Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=Mattyk;717872]Teaching kids acceptance is so overrated anyway[/quote]

agreed.. overstated as well.. that is part of the PC horseshit.. that and "criss-cross applesauce" .. choosing to accept or support (as I do being a contributing member of HRC, though not gay myself) isn't part of that, it's part of realizing that the world is bigger than yourself and recognizing the diversity of the people around you.. a lot of people aren't used to imagining that there are those not like them and that it doesn't make those people evil or less deserving of something that many others get to practice

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=saden1;717899]Question...would any of you who don't like the idea of gay marriage vote against a proposition similar to prop 8 if it were on your state ballet?[/quote]
it was ridiculous how many in VA thought that it was a ban it vs make it legal vote

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;717957]I think the problem most parents have is that they don't want their children taught about controversial subjects by someone other than them, especially for the introduction to the topic (sex ed. and things that may counter a family's religous teaching). The other issue is when subjects are taught in public school, obviously the sex ed for 5 yr. olds is ridiculous, same as HS juniors/seniors not being made aware of contraception.

Having a 17 yr. old and being involved in coaching from 6yrs old. into HS, I can tell you one thing is for sure. Normal, rational folks from all walks of life can quickly go completely bat-shit crazy over something to do with their kids.[/quote]
a lot of parents don't talk about nearly ANYTHING societal or cultural with their kids

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;717978]Let me ask a question. Are there homosexuals in the Omish community? I don't see the Omish men wearing dresses and holding hands with each other. I don't see the Omish starting any wars either. I think we could learn a lot from their example.[/quote]

omish? lol..

the gay and wars.. everyone turn off your electricity!

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

i[quote=Trample the Elderly;717997]That sounds good to me. I agree with them then. People and their communities should have the right to decide what is right and wrong within their own community.[/quote]
America isn't a community though.. neither is VA

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

sorry guys!

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=Mattyk;718150]You don't think that fear and ignorance is part of the equation here when talking about those on the extreme side against gay marriage?[/quote]

Oh, I misunderstood you, thought you were referring to me for some reason... no doubt ignorance and fear play a big role for extremists of any type, not just pertaining to this issue.

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=tryfuhl;718160]it was ridiculous how many in VA thought that it was a ban it vs make it legal vote[/quote]

What is even more ridiculous is the cowardis displayed in answering this question.

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=djnemo65;496709]Good for Steve Young for doing the right thing. I heard David Frum (the axis of evil guy, who is actually really impressive) talking about this issue recently; he said that all you have to do is look at polling data for people under 40 to see where we are headed in this country with respect to this issue.

I think with an economy in crisis people are really tuning into the inanity of these divisive social issues, which have been at the center of our presidential elections for the past 40 years. They aren't working this time and that's a very very good thing.[/quote]

I agree to some extent, but social issues matter. Why do I say that? Simple, because the breakdown of social mores, etc has helped contribute to the economic crisis that we are facing. What is the major factor in our impending economic collapse? Greed and the lust for power. On top of that, folks want something for nothing. There is nothing outside of chasing the almighty buck anymore. Outside of this people don't really believe in anything. Nihlism is the order of the day, absolutely no morality at all. Gambling, drug and alcohol abuse, etc all have negative consequences on society as a whole.

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=tryfuhl;718165]i
America isn't a community though.. neither is VA[/quote]


America is a conglomerate of communities though, same with VA.

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=saden1;717899]Question...would any of you who don't like the idea of gay marriage vote against a proposition similar to prop 8 if it were on your state ballet?[/quote]In VA, it would depend on how the law was written, but I could vote against it.

(Not to completely derail the thread)That being said, I would be much more inclined to do so, if I knew as a quid pro quo those that support gay marriage would then support a national ban on third trimester abortion, except in the cases of a threat to the life of the mother.

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;718181]Oh, I misunderstood you, thought you were referring to me for some reason... no doubt ignorance and fear play a big role for extremists of any type, not just pertaining to this issue.[/quote]

I was just speaking in general, sorry that wasn't clear

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;718196]I agree to some extent, but social issues matter. Why do I say that? Simple, because the breakdown of social mores, etc has helped contribute to the economic crisis that we are facing. What is the major factor in our impending economic collapse? Greed and the lust for power. On top of that, folks want something for nothing. There is nothing outside of chasing the almighty buck anymore. Outside of this people don't really believe in anything. Nihlism is the order of the day, absolutely no morality at all. Gambling, drug and alcohol abuse, etc all have negative consequences on society as a whole.[/quote]
true.. those factors didn't create capitalism and greed though

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;718197]America is a conglomerate of communities though, same with VA.[/quote]
the Amish community and a township community don't begin to compare as one is more ideological and the other geographical

Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;718196]I agree to some extent, [B]but social issues matter.[/B] Why do I say that? Simple, because the breakdown of social mores, etc has helped contribute to the economic crisis that we are facing. What is the major factor in our impending economic collapse? Greed and the lust for power. On top of that, folks want something for nothing. There is nothing outside of chasing the almighty buck anymore. Outside of this people don't really believe in anything. Nihlism is the order of the day, absolutely no morality at all. [B]Gambling, drug and alcohol abuse, etc all have negative consequences on society as a whole.[/B][/quote]

The problem I have with the social issues crowd is that they feel the best way to deal with things like drugs, gambling or, in this case, homosexual behavior/marriage, is criminalization. The notion that we can do away with whatever we don't like with the wave of a legislative wand. There are always unintended consequences when you go that route, and, it only tends to make things worse. The War on Drugs is the very best example of this.

Also, when I pin social conservatives down on [I]exactly how [/I]society is impacted by homosexual marriage, how they are directly affected, or how their marriage suffers because gays can call themselves married, nobody's been able to do it.

There's a mentality among too many of us which essentially says, "someone is doing something I don't like, so therefore, I want to see that activity banned." We often say our liberty and freedom is under attack from the political left. Well, we can clearly see that the political right also wants to take away our liberty and freedom too, just in different areas.