doing his job well enough?

I put some blame on McL for not addressing the d-line more strongly. Going in with basically career backups as starters (Goldson, Hood, RJF) is hardly a formula for success in the NFL.

I just think our def problems need more talent before we can judge Barry fairly. But, hey, if he's the one telling McL that he could make those pieces work, then I would agree that he should go.

I'm not close enough to know if that's the case though.

-Hail.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote]No team in the NFL is worse on third down than the Redskins, who are allowing conversions 48 percent of the time. They're on pace to have the second-worst third-down defense in the past 15 seasons [B][U]behind only the 2011 San Diego Chargers[/U][/B].

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/news/redskins-nfl-worst-3rd-down-defense-obstacle-playoffs-212739259--nfl.html]Redskins' NFL-worst 3rd-down defense is obstacle to playoffs[/url]
[/quote]

So the worst team in past 15 seasons on third downs? 2011 San Diego Chargers, when Barry was the LB coach. Joe Barry's teams in the past 10 years have some of the WORST third down defenses in history -- and although he didn't always make the D calls, you've got to believe he clearly wasn't the solution. He's used to mediocrity and his experience and everything he's learned in the NFL has been about BAD DEFENSE. Not sure why his career makes us trust him.

Detroit - 2007 - 45% (30th in league)
Tampa Bay - 2009 - 40% (23rd in league)
San Diego - 2011 - 49% (32nd in league)
San Diego - 2012 - 42% (29th in league)
San Diego - 2013 - 40% (21st in league)
San Diego - 2014 - 43% (25th in league)

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=SirLK26;1158953]Good post, imo we need a big dominant NT, at least one new safety, and maybe another corner if Breelands not the guy. Some of our young guys will be better next year, Cravens, Fuller, Smith, Ioannidis, could all turn into nice pieces. And if Galette returns we have an athletic pass rusher to rotate in instead of the plodders we have now. We could actually be solid on defense next year

Edit: Oh and of course a new D coordinator is a must[/quote]

Better off drafting DTs than a NT. Better yet if we don't get into the playoffs Barry will be probably out and maybe a 4-3 guy installed as DC. Never really heard of any real dominant NTs in the NFL. Those guys usually are just hole pluggers. We need a CB regardless of Breeland, but I think we need to move on from him. He showed so much promise last season, not sure what to think..

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=ethat001;1158999]So the worst team in past 15 seasons on third downs? 2011 San Diego Chargers, when Barry was the LB coach. Joe Barry's teams in the past 10 years have some of the WORST third down defenses in history -- and although he didn't always make the D calls, you've got to believe he clearly wasn't the solution. He's used to mediocrity and his experience and everything he's learned in the NFL has been about BAD DEFENSE. Not sure why his career makes us trust him.

Detroit - 2007 - 45% (30th in league)
Tampa Bay - 2009 - 40% (23rd in league)
San Diego - 2011 - 49% (32nd in league)
San Diego - 2012 - 42% (29th in league)
San Diego - 2013 - 40% (21st in league)
San Diego - 2014 - 43% (25th in league)[/quote]

Wow, I mean just wow?! Bloody hail no wonder Barry struggles with OT he's never seen or learned a solid strategy for defending third down? :(

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158997]And while we're at it, let's cut down on letting the other team score!

The discussion is [B]what does it take to make that happen[/B]?

What has to happen to get off the field on 3rd down? Just get a new Def Coord & we get massively better?

Our secondary (even with Josh Norman) seems to have regressed. Our safeties suck (again), Breeland & Dunbar regressed and Fuller doesn't seem like he's improving. Is Perry Fewell doing his job well enough?

I put some blame on McL for not addressing the d-line more strongly. Going in with basically career backups as starters (Goldson, Hood, RJF) is hardly a formula for success in the NFL.

I just think our def problems need more talent before we can judge Barry fairly. But, hey, if he's the one telling McL that he could make those pieces work, then I would agree that he should go.

I'm not close enough to know if that's the case though.

-Hail.[/quote]

We are simply victims of hype, just like fans of most NFL teams. In May the experts gave our draft an A or B+ and we fell for it. Our expectations for the D were too high and thinking the addition of
Norman alone wasn't going to boost it, especially when Breeland has regressed. Our defense is full of guys that are really backups. I will give a pass to our rookies.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

I cant wait for a new DC honestly. Can.... Not.. . Wait.

Re: Skins vs Carolina Pre Game
 

[quote=Meks;1159004]I cant wait for a new DC honestly. Can.... Not.. . Wait.[/quote]

We said that with Haslett.

I can't wait to improve the talent on D first and foremost.