Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185312]Yeah just saying it’s pointless to try to read into everything. I’m sure Gruden would rather have him back than to start over with someone else. He just wants it settled either way like we all do.

You think only 5% would be ok with him walking?? It’s much higher than that.[/quote]

I agree about the settled thing. Its getting to the point now that this is the only thing that matters. I'll roll with whatever happens, just get it done asap. For Pete's Sake.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185312]Yeah just saying it’s pointless to try to read into everything. I’m sure Gruden would rather have him back than to start over with someone else. He just wants it settled either way like we all do.

You think only 5% would be ok with him walking?? It’s much higher than that.[/quote]

Especially on Twitter. In fact, I'd say the fanbase is quite divided on Kirk Cousins. Which is kind of funny. It's not like each of us is having to fund his contract. If the 'skins can sign him to a LTD while signing other areas of need, I really don't care what Cousins makes. More power to him! All I care is that he leads us to a Super Bowl championship, and personally, anything less is a disappointment.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185312]Yeah just saying it’s pointless to try to read into everything. I’m sure Gruden would rather have him back than to start over with someone else. He just wants it settled either way like we all do.

You think only 5% would be ok with him walking?? It’s much higher than that.[/quote]

Gruden baffles me at times.. He will win more games with Cousins next year than starting over so if I am Gruden I would praise Cousins every chance i could UNLESS he knows something the rest don't. He could know that the front office are not going to sign cousins to a LTD so he is playing Coy with Cousins..He maybe thinking with a different QB next year it would buy him more time as head coach. I agree with MTK that Gruden should want Cousins back but you never know.

Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=rocnrik;1185317]Gruden baffles me at times.. He will win more games with Cousins next year than starting over so if I am Gruden I would praise Cousins every chance i could UNLESS he knows something the rest don't. He could know that the front office are not going to sign cousins to a LTD so he is playing Coy with Cousins..He maybe thinking with a different QB next year it would buy him more time as head coach. I agree with MTK that Gruden should want Cousins back but you never know.[/QUOTE]


But you’re against Cousins I thought, didn’t you used to say he wasn’t worth it, that he wouldn’t win 6 games this year

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

Cousins is holding the Redskins hostage and I'm tired of it. His first priority is getting his freedom, not necessarily resigning w/ the Redskins. That bothers me. I want a guy that's "all in" as someone use to say. He's not.

He's not signing before March 6th so I'd try and trade him.The Browns have plenty of cap space to absorb 34 million and they have the 1st and 4th picks of the 1st round. They'd be my first call.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

As far as Gruden is concerned, I wish he'd just shut up. He needs a lesson in PR and clock management. You NEVER say negative things to the media about your players. Especially the QB. All he had to say is.." Kirk's been a good QB for us the last few years and if he stays we think he can take his game to the next level"...just something like that. He's such a dummy sometimes with his comments.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185318]But you’re against Cousins I thought, didn’t you used to say he wasn’t worth it, that he wouldn’t win 6 games this year[/quote]

Well they won 7 games..my bad, I am not so much against Cousins as Against what they will have to pay to get him and how that will effect the rest of team signings. At times we all have had mixed feelings on this team from coach to QB to Owner and Front office. If any of us knew who would replace Kirk if he left then it would be much easier to decide. Seems Smith,Bridgewater, are names I hear and throw in Colt and we could always draft a QB. not sure any of that would come close to replacing Cousins..but I am wrong about this team a lot.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

I'd offer Cousins a contract this week then give him to end of January to take it. If not...well bye...and we start planning out FA and draft knowing we need to pickup 1/2 qbs. That way its on him, and the team can say we made an offer and he wanted to take his chances somewhere else.

Waiting till March is going to suck. I feel like that time can be better spent by the team.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

I think the FA period begins in mid March. I guess they could talk but nothing would be official till then.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=rocnrik;1185326]Well they won 7 games..my bad, I am not so much against Cousins as Against what they will have to pay to get him and how that will effect the rest of team signings. At times we all have had mixed feelings on this team from coach to QB to Owner and Front office. If any of us knew who would replace Kirk if he left then it would be much easier to decide. Seems Smith,Bridgewater, are names I hear and throw in Colt and we could always draft a QB. not sure any of that would come close to replacing Cousins..but I am wrong about this team a lot.[/quote]

They won 7 games because of KC lol, if we had Colt we would have gone 3-13. Kirk sucked it up a couple games I admit but overall he played very good. The money issue is what it is, if you want nice things you pay more for them right? It's all about the market. Like a new house or car.. I want Kirk back and hope he stays. Either way I don't disagree with fans that want a new QB (Not some bum backup though). I just hope it ends sooner than later

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1185325]As far as Gruden is concerned, I wish he'd just shut up. He needs a lesson in PR and clock management. You NEVER say negative things to the media about your players. Especially the QB. All he had to say is.." Kirk's been a good QB for us the last few years and if he stays we think he can take his game to the next level"...just something like that. He's such a dummy sometimes with his comments.[/quote]

I couldn't agree more. What the hell is he thinking? I have to think he know's something that we don't.

Gibbs would never do that. That's why he was able to work with the likes of John Riggins.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1185329]I think the FA period begins in mid March. I guess they could talk but nothing would be official till then.[/quote]

They can resign their own players before then from what I understand.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=metalskins;1185356]They can resign their own players before then from what I understand.[/quote]

Pretty sure this is correct as we just signed a 3 year deal with Dunbar. Really hope they get this figured out well before FA starts for all players.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=metalskins;1185356]They can resign their own players before then from what I understand.[/QUOTE]


Under the franchise tag I don’t think he can sign until the current season ends after the SB.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=rickmmrr;1185338]I couldn't agree more. What the hell is he thinking? I have to think he know's something that we don't.

Gibbs would never do that. That's why he was able to work with the likes of John Riggins.[/quote]

I know I'm in the minority but I find it refreshing to have a coach who will candidly answer question instead of just giving the usual BS non-answer answer. Its a cant win for these guys, when they answer honestly they are ripped for being honest and not giving a PC answer. When they give a BS non-answer they are ripped for giving what everyone knows is a non-answer. I like and appreciate that JG seems to be an open and honest coach.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185358]Under the franchise tag I don’t think he can sign until the current season ends after the SB.[/quote]

Oh. Yeah, I guess that makes sense. Hopefully they have the official offer on the table the 1st day they can offer it.

*edited

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=MTK;1185358]Under the franchise tag I don’t think he can sign until the current season ends after the SB.[/quote]

Right. My thoughts were when the off-season officially began. Meaning, the 'skins wouldn't have to wait until March to resign Cousins.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185359]I know I'm in the minority but I find it refreshing to have a coach who will candidly answer question instead of just giving the usual BS non-answer answer. Its a cant win for these guys, when they answer honestly they are ripped for being honest and not giving a PC answer. When they give a BS non-answer they are ripped for giving what everyone knows is a non-answer. I like and appreciate that JG seems to be an open and honest coach.[/quote]

This. I believe this quality is appreciated my the players as well. No one gets a free pass and I would bet most of the players feel the same way as JG on this particular issue.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1185327]I'd offer Cousins a contract this week then give him to end of January to take it. If not...well bye...and we start planning out FA and draft knowing we need to pickup 1/2 qbs. That way its on him, and the team can say we made an offer and he wanted to take his chances somewhere else.

Waiting till March is going to suck. I feel like that time can be better spent by the team.[/quote]

This is how I feel and that's why he's holding the Redskins hostage. Suppose they want to try and sign Jarvis Landry or other wr's? He's obviously going to want to know who the QB is going to be. Put a contract in front of him that's fair and give him until March 1st. No signature by then it's off the table.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1185363]This is how I feel and that's why he's holding the Redskins hostage. Suppose they want to try and sign Jarvis Landry or other wr's? He's obviously going to want to know who the QB is going to be. Put a contract in front of him that's fair and give him until March 1st. No signature by then it's off the table.[/quote]

This- Exactly. 30 mil + is a lot to hold in flux for your FA plans.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=rickmmrr;1185338]I couldn't agree more. What the hell is he thinking? I have to think he know's something that we don't.

Gibbs would never do that. That's why he was able to work with the likes of John Riggins.[/quote]

You're right and that's what I loved about Joe. He would never ever say anything that would create controversy.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=rocnrik;1185317]Gruden baffles me at times.. He will win more games with Cousins next year than starting over so if I am Gruden I would praise Cousins every chance i could UNLESS he knows something the rest don't. He could know that the front office are not going to sign cousins to a LTD so he is playing Coy with Cousins..He maybe thinking with a different QB next year it would buy him more time as head coach. I agree with MTK that Gruden should want Cousins back but you never know.[/quote]

Whos to say that Cousins success isnt due to Gruden, and Seans tutelage and system, and whos to say that if you bring in Dalton or another vet that you cant win more without Cousins than with him? I like Cousins, but i also like and respect Jay and his system. I also feel like if you have made over 40 mil from a team in the past two years you shouldnt need your ego stroked and can take the truth that you played well "at times". "At times" he also turned the ball over at crucial points on the game and couldnt get the job done.
Gruden is being real and i respect that.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

Here is a link with important dates:

[url]https://www.thephinsider.com/2018/1/3/16843444/when-is-the-nfl-draft-when-is-free-agency-2018-nfl-calendar-regular-season-week-1[/url]

[url]https://operations.nfl.com/football-ops/league-governance/2018-important-nfl-dates/[/url]

The nfl.com link doesn't have s separate date for franchise tagged players so not sure if that date was left off or if it means we can resign Cousins now.

If its now the offer should be on the table immediately. Otherwise legal tampering begins on March 12th, deadline to tag is March 6th. We should have an offer on the table no later than February 20th (1st day to tag) and give him till like March 5th to sign. If no signature we let him leave.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=doughtydoubter;1185366]Whos to say that Cousins success isnt due to Gruden, and Seans tutelage and system, and whos to say that if you bring in Dalton or another vet that you cant win more without Cousins than with him? I like Cousins, but i also like and respect Jay and his system. I also feel like if you have made over 40 mil from a team in the past two years you shouldnt need your ego stroked and can take the truth that you played well "at times". "At times" he also turned the ball over at crucial points on the game and couldnt get the job done.
Gruden is being real and i respect that.[/quote]

I do think Kirk benefits in this system but he also makes plays that Dalton can't make with his legs.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185359]I know I'm in the minority but I find it refreshing to have a coach who will candidly answer question instead of just giving the usual BS non-answer answer. Its a cant win for these guys, when they answer honestly they are ripped for being honest and not giving a PC answer. When they give a BS non-answer they are ripped for giving what everyone knows is a non-answer. I like and appreciate that JG seems to be an open and honest coach.[/quote]

Personally I don't rip him for being honest... I just think it tells he doesn't believe in Kirk that much, and it amazes me (in a bad way).

And I don't think that's reading too much out of it: I went back and listen to this segment again, in the same sentence he praises TW, Brandon Scherff and RK who are "Pro Bowl type guys" and are among the "few guys obviously that jump out".

So even when the team is 7-9, there are some players that you can say without any hesitation had a solid season? But not Kirk?

I'm sorry but that tells me he doesn't believe in him.

Because by that standard you could say that TW Scherff and RK "played well at times"... Even they had bad plays, RK disappeared in some games, Scherff wasn't ALWAYS that great in the run game, TW was awesome even when hurt but he did gave away some sacks...

I think these 3 are really good players but I think Kirk is right there with them.

He's part of why we're not 4-13, he's not part of why we're not 11-5, so to hear the HC sort of pin the 7-9 season on him is unfair and not a good sign if you hope Kirk's staying here.

(Didn't read the article but here's a video of the segment I'm talking about: [url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/jay-gruden-wasnt-overly-critical-kirk-cousins-he-was-honest?utm_content=bufferd7f11&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer]Jay Gruden wasn't overly critical of Kirk Cousins, but he was honest | NBC Sports Washington[/url] )

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1185367]Here is a link with important dates:

[url]https://www.thephinsider.com/2018/1/3/16843444/when-is-the-nfl-draft-when-is-free-agency-2018-nfl-calendar-regular-season-week-1[/url]

[url]https://operations.nfl.com/football-ops/league-governance/2018-important-nfl-dates/[/url]

The nfl.com link doesn't have s separate date for franchise tagged players so not sure if that date was left off or if it means we can resign Cousins now.

If its now the offer should be on the table immediately. Otherwise legal tampering begins on March 12th, deadline to tag is March 6th. We should have an offer on the table no later than February 20th (1st day to tag) and give him till like March 5th to sign. If no signature we let him leave.[/quote]

[url=http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35347/redskins-kirk-cousins-face-multiple-key-dates-in-contract-decision]Redskins, Kirk Cousins face multiple key dates in contract decision - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN[/url]

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1185373][url=http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/35347/redskins-kirk-cousins-face-multiple-key-dates-in-contract-decision]Redskins, Kirk Cousins face multiple key dates in contract decision - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN[/url][/quote]

Not seeing anything there either that suggest we have to wait past January 1st to negotiate with him like any of our other FAs. Seems like they should be able to get this resolved prior to February 20th but they won't.

I don't want any of the tag options unless there is already a guaranteed trade agreed to. Otherwise, he can just not sign any offer, play for a minimum of 28.5 million and leave us in same situation next year. Rather let him walk and take our 3rd round compensatory pick in 2019.

I won't hold my breath for anything happening until March.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1185372]Personally I don't rip him for being honest... I just think it tells he doesn't believe in Kirk that much, and it amazes me (in a bad way).

And I don't think that's reading too much out of it: I went back and listen to this segment again, in the same sentence he praises TW, Brandon Scherff and RK who are "Pro Bowl type guys" and are among the "few guys obviously that jump out".

So even when the team is 7-9, there are some players that you can say without any hesitation had a solid season? But not Kirk?

I'm sorry but that tells me he doesn't believe in him.

Because by that standard you could say that TW Scherff and RK "played well at times"... Even they had bad plays, RK disappeared in some games, Scherff wasn't ALWAYS that great in the run game, TW was awesome even when hurt but he did gave away some sacks...

I think these 3 are really good players but I think Kirk is right there with them.

He's part of why we're not 4-13, he's not part of why we're not 11-5, so to hear the HC sort of pin the 7-9 season on him is unfair and not a good sign if you hope Kirk's staying here.

(Didn't read the article but here's a video of the segment I'm talking about: [url=http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/jay-gruden-wasnt-overly-critical-kirk-cousins-he-was-honest?utm_content=bufferd7f11&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer]Jay Gruden wasn't overly critical of Kirk Cousins, but he was honest | NBC Sports Washington[/url] )[/quote]

Kirk has been his starter for what 3 years and yet somehow JG doesn't believe in him because of a comment or two. I think people are looking waaay too deep into all of this. If JG didn't believe in Kirk then he wouldn't be the starting QB.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185375]Kirk has been his starter for what 3 years and yet somehow JG doesn't believe in him because of a comment or two. I think people are looking waaay too deep into all of this. If JG didn't believe in Kirk then he wouldn't be the starting QB.[/quote]

Agree. I think it's because most people are much, much more sensitive than NFL players and coaches are.

If you can't handle an honest assessment of your performance and handle constructive criticism then the NFL isn't for you. Don't project your mamby pamby sensibilities on Kirk Cousins and Jay Gruden. They're in the NFL for a reason, one of which is they've got bigger onions than you.

Gruden likes Cousins. Gruden wants Cousins. But he's right in pointing out Cousins had some stinkers. It doesn't mean Cousins hates Gruden or hates being a Redskin.

Same goes for the overblown bullshit about Snyder snubbing him for RG3 after Cousins won that game as a rookie against the Browns. Overblown nonsense. Just because you're a drama queen doesn't mean these guys are.

Cousins will simply weigh all of his options. If he leaves, then it will be on Gruden Snyder and Allen to look in the mirror and realize that the Redskins aren't the model franchise they'd all like it to be. It would be yet another dose of constructive criticism. They wouldn't curl up with a blanket, a pint of Ben & Jerry's and have a good cry. They'd take it on the chin and get to work. Hopefully by firing Allen.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;1185378]Agree. I think it's because most people are much, much more sensitive than NFL players and coaches are.

If you can't handle an honest assessment of your performance and handle constructive criticism then the NFL isn't for you. Don't project your mamby pamby sensibilities on Kirk Cousins and Jay Gruden. They're in the NFL for a reason, one of which is they've got bigger onions than you.

Gruden likes Cousins. Gruden wants Cousins. But he's right in pointing out Cousins had some stinkers. It doesn't mean Cousins hates Gruden or hates being a Redskin.

Same goes for the overblown bullshit about Snyder snubbing him for RG3 after Cousins won that game as a rookie against the Browns. Overblown nonsense. Just because you're a drama queen doesn't mean these guys are.

Cousins will simply weigh all of his options. If he leaves, then it will be on Gruden Snyder and Allen to look in the mirror and realize that the Redskins aren't the model franchise they'd all like it to be. It would be yet another dose of constructive criticism. They wouldn't curl up with a blanket, a pint of Ben & Jerry's and have a good cry. They'd take it on the chin and get to work. Hopefully by firing Allen.[/QUOTE]I don't think these comments hurt Kirk's feeling. If they did I don't care, it's a business. I just think by comparing those comments to others and trying to read the situation you can deduct things... Granted you can also be wrong doing so.

Btw, as Kevin Sheehan pointed out yesterday, Kirk did say during his charity event that he was surprised Jay pinned the 7 - 9 season on him.

Envoyé de mon SM-J320FN en utilisant Tapatalk

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185375]Kirk has been his starter for what 3 years and yet somehow JG doesn't believe in him because of a comment or two. I think people are looking waaay too deep into all of this. If JG didn't believe in Kirk then he wouldn't be the starting QB.[/quote]

He believes "he's a very good QB, but ...". He believes he's good but he doesn't seem to be all in on "Pay the guy I want him back at any price".

And maybe he's right. I don't know. All I'm saying is I'm not sure he's as high on Kirk as the narrative was last season.

And maybe a HC shouldn't be crazy high on any player, maybe it's ok. It's just a bit disappointing when you really want Kirk to be back.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

He... is... right!!!

Kirk is good, not great. I want him signed, but I acknowledge I don’t think he will win a Super Bowl.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1185385]He... is... right!!!

Kirk is good, not great. I want him signed, but I acknowledge I don’t think he will win a Super Bowl.[/quote]

Maybe he's right. That wasn't my point. Anyway the irony is we are blowing it way out of proportion of what it is AND of what I thought it meant... So I'll just let it go and hope this QB situation gets settled quickly so we can go back to talking football !

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1185385]He... is... right!!!

Kirk is good, not great. I want him signed, but I acknowledge I don’t think he will win a Super Bowl.[/quote]

I feel that way too. I think you can win a title with him, not because of him.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1185391]I feel that way too. I think you can win a title with him, not because of him.[/quote]

But that's the case with any QB. Trading Brady to the Browns doesn't suddenly make them a Super Bowl favorite. Football is a dependent sport and no position is more dependent that QB.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185392]But that's the case with any QB. Trading Brady to the Browns doesn't suddenly make them a Super Bowl favorite. Football is a dependent sport and no position is more dependent that QB.[/quote]

Pretty much this...But you need to complement him either in a system that exploits his strengths or surround with players that will elevate him.

I truly believe if we resign Cousins and then focus on a building Running game we are extremely competitive for the NFC East and in the discussion of NFC crown.

Things change extremely quick in the NFL. Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers...There only 2 elite QB in the game meaning everyone has flaws....Cam, Russell Wilson, Matt Ryan, Big Ben,...flawed flawed flawed flawed.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1185394]Pretty much this...But you need to complement him either in a system that exploits his strengths or surround with players that will elevate him.

I truly believe if we resign Cousins and then focus on a building Running game we are extremely competitive for the NFC East and in the discussion of NFC crown.

Things change extremely quick in the NFL. Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers...There only 2 elite QB in the game meaning everyone has flaws....Cam, Russell Wilson, Matt Ryan, Big Ben,...flawed flawed flawed flawed.[/quote]

Agree and in addition to complimentary strengths on offense a team also needs a solid defense. Dan Marino had loads of complimentary players on offense but they had to score a bunch of points to stay in games because the D gave up a lot of points.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

QB is definitely a dependent position and I think Cousins has been helped by the talent around him in our offense. I think there are a lot of QBs that can do a lot of what Cousins has done in our offense.

We have an excellent - excellent - pass protecting line when it's healthy. This year it obviously wasn't healthy and Cousins took the 6th most sacks in the league. But otherwise it's been good.

But if you put Case Keenum in this situation, I think he could do a lot of the same stuff.
He's got the same quick release as Cousins and the same brainy approach to quickly reading a defense and identifying the open man. To be fair to Cousins he was under pressure a lot this year and still made a lot of plays. The one in Dallas where he hit Crowder while falling on his ass comes to mind as a pretty impressive one.

So Cousins can elevate you a little beyond what your protection provides you, but it's important to keep in perspective that it's not by all that much. That's why we all come to the conclusion that you can win with him, but not because of him.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1185396]QB is definitely a dependent position and I think Cousins has been helped by the talent around him in our offense. I think there are a lot of QBs that can do a lot of what Cousins has done in our offense.

We have an excellent - excellent - pass protecting line when it's healthy. This year it obviously wasn't healthy and Cousins took the 6th most sacks in the league. But otherwise it's been good.

But if you put Case Keenum in this situation, I think he could do a lot of the same stuff.
He's got the same quick release as Cousins and the same brainy approach to quickly reading a defense and identifying the open man. To be fair to Cousins he was under pressure a lot this year and still made a lot of plays. The one in Dallas where he hit Crowder while falling on his ass comes to mind as a pretty impressive one.

So Cousins can elevate you a little beyond what your protection provides you, but it's important to keep in perspective that it's not by all that much. That's why we all come to the conclusion that you can win with him, but not because of him.[/quote]

Other than Brady and Rodgers what QBs do team win because of? The answer is none.

Re: Cousins Saga 4.0. Is he done in DC?
 

[quote=irish;1185398]Other than Brady and Rodgers what QBs do team win because of? The answer is none.[/quote]

I'd add Wentz and Russell Wilson to the "because of" list.

But don't oversimplify, it's not black and while like these QBs you win "because of", and these you win "with".

Some create a ton of plays on their own, some create some on their own, some create a little on their own, and some create none on their own.

Like Roethlisberger isn't on the level of Brady Rodgers and Wentz in my mind but I'd gladly take him over Cousins any day. When you're that big and can extend plays it adds a lot of value. But yeah he's not going to do it on his own, he needs Antonio Brown and that line and LeVeon.

Cousins is good and we should try to retain him but we need to keep in perspective that his ceiling is probably a Matt Ryan career. If everything breaks right on the team around him, you can succeed.