Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=tryfuhl;688153]Once again you guys need to actually understand what you're reading.

This is speaking about physician-owned hospitals only, not other privately owned ones. Whether it's good or bad I'll leave to other people to argue since there's so much back and forth in the healthcare industry. It's an interesting decision as patients have the choice where to go, I'll say that.[/quote]

When you get down to it, all hospitals are privately owned unless it's a VA hospital.

Yes, these are doctor-owned -- which apparently have been a target of larger, corporate owned hospitals. Not surprising since corporations often try to influence the powers of government to legislate their competition out of business.

The point of this article is simply that another provision has been uncovered which further restricts the free enterprise aspect of the healthcare market. At a time when doctors are fleeing the industry, when overcrowding is becoming more of a problem, I'd love to hear how this portion of the bill helps anything.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Beemnseven;688480]When you get down to it, all hospitals are privately owned unless it's a VA hospital.

Yes, these are doctor-owned -- which apparently have been a target of larger, corporate owned hospitals. Not surprising since corporations often try to influence the powers of government to legislate their competition out of business.

The point of this article is simply that another provision has been uncovered which further restricts the free enterprise aspect of the healthcare market. At a time when doctors are fleeing the industry, when overcrowding is becoming more of a problem, I'd love to hear how this portion of the bill helps anything.[/quote]

In order to save the country I have to join a group that includes the KKK, damn I hate communism. How ironic!!!

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Buster;688184]Your last three (at least) posts all have the word Communism or Communist in it. It's getting to the point that when you talk, all I hear is: [img]http://www.thewarpath.net/images/avatars/parrot.jpg[/img][/quote]

Oh my fault I been trying to stay on queue. Okay give me a signal when I am supposed to start sqawking communism. I'm a team player. Mow tea sir!!!!

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Buster;688184]Your last three (at least) posts all have the word Communism or Communist in it. It's getting to the point that when you talk, all I hear is: [IMG]http://www.thewarpath.net/images/avatars/parrot.jpg[/IMG][/quote]

Thats about what liberals do.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;688563]Thats about what liberals do.[/quote]

Communism, that's conservatives favorite boogey man. I'm scared please take all my rights away and protect me from tehe boogeyman. Prolly haven't even been in this country three generations trying to tell the original 13 colonies natives what to do. You can go back to Europe now. Your calls of socialismwill do them alot of good.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;688581]Communism, [IMG]http://www.thewarpath.net/images/avatars/parrot.jpg[/IMG].[/quote]

What are you squawking about now?

Re: Obama Care
 

I am repeating the conservative mantra communism communism communism. They don't like it when i say it all the time. I thought i was being enlightened to true freedom. I make conclusions that are irrelevant, just like them. I make stuff up just like them.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;688563]Thats about what liberals do.[/quote]
"I'm not going to name individual Republicans,” Reid responded, “but I think it's very clear, as a result of the actions, since Obama was elected, that people want him to fail. Some have said so; others have just acted accordingly. And I think that as a result of what's been going on in the press the last few days, we know that there's a significant number of Republicans out there who want the president to fail."

and this is what the GOP does. remember, just say no

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;688581]Communism, that's conservatives favorite boogey man. I'm scared please take all my rights away and protect me from tehe boogeyman. Prolly haven't even been in this country three generations trying to tell the original 13 colonies natives what to do. You can go back to Europe now. Your calls of socialismwill do them alot of good.[/quote]

Actually my family traces back to before the 13 colonies. So I guess I have plenty of right to say how I feel and please find any post I've made with the word socialism.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=dmek25;688661]"I'm not going to name individual Republicans,” Reid responded, “but I think it's very clear, as a result of the actions, since Obama was elected, that people want him to fail. Some have said so; others have just acted accordingly. And I think that as a result of what's been going on in the press the last few days, we know that there's a significant number of Republicans out there who want the president to fail."

and this is what the GOP does. remember, just say no[/quote]

Funny, and the Dems voted Yes for evrything Bush or other Rep. presidents pushed. No, they did not and a NO vote means they do not want the bill passed so they want the president to fail on that bill. Is this really that hard to understand. We don't like the health bill so we do not support or vote for the bill. Its no different then the liberals who did not want Bush to pass the tax cuts and voted against them. Its called a play of words and by saying rep. want Obama to fail when really what they want is for him to fail on his liberal policies which is no different then liberals wanting a Rep. president to fail on their agenda.

Re: Obama Care
 

then why don't they come up with their own ideas? instead of blasting the health care bill, come up with an alternative. don't just say its a Democratic idea, and it stinks. i do not totally agree with the bill. but i hoping its a start, not the finish. the GOP has been talking about tort reform forever. this is probably where the issue should have started. they had 6 years of total control of everything under W. they could have passed anything they wanted to. did they accomplish anything in those 6 years?

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=dmek25;688742]then why don't they come up with their own ideas? instead of blasting the health care bill, come up with an alternative. don't just say its a Democratic idea, and it stinks. i do not totally agree with the bill. but i hoping its a start, not the finish. the GOP has been talking about tort reform forever. this is probably where the issue should have started. [B]they had 6 years of total control of everything under W. they could have passed anything they wanted to. did they accomplish anything in those 6 years?[/B] [/quote]

They did none of the things they're talking about now, other than pay lip service to tort reform.

Nope. Instead of working to eliminate ridiculous mandates, remove the barriers to allow the purchase of health coverage across state lines, make the cost of health insurance tax deductible, they added another [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_Prescription_Drug,_Improvement,_and_Modernization_Act"]entitlement[/URL].

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Beemnseven;688832]They did none of the things they're talking about now, other than pay lip service to tort reform.

Nope. Instead of working to eliminate ridiculous mandates, remove the barriers to allow the purchase of health coverage across state lines, make the cost of health insurance tax deductible, they added another [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_Prescription_Drug,_Improvement,_and_Modernization_Act"]entitlement[/URL].[/quote]


Are you a supporter of the Republican party or their base of operations the TEA party movement? IF so I wanted to say that those are some very good proposals. They should be included in the bill. THIS IS A SERIOUS post "queue for a good tramp diss" .

One question, and this is a rhetorical question. (So tramp can keep up;)

This is why you guys can not be trusted. You have all the solutions to the health care problem and choose not to share this with the country. Choose not to participate in a very serious new bill. Choose a strategy as insurgents (Who the hell came up with that image?), this is not Iraq. This is the country you want to lead. That leads to the real question, if you guys were in charge where would you lead us? (oops that was rhetorical) Return us to the rules of 1776 with the technology of 2010? Let you guys shape the future when we know you had all the answers all along and you left the American people to suffer. Are you punishing us? You choose not to listen or give your plan, yet I should trust you to lead me? The last president was Bush, he started with a budget surplus and he ended with record deficits. He let the twin towers fall. He let thousands drown in New Orleans, he could not catch a 70 year old man on kidney dialysis, he got on national TV and announced he was removing over 700 million dollars out the treasury to give to Wall Street, the worse recession since the great depression, the space shuttle blew up (bad luck factor evidence), Cheney shot his homeboy in the face, Israel's 1st defeat (Condi was pulling the UN levers), Sunami killed 100's of thousands, 8 million jobs lost, etc.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;688839]Are you a supporter of the Republican party or their base of operations the TEA party movement? IF so I wanted to say that those are some very good proposals. They should be included in the bill. THIS IS A SERIOUS post "queue for a good tramp diss" .

One question, and this is a rhetorical question. (So tramp can keep up;)

This is why you guys can not be trusted. You have all the solutions to the health care problem and choose not to share this with the country. Choose not to participate in a very serious new bill. Choose a strategy as insurgents (Who the hell came up with that image?), this is not Iraq. This is the country you want to lead. That leads to the real question, if you guys were in charge where would you lead us? (oops that was rhetorical) Return us to the rules of 1776 with the technology of 2010? Let you guys shape the future when we know you had all the answers all along and you left the American people to suffer. Are you punishing us? You choose not to listen or give your plan, yet I should trust you to lead me? The last president was Bush, he started with a budget surplus and he ended with record deficits. He let the twin towers fall. He let thousands drown in New Orleans, he could not catch a 70 year old man on kidney dialysis, he got on national TV and announced he was removing over 700 million dollars out the treasury to give to Wall Street, the worse recession since the great depression, the space shuttle blew up (bad luck factor evidence), Cheney shot his homeboy in the face, Israel's 1st defeat (Condi was pulling the UN levers), Sunami killed 100's of thousands, 8 million jobs lost, etc.[/quote]
Worst post of all time . Blame America < bush > for 9-11 ?? The CIA and FBI directors were Clinton appointees . The intel angency's were hampered by another Clinton Appt. ...[URL="http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/09/mistress_of_disaster_jamie_gor.html"]American Thinker: Mistress of Disaster: Jamie Gorelick[/URL] who along with fellow Clinton appt. commited accounting fraud at Fannie and AIG ....[URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32845-2005Apr6.html"]False Signatures Aided Fannie Mae Bonuses, Falcon Says (washingtonpost.com)[/URL] In Sept. 2003 the Bush admin. had reg's on capitol hill [URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/business/new-agency-proposed-to-oversee-freddie-mac-and-fannie-mae.html?sec=&spon=&&scp=3&sq=%202003%20fannie%20freddie%20labaton&st=cse"]New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae - NYTimes.com[/URL] only to have dems like M. Waters kill the reg reform ... [URL]http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008a10/11/maxine-waters-caught-lying-about-fannie-mae-ties-real-time[/URL] and Clintons Tres. Sec , running Citi and .....[URL="http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0410/35515.html"]Robert Rubin returns - Eamon Javers - POLITICO.com[/URL] ...[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Rubin..http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis[/URL] so you can see the facts point to Clintons admin ... they signed the bills into law , CRA / Subprime Lending / eliminated the glass-steagal acthttp://www.articlesbase.com/real-estate-articles/the-glasssteagall-acts-loss-is-the-community-reinvestment-acts-gain-731738.html , ran our banks , GSE's and had Frank and Dodd running the house /senate finance committee's ,,,,,, facts , facts , no hope in dope :) Oh and if you did not know this , as far as Katrina , only the States Gov. can order an evacuation , which she declined to do , nor would she accept the help of the Nat. Guard .... offered by the the Bush Admin. Facts , facts .... no hope in dope :)

Re: Obama Care
 

I'm sure you guys will find a way to be upset about this too...

[URL="http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126034014"]Obama: Hospitals Must Grant Same-Sex Visitations[/URL]

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=budw38;688897]Worst post of all time . Blame America < bush > for 9-11 ?? The CIA and FBI directors were Clinton appointees . The intel angency's were hampered by another Clinton Appt. ...[URL="http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/09/mistress_of_disaster_jamie_gor.html"]American Thinker: Mistress of Disaster: Jamie Gorelick[/URL] who along with fellow Clinton appt. commited accounting fraud at Fannie and AIG ....[URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32845-2005Apr6.html"]False Signatures Aided Fannie Mae Bonuses, Falcon Says (washingtonpost.com)[/URL] In Sept. 2003 the Bush admin. had reg's on capitol hill [URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/business/new-agency-proposed-to-oversee-freddie-mac-and-fannie-mae.html?sec=&spon=&&scp=3&sq=%202003%20fannie%20freddie%20labaton&st=cse"]New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae - NYTimes.com[/URL] only to have dems like M. Waters kill the reg reform ... [URL]http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008a10/11/maxine-waters-caught-lying-about-fannie-mae-ties-real-time[/URL] and Clintons Tres. Sec , running Citi and .....[URL="http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0410/35515.html"]Robert Rubin returns - Eamon Javers - POLITICO.com[/URL] ...[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Rubin..http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis[/URL] so you can see the facts point to Clintons admin ... they signed the bills into law , CRA / Subprime Lending / eliminated the glass-steagal acthttp://www.articlesbase.com/real-estate-articles/the-glasssteagall-acts-loss-is-the-community-reinvestment-acts-gain-731738.html , ran our banks , GSE's and had Frank and Dodd running the house /senate finance committee's ,,,,,, facts , facts , no hope in dope :) Oh and if you did not know this , as far as Katrina , only the States Gov. can order an evacuation , which she declined to do , nor would she accept the help of the Nat. Guard .... offered by the the Bush Admin. Facts , facts .... no hope in dope :)[/quote]

Don't even try the subprime blame game. Most foreclosures were people with multiple mortgages. You had people with 6 or 7 mortgages, counting on rising housing prices to make a profit. These are the people who can walk away, because they have homes. There were a few that defaulted, and this was their first home and only home, in those cases it wasn't the subprime mortagage. Beazer homes had people (couples) defaulting on 700 dollar a month mortgages (drug problems). Blame greed and speculation. The reason they had to make subprime mortgages "oh yeah, remember Bush's reelection campaign (Ownership Society)". Democrats had congress for 2 years, republicans for 6. None of their magic cures for america's ills were implemented. Atleast THE democrats can implement an agenda. Ownership society was a money grab plan, they made no stipulation about how many or who gets the subprime loans. They figured two years was all they needed to sell the homes. So they bought many mortgages. Dumbasses built too many houses and market forces forced prices down. Foiled again!!!! The rest is history, first black president etc.

Re: Obama Care
 

SUBPRIME

example Miami housing market :

Most mortgages that defaulted were those without nay tenants. Notice all the condo's without nay residents that went belly up!! The risk in subprimes came from people gambling, if I pay a fraction of the mortgage for two years the housing prices rise and if I can sell the house before my mortgage resets to a higher amount I make a profit. subrpimes allowed some people to over extend themselves, copycats begat copycats.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;688996][SIZE=3]Don't even try the subprime blame game. Most foreclosures were people with multiple mortgages. You had people with 6 or 7 mortgages, counting on rising housing prices to make a profit.[/SIZE] These are the people who can walk away, because they have homes. There were a few that defaulted, and this was their first home and only home, in those cases it wasn't the subprime mortagage. Beazer homes had people (couples) defaulting on 700 dollar a month mortgages (drug problems). Blame greed and speculation. The reason they had to make subprime mortgages "oh yeah, remember Bush's reelection campaign (Ownership Society)". Democrats had congress for 2 years, republicans for 6. None of their magic cures for america's ills were implemented. Atleast THE democrats can implement an agenda. Ownership society was a money grab plan, they made no stipulation about how many or who gets the subprime loans. They figured two years was all they needed to sell the homes. So they bought many mortgages. Dumbasses built too many houses and market forces forced prices down. Foiled again!!!! The rest is history, first black president etc.[/quote]
Please provide some data to back that. You really should read up on stuff because you have no clue what your talking about.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=jdlea;688994]I'm sure you guys will find a way to be upset about this too...

[URL="http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126034014"]Obama: Hospitals Must Grant Same-Sex Visitations[/URL][/quote]

From that article:

[quote]J.P. Duffy, vice president for communications at the Family Research Council, said Obama is pandering to a radical special interest group.

"There are many other ways to deal with this issue, whether through a health care proxy or power of attorney, through private contractual arrangements. We have no problem with those situations," Duffy said, [B]"but the fact here is that this is undermining the definition of marriage." [/B][/quote]

How? A sick, or terminally ill patient wants to be with their partner and that's 'undermining the definition of marriage' ??

I'm so damn sick of the nutcases at Family Research Council I don't know what to do. If only the writer of that article would have told this douchebag Duffy to bury his nose in his bible if he wants to but leave everybody else the F alone.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;564213]What did I tell ya? These fools think health insurance is a human right. :bs:[/quote]

exactly...it's not, it's a privelage, and should be treated as such.

what's the point of working to get ahead in this society, you'll just get taxed so much it's pointless. If you live on welfare you are making more than minimum wage...and that is ridiculous.

Now I don't mind it if people need help and need the hand up, but I just wish the gov't would make them do something. Could you imagine if you had to go scrub toilets to pick up your gov't check, how many people would be looking for employment at the local mcd's?

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Beemnseven;689060]From that article:



How? A sick, or terminally ill patient wants to be with their partner and that's 'undermining the definition of marriage' ??

I'm so damn sick of the nutcases at Family Research Council I don't know what to do. If only the writer of that article would have told this douchebag Duffy to bury his nose in his bible if he wants to but leave everybody else the F alone.[/quote]

I really don't see why anyone would care who someone wants by their side when they are sick so whats the big deal.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;689028]Please provide some data to back that. You really should read up on stuff because you have no clue what your talking about.[/quote]

Next time I will include quotes from blogs. LOL!!!

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;689074]Next time I will include quotes from blogs. LOL!!![/quote]
The only reason I asked is because for what I have seen and read most foreclosurs are coming from homeowners living in their homes. I'm sure there is some people loosing investment properties but I would think thats a small %. I do know the problem with investors and people buying 2nd homes in FL. was bigger than in most areas. Actually now is the time to buy that 2nd home in FL.

Re: Obama Care
 

Those numbers have not been totally forth coming. Those are the numbers that we need right now. When you have cvondos sold out before their finihsed, and now all of them are empty. Interesting.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;689141]Those numbers have not been totally forth coming. Those are the numbers that we need right now. When you have cvondos sold out before their finihsed, and now all of them are empty. Interesting.[/quote]

Back in that market it was very common for the condos or homes to be sold before they were even built. My buddy purchased a home and the contractor took 1 1/2 years to build the house. The market was going crazy and now this home he purchased for 280,000 was now selling for 420,000. He never moved into the house and sold it the same day he colsed on the house and he purchased another home.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;689213]Back in that market it was very common for the condos or homes to be sold before they were even built. My buddy purchased a home and the contractor took 1 1/2 years to build the house. The market was going crazy and now this home he purchased for 280,000 was now selling for 420,000. He never moved into the house and sold it the same day he colsed on the house and he purchased another home.[/quote]

Nice move, but greed caused some people to try that with let's say 5 condos. The lax oversight and subprime loans made the perfect environment so people could do this. Ii know fools who were declaring themsleves millionaires over night. Everybody was getting in the game and it became saturated. When the wheels started coming off those who took the high risk high reward route teeter tottered the damn country.

Re: Obama Care
 

Bush owns this for one simple reason. He was relected because of it. He barely won, he took that issue from the Democrats and it was a nice nice political move. Slogan "Ownership Society". A utopia where all people own their own property and get tax breaks for it. Result = deficit hell. We had to borrow more money because the tax cuts left the revenue pool drained and America was spoiled from the tax cuts, just like entitlements make people spoiled also. don't even mentioned the war. He tried to solve the Israeli/Palestinian conflict by taking Iraq out the picture. This blew ozygen on the flame.

Neocons are not good strategists.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;689263]Nice move, but greed caused some people to try that with let's say 5 condos. The lax oversight and subprime loans made the perfect environment so people could do this. Ii know fools who were declaring themsleves millionaires over night. Everybody was getting in the game and it became saturated. When the wheels started coming off those who took the high risk high reward route teeter tottered the damn country.[/quote]

Why do you think all this was done on subprime loans? Many of these people had regular loans its just that he market went flat and they are now stuck with a bad investment that they cannot sell. I also don't remember Bush running on everyone should own a home.

Re: Obama Care
 

[url=http://www.hud.gov/news/speeches/presremarks.cfm]Remarks by the President on Homeownership - HUD[/url]

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Mattyk;689853][URL="http://www.hud.gov/news/speeches/presremarks.cfm"]Remarks by the President on Homeownership - HUD[/URL][/quote]


It's official, Bush is definitely not a conservative.

Re: Obama Care
 

Welcome all conservatives while yall are tying to relive 1776, I will live for the future. Guess hwo is gonna win? We must unite Earth under one government how else will we achieve Star Trek status. I will gladly help set the stage for the future federation of planets and not live with you Ferengi.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Mattyk;689853][URL="http://www.hud.gov/news/speeches/presremarks.cfm"]Remarks by the President on Homeownership - HUD[/URL][/quote]

I know he talked about home ownership JTFan said he based his whole campain off this which I don't remember. He could have I remember it more about finishing the war on terrorism and Iraq.

Re: Obama Care
 

Not a fan of this at all:

[url=http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/insurance/2010-04-29-healthirs28_CV_N.htm]IRS lacks clout to enforce mandatory health insurance - USATODAY.com[/url]

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;564161]Well it seem's that ABC is in Obama's corner [/B]and they will not allow any opposing views to [B]his Socialized health care. They are going to hand pick the audience (might as well say hand pick the questions) and [B]it seems Obama is running ABC now as well. Am I living in China or Iran?[/B]
[url=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/18/critics-attack-abc-news-refusing-air-opposing-ads-obamas-health-care-special/]Critics Attack ABC News for Refusing to Air Opposing Ads During Obama's Health Care Special - Political News - FOXNews.com[/url][/quote]


pretty sure you might be living on Pluto.

i'm not reading this thread.

Re: Obama Care
 

Rainy,

If you are gonna read through this thread, you may need Obama Care by the end :)

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;698597]pretty sure you might be living on Pluto.

i'm not reading this thread.[/quote]

So you really went back to a post I made a year ago about ABC giving Obama a avenue to present his health care bill without a voice from the opposition. You know you can do a search online in about 30 sec. and see that was correct.

[url=http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2009/06/17/2009-06-17_abc_pledges_gop_a_healthy_debate.html]ABC promises Republicans health care coverage won't be Obama 'infomercial'[/url]

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=firstdown;698611]So you really went back to a post I made a year ago about ABC giving Obama a avenue to present his health care bill without a voice from the opposition. You know you can do a search online in about 30 sec. and see that was correct.

[url=http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2009/06/17/2009-06-17_abc_pledges_gop_a_healthy_debate.html]ABC promises Republicans health care coverage won't be Obama 'infomercial'[/url][/quote]


actually, dont flatter yourself, i was just scrolling down thru the forum and saw it.

Re: Obama Care
 

Plus this is kind of our official unofficial health care thread the ABC portion of it got lost about 77 pages ago.

Re: Obama Care
 

[quote=Rainy Parade;698614]actually, dont flatter yourself, i was just scrolling down thru the forum and saw it.[/quote]

You say I must be from Pluto but your starting to sound like Goffy.

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Goofy.svg"][IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a6/Goofy.svg/130px-Goofy.svg.png[/IMG][/URL]

Re: Obama Care
 

Kinda helps if you can at least spell Goofy