Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=over the mountain;516237]the past 5-8 years we've had a great O line and the results were the same: 7-9 to 9-7. this year the O line was a problem for about 8 games and all of the sudden its the O lines fault weve had a below average passing game for a decade now?

i love our O line guys, tired of seeing them made out to be a scapegoat this year when theyve been our bread and butter for years and we still had no passing game.

the problems this team has have been here for awhile, well before the O line started to age and decline.

sorry man, what you say is true just wish we could sprinkle the blame to other areas of the team too.

go skins!![/quote]

mountain, so do you think the blame is on JC??
Could it be that JG had no spine and refused to air the ball out and was working with an antiquated offense?? And you answered you're question yourself, the last 5-8 years...the unit is old!!!
Chris Samuels has been in the league 9 years, Rabach - 8, Kendall - 13, Thomas - 10, Jansen - 10
It is time to inject some youth into the offensive trenches, Clinton Portis should be running free over everyone

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=Paintrain;516358]I'd be fine trading Rogers for a 2nd round pick if we can get that. He's a decent corner, he doesn't suck but he's far from elite. The kid can't catch anything, makes some plays but gets burnt more than his fair share of times. There's a decent number of quality CB on the free agent market so if he goes he would be easily replaced.[/quote]

So you'd like to give up on a top 10 pick who, quite frankly, played at an elite level during the first half of the season after coming back from serious knee surgery the year before and who has a year left on his rookie deal for a 2nd round pick? Add to that you'd be handing this 2nd round pick to Vinny Cerrato who will (I guess) turn around a pick a corner high in the draft. And I guess that would also mean giving D. Hall a boatload of money. No thanks. I can only hope this story is JLC running off at the mouth, but the end of the season demotion might suggest that it has some legs. I wish the team would trade for Scott Pioli instead.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=Paintrain;516358]I'd be fine trading Rogers for a 2nd round pick if we can get that. He's a decent corner, he doesn't suck but he's far from elite. The kid can't catch anything, makes some plays but gets burnt more than his fair share of times. There's a decent number of quality CB on the free agent market so if he goes he would be easily replaced.[/quote]

I dont see the point in trading a first round corner with experience for a 2nd round pick....this screams out stupid....not to mention, this would leave us with a bad option at the 2nd corner...either smoot or the oft injuried Springs.

Do any of you honestly think we could get a better starting corner with a 2nd round pick than Rogers with all his experience....especially with vinny making the selection?
His 2nd round picks haven't been that great....not to mention...we blew our 2nd rounder on MR..."whats a sack" Taylor

Rogers is a young talent...one of the few on our team...to trade him would be idiotic...if you are gunna trade someone, trade Portis...you'll get massive value there for a guy that is going to get injured more and more....that is crazy, but at least it makes sense since his value is peaking. Hell, trade Cooley and Samuels while your at it and get monster linemen and draft picks in return!

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

Damn, doesn't even seem like he has the I hope to remain a Redskins like a lot of guys.. damn shame

Here's to hoping that he gets a good deal somewhere and learns that his hands catch balls, somewhere that we never play, because our number 1 receiver will prob never get a catch on him

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

Sorry to make the double post, but if rogers is gone.. hall is number 1, springs might be back, sometimes possibly at FS, that our secondary will no longer be nearly as dominant

springs and rogers shut down the big divisional opposition this year... I don't see that coming from smoot, hall (though i support keeping him), or definitely tryon

tryon is a young smoot, nickel at best

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

Carlos isn't going anywhere. I like JLC but this article is pure speculation. Just because Rogers doesn't like how he is being used doesn't mean he is leaving. Why would the FO get rid of a guy that they drafted in the 1st round only a few years ago? Oh wait we are talking about Vinny.

Anyway... Carlos's attitude is the epitome of what is wrong with the Skins. Average to good players thinking they are "superstars". News flash to #22... superstar CBs can catch. You can talk about how tons of teams would give their right arm for your services but you haven't won jack in the NFL. Not saying 22 isn't a good player, just that his attitude is representive of a larger problem in the locker room. And in my opinion this attitude comes from the FO overpaying good (not great players) who show "potential" but haven't proven they are elite players before giving them the big contracts.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=tryfuhl;516393]Sorry to make the double post, but if rogers is gone.. hall is number 1, springs might be back, sometimes possibly at FS, that our secondary will no longer be nearly as dominant

springs and rogers shut down the big divisional opposition this year... I don't see that coming from smoot, hall (though i support keeping him), or definitely tryon

tryon is a young smoot, nickel at best[/quote]


I don't understand why you get rid of Rodgers and keep Springs... that is beyond absurd in my opinion. Classic Vinny move if it happens.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

A couple points on trading Rogers-
1. He's not elite, nowhere close. He has terrible hands, has no history of shutting down elite WR-in fact I'd challenge anyone to point out one time he has done such-and isn't feared by coordinators or QB in the league.
2. Despite him being a top 10 pick, he is not in the top 40 in his position. There are dozens of Carlos Rogers out there in the league. He's a guy that won't kill you but won't really help you either. He doesn't change field position for your team, doesn't put points on the board and doesn't do anything 'special'. There are a dozen CB on the free agent market that will be more affordable and represent the same level of play if not better. Losing him is no great loss on the field.
3. He's going into a contract year, is well known to have an excessively high opinion of himself and is going to try to get top CB dollars. We're going to lose him with no compensation next year so it makes sense to get something while we can for him. A 2nd round pick would be a solid value for Rogers.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;516397]Carlos isn't going anywhere. I like JLC but this article is pure speculation. Just because Rogers doesn't like how he is being used doesn't mean he is leaving. Why would the FO get rid of a guy that they drafted in the 1st round only a few years ago? Oh wait we are talking about Vinny.

Anyway... Carlos's attitude is the epitome of what is wrong with the Skins. Average to good players thinking they are "superstars". News flash to #22... superstar CBs can catch. You can talk about how tons of teams would give their right arm for your services but you haven't won jack in the NFL. Not saying 22 isn't a good player, just that his attitude is representive of a larger problem in the locker room. And in my opinion this attitude comes from the FO overpaying good (not great players) who show "potential" but haven't proven they are elite players before giving them the big contracts.[/quote]

sooo.. he's not good enough to stay.. too good to leave?

which side are you taking?

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=skinsnut;516390]I dont see the point in trading a first round corner with experience for a 2nd round pick....this screams out stupid....not to mention, this would leave us with a bad option at the 2nd corner...either smoot or the oft injuried Springs.

Do any of you honestly think we could get a better starting corner with a 2nd round pick than Rogers with all his experience....especially with vinny making the selection?
His 2nd round picks haven't been that great....not to mention...we blew our 2nd rounder on MR..."whats a sack" Taylor

[B]Rogers is a young talent...one of the few on our team...to trade him would be idiotic...if you are gunna trade someone, trade Portis...you'll get massive value there for a guy that is going to get injured more and more....that is crazy, but at least it makes sense since his value is peaking. Hell, trade Cooley and Samuels while your at it and get monster linemen and draft picks in return[/B]![/quote]

Agree with all of this expect about trading Cooley.... he is one our only truly great players.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=tryfuhl;516400]sooo.. he's not good enough to stay.. too good to leave?

which side are you taking?[/quote]

Im not talking either side... I'm just saying that JLC article isn't really based on anything except that Rodgers is mad no one told him why he got demoted. Not really anything concrete that indicated he will leave.

I could really care less either way what he does... Average to slightly above average CB in my opinion.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=Paintrain;516399]A couple points on trading Rogers-
1. He's not elite, nowhere close. He has terrible hands, has no history of shutting down elite WR-in fact I'd challenge anyone to point out one time he has done such-and isn't feared by coordinators or QB in the league.
2. Despite him being a top 10 pick, he is not in the top 40 in his position. There are dozens of Carlos Rogers out there in the league. He's a guy that won't kill you but won't really help you either. He doesn't change field position for your team, doesn't put points on the board and doesn't do anything 'special'. There are a dozen CB on the free agent market that will be more affordable and represent the same level of play if not better. Losing him is no great loss on the field.
3. He's going into a contract year, is well known to have an excessively high opinion of himself and is going to try to get top CB dollars. We're going to lose him with no compensation next year so it makes sense to get something while we can for him. A 2nd round pick would be a solid value for Rogers.[/quote]

Excellent points. If he could catch we would a great player. Buts that a big if.

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;516401]Agree with all of this expect about trading Cooley.... he is one our only truly great players.[/quote]

Actually, if Cooley were traded, we supposedly have a pass catching 2nd rounder with solid talent right behind him.

And regarding those saying Rodgers is average...he is not...he would easiliy be the 2nd best corner on 80% of NFL Teams.
He would be the top corner on about 25% of them.

No, he doesn't get picks...but he is covering well, tackling well, understands positioning...he is a solid corner.
Of our 4 corners, he is arguably the best combination of age, skill, technique.
Springs would be the best, but he's old and gets injured.
Rodgers is good all around, not spectacular at anything, excellent fundementals
Smoot is undersized and has marginal cover skills...a good nickle at best.
Deangelo Hall has great age, like Rodgers, and is explosive and can get picks, but I worry about his weak fundementals, his undiciplined coverage tends to getting burned. Even though he has tackled well while with the Skins, he hasn't been the best.

Our best 1-2 punch is still Springs/Rodgers with Hall as a Nickle that can grab picks. If we can afford that, we need Rodgers as he is easily the most dependable of the 4.

Rating from 1-10 including all factors
8-Rodgers
8-Springs
7-Hall
6-Smoot

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

Sounds like Marcus Washington could be hitting the road as well.

[url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/2008/12/marcus_washington_perhaps_movi.html]Washington, Perhaps Moving On - Redskins Insider[/url]

Re: JLC: Rogers, Possibly on the Way Out
 

I said he value hasn't been higher since the draft, I would be willing to trade him, for a late 1st early second, maybe a second and a 3rd. Its a good time to trade rogers, package him with ARE.