Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=SCRedskinsFan;1359522]So I guess Patrick Mahomes is a "pocket" quarterback?

I think what we're seeing is a new "post Brady" model of an elite quarterback. One that can drop the dime, with touch when necessary, but is able to consistently make plays in AND out of the pocket. I think excellent mobility has come to be a expected trait of today's top tier quarterbacks. That's in addition to all the other qualities, mental and physical, you expect to see, of course.[/quote]

There's a difference between mobile and running QB's. A mobile QB can run adequately or even very well, when the situation demands. But they are still primarily pocket passers. They win primarily with air yards not ground yards. Running QB's are defendable. Just look at what KC did to Jackson as evidence.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Giantone;1359518]Not sure I agree with your assessment. There have been a few mobile QB's in the Super Bowl era that have taken or even won a Super bowl, not many I agree but a few.

Tarkington

Staubach

Young

Elway , all were at their time considerd running / moble QB's then there was a newer version...........

Kaepernick

Newton
maybe even.

R. Wilson[/quote]

Thanks for the correction, I meant to go with win a SB but when I changed it to appearances I omitted Cam and Kap. Wilson should be on the list as well. I am not considering Elway, Young Staubach etc because they were pass first QBs who had the ability to run but didn't do it that often.

So we are still left with Wilson as the only super mobile QB who has won a title.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=SCRedskinsFan;1359522]So I guess Patrick Mahomes is a "pocket" quarterback?

I think what we're seeing is a new "post Brady" model of an elite quarterback. One that can drop the dime, with touch when necessary, but is able to consistently make plays in AND out of the pocket. I think excellent mobility has come to be a expected trait of today's top tier quarterbacks. That's in addition to all the other qualities, mental and physical, you expect to see, of course.[/quote]

Yes. He does most of his damage from the pocket or creating off script. I don't consider him in the same group with Lamar, Kyler etc. who rely on their running more than Mahomes.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

The best qb's watch so much film that they're rarely surprised by a coverage they see pre-snap. It's one thing to have the physical attributes that a Drake Maye or a Jayden Daniels has, what is going to determine their success is how bad they want it. If they want it bad enough they'll live religiously in the film room until they can identify 90% of what a defense is going to do. That's what this coaching staff has to figure out - which prospect is going to put in the work to be great. Tons of guys who had the athleticism to be great but never put in the work watching tape.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[QUOTE=mooby;1359533]The best qb's watch so much film that they're rarely surprised by a coverage they see pre-snap. It's one thing to have the physical attributes that a Drake Maye or a Jayden Daniels has, what is going to determine their success is how bad they want it. If they want it bad enough they'll live religiously in the film room until they can identify 90% of what a defense is going to do. That's what this coaching staff has to figure out - which prospect is going to put in the work to be great. Tons of guys who had the athleticism to be great but never put in the work watching tape.[/QUOTE]Your comment made me wonder if now that they get paid in college the ones that don't really want it as bad will be easier to identify. In other words how did a player react after his first big check. Maybe the transition to the NFL and really big paydays won't be quite as drastic.

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Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Darrell Green Fan;1359530]Thanks for the correction, I meant to go with win a SB but when I changed it to appearances I omitted Cam and Kap. Wilson should be on the list as well. I am not considering Elway, Young Staubach etc because they were pass first QBs who had the ability to run but didn't do it that often.

So we are still left with Wilson as the only super mobile QB who has won a title.[/quote]

I wouldn't so easily dismiss Young or Elway as not running very often. 4329 and 3407 respectively, both with a very good average YPC. Given their era where passers were pretty much purely pocket passers, those aren't casual numbers. They'd be closer too Mahomes (mobile) than Jackson (running), but having watched them play, I'd put them on the scale closer to Jackson than Mahomes.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=AnonEmouse;1359548]I wouldn't so easily dismiss Young or Elway as not running very often. 4329 and 3407 respectively, both with a very good average YPC. Given their era where passers were pretty much purely pocket passers, those aren't casual numbers. They'd be closer too Mahomes (mobile) than Jackson (running), but having watched them play, I'd put them on the scale closer to Jackson than Mahomes.[/quote]

Yeah but we are talking about 2 of the elite passers of our lifetime and that's what made them all time greats. Young averaged 25 rushing yards a game, Elway 14. So I can't put them in the same group as Lamar, Kyler, Vick etc. because they were different types of QBs.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Couple things I’ve heard from the so called experts about this draft class coming out:

1. Great at class at every position along the Oline. Deep
2. Weak class at TE and pass rushers.
3. Inside Dline and WR class is solid.
4. Considered a decent QB class.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1359553]Couple things I’ve heard from the so called experts about this draft class coming out:

1. Great at class at every position along the Oline. Deep
2. Weak class at TE and pass rushers.
3. Inside Dline and WR class is solid.
4. Considered a decent QB class.[/quote]

While I would broadly agree with your list, I would take issue with the fourth item, I think they consider it as good to great, the top two going into this were ranked in the top five QBs in the last decade in terms of rating coming out of college.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

#2 is why we need to make Fant, Gesicki, or Schultz a priority, and target a couple Edge Rushers.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1359555]#2 is why we need to make Fant, Gesicki, or Schultz a priority, and target a couple Edge Rushers.[/quote]

Agreed except for Fant - for some reason, he haven't become the player everyone expected him to be after the draft. Also, I would be surprised if Texans don't resign Schultz.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

The bears all but came out and said JF is gone.

Adam S posted it on X earlier


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Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Fields should be happy that he's getting out of Chicago. But just not sure there are going to be a lot of suiters for him as far as being a starter is concerned. Maybe
Atlanta or New England.

Caleb is going to go there and he is going to really struggle. I feel like his only shot is when they blow out Euberflus, bring in an offense first coach that can really develop him. Maybe Kingsberry would possibly go after this year.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=GridIron26;1359556]Agreed except for Fant - for some reason, he haven't become the player everyone expected him to be after the draft. Also, I would be surprised if Texans don't resign Schultz.[/quote]

The main reason is that he just hasn't been that involved. Only 106 total targets the last two years with Seattle, compared to 177 for Schultz the last two years.

I think Fant would come cheaper and be just as (if not more ) productive here. He's a tad younger, just turning 26 as well.

Either way, can't bank on landing a good TE in the draft, so I think we have to go after one of the top TEs in FA.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1359542]Your comment made me wonder if now that they get paid in college the ones that don't really want it as bad will be easier to identify. In other words how did a player react after his first big check. Maybe the transition to the NFL and really big paydays won't be quite as drastic.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk[/quote]

That would make it so much easier to pick the right guy haha. We'll see I guess. Peters and co. have a tough decision to make, but one thing's for sure. If whoever they pick isn't the guy they need to keep swinging for the fences until they get that position locked down. Without it they'll be wasting years like Ron did.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

If you build it (draft Daniels), they (victories) will come.

[IMG]https://gray-wvue-prod.cdn.arcpublishing.com/resizer/v2/2I3AHLBRKFHEVC2YR347G6IVPI.jpg?auth=73b866f5ee23f8d2f29bb42ac02c99893d1182dec8c138bd2a7b4cd66bdb4d87&width=800&height=450&smart=true[/IMG]

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Is he gonna be the pick?

Gotta figure Williams is going #1, to CHI or someone else...

It's Drake Maye, Jayden Daniels or trade. As much as I'd like a haul of draft picks, it's going to be tough to pass on one of those QBs.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;1359564]Is he gonna be the pick?

Gotta figure Williams is going #1, to CHI or someone else...

It's Drake Maye, Jayden Daniels or trade. As much as I'd like a haul of draft picks, it's going to be tough to pass on one of those QBs.[/quote]

No when you get the chance to draft a highly rated QB you pull the trigger and don't look back.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

I just turned on the Junkies and Quinn was on there. He was describing some of the QB's w/ one word, all nice stuff. But when they asked him about Daniels he said, " game changer" .. In other words, it was obvious that he likes Daniels above the other guys that were mentioned... Maye, Caleb, Howell...

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

I think they're going to be perfectly happy with taking Daniels at #2.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[IMG]https://media1.tenor.com/m/6d6UU4WS8-kAAAAC/jayden-daniels-lsu.gif[/IMG]

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

If you listen to his reply it could equally point to Maye. Deep ball accuracy was one of the points he mentioned. I think all three QBs are going to be good, I just don't want them to pick one based on a fit with "this years scheme", it should be the best QB regardless of scheme.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Just don’t move up and lose draft picks. If you get a guy and he sucks, swing again next year with another pick on a QB.

I think the Trey Lance and Brock Purdy experience lessons matter to Peters.

Why move up for a gamble like Lance? Even if it’s one spot you impact a roster that’s in much more dire need of talent. And you got a starter the next year in Purdy late in the draft. It can be done.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=EdmundDorf;1359573]If you listen to his reply it could equally point to Maye. Deep ball accuracy was one of the points he mentioned. I think all three QBs are going to be good, [B]I just don't want them to pick one based on a fit with "this years scheme", it should be the best QB regardless of scheme.[/B][/quote]

Agreed. I wouldn't be surprised if Kliff will interview for head coach position if our offense plays well this year and/or next year, so Quinn must make sure that we create a system that ensures all players are in the position to play well regardless of who the coordinators are. Quinn actually mentioned this part in one of his media presses, he said he learned this lesson when Kyle left Falcons to become head coach for 49ers and Quinn allowed Kyle's assistants to follow Kyle to 49ers and hired a new offense coordinator who wanted to install a new offense system, this move ended up making things difficult for the offense players.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1359567]I think they're going to be perfectly happy with taking Daniels at #2.[/QUOTE]


As should we all be


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Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[url]https://sports.yahoo.com/jayden-daniels-nfl-draft-stock-has-risen-more-than-anyone-but-will-he-live-up-to-it-021631977.html[/url]

I see RG3 part 2. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, IF he knows how to protect himself. But in the limited watching that I did, I never saw him slide. And I saw him take a hit exactly like the one that knocked RG3 out.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Maye been getting some bad press of late:

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj_z3rm3lhg&t=732s[/url]

i almost have it in my head from everything i have read/listen

daniels/williams/maye that order

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1359586][url]https://sports.yahoo.com/jayden-daniels-nfl-draft-stock-has-risen-more-than-anyone-but-will-he-live-up-to-it-021631977.html[/url]

I see RG3 part 2. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, IF he knows how to protect himself. But in the limited watching that I did, I never saw him slide. And I saw him take a hit exactly like the one that knocked RG3 out.[/quote]

This is exactly what I’ve been warning about. The kid is a heck of an athlete. I’m increasingly concerned that he is not an NFL QB.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1359586][url]https://sports.yahoo.com/jayden-daniels-nfl-draft-stock-has-risen-more-than-anyone-but-will-he-live-up-to-it-021631977.html[/url]

[B]I see RG3 part 2. [/B] Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, IF he knows how to protect himself. But in the limited watching that I did, I never saw him slide. And I saw him take a hit exactly like the one that knocked RG3 out.[/quote]

Agree but with the knowledge of hindsight could RG3 been better managed and could he had become a Lamar type QB.

When it was all clicking and they rotated in Kirk at times as the true pocket passer guy, man that was awesome. Imagine JD and SH in that one two combo

I much rather roll the dice on RG3 2.0 then SH 2.0 (Maye); we already got SH 1.0 and he is still under warranty

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Redskin Jim;1359591]This is exactly what I’ve been warning about. The kid is a heck of an athlete. I’m increasingly concerned that he is not an NFL QB.[/quote]

High scramble rate and doesn’t throw between the numbers in the field are flashing bad signs. The reason he not throwing middle of field is because he can’t.

In college you can get away with it, not gonna work in the nfl

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1359586][url]https://sports.yahoo.com/jayden-daniels-nfl-draft-stock-has-risen-more-than-anyone-but-will-he-live-up-to-it-021631977.html[/url]

I see RG3 part 2. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, IF he knows how to protect himself. But in the limited watching that I did, I never saw him slide. And I saw him take a hit exactly like the one that knocked RG3 out.[/quote]

The thing is, none of the people making this QB decision was here for RG3...so they don't have those memories to make the comparison like we all do. He did take a lot of hits, same as RG3...and so it makes me think that it's going to be hard to coach that out of him too...again like RG3. He's just so thin...and those 2 things combined are my concerns with him. Just look at the Bengals, as good as Burrow is when he plays, he's been often injured so already a couple of lost seasons because of that. It's a big factor.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Less than 2 months until we take another 1st round swing at QB1. RG3 didn't workout for us, so the 50/50 odds say this time should be our gold-strike.

I want Daniels, but it's like 60/40, where I won't be throwing my remote if Maye is the choice.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Redskins247;1359597]The thing is, none of the people making this QB decision was here for RG3...[B]so they don't have those memories to make the comparison like we all do.[/B] He did take a lot of hits, same as RG3...and so it makes me think that it's going to be hard to coach that out of him too...again like RG3. He's just so thin...and those 2 things combined are my concerns with him. Just look at the Bengals, as good as Burrow is when he plays, he's been often injured so already a couple of lost seasons because of that. It's a big factor.[/quote]

Bro, come on

there is film on RG3 and i am sure a ton of paperwork at Commanders Park ; they have more insight then a commanders form filled with Monday morning QBs

But i do agree injury is a major factor to consider ; even Lamar has had his shorten seasons

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Jayden Daniels - I get the RGIII comparisons.
One difference I see is RGIII tore his right knee ACL in his sophomore year in college. That same knee in week 14 of his NFL rookie year was reinjured by Ravens Haloti Ngata, causing RGIII to miss next game. His knee was comprised, ending in the ACL, LCL and meniscus tear in Seahawks game a few weeks later. That right knee ended his career because his scrambling and confidence were eroded.
By comparison Jayden Daniels’ wheels are good. He has had no major injury in college.
Jayden escaped college football relatively intact. I like that. He is my favorite of the three QB’s at the top of this draft. I do like the other two.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=mredskins;1359600]Bro, come on

there is film on RG3 and i am sure a ton of paperwork at Commanders Park ; they have more insight then a commanders form filled with Monday morning QBs

But i do agree injury is a major factor to consider ; even Lamar has had his shorten seasons[/quote]

I just meant that it's easy for US to make that comparison to RG3 because we all lived every play of his career...they didn't, and why would they look back at that.

Maybe much more concerning is that Josh Harris is sitting in on all the QB interviews at the combine...if that doesn't sound like Snyder, I don't know what does. Hopefully he just wants to see how the process all works because he's just curious.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Redskins247;1359603]I just meant that it's easy for US to make that comparison to RG3 because we all lived every play of his career...they didn't, and why would they look back at that.

Maybe much more concerning is that Josh Harris is sitting in on all the QB interviews at the combine...if that doesn't sound like Snyder, I don't know what does. Hopefully he just wants to see how the process all works because he's just curious.[/quote]

i agree with you rg3 probably isn't in their thought process just saying their is plenty of historical data if they wanted too

i compare today to more a lamar type (6-2 216lb); lamar actually added size this off season made it through the year and was mvp

As far harris he is fine; its a big difference if your boss comes to the meeting and he his hitler versus jfk

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Chico23231;1359574]Just don’t move up and lose draft picks. If you get a guy and he sucks, swing again next year with another pick on a QB.

I think the Trey Lance and Brock Purdy experience lessons matter to Peters.

Why move up for a gamble like Lance? Even if it’s one spot you impact a roster that’s in much more dire need of talent. And you got a starter the next year in Purdy late in the draft. It can be done.[/quote]

You move up because you think he will be a game changer.
If the team thinks Caleb Williams will be anywhere near Mahomes then you have to make the trade.

The Chiefs won the Super Bowl with only one first round pick (Mahomes) starting on offense.
It's by far more important to have an elite QB than any other position by far.

Also, the Trey Lance trade didn't really set SF back. End of the day, they still are stacked with talent.

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[quote=Redskins247;1359603]I just meant that it's easy for US to make that comparison to RG3 because we all lived every play of his career...they didn't, and why would they look back at that.

Maybe much more concerning is that Josh Harris is sitting in on all the QB interviews at the combine...if that doesn't sound like Snyder, I don't know what does. Hopefully he just wants to see how the process all works because he's just curious.[/quote]

Peters said in the beginning that decisions where going to be made by the group. Everyone one of them, including Harris bring something different to the table. Harris finding out who the man is he might be hiring is just smart business. As long as he is letting the football men vet the football side of things then i am fine with it!!

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

Its down to JD5 and Maye.. I trust DQ and KK

Re: 2024 Early Bird Draft Thread
 

[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/Lxz8qb9/PFN-Draft-result-1709248979738.png[/IMG]