Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

chemistry means alot in this league. to have wholesale changes every year would be stupid. i really think a change in quarterback would inject life into this team. and no, its not going to fix the disaster we have on defense, but we could possibly start outscoring some of these teams

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

Move Archuletta off the roster.....or off the planet....only move I would make.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

You guys aren't buying into JC not being good enough to supplant Brunell are you? Gibbs is afraid that his NFL inexperience won't equate to solid play since the whole team is adjusting to the new offense. Catch 22.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=The Zimmermans;236463]Yeah, I didn't merge the threads, they arent the same topic. One topic is what we should do, the next is what snyder and the rest of the staff will do. People need to stop pretending that snyder has no say in the personnel moves.[/quote]

Where is your proof that he has a say in personnel??

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

Snyder has the final say in everything, where's the proof that he doesn't?

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=GiantsSuck703;236589]Your really trying to tell me a Billionaire who took over the Redskins and made them the Highest grossing sports franchise in the United States is not Savvy enough, come on. I have no problem with having an owner that gives his coach everything he wants, or would you rather have an owner like the Cardinals. Why is it fun to bash Snyder about how much he charges to park and come to games, most of that money goes right back into the team, trust me Snyder does not need your money. Im damn proud to be able to go to the biggest and one of the loudest stadiums in the league, it has definately got better since Gibbs came back and when that stadium rocks you cant hear anything. And actually football is a business my friend, and what some dont seem to understand is that in the world of business men, like Danial Snyder, the goal is to make money, and I dont think hes that bad of an owner if he can take a team that has been pretty bad even before he took over and still make them a cash cow. Stop the Snyder bashing, he does not wear a uniform, he doesnt miss tackles.[/quote]
I'm not a fan of the business, and the top ranking revenue - I'm a fan of building a winner with staying power. I can't believe some of you feel Snyder is a genius skirting the cap every year. We carry more dead cap money than any team in the league. It's Gibbs attitude as well. I thought he'd bring roster stability upon his return, but he hasn't been able to retain core Redskins (Pierce, Smoot, Clark) because we have over-leveraged our cap every year. Teams like Philly and New England stay way under the cap to allow them to re-sign their core players as they APPROACH free agency. Both have done this brilliantly, and since they do so before their players hit the open market, they can usually retain their own at a significant discount. Tom Brady is Exhibit A - making significantly less than Peyton Manning. That doesn't mean they keep everyone, but they have the price they're willing to pay, and they're in a position to make a solid offer before their key guys are free agents. The Redskins NEVER have enough cap room to sign a guy like Pierce to an extension during the season, so we end up competing on the open market, and as history has demonstrated, we usually lose out. It burns me that we let go of self-made Redskins like Pierce and Clark, then pay a lot more for guys like Archuleta and Carter. The only year under Snyder that the Redskins have shown restraint was the lone year that Schottenheimer was in charge.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=The Zimmermans;236774]Snyder has the final say in everything, where's the proof that he doesn't?[/quote]

Pretty much every word that's come out of Redskins Park since Gibbs came back says that Gibbs has the final say over personnel and Snyder just signs the checks and handles the negotiation process with agents.

Here's an [URL="http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-114278.html"]interview with Cerrato [/URL]where he explains the front office setup:

[quote]ESPN Insider wrote the other day how teams come about their decisions. One of the things written was that pretty much was that Dan and you are the overriding people making decisions, so if Joe Gibbs wanted a player, he'd really have to sell you on it, and if he couldn't sell you on it, you guys would say yes or no. Or does Joe Gibbs have the final say? Or does Dan Snyder have the final say?

[B]Vinny Cerrato[/B]

That's totally false.

[U][B]The coach has the final say[/B][/U]. We'll go through the whole process. We'll put everybody in an order. Then it will come down to the coach saying this is what I need or this is what I don't need.

[B][U]Dan takes no say so in the player moves. He gives it all to Coach Gibbs.[/U][/B] We all work together to come up with an answer and then the coach makes the final call. Like he says, somebody has to make the final call. He does.

He takes all the information and the thing that he does that's great is we go over it and over it and he asks everybody's opinion and everybody's opinion counts, from the trainers, to the strength coaches, to the scouts, to everybody.

He wants every opinion, every bit of information, then we'll make a good decision and he'll make the final call.

So, the Insider is totally wrong.[/quote]

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

K, I'll buy it, I guess we need a GM


very well put souper, i don't understand why snyder gets so much credit for screwing things up

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;236078]Phillip Daniel, Reynaldo Wynn, Mark Brunnel, and John Hall equals 9.3 million in freed up cap space. They all suck. Does anyone think they will be around next year? For them to retain the guys they have, they have to let some go. These are the most likely candidates. All are shoe ins, except Daniels. Fauria, gives us another million. This will provide us with the room to sign our draft picks. I dont think much else. It does'nt make sense to get rid of Archuletta until 2009. I hope that three weeks from now the Redskins are 4 and 5, and we can stop talking about next year. If the season go bad, it is time to start to build thru the draft. Who ever is making our draft choices and walk on free agents, has done a good job. Just look at Bailey, Smoot, Peirce, and Clark.[/quote]

and who starts at DE? hall, brunell, collins, etc can go. wynn and daniels will both be back, we don't have many other options there.

clark and pierce were FAs (pierce was undrafted, clark was let go from the giants).

clements would be a worthwhile signing.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;236710]Bill B, all of the players that you are sugesting we release would cost us more to release than to keep. The players that make sense to release are the ones that I stated in the begginning of this post. Go to the salary cap section and look at the subtitle release fees. We cant even think about releasing any of the free agents we signed this year until 2009.[/quote]


Thanks - I did not see that section - it seems the bigger the contracts that the Redskins have given the more salary cap trouble we are getting into! Looks like the should remain stable for a while

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

Hey, That Guy, I don't know who will start at DE. But, I can tell you unless Wynn will play for about what they will give up, by cutting him, he's gone. He is not worth 4 million a year. Maybe Demetric Evans and Carter will start, or maybe Joe Skykes, or maybe our first round pick, or maybe a walk on free agent. I also said that Daniels was not a [COLOR=black]shoe[/COLOR] in.

[quote]Who ever is making our draft choices and walk on free agents, has done a good job. Just look at Bailey, Smoot, Peirce, and Clark[/quote]


What I ment about Pierce and Clark, was that they we both walk on free agents, that our scouts invited to camp.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=SouperMeister;236784]I'm not a fan of the business, and the top ranking revenue - I'm a fan of building a winner with staying power. I can't believe some of you feel Snyder is a genius skirting the cap every year. We carry more dead cap money than any team in the league. It's Gibbs attitude as well. I thought he'd bring roster stability upon his return, but he hasn't been able to retain core Redskins (Pierce, Smoot, Clark) because we have over-leveraged our cap every year. Teams like Philly and New England stay way under the cap to allow them to re-sign their core players as they APPROACH free agency. Both have done this brilliantly, and since they do so before their players hit the open market, they can usually retain their own at a significant discount. Tom Brady is Exhibit A - making significantly less than Peyton Manning. That doesn't mean they keep everyone, but they have the price they're willing to pay, and they're in a position to make a solid offer before their key guys are free agents. The Redskins NEVER have enough cap room to sign a guy like Pierce to an extension during the season, so we end up competing on the open market, and as history has demonstrated, we usually lose out. It burns me that we let go of self-made Redskins like Pierce and Clark, then pay a lot more for guys like Archuleta and Carter. The only year under Snyder that the Redskins have shown restraint was the lone year that Schottenheimer was in charge.[/quote]
Just the latest example of intelligent cap management by Philly to retain the team's core: [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2647220]ESPN.com - NFL - Eagles DT Patterson inks seven-year, $32M extension[/url]

Patterson joins guard [URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=6775"][COLOR=#0000ff]Shawn Andrews[/COLOR][/URL], cornerbacks [URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=5912"][COLOR=#0000ff]Lito Sheppard[/COLOR][/URL] and [URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=5945"][COLOR=#0000ff]Sheldon Brown[/COLOR][/URL] and other top draft choices in recent years to receive extensions before their rookie contracts expire. But the Patterson deal was one of the earliest, coming in the middle of his second year.

Andy Reid is making a calculated gamble that Patterson and others will develop into solid players that would have commanded far more money if allowed to bid their services as free agents.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

First things first we should sign Brunell to a contract extension with about 40 million signing bonus. Sign Vinny to a long term contract too. Make sure we always wear white on white uniforms. Make sure any players that are productive for the skins we let them go in FA. Then we can sign other peoples FA to about 13 million signing bonuses this year that should be the going rate over last year 10 million. Trade all of our draft picks to make sure we can get some of those undervalued FA that the other teams dont appricate like Danny does and the Gibbster would. Also hopefully we can sign some more coaches this off season we still dont have one player to a coach yet and make sure the coaches get their titles of Assiant Head Coach and about 3 million dollars too. If we draft make sure the players are from the U to make sure Portis and the rest of the U players are happy. Charge 30 dollars for parking next year. Hail to the skins.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

GONE.....
offense
brunell, betts (they won't pay him starter's salary, someone will), duckett (unless they get him signed in the next few games), patten, thrash, dockery (the same template will be followed.. they want him, he is a core redskin..ooops, someone pays him too much for us to match and ..bye-bye),
fauria, yoder (has he done anything ??), collins (only if campbell gets enough games to get a read on his long term abilities... and see my later comment on coaches).... jansen ???? he really needs to prove he is not too old for the position...

special teams
hall, frost (a couple of shanks too many over the remainder of the season)

defense
wynn, daniels, salavea, holdman, wright, rumph, vincent (really shows his age later this year), springs (salary is insane and unless he redoes his deal, say goodbye)

coaches
saunders (by mutual decision), gray, blache (if ron rivera gets a head coaching slot, blache will move to the bears as def coord)
williams ??? might happen if fisher has had enough and leaves tennessee. williams makes more sense under those circumstances. if he goes, then blache gets elevated to def coordinator if he wants the position

offseason needs
corners of all types (clements, draft pick, reserve types)
safety..(if PP does not come back whole)
def end ( 1st round pick? trade down 1st rounder for extra first day picks.. plus at least 1 free agent)
reserve LB through draft or free agency
starting guard (steinbach ? manawai??)..tackle if jansen is through and wade cannot man the position
back up qb if collins goes when saunders goes.. real question is whether gibbs messes with campbell's head the same way he messed with ramsey.. if so plummer, simms, leftwich could get a serious look.. gibbs always likes to have maturity on the bench. plus, a true #3 to develop via the draft or college free agency..
punter
reserve runner if duckett and betts both leave

get the impression there will be wholesale changes ? bet on it if this team finishes under .500 and misses the playoffs.. there is no reason to stand pat with a team that is ageing along both lines and watched the defense flounder all year...if that happens, expect a tumultuous off season...

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

Shallyshal the problem with your predictions is that Blache is already the defensive coordinator here. So he won't be going anywhere else just to be a d-coordinator

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

the priority in the offseason should be to find a general manager.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=shallyshal;238064]GONE.....
get the impression there will be wholesale changes ? bet on it if this team finishes under .500 and misses the playoffs.. there is no reason to stand pat with a team that is ageing along both lines and watched the defense flounder all year...if that happens, expect a tumultuous off season...[/QUOTE]

Tumultuous? So much the same as any other skins offseason then?

Perhaps now that Freeney can't buy a sack we'll throw the GDP of a small country at him for a 10 year contract!!!

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS;238065]Shallyshal the problem with your predictions is that Blache is already the defensive coordinator here. So he won't be going anywhere else just to be a d-coordinator[/QUOTE]

nothing that snyder cannot fix with more money and a fancier title, if he stays..

and there is no reason why blache could not go to chicago as a true def coordinator and leader of the defense. as long as GW is here, he will always be under someone. if he were to go elsewhere, he might have the same title as def coordinator but he would not be under someone like GW..

one way or the other, i expect further significant changes in both the roster and coaches after this season..

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=shallyshal;238112]nothing that snyder cannot fix with more money and a fancier title, if he stays..

and there is no reason why blache could not go to chicago as a true def coordinator and leader of the defense. as long as GW is here, he will always be under someone. if he were to go elsewhere, he might have the same title as def coordinator but he would not be under someone like GW..

one way or the other, i expect further significant changes in both the roster and coaches after this season..[/QUOTE]

Yeah I guess maybe you missed my point. By the rules of the league he can't go somewhere else (assuming he's under contract which I believe he is) as "Defensive Coordinator" it has to be something more.

If anything, he'll go somewhere to be a head coach. And frankly, I think he deserves the chance. Also, why would he go back to Chicago to be defensive coordinator when he left there after 5 years of being the defensive coordinator?

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

I agree about Blache. His next stop will likely be as a HC somewhere.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;238118]I agree about Blache. His next stop will likely be as a HC somewhere.[/QUOTE]

There's just a question as to when exactly that will be. If the defense keeps playing like it has, he's not going anywhere.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;237941]Hey, That Guy, I don't know who will start at DE. But, I can tell you unless Wynn will play for about what they will give up, by cutting him, he's gone. He is not worth 4 million a year. Maybe Demetric Evans and Carter will start, or maybe Joe Skykes, or maybe our first round pick, or maybe a walk on free agent. I also said that Daniels was not a [COLOR=black]shoe[/COLOR] in.




What I ment about Pierce and Clark, was that they we both walk on free agents, that our scouts invited to camp.[/quote]

why the hell would you dump someone just to dump them without a viable replacement? joe sykes? he's not even NFL backup quality right now, so why would anyone think he could start?

everyone seemed to think wynn would be gone this year cause of his cap number, but i figured he'd be a shoe-in for the roster (after passing first cut), because he can play. his salary is twice what it should be, but unless there's a very specific reason to dump him, he'll probably be back. You don't just downgrade your roster without a reason, and i don't believe we'd be over cap with other cuts that should be made.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=shallyshal;238064]GONE.....
offense
brunell, betts (they won't pay him starter's salary, someone will), duckett (unless they get him signed in the next few games), patten, thrash, dockery (the same template will be followed.. they want him, he is a core redskin..ooops, someone pays him too much for us to match and ..bye-bye),
fauria, yoder (has he done anything ??), collins (only if campbell gets enough games to get a read on his long term abilities... and see my later comment on coaches).... jansen ???? he really needs to prove he is not too old for the position...

special teams
hall, frost (a couple of shanks too many over the remainder of the season)

defense
wynn, daniels, salavea, holdman, wright, rumph, vincent (really shows his age later this year), springs (salary is insane and unless he redoes his deal, say goodbye)

coaches
saunders (by mutual decision), gray, blache (if ron rivera gets a head coaching slot, blache will move to the bears as def coord)
williams ??? might happen if fisher has had enough and leaves tennessee. williams makes more sense under those circumstances. if he goes, then blache gets elevated to def coordinator if he wants the position

offseason needs
corners of all types (clements, draft pick, reserve types)
safety..(if PP does not come back whole)
def end ( 1st round pick? trade down 1st rounder for extra first day picks.. plus at least 1 free agent)
reserve LB through draft or free agency
starting guard (steinbach ? manawai??)..tackle if jansen is through and wade cannot man the position
back up qb if collins goes when saunders goes.. real question is whether gibbs messes with campbell's head the same way he messed with ramsey.. if so plummer, simms, leftwich could get a serious look.. gibbs always likes to have maturity on the bench. plus, a true #3 to develop via the draft or college free agency..
punter
reserve runner if duckett and betts both leave

get the impression there will be wholesale changes ? bet on it if this team finishes under .500 and misses the playoffs.. there is no reason to stand pat with a team that is ageing along both lines and watched the defense flounder all year...if that happens, expect a tumultuous off season...[/quote]


boy, i'm glad you're not in charge. jansen? are you kidding? who's his replacement that'd cost less and perform better? you do know that stability helps a team and these sprees and massive cuts are part of the problem, right? vincent is making minimum. what other 53 players are going to be on the roster that are more talented and warrant his release? springs salary is insane? are you nuts? he's underpaid due to a history of injuries, even though that's just bitten us. #1 corners ain't cheap, and clements is going to want something close to $7.5mill a year.

and we've had so much luck finding one DE that will let the best 2 we've had in the last few years go with no plan or replacement in sight? btw, we won't have the money to go get clements, a DE, and steinbach, etc etc to replace those cuts.

sorry, but THAT plan needs a lot more work with reality.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote]why the hell would you dump someone just to dump them without a viable replacement? joe sykes? he's not even NFL backup quality right now, so why would anyone think he could start?

everyone seemed to think Wynn would be gone this year cause of his cap number, but i figured he'd be a shoe-in for the roster (after passing first cut), because he can play. his salary is twice what it should be, but unless there's a very specific reason to dump him, he'll probably be back. You don't just downgrade your roster without a reason, and i don't believe we'd be over cap with other cuts that should be made.[/quote]
That Guy, have you looked at what Wynn will cost next year. He will cost four million to keep him and one million to get rid of him. I realize that I am not the general manager and certainly not a professional NFL team manager. But it is logical to think that since he is a back up and expensive , he will either play for one million or get cut. There will be much better back ups for four million dollars. We also will be in need of his cap space. As for Joe Skykes, I did not say he would be the replacement, but it is not crazy to think that in his second year with the Redskins he could assume a back role on the roster. As for everyone thinking he would be gone this year, there was no cap benefit to letting him go this year. Read the posts more carefully, and unless you are employed by the NFL stop acting as if you above every one else's opinion.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;238482] As for everyone thinking he would be gone this year, there was no cap benefit to letting him go this year. Read the posts more carefully, and unless you are employed by the NFL stop acting as if you above every one else's opinion.[/quote]

sorry, but that's wrong. he would have saved money if he was let go before this season started, and you should really check your information and read posts more carefully before asking me to do the same :P I said "unless there's a very specific reason to dump him" (ie, needing the cap space) but i guess you missed that.

and i'm sorry if i missed the "don't disagree with chris rule" but if there's a flawed arguement presented, then why am i not allowed to question it? should i ask for your approval on every post i make? seriously. I asked why you would downgrade your roster without having a reason to do so, and i get "stop acting like you're above everyone" as a response? what would chris do :P ?

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Ok That Guy, releasing him would look like this.

......................2006 ......................2007
......................Salary Release .........Salary Release
Rynaldo Wynn ..$3028 and $3057 ......$4028 and $1528

In 2006 we would have had a $29000 dollar charge to release Wynn. In 2007 we have $2.5 million dollars of freed up cap space. Someone, please correct me if I am wrong.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/11152-if-extension-cba-cant-get-done.html[/url]

has a link to a WP article as well. cutting wynn would have saved 396k last year. he has a 500k roster bonus in both 2006 and 2007 and he converted 2.835mill from salary to SB in 2005 (this offseason during the cap crisis).


more links:
[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/printthread.php?t=11196&page=1&pp=10[/url]
[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/02/24/AR2006022401722.html]Amid Labor Deal Uncertainty, Redskins Face Payroll Cuts[/url]
[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/printthread.php?t=11196&pp=40[/url]

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=chris36;238535]Ok That Guy, releasing him would look like this.

......................2006 ......................2007
......................Salarie Release .........Salarie Release
Rynaldo Wynn ..$3028 and $3057 ......$4028 and $1528

In 2006 we would have had a $29000 dollar charge to release Wynn. In 2007 we have $2.5 million dollars of freed up cap space. Someone, please correct me if I am wrong.[/QUOTE]

What in the hell is a "Salarie"?

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[code]Player Lgth Sal SB OB Total
Renaldo Wynn 6 $7,690 $6,335 $1,000 $15,025
----Converted $2.835M from 2005 salary to SB/Readjusted 2006 & 2007 salary
----and Added $500K RB in 2006-2007[/code]

so... here's the before an after breakdown on his contract:
[code] pre-restructure post-restructure
total 6 years/$15.025/$3.5 6 years/$7.69/6.335
2006 1.5?/0.583SB 1/1.528SB/0.5roster
2007 3.5?/0.583SB 2/1.528SB/0.5roster

? = best guess from memory...[/code]

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

ok your right. Saving $396,000 was worth cutting Wynn. I would have played in his place for $300,000.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;238584]ok your right. Saving $396,000 was worth cutting Wynn. I would have played in his place for $300,000.[/quote]

you're rationalizing. i never said it made sense, only that you were wrong in stating that it'd cost us money to cut him while telling me to be more careful about getting MY shit straight :P.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote]Ok That Guy, releasing him would look like this.

......................2006 ......................2007
......................Salary Release .........Salary Release
Rynaldo Wynn ..$3028 and $3057 ......$4028 and $1528

In 2006 we would have had a $29000 dollar charge to release Wynn. In 2007 we have $2.5 million dollars of freed up cap space. Someone, please correct me if I am wrong.[/quote]
You are extremely hard headed, sometimes it is better just to admit you are wrong. I was simply stating what is on the cap page. Which I tend to beleive more so than you.

[quote]
Code:
[LEFT]Player Lgth Sal SB OB TotalRenaldo Wynn 6 $7,690 $6,335 $1,000 $15,025----Converted $2.835M from 2005 salary to SB/Readjusted 2006 & 2007 salary----and Added $500K RB in 2006-2007[/LEFT]

so... here's the before an after breakdown on his contract:

Code:

[LEFT]pre-restructure post-restructure
total 6 years/$15.025/$3.5 6 years/$7.69/6.335
2006 1.5?/0.583SB 1/1.528SB/0.5roster
2007 3.5?/0.583SB 2/1.528SB/0.5roster[/LEFT]

[LEFT]? = best guess from memory...[/LEFT]
[/quote]




This is your best gues from memory. But in the case that you are correct, they kept him because it made no monetary sense to let him go. That was not your argument for keeping him. You are at this point, contradicticting yourself.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

Hey ThatGuy and chris36, I can beat of you in a pissing match. ;)

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

where is crazycanuck to settle this?

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=Bill B;236707]From a cap and contract perspective I could see the following cuts:
Brunell - his salary jumps to $6.633 in 2007, Andre Carter in 2008 when his salary jumps to $5 million, unless a restructure occurs one has to take notice of Cornelius Griffins contract - it jumps to $6.166 million in 2007 and with his injuries that is a lot of money tied up in one player, Shawn Springs contract jumps to $7.3 million in 2007 - cutting him and signing Clements makes sense in 2007. Finally David Patten jumps to $3 million in 2007 so he is also a cap cut too I would think.[/QUOTE]



Brunell will cost 6.6 mil. if he's on the team next year. If we cut him before June 1st he'll count 4.3 mil. in DC. however if he's released after June 1st, he'll count 1.5 mil. a saving of 5.1 mil. which would apear to make him a prime candidate to be released. Springs must think seriously about restructering as well as Patten, otherwise they too could be considered candidates for release. However much depends on what happens the remainder of this season.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[QUOTE=That Guy;238438]boy, i'm glad you're not in charge. jansen? are you kidding? who's his replacement that'd cost less and perform better? you do know that stability helps a team and these sprees and massive cuts are part of the problem, right? vincent is making minimum. what other 53 players are going to be on the roster that are more talented and warrant his release? springs salary is insane? are you nuts? he's underpaid due to a history of injuries, even though that's just bitten us. #1 corners ain't cheap, and clements is going to want something close to $7.5mill a year.

and we've had so much luck finding one DE that will let the best 2 we've had in the last few years go with no plan or replacement in sight? btw, we won't have the money to go get clements, a DE, and steinbach, etc etc to replace those cuts.

sorry, but THAT plan needs a lot more work with reality.[/QUOTE]

it comes down to how this team plays for the remainder of this year..

as i said, if they finish 5-11 or in that range, there is no reason to maintain "stability" by keeping players who are pulling down large increases in salaries and yet whose production is falling off.
both wynn and daniels are old by league standards. and we are getting neither pass rush, nor consistent run stoppage by the d line. that is not to be rewarded. we need younger, more athletic performers at defensive end because without a consistent pass rush from the def end position, GW's defense will continue to flounder.

i said that dockery should be resigned. i do not think he will be because he will ask for the moon if he is allowed to go into the offseason as a free agent. what gives you confidence the front office will resign him ? if not, because we have allowed a number of potential younger players to slip away (ndukwe, harvey, pino) we will not have a ready replacement on the roster. that means someone who is a free agent

as for springs. he has always been a brittle player. that was the knock on him in seattle. if he cannot regain his health is he worth 7 mil per year next year? if clements and he cost the same, and clements is younger and healthier, who is the better corner to have? we will need at least 1 free agent corner if we follow the same path we have travelled the last couple of years. at least a #3. harris, then wright, then ???

i hope vincent plays well and is worth keeping next year. but even vet minimum is steep with the number of years of service he has accrued.
too bad we didn't keep the younger, cheaper clark.. but that was hindsight

and now onto my favorite player.. jansen.. have you even looked at his play this year ? he is not the same player he was before his series of injuries 2 years ago. part of the reason brunell rolls to his left constantly is because jansen's play has fallen off so dramatically. i believe that parcell's focus on beating jansen was well reported. let's see what he does tomorrow after he has in effect, been called out. in fact, we have a huge amount of dollars invested inthe o line overall. is there any group on the team that is giving less bang for the buck now?... continuity? sure it is good. but both the saints and cowboys have retooled their o line on the fly this year and are getting far better production than we are for less bucks..

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

I am not seeing Jansen playing that bad. I thought Brunnell rolled to his left because he was left handed. I was kind of suprised that Parcels said that about Jansen. The guy that I have been disapointed with is Samuels.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;238711]I am not seeing Jansen playing that bad. I thought Brunnell rolled to his left because he was left handed. I was kind of suprised that Parcels said that about Jansen. The guy that I have been disapointed with is Samuels.[/quote]
With as bad as Jansen has been playin' you'd think his thumbs were still broken!

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=chris36;238652]You are extremely hard headed, sometimes it is better just to admit you are wrong. I was simply stating what is on the cap page. Which I tend to beleive more so than you.






This is your best gues from memory. But in the case that you are correct, they kept him because it made no monetary sense to let him go. That was not your argument for keeping him. You are at this point, contradicticting yourself.[/quote]


you're an idiot. why should i admit i'm wrong when it's clear you can't read?
you see the note about how the contract was adjusted in this offseason? that changed the 2006 and 2007 figures, BUT IT'S IN THE CAP SHEET you say you've read. once the extra 2.8 went from salary to signing bonus, the economics of ditching wynn changed. i even linked to f'ing articles from the time showing that cutting him would clearly save cap space. I'm sorry you've decided to side with ignorance, but trying to teach brick walls is a waste of my time. though it is amusing that you'd call me hard-headed when you're the one that's repeatedly reciting false information, even after the actual facts are presented.

and my arguement for keeping him is simply that unless you have a reason to let him go (ie getting a better player with his cap space), there's no reason to do so. Once again, i'd appreciate if you actually took the time to at least read my posts before wasting your time with pointless replies.

Re: The Moves We Should Make Next Year (merged)
 

[quote=shallyshal;238704]it comes down to how this team plays for the remainder of this year..

as i said, if they finish 5-11 or in that range, there is no reason to maintain "stability" by keeping players who are pulling down large increases in salaries and yet whose production is falling off.
both wynn and daniels are old by league standards. and we are getting neither pass rush, nor consistent run stoppage by the d line. that is not to be rewarded. we need younger, more athletic performers at defensive end because without a consistent pass rush from the def end position, GW's defense will continue to flounder.[/quote]

true. good points.

[quote]i said that dockery should be resigned. i do not think he will be because he will ask for the moon if he is allowed to go into the offseason as a free agent. what gives you confidence the front office will resign him ? if not, because we have allowed a number of potential younger players to slip away (ndukwe, harvey, pino) we will not have a ready replacement on the roster. that means someone who is a free agent[/quote]well, i honestly don't think he's done anything to earn a big paycheck. he's average at best at one of the very cheapest positions in football. A 3rd round pick last year could have gotten a day 1 starter for september (charles spencer or max-jean gilles), but we opted to trade ours to move up for an LB that can't beat out holdman (of all people) and next year's 3rd for a RB we haven't played (and most likely won't be able to sign, not that i think we should try). I think he'll probably be kept. I wouldn't worry about ndukwe pino et al though, none of those guys are starters and all are readily replaceable with generic roster trash.

[quote]as for springs. he has always been a brittle player. that was the knock on him in seattle. if he cannot regain his health is he worth 7 mil per year next year? if clements and he cost the same, and clements is younger and healthier, who is the better corner to have? we will need at least 1 free agent corner if we follow the same path we have travelled the last couple of years. at least a #3. harris, then wright, then ???[/quote]again, that's true, and clements is a real #1, but it'd be cheaper to keep springs than it'd be to cut him next year (by about 100k), so it's not like you'd be able to choose to pay one over the other for 2007. harris was better than wright, but wright, prioleau, and vincent may all be back for 2007, so that may work itself out. I do agree that clements would be a good investment, it's just projecting the future impact with all the craptacularly overpaid dead weight is hard, but i haven't really taken time to look into it (in depth) yet.

[quote]i hope vincent plays well and is worth keeping next year. but even vet minimum is steep with the number of years of service he has accrued.
too bad we didn't keep the younger, cheaper clark.. but that was hindsight[/quote]if he signs a 1year deal, vet min is capped at 425k, if it's multi-year, than it'd be capped at 810k. price/performance-wise, 810k would still be pretty hard to knock. on clark, plenty of people here saw that with foresight, and EVERYONE has seen it in hindsight ;). it is a shame though, cause arch is stuck here for 3 years minimum.

[quote]and now onto my favorite player.. jansen.. have you even looked at his play this year ? he is not the same player he was before his series of injuries 2 years ago. part of the reason brunell rolls to his left constantly is because jansen's play has fallen off so dramatically. i believe that parcell's focus on beating jansen was well reported. let's see what he does tomorrow after he has in effect, been called out. in fact, we have a huge amount of dollars invested inthe o line overall. is there any group on the team that is giving less bang for the buck now?... continuity? sure it is good. but both the saints and cowboys have retooled their o line on the fly this year and are getting far better production than we are for less bucks..[/quote]well, that's the FO's fault for overpaying (they had plenty of time to get samuels much cheaper, but they waited and waited, and then seattle made their guy the highest paid LT EVER, and that screwed the works :/). with only one #1 pick, some 2nd day selections, and limited cap flexibility, i don't think we're going to be able to fix all the holes, and cb + pass rush are much bigger issues. jansen is still better than his backup (who's actually pretty good for a backup OT and has lots of starting experience - for the texans :/).